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Pakistan-Israel relationship

it still worth a try though. i mean if we can do this, it should be easier even for Pakistan.
Do Indonesian politicians worry about their own bodyguards shooting them for doing something "un-Islamic"? I don't think so and that's the worry Pakistanis have. Thus the low-key, deniable approach only raises suspicion and militancy while the open approach offers the opportunity to combat this.
 
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You might want to research that some more.
Maybe I do but not as much as you need it to do.
U.N. says the territory referred to is Israel-occupied Syria.)
The purported annexation of East Jerusalem was condemned by the United Nations Security Council as "a violation of international law" and declared "null and void" in United Nations Security Council Resolution 478 and has not been recognized by the international community; no country has its embassy in Jerusalem. Instead, the embassies are located in Tel Aviv, whilst Jerusalem remains home to many consulates.[39][40]

The boundaries of a future Palestinian State, vis-a-vis Israel, are subject to ongoing negotiations in the Israel–Palestinian peace process.
Long story short, Durand line is an international boundary separating Pakistan and Afghanistan but you have no definite boundary separating Palestine.
Do you endorse that all that's needed for a terrorist to act with impunity is to take civilians hostage and compel them to act as shields? Looks like that's what you're doing to me. It's a tough call, at what point to risk killing civilians or risk the guilty party getting away to kill more people
So you will you kill many many innocents just to kill few terrorists? Very irresponsible statement made by you. Yes terrorists need to be eliminated but not on the cost of innocent lives. You need to clear terrorists by finding a way by which innocents are not killed .
America is "the devil" that won't oppress or shoot other people for calling it a devil.
Cool logic. Someone call you a devil and you shoot him. Are you feeling Alright?
Your words would have greater credibility if you were willing to condemn and act against war crimes committed by Muslims against people of all faiths in war time. By the way, are you so certain you know what a war crime is? I'm not convinced you do.
Yes maybe my words will. But comparing your credibility to mine, your words might have no credibility.

There is no "try our level best" by the P.A.: it insists its evacuations are 100% successful, keeps newsmen out, and points to the resulting lack of news reports as evidence of success at reducing civilian casualties. An insult to every Pakistani's intelligence
Too bad, America does drone strike in an area and you do not bat an eye, PA does operation in the same area and you start to cry about civilian casualties. Ironic!
Tch. Reporters accept the risk of their assignment as part of their job. Look at all the coverage Gaza got last year
Last time I check Gaza is not part of Israel. You do not respect sovereignty of other Nation. While we are clearing our areas within our boundaries. Most of the area is well known for terrorist stronghold and their oppression on residing local community their. While never heard Gaza being oppressed by anyone except Israel.
Maybe it's just you? Blindly deciding that if you can't evaluate from my perspective then I can't evaluate from yours?

Recognizing Israel - exchanging ambassadors and such - is good, but not enough. The example of Egypt is instructive: after Sadat was assassinated, Egyptians were encouraged to think of Israel as a barely-restrained enemy rather than friendly neighbor. Trade should move from covert transactions to public ones. Pakistanis have to have the freedom to travel to and report from the Jewish State. And Israel advocacy has to be made legitimate. Only then can you start to unravel the mental complexes that have held Pakistan back for generations - that have kept Pakistan locked in war and hate and corruption rather than becoming another Canada or South Korea.
How should I put this...
Your case is very weak whether you accept it or not.
I do not mind having complexes holding me back if I help Palestine cause. The truth is despite being locked by war,corruption,hate we are getting stronger and stronger day by day and our defense capabilities need no describing.
Anyway, lets end our discussion here. This discussion will not bear much fruit. Maybe we will talk some other time.
Till then,take care of yourself and have a nice day.
 
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Do Indonesian politicians worry about their own bodyguards shooting them for doing something "un-Islamic"? I don't think so and that's the worry Pakistanis have. Thus the low-key, deniable approach only raises suspicion and militancy while the open approach offers the opportunity to combat this.

i see. well, pakistan can take the "quiet" way of bilateral relations like we do. it'll be even easier had Pakistan were to adapt the same Unity in Diversity like we did, but that is yet to be implemented. anyway, i hope good luck for both Israel and Pakistan
 
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My friends, please have an open mind i found it on the net while reading about Pakistan-Israel relations.

