Pakistan is now the real problem – Khan is about to pivot away from West ...

[khansaheeb]

Pakistan is now the real problem – Khan is about to pivot away from West, says BEN HABIB
Our withdrawal from Afghanistan and the manner of it is the biggest foreign policy disaster of the 21st century.
By BEN HABIB
PUBLISHED: 00:01, Thu, Aug 19, 2021 | UPDATED: 18:51, Thu, Aug 19, 2021
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Afghanistan: Pakistan are 'biggest victims' says minister










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Its immediate impact is a humanitarian crisis in Afghanistan but its long-term impact will be decades of instability and the loss of Western influence in the region. The Prime Minister blaming the Americans for this failure is risible. In doing so all he has done is lend credence to those that claim we are no more than a lapdog for the US, unable to stand alone as a military power and that we should never have bitten off more than we can chew. And he is wrong.


There is a great deal we could and should have done. For a start, we should have been vocal months ago against the withdrawal. We had to make it known in the West and in the region that we are utterly opposed to it.The reality is that we favoured the withdrawal. General Sir Nick Carter said so in early July. So we are complicit.

Imran Khan may be pushed further away from the West (Image: Getty)

The UK favoured the withdrawal, as confirmed by Gen Sir Carter (Image: Getty)
Moreover, we were hugely divisive in Afghanistan. We sought to impose our ideology over their theology, forcing Afghans to side with us or the Taliban. God is a powerful motivator.


And those that did side with us are now being tortured and killed – not just interpreters but anyone who joined our way.
Whatever we might have thought of their religion and culture, it was not for us to go into their ecosystem and thoroughly unbalance it.
Seeking to export “democracy” to North Africa, the Middle and Near East has been an unmitigated disaster. Stable democracies cannot be created at the end of the muzzle of a gun.
What started without a geopolitical aim is ending in a geopolitical catastrophe.
This particular catastrophe is not in fact in Afghanistan but its neighbouring Pakistan.
Just as the people of Afghanistan had to choose sides, so have the people and government of Pakistan.
The West’s war in Afghanistan has been to a significant extent prosecuted through Pakistan, variously relying on or admonishing it.


It is Pakistan that has had to deal with the fallout of the Afghan invasion and it will be Pakistan that will have to deal with the fallout of the retreat. There are already over 3 million Afghan refugees in Pakistan. This is now going to rise dramatically.
Pakistan rightly blames the West for the problems it faces in Afghanistan.

Afghan nationals cross the border into Pakistan at the border crossing in Chaman (Image: Getty)


It has little option but to make some sort of peace with the Taliban.


In doing so, it will pivot further away from the West. So robbed are we now of moral authority that they will have little truck with our wants and desires.
If we ever wanted to influence the Islamic world, the way to have done it was through what was moderate Pakistan. That opportunity has all but gone.
The power that will likely replace the West in the region is China.
It clearly sees the benefits that accrue to its Belt and Roads initiative from a close association with Pakistan. It has been financing projects in the country and the government for many years now.It will see the debacle in Afghanistan as an opportunity to further strengthen its ties. These overtures will be welcomed in Islamabad.

Afghanistan tops the list of countries most affected by terrorism (Image: Daily Express)China does not seek to export its ideology; it deals through commerce.It does not lecture Pakistan. It cooperates with the country. It is stable in its affections. It is therefore respected and welcomed.
https://www.express.co.uk/comment/e...istan-latest-Afghanistan-crisis-China-backing
We need to start taking a leaf out of China’s foreign policy approach. It has worked brilliantly in securing its global trade needs. Our obsession, on the other hand, with exporting our ideology and democracy has yielded nothing other than bloodshed, vast cost and the loss of moral authority.
We see China as a threat to the West. We abhor its human rights record. We wish to check its advances. But our retreat in Afghanistan has just propelled China forward and set ourselves back immeasurably in the region.

Xi Jinping... Should we be looking at China for reference? (Image: Getty)



It may be ironic that to secure our aims in the region we must emulate China’s approach but that is what we must do.
If anything is to be salvaged from the collapse in Afghanistan we need to eat a lot of humble pie and extend a hand of friendly support to Pakistan. We need to do that urgently.

To the Hindjews, Pakistan has always been a problem. Whatever Pakistan does and contributes is never enough to the colonialists. Only the undoing of Pakistan will satisfy their colonial hegemonistic lust.

 

[khansaheeb]

Pakistan's future and destiny is somewhat dependent on our relationship with China, Afghanistan and Iran. These nations have a DIRECT impact on Pakistan.

and India, for good or for bad.

