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pakistan is being looted via expensive Qatari gas

The details of contract never became public and hence internet speculations.

But i heard from an Iranian official that Iran had suggested Pakistan with free gas in Exchange for allowing Iran to access Indian market. Almost free, i mean.

An other publicized detail was that Iran was ready to build the Pakistani section of pipeline providing Khatam Al Anbia with 500 million dollar loan to do the job.

The only thing that Pakistan had to do was, sitting on a table and enjoy the show.
Sounds to good to be true. I remember listening to a federal ministry involved in negotiations with Iran about Iranian side refusing to lower their gas prices. Every step of IP project was much discussed in media. There wasn’t any free ride.
And get sanctions too?
Negotiations took place when UN was about to lift sanctions of Iran after P5+1 nuclear deal. Iranians were asking way too much price.
 
I believe we live in world of internet. I took them from various news reports available online for free.

yes, here's something from the internet




^^ hammad azhar has said IRAN GAS is stopped due to US santions

no where does it mention price
( you may want to read it all)

----------

please stop talking B.s
i remember listening to a federal ministry involved in negotiations................


LOL
 
Hi,

Can you please provide landfall and end consumer price comparissions for Qatar (2016 and 2021) Lng Contracts and NG from Iran (through IP) for better understanding.



hi

NG intl 'spot ' ( market ) price as of today is = 5.14 USD / MMbtu


LNG intl 'spot' ( market) price as of today = around 30 USD / MMBtu


oilprice.com


-------------

even if iranian gas is expensive , its still way cheaper than LNG . Iran cannot sell above mkt spot rate anyway
 
With or without sanctions, what was the difference in the lives of average Pakistanis?

Yeh batain karna bara asan hota hai, but when push comes to shove, you would be the first one out on the streets protesting mehengai.

I agree, PTI is doing dumb mistakes in a lot of places, but let us just all also accept that we are in this position because of decades of negligence, ineptitude, and apathy by not only those in power, but also the people.
 
Yeh batain karna bara asan hota hai, but when push comes to shove, you would be the first one out on the streets protesting mehengai.

I agree, PTI is doing dumb mistakes in a lot of places, but let us just all also accept that we are in this position because of decades of negligence, ineptitude, and apathy by not only those in power, but also the people.
I wasn't trying to undermine the situation in Pakistan sir, but merely trying to state the fact that following American imposed policies blindly cannot make one prosperous. The project was stopped by American snakes but they never introduced Pakistani side with a better and a safer choice. Rouhani the idiot followed western advices and in return, inflation hit our economy and Iranian currency went down the drain. Iran is no exception sir.

In case of Pakistan importing LNG, knowing the fact that Pakistan's enemy has a Long sea border with it, LNG owuld be the most insecure way of importing energy. Indian navy is strong enough to make problems.

Besides, a pipeline from Pakistan into India would have provided Pakistan with political leverage over Indians having their energy life line in their hands.

Cheap gas plus a safe energy source/route plus a political leverage. If it was up to me, i wouldve paid Double price just to have that leverage.
 
even if iranian gas is expensive , its still way cheaper than LNG . Iran cannot sell above mkt spot rate anyway
if you want to get hit by sanctions, then by all means, go ahead. also, why didnt mian saab go for this deal in his tenure?
 
I wasn't trying to undermine the situation in Pakistan sir, but merely trying to state the fact that following American imposed policies blindly cannot make one prosperous. The project was stopped by American snakes but they never introduced Pakistani side with a better and a safer choice. Rouhani the idiot followed western advices and in return, inflation hit our economy and Iranian currency went down the drain. Iran is no exception sir.

In case of Pakistan importing LNG, knowing the fact that Pakistan's enemy has a Long sea border with it, LNG owuld be the most insecure way of importing energy. Indian navy is strong enough to make problems.

Besides, a pipeline from Pakistan into India would have provided Pakistan with political leverage over Indians having their energy life line in their hands.

Cheap gas plus a safe energy source/route plus a political leverage. If it was up to me, i wouldve paid Double price just to have that leverage.

Govt after govt is an idiot. The best time to get Iranian oil and gas was during the American invasion of Afghanistan. They needed Pakistan at that time, we should have milked the opportunity.
 
:coffee:

When Iran's Oil and Gas enters market it creates a "Surplus" of supplies
When there is more of something it crashes the Prices down 30-50%

For countries like Pakistan and China , Iranian Oil and Gas , is good as it drops international Prices

Prices have hiked up only because Iran is not fully allowed to bring it's Oil and Gas Supplies in market

There is enough oil and gas to last another 1,000 years easily

1637146842238.png





Unfortunately , due to political pressure Pakistan has shown reluctance to complete the oil and gas projects pipelines with Iran, had it done it long time ago , our Oil and Gas bill would have dropped 70%

We could have negotiated country to country preferential deals
 
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yes, here's something from the internet




^^ hammad azhar has said IRAN GAS is stopped due to US santions

no where does it mention price
( you may want to read it all)

----------

please stop talking B.s



LOL
In late October 2013, Sustainable Policy Development Institute published a report in which the proposed pipeline was termed as "death sentence" for Pakistan. Since the prices in the contract are linked to crude oil prices, the government "blatantly ignored the energy dynamics and its pricing while going for this deal". The gas sold to Pakistan will be higher priced than the current domestic prices of gas in the country.