Pashtun clue to lost tribes of Israel | World news | The Guardian

Pashtun clue to lost tribes of Israel

Israel is to fund a rare genetic study to determine whether there is a link between the lost tribes of Israel and the Pashtuns of Afghanistan and northern Pakistan.

Historical and anecdotal evidence strongly suggests a connection, but definitive scientific proof has never been found. Some leading Israeli anthropologists believe that, of all the many groups in the world who claim a connection to the 10 lost tribes, the Pashtuns, or Pathans, have the most compelling case. Paradoxically it is from the Pashtuns that the ultra-conservative Islamic Taliban movement in Afghanistan emerged. Pashtuns themselves sometimes talk of their Israelite connection, but show few signs of sympathy with, or any wish to migrate to, the modern Israeli state.

Now an Indian researcher has collected blood samples from members of the Afridi tribe of Pashtuns who today live in Malihabad, near Lucknow, in northern India. Shahnaz Ali, from the National Institute of Immunohaematology in Mumbai, is to spend several months studying her findings at Technion, the Israel Institute of Technology, in Haifa. A previous genetic study in the same area did not provide proof one way or the other.

The Assyrians conquered the kingdom of Israel some 2,730 years ago, scattering 10 of the 12 tribes into exile, supposedly beyond the mythical Sambation river. The two remaining tribes, Benjamin and Judah, became the modern-day Jewish people, according to Jewish history, and the search for the lost tribes has continued ever since. Some have claimed to have found traces of them in modern day China, Burma, Nigeria, Central Asia, Ethiopia and even in the West.

But it is believed that the tribes were dispersed in an area around modern-day northern Iraq and Afghanistan, which makes the Pashtun connection the strongest.

"Of all the groups, there is more convincing evidence about the Pathans than anybody else, but the Pathans are the ones who would reject Israel most ferociously. That is the sweet irony," said Shalva Weil, an anthropologist and senior researcher at the Hebrew University of Jerusalem.

The Pashtuns have a proud oral history that talks of descending from the Israelites.

Their tribal groupings have similar names, including Yusufzai, which means sons of Joseph; and Afridi, thought by some to come from Ephraim. Some customs and practices are said to be similar to Jewish traditions: lighting candles on the sabbath, refraining from eating certain foods, using a canopy during a wedding ceremony and some similarities in garments.

Weil cautioned, however, that this is not proof of any genetic connection. DNA might be able to determine which area of the world the Pashtuns originated from, but it is not at all certain that it could identify a specific genetic link to the Jewish people.

So far Shahnaz Ali has been cautious. "The theory has been a matter of curiosity since long ago, and now I hope a scientific analysis will provide us with some answers about the Israelite origin of Afridi Pathans. We still don't know what the truth is, but efforts will certainly give us a direction," she told the Times of Indialast year.

Some are more certain, among them Navras Aafreedi, an academic at Lucknow University, himself a Pashtun from the Afridi tribe. His family trace their roots back to Pathans from the Khyber Agency of what is today north-west Pakistan, but he believes they stretch back further to the tribe of Ephraim.

"Pathans, or Pashtuns, are the only people in the world whose probable descent from the lost tribes of Israel finds mention in a number of texts from the 10th century to the present day, written by Jewish, Christian and Muslim scholars alike, both religious as well as secularists," Aafreedi said.

The implications of any find are uncertain. Other groups that claim Israelite descent, including those known as the Bnei Menashe in India and some in Ethiopia, have migrated to Israel. That is unlikely with the Pashtuns.

But Weil said the work was absorbing, well beyond questions of immigration. "I find a myth that has been so persistent for so long, for 2,000 years, really fascinating," she said.


Just How Similar are Pashtun and Jewish People? | Sharnoff's Global Views

Just How Similar are Pashtun and Jewish People?

The Pashtun people who live in Afghanistan and Pakistan have common historical, linguistic and cultural similarities with Jewish people.


Credit: muslimbaniisrael.wordpress.com

Previously, we have compared the Pashtunwali, an unwritten code of conduct for the Pasthun people of Afghanistan and Pakistan, with the Jewish Torah.