 

[Arulmozhi Varman]

I agree with the article. The west has lost all leverage over Pakistan. Even the F16 diplomacy wont work...it has run its course. The west always claims that Islam was spread by the sword but never self reflected on how they spread democracy by bombs and bullets. There were better ways to fight the WoT without upsetting the balance of power in a region. If it was OBL, just use CIA and quietly drop a bomb on him. Would have been far easier if they did not invade Afghanistan because he would not have run from there. What could the Taliban of the 1990s do to against such US aggression?...a few protests, burning of a US embassy...and then it would have fizzled away.

Nah, the US was drunk in its own power...it committed a grave mistake...and it is solely responsible for its outcome. There is no way they can turn this and pin it on anyone else. Pakistan protected itself and had already experienced the US abandonment from the Soviet-Afghan war and was justified to back the right regional player. It balanced itself well in front of both and correctly calculated the eventual exit of the US. Now, we have a favourable Afghan government for the Pakistanis. The hell with the rest of the world if they dont understand. It is our neighbourhood and we live here.

China watched and observed the west and drafted its own foreign policies for every part of the world. That is why China is benefitting more from the US follies.




After so much lies and deceit, these western journalists do not have a leg to stand on. They clearly dont understand the region, the power dynamics. The western generals failed miserably who are probably the most informed people regarding such affairs. The western world needs to stop being the world's policeman...there are limits to such a power. Imagine all the money they threw away on these wars, they would not be struggling today against China's meteoric rise. Chinese war machinery's development is on a footing never seen before. The west is now struggling to field advance systems. No one is going to stop the west from repeating this mistake, eventually, it will run out of funds and its economy will shrink and with that its military reach and influence.

Blaming others is a folly and will yield nothing.

The west has one biggest leverage which Pakistan can't create over the next 10-15 years. Trade and immigration. If the China and US open border at the same time, to whom do you think the people will jump?

Your export trade is skewed towards the west. It's not going anytime down. It buys your products and not China. And your lawful migrants prefer West over China. Until less that trade is reduced and China's export trade rises and your migrants create an circle of influence in China, it's not going to happen.

 

[Blacklight]

There is a WSJ opinion called “reckoning for Pakistan “ - anyone have a link to the full article?

A Reckoning For Pakistan
By The Editorial Board
Aug. 16, 2021
6:38 pm ET

American strategists will be studying for some time how Afghanistan’s U.S.-trained security forces crumbled so quickly before what appeared to be an inferior Taliban militia. One place they should look for answers is Pakistan, whose leader on Monday cheered the Taliban takeover of its northwestern neighbor.
Afghans “have broken the shackles of slavery,” said Pakistan Prime Minister Imran Khan, according to Indian media. The offhand celebration of the U.S. retreat from Afghanistan came as Mr. Khan denounced English education in Pakistan as promoting cultural control.

That a U.S. security partner would say this out loud certainly raises eyebrows. But the sentiment should not surprise. As Walter Russell Mead notes nearby, a key obstacle to American success in Afghanistan was “unrelenting support for the Taliban from our ‘ally’ in Islamabad.” The Taliban safe-haven across Afghanistan’s southern border was crucial to the group’s longevity and eventual military success.
Over the last two decades, the U.S. depended on bases in Pakistan for its war-on-terror operations in Central Asia. Yet Islamabad is playing its own great-power games in the region.

Its intelligence services want control over Afghanistan and have seen the Taliban as the best vehicle. They want to frustrate the objectives of their greatest regional rival, India, which would prefer a secular government in Kabul.

The U.S. relationship with Islamist-influenced Pakistan has arguably become a devil’s bargain. Americans caught a glimpse of that a decade ago when they found out Osama Bin Laden was hiding in the country, apparently unmolested. Now Islamabad has played a key role in restoring to power the Taliban that the U.S. sacrificed for two decades to keep from power in Kabul.

But Mr. Khan may rue what he wished for. Jihadists want to control Pakistan and its nuclear weapons, which would instantly become a dangerous Islamist caliphate. Mr. Khan’s glib anti-Americanism may be an effort to appease Pakistan’s extremists, but he should watch that they don’t come for him first.

 

[Mahmood-ur-Rehman]

Not asure i fully agree with turning away from the west - but this bit i do.

Real problem is Pakistan: Khan about to pivot away from West BEN HABIB

Our withdrawal from Afghanistan and the manner of it is the biggest foreign policy disaster of the 21st century.

www.express.co.uk

For Jews Pakistan will remain a problem

 

[Falconless]

The west abandoned Pakistan many times in the past, why are they so shocked that Pakistan is now trying to find reliable partners?

 

[maverick1977]

The west has one biggest leverage which Pakistan can't create over the next 10-15 years. Trade and immigration. If the China and US open border at the same time, to whom do you think the people will jump?

Your export trade is skewed towards the west. It's not going anytime down. It buys your products and not China. And your lawful migrants prefer West over China. Until less that trade is reduced and China's export trade rises and your migrants create an circle of influence in China, it's not going to happen.