Now we can look for similarities that originate from the Torah or from the Bible that do not have necessarily something in common with the Pashtunwali.

There are some recognized stories of Pashtun practices virtually identical to Jews: Lighting candles on Friday night, separation of meat and dairy, and covering graves with stones.

Moreover, some Pashtu names derive from Hebrew. For example, Asif, Assaf, Binyamin, Kenan, and Barak (Barak is the name of the known Barakzai tribe, which traces after Barak son of Avinoam, officer- warrior of the ancient Israeli Kingdom.

Barak means glance, sparkling, flash. The other names mentioned in the Torah: Asif (harvest in Heberew), Assaf (gather in Hebrew), also known as the compositor of the Levi’s (Liwan tribe) choir, Binyamin (fool of power), the 12th Israeli tribe, and Kenan (lamenter in Hebrew) the fourth generation of the humanity.

These names are quite ordinary in Israel and in Pashtun areas. Names that do not originate from the Torah, like Tameer (high in Hebrew/hideen in Aramaic) and Timor (carved decorating shape of palms found at the Jewish temple), are also common among the two groups, as well as Shir and Sahar.

Religious names and tool share common characteristics.

In Pashtu, names of God are known as Khudai; while in biblical Hebrew God is referred to as (El) Shadai. The Jewish prayer shawl (talit) issue also has a great resemblance to the Pashtu/Urdu word tolia which means towel.

Many Pashtun wear scarves which look like a talit: a wide white scarf decorated with blue stripes on both sides of it. The only thing that is missing in the knotted fringes (tzitzit) attached to its four corners.

Saturday in Pashtu is called Shanbay and Hebrew, Shabbat – the holy day of the week for Jews. During Shabbat, Jews are commanded to abstain from labor and reflect. Shabbat is the Jewish symbol of loyalty for God. In Pashtu, Sabat means loyalty, and on Shanbay work is also not allowed.

Furthermore, Pashtu and Hebrew prefixes originate from the ancient Semitic language Aramaic. For example, the prefix “De” which used in Hebrew and Pashtu literature means “from” or “of.”

There are probably more common words, names and phrases between the Pashtu, which belongs to western Iranian language group, and Hebrew which belongs to west Semitic language group. And yet both groups still have much in common, as the Pashtuns originate from the lost tribes of Israel.

Watch this excerpt from the Quest for the Lost Tribes of Israel




Your inputs my friends? @Solomon2 , @Slav Defence , @haviZsultan , @Green Arrow , @Syed.Ali.Haider , @Armstrong ,@WAJsal , @500

@Archdemon

Please do not be offended on my post, it was not intended to insult anyone my friends. As I have mentioned days ago, maybe just maybe we can start the peace here .....


at PDF...
 
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Good One...
No Offence dear....But that practice needs to be address.
Child abuse us epidemic in South Asia.. Afghanistan, Pakistan , india all are in the same boat...

As you pashtuns.. Remember kasur tragedy? It's happening everywhere...
 
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Child abuse us epidemic in South Asia.. Afghanistan, Pakistan , india all are in the same boat...

As you pashtuns.. Remember kasur tragedy? It's happening everywhere...

In Kasur Culprits as well as some victim's poor parents making money out of Vdos generation in closed doors. There is no social norm and acceptance about it anywhere, something we cant say about the opposite.
 
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My friends, please have an open mind i found it on the net while reading about Pakistan-Israel relations.

Pashtun clue to lost tribes of Israel | World news | The Guardian

Pashtun clue to lost tribes of Israel

Israel is to fund a rare genetic study to determine whether there is a link between the lost tribes of Israel and the Pashtuns of Afghanistan and northern Pakistan.

Historical and anecdotal evidence strongly suggests a connection, but definitive scientific proof has never been found. Some leading Israeli anthropologists believe that, of all the many groups in the world who claim a connection to the 10 lost tribes, the Pashtuns, or Pathans, have the most compelling case. Paradoxically it is from the Pashtuns that the ultra-conservative Islamic Taliban movement in Afghanistan emerged. Pashtuns themselves sometimes talk of their Israelite connection, but show few signs of sympathy with, or any wish to migrate to, the modern Israeli state.

Now an Indian researcher has collected blood samples from members of the Afridi tribe of Pashtuns who today live in Malihabad, near Lucknow, in northern India. Shahnaz Ali, from the National Institute of Immunohaematology in Mumbai, is to spend several months studying her findings at Technion, the Israel Institute of Technology, in Haifa. A previous genetic study in the same area did not provide proof one way or the other.

The Assyrians conquered the kingdom of Israel some 2,730 years ago, scattering 10 of the 12 tribes into exile, supposedly beyond the mythical Sambation river. The two remaining tribes, Benjamin and Judah, became the modern-day Jewish people, according to Jewish history, and the search for the lost tribes has continued ever since. Some have claimed to have found traces of them in modern day China, Burma, Nigeria, Central Asia, Ethiopia and even in the West.

But it is believed that the tribes were dispersed in an area around modern-day northern Iraq and Afghanistan, which makes the Pashtun connection the strongest.

"Of all the groups, there is more convincing evidence about the Pathans than anybody else, but the Pathans are the ones who would reject Israel most ferociously. That is the sweet irony," said Shalva Weil, an anthropologist and senior researcher at the Hebrew University of Jerusalem.

The Pashtuns have a proud oral history that talks of descending from the Israelites.

Their tribal groupings have similar names, including Yusufzai, which means sons of Joseph; and Afridi, thought by some to come from Ephraim. Some customs and practices are said to be similar to Jewish traditions: lighting candles on the sabbath, refraining from eating certain foods, using a canopy during a wedding ceremony and some similarities in garments.

Weil cautioned, however, that this is not proof of any genetic connection. DNA might be able to determine which area of the world the Pashtuns originated from, but it is not at all certain that it could identify a specific genetic link to the Jewish people.

So far Shahnaz Ali has been cautious. "The theory has been a matter of curiosity since long ago, and now I hope a scientific analysis will provide us with some answers about the Israelite origin of Afridi Pathans. We still don't know what the truth is, but efforts will certainly give us a direction," she told the Times of Indialast year.

Some are more certain, among them Navras Aafreedi, an academic at Lucknow University, himself a Pashtun from the Afridi tribe. His family trace their roots back to Pathans from the Khyber Agency of what is today north-west Pakistan, but he believes they stretch back further to the tribe of Ephraim.

"Pathans, or Pashtuns, are the only people in the world whose probable descent from the lost tribes of Israel finds mention in a number of texts from the 10th century to the present day, written by Jewish, Christian and Muslim scholars alike, both religious as well as secularists," Aafreedi said.

The implications of any find are uncertain. Other groups that claim Israelite descent, including those known as the Bnei Menashe in India and some in Ethiopia, have migrated to Israel. That is unlikely with the Pashtuns.

But Weil said the work was absorbing, well beyond questions of immigration. "I find a myth that has been so persistent for so long, for 2,000 years, really fascinating," she said.


Just How Similar are Pashtun and Jewish People? | Sharnoff's Global Views

Just How Similar are Pashtun and Jewish People?

The Pashtun people who live in Afghanistan and Pakistan have common historical, linguistic and cultural similarities with Jewish people.


Credit: muslimbaniisrael.wordpress.com

Previously, we have compared the Pashtunwali, an unwritten code of conduct for the Pasthun people of Afghanistan and Pakistan, with the Jewish Torah.

Now we can look for similarities that originate from the Torah or from the Bible that do not have necessarily something in common with the Pashtunwali.

There are some recognized stories of Pashtun practices virtually identical to Jews: Lighting candles on Friday night, separation of meat and dairy, and covering graves with stones.

Moreover, some Pashtu names derive from Hebrew. For example, Asif, Assaf, Binyamin, Kenan, and Barak (Barak is the name of the known Barakzai tribe, which traces after Barak son of Avinoam, officer- warrior of the ancient Israeli Kingdom.

Barak means glance, sparkling, flash. The other names mentioned in the Torah: Asif (harvest in Heberew), Assaf (gather in Hebrew), also known as the compositor of the Levi’s (Liwan tribe) choir, Binyamin (fool of power), the 12th Israeli tribe, and Kenan (lamenter in Hebrew) the fourth generation of the humanity.