West already had a bigger market India, and cannon fodder against China. Pakistan was a liability.

 

[RoadRunner401]

Alternatively, it may be time to let Pakistan choose its own path forward, and if it is indeed away from the West, then so be it.

India Gets billions of dollars worth of bailout, Pakistan gets terrorists and sanctions, India gets trade, Pakistan gets drone strikes, India spends billions spreading terrorism in Pakistan, Pakistan gets FATF... And in the end, Pakistan is told to do more...


If it isn't in Pakistan's favor, it's not happening anymore, PrimeMisniter of Pakistan has made it pretty clear we will no longer fight your wars, but we are your partners in peace and trade...

The reckoning for Pakistan will come from within it, and relatively soon.

Arabs no longer hold any real power in Pakistan, Saudis man on the run rest of the Traitors stand exposed plus Military general have learned their lesson, Reckoning days from with In are done.

 

[cloud4000]

Who is the wife in this scenario?

Depends on the perspective. This editorial could be easily found in a Pakistani newspaper to describe the US.

 

[SQ8]

A Reckoning For Pakistan
By The Editorial Board
Aug. 16, 2021
6:38 pm ET

American strategists will be studying for some time how Afghanistan’s U.S.-trained security forces crumbled so quickly before what appeared to be an inferior Taliban militia. One place they should look for answers is Pakistan, whose leader on Monday cheered the Taliban takeover of its northwestern neighbor.
Afghans “have broken the shackles of slavery,” said Pakistan Prime Minister Imran Khan, according to Indian media. The offhand celebration of the U.S. retreat from Afghanistan came as Mr. Khan denounced English education in Pakistan as promoting cultural control.

That a U.S. security partner would say this out loud certainly raises eyebrows. But the sentiment should not surprise. As Walter Russell Mead notes nearby, a key obstacle to American success in Afghanistan was “unrelenting support for the Taliban from our ‘ally’ in Islamabad.” The Taliban safe-haven across Afghanistan’s southern border was crucial to the group’s longevity and eventual military success.
Over the last two decades, the U.S. depended on bases in Pakistan for its war-on-terror operations in Central Asia. Yet Islamabad is playing its own great-power games in the region.

Its intelligence services want control over Afghanistan and have seen the Taliban as the best vehicle. They want to frustrate the objectives of their greatest regional rival, India, which would prefer a secular government in Kabul.

The U.S. relationship with Islamist-influenced Pakistan has arguably become a devil’s bargain. Americans caught a glimpse of that a decade ago when they found out Osama Bin Laden was hiding in the country, apparently unmolested. Now Islamabad has played a key role in restoring to power the Taliban that the U.S. sacrificed for two decades to keep from power in Kabul.

But Mr. Khan may rue what he wished for. Jihadists want to control Pakistan and its nuclear weapons, which would instantly become a dangerous Islamist caliphate. Mr. Khan’s glib anti-Americanism may be an effort to appease Pakistan’s extremists, but he should watch that they don’t come for him first.

Expected better from the WSJ - not in terms of intent but rather the articulation of the message. More whiney and mouth-frothing frustration instead of a well thought out opinion even if the message was to be the same.

 

[jamal18]

few years from now US will be just as irrelevant in international politics as USSR was after Afghan defeat.

' Those whom the Gods destroy, they first make mad.'

I think a little longer.

 

[Reichsmarschall]

Depends on the perspective. This editorial could be easily found in a Pakistani newspaper to describe the US.

But Pakistan isn't going anywhere, it's the USA who is leaving us

 

[VCheng]

India Gets billions of dollars worth of bailout, Pakistan gets terrorists and sanctions, India gets trade, Pakistan gets drone strikes, India spends billions spreading terrorism in Pakistan, Pakistan gets FATF... And in the end, Pakistan is told to do more...

There are many things Pakistan has done in all of this saga that you are simply ignoring, but it is not for me to mention them at PDF.

Arabs no longer hold any real power in Pakistan, Saudis man on the run rest of the Traitors stand exposed plus Military general have learned their lesson, Reckoning days from with In are done.

Pakistan's problems are internal, and that does not mean the Arabs. Its gravest existential threats continue to worsen from totally within Pakistan.

 

[MultaniGuy]

few years from now US will be just as irrelevant in international politics as USSR was after Afghan defeat.

Lets hope so. I personally hope countries like China and Brazil fill in the void.
USA needs to adopt an isolationist policy and mind its own business.

The west abandoned Pakistan many times in the past, why are they so shocked that Pakistan is now trying to find reliable partners?

Exactly like the Pressler Amendment. For Pakistani Nationalists like ourselves we should not fall into the same trap again.

I would rather work with the Chinese, and maybe the Russians. But the Russians are pro-India though.