These names are quite ordinary in Israel and in Pashtun areas. Names that do not originate from the Torah, like Tameer (high in Hebrew/hideen in Aramaic) and Timor (carved decorating shape of palms found at the Jewish temple), are also common among the two groups, as well as Shir and Sahar.

Religious names and tool share common characteristics.

In Pashtu, names of God are known as Khudai; while in biblical Hebrew God is referred to as (El) Shadai. The Jewish prayer shawl (talit) issue also has a great resemblance to the Pashtu/Urdu word tolia which means towel.

Many Pashtun wear scarves which look like a talit: a wide white scarf decorated with blue stripes on both sides of it. The only thing that is missing in the knotted fringes (tzitzit) attached to its four corners.

Saturday in Pashtu is called Shanbay and Hebrew, Shabbat – the holy day of the week for Jews. During Shabbat, Jews are commanded to abstain from labor and reflect. Shabbat is the Jewish symbol of loyalty for God. In Pashtu, Sabat means loyalty, and on Shanbay work is also not allowed.

Furthermore, Pashtu and Hebrew prefixes originate from the ancient Semitic language Aramaic. For example, the prefix “De” which used in Hebrew and Pashtu literature means “from” or “of.”

There are probably more common words, names and phrases between the Pashtu, which belongs to western Iranian language group, and Hebrew which belongs to west Semitic language group. And yet both groups still have much in common, as the Pashtuns originate from the lost tribes of Israel.

Watch this excerpt from the Quest for the Lost Tribes of Israel




Your inputs my friends? @Solomon2 , @Slav Defence , @haviZsultan , @Green Arrow , @Syed.Ali.Haider , @Armstrong ,@WAJsal , @500

@Archdemon

Please do not be offended on my post, it was not intended to insult anyone my friends. As I have mentioned days ago, maybe just maybe we can start the peace here .....


at PDF...
Dear James,

You are not the only curious person.I have been continuously reading news about Jewish relation with Arabs and have also heard about their genetic relationships with Afridi tribe.It would be amazing if I will get my hands on research paper published in this regard.
My friend,there is no denying even if proved via genetic traits that either lost tribes of jewish were settled in SA and might be pashtuns or have been evolved from same area.(there is a difference b/w evolution from single father and being declared very close relative..of characteristics and variation,the degree of homology or similar characters they share etc)
However,politics and warfare in past decades and type of approach adopted is the major cause.The hate is not with jewish,infact jewish are very nice and sane people.The problem is with ideology Israel is following.Keeping all blame game and all hateful bullshit aside my friend..the main cause is that our orientation,interests and ideology completely reciprocates which makes us to oppose each other.:)
Forget genetic studies,I can simply show you verses that God himself have stated that we all are children of Adam(A.s) and we are also descendants of Noah(A.S) and Abraham(A.S).:D


regards
 
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Dear James,

You are not the only curious person.I have been continuously reading news about Jewish relation with Arabs and have also heard about their genetic relationships with Afridi tribe.It would be amazing if I will get my hands on research paper published in this regard.
My friend,there is no denying even if proved via genetic traits that either lost tribes of jewish were settled in SA and might be pashtuns or have been evolved from same area.(there is a difference b/w evolution from single father and being declared very close relative..of characteristics and variation,the degree of homology or similar characters they share etc)
However,politics and warfare in past decades and type of approach adopted is the major cause.The hate is not with jewish,infact jewish are very nice and sane people.The problem is with ideology Israel is following.Keeping all blame game and all hateful bullshit aside my friend..the main cause is that our orientation,interests and ideology completely reciprocates which makes us to oppose each other.:)
Forget genetic studies,I can simply show you verses that God himself have stated that we all are children of Adam(A.s) and we are also descendants of Noah(A.S) and AbrahaM(A.S).:D


regards

My Friend,

I just find it amazing specially after watching some videos on youtube and reading various articles I can find. I cannot help but wonder what if? Do you know any articles or papers that I can read with regards to this matter or any videos if you don't mind? Please send me the link brother. It is now almost 0500H here and I haven't slept yet.

Best regards,
James
 
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My Friend,

I just find it amazing specially after watching some videos on youtube and reading various articles I can find. I cannot help but wonder what if? Do you know any articles or papers that I can read with regards to this matter or any videos if you don't mind? Please send me the link brother. It is now almost 0500H here and I haven't slept yet.

Best regards,
James
Inshallah,I will post you tomorrow.It is Eid here and I am doing so many things simultaneously:)

regards
 
.
Although i m not against the cooperation between Pakistan and Israel at state level,But the point which people are missing here is that there will be a serious backlash in Pakistan in case Pakistan accepts israel.We will see a large number of Pakistanis opposing it vehementally and the most damaging thing will br that the fundamentalis mullahs and terrorist organisations will get another point to bash Pakistani govt and in this way the will try to justify their acts of terror against Pakistan by calling Pakistan as the "friend of infidels".
All of this will happen due to the mentallity that most Pakistanis have developed over the years due to fundamentalist ideologies.
@Slav Defence Sir your take on this
 
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Although i m not against the cooperation between Pakistan and Israel at state level,But the point which people are missing here is that there will be a serious backlash in Pakistan in case Pakistan accepts israel.We will see a large number of Pakistanis opposing it vehementally and the most damaging thing will br that the fundamentalis mullahs and terrorist organisations will get another point to bash Pakistani govt and in this way the will try to justify their acts of terror against Pakistan by calling Pakistan as the "friend of infidels".
All of this will happen due to the mentallity that most Pakistanis have developed over the years due to fundamentalist ideologies.
@Slav Defence Sir your take on this
As I have stated earlier that it will be ''suicide'' at every level.
1-Pakistan's foreign policy supports Palestine,not Israel.
2-Pakistan cannot afford to give a justified reason to terrorists outfits.We can manipulate to them in case of USA,since she has greater role in Russian-Afghan region.
3-Either Pakistan could have accepted in 1947,but since then whatsoever events have taken place cannot make Israel trust upon Pakistan.Pakistan will always be considered as threat due to past events and (vice versa)Pakistan due to Israel's attack in destroying Iraq's nuclear reactor and conspiracy with Indians etc.
4-Allowing Israel to establish democratic relations means,influencing Pakistan's decisions while keeping their interests.
5-Opening another channel to cold war.
6-Less brownies,greater threats.
7-Table talks,US pressure as well.
8-Huge embarrassment in Arab world.
9-Pakistan will loose respect/status in sight of Palestine and world as well.
10-Political defeat of Pakistan and huge demoralization of Palestine
11-Palestine will loose moral war as well
12-Cause of conflict blurred,Israel will be in huge benefit,while Pakistan will be in greater loss for sake of few brownies.

Regards
 
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BS.. I have Pashtun relatives,friends .. I've lived in rural Pashtun "semi tribal" areas ... Bacha bazi isn't a norm there ... It's the same as assholez in Panjab or other parts of the country using kids to satisfy their lust... Pashtuns than to northern alliance are more notorious/defamed.

But to be honest the gayest region in Pak is probably bannu?:lol:,Taunsa etc...

false,as per a recent survey,no city of KPK made it to the top ten list of cities by child molestation
 
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As I have stated earlier that it will be ''suicide'' at every level.
1-Pakistan's foreign policy supports Palestine,not Israel.
2-Pakistan cannot afford to give a justified reason to terrorists outfits.We can manipulate to them in case of USA,since she has greater role in Russian-Afghan region.
3-Either Pakistan could have accepted in 1947,but since then whatsoever events have taken place cannot make Israel trust upon Pakistan.Pakistan will always be considered as threat due to past events and (vice versa)Pakistan due to Israel's attack in destroying Iraq's nuclear reactor and conspiracy with Indians etc.
4-Allowing Israel to establish democratic relations means,influencing Pakistan's decisions while keeping their interests.
5-Opening another channel to cold war.
6-Less brownies,greater threats.
7-Table talks,US pressure as well.
8-Huge embarrassment in Arab world.
9-Pakistan will loose respect/status in sight of Palestine and world as well.
10-Political defeat of Pakistan and huge demoralization of Palestine
11-Palestine will loose moral war as well
12-Cause of conflict blurred,Israel will be in huge benefit,while Pakistan will be in greater loss for sake of few brownies.

Regards
Brilliant reply Sir.I was waiting for this kind of an answer that touches all the pros and cons and yet is brief.:tup:
 
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