Stop creating BS threads and keep repeating yourself like a broken record. Hamad Azhar wasn’t any minister at that times. Question of Sanctions came later. Iranian even offered loan to Pakistan to finish the pipeline, but fact remains that Zardari govt signed a bad deal and favored Iran, because Iranian assets support Zardari thugs like Uzair Bloch and other Shia politicians in sindh.

IP gas was expensive than LNG even after Including LNG Transportation cost.Iranian were not building Billions of dollars worth of pipeline for charity. They were charging everything to Pakistan in gas rates.
 
In late October 2013, Sustainable Policy Development Institute published a report in which the proposed pipeline was termed as "death sentence" for Pakistan. Since the prices in the contract are linked to crude oil prices, the government "blatantly ignored the energy dynamics and its pricing while going for this deal". The gas sold to Pakistan will be higher priced than the current domestic prices of gas in the country.

Stop creating BS threads and keep repeating yourself like a broken record. Hamad Azhar wasn’t any minister at that times. Question of Sanctions came later. Iranian even offered loan to Pakistan to finish the pipeline, but fact remains that Zardari govt signed a bad deal and favored Iran, because Iranian assets support Zardari thugs like Uzair Bloch and other Shia politicians in sindh.

IP gas was expensive than LNG even after Including LNG Transportation cost.Iranian were not building Billions of dollars worth of pipeline for charity. They were charging everything to Pakistan in gas rates.


No sources
No authentic links


Keep going with the b.s


Hammad azhar , a sitting energy minister, is wrong .

And you, an internet troll is right
IP gas was expensive than LNG even after Including LNG Transportation cost.Iranian were not building Billions of dollars worth of pipeline for charity. They were charging everything to Pakistan in gas rates.

Another lie and fabrication by you.

Based on heresay and made up conjectures

You should stay away from topics you have no clue about


Lng spot rate. 30 usd per mmbtu
Ng spot . 5 usd per mmbtu

Oilprice.com
 
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1 . qatar ,a crook , cunning state is manipulating and under supplying the market to ' pump ' LNG prices while there is ample evidence to prove that LNG market is over supplied .

@muhammadhafeezmalik


2 . qatar extracts gas from its share of the gigantic south pars natural gas field ( shared with iran) .

The South Pars/North Dome field is a natural-gas condensate field located in the Persian Gulf. It is by far the world's largest natural gas field,[1] with ownership of the field shared between Iran and Qatar.[2][3] According to the International Energy Agency (IEA), the field holds an estimated 1,800 trillion cubic feet (51 trillion cubic metres) of in-situ natural gas and some 50 billion barrels (7.9 billion cubic metres) of natural gas condensates.[4] On the list of natural gas fields it has almost as much recoverable reserves as all the other fields combined. It has significant geostrategic influence



3. why are Pakistani policy makers buying expensive, spot rate LNG when iran has one the largest gas deposits( existing and being discovered ) and is willing to work with pakistan ?

LNG is far more expensive to transport, re gassify and make available to consumers . NG just needs to be connected to existing systems



4. iran has just discovered the Chalous gas field in the caspian sea, the gas field is being developed by russian companies and it is estimated that the capacity is 40TCM ( one of the largest in the world )


my hypothesis stands - the gas /LNG market is extremely over supplied and pakistani policy makers are buying expensive SPOT lng for no reason ( kickbacks ?)
--------------------------------------


A deal finalized last week to develop Iran’s multi-trillion dollar new gas discovery, the Chalous field, will see Russian companies hold the major share in it, followed by Chinese companies, and only then Iranian ones, sources close to the deal exclusively told OilPrice.com. This is despite Chalous’s position unequivocally within the Iranian sector of the Caspian Sea, over which the Islamic Republic has complete sovereignty. Billions of dollars in additional capital investment are scheduled to come from financial institutions in Germany, Austria, and Italy, as the indications are that the size of Chalous’s gas reserves are even greater now than initially thought. According to one of the senior Russian officials involved in negotiating the deal: “This is the final act of securing control over the European energy market.”

In context, the wider Caspian basins area, including both onshore and offshore fields, is conservatively estimated to have around 48 billion barrels of oil and 292 trillion cubic feet of natural gas in proven and probable reserves. As exclusively covered and analyzed by OilPrice.com in 2019, Russia was instrumental in manipulating a change in the legal status of the Caspian basins area that meant that Iran’s share of the total revenues from the entire Caspian site was slashed from 50-50 split with the USSR that it had enjoyed as from the original agreement made in 1921 (on ‘fishing rights’) and amended in 1924 to include ‘any and all resources recovered’ to just 11.875 percent. Before the Chalous discovery, this meant that Iran would lose at least US$3.2 trillion in revenues from the lost value of energy products across the shared assets of the Caspian Sea resource going forward. Given the latest internal-use only estimates from Iran and Russia, this figure will now be a lot higher.

Previously, the estimates of Iran and Russia were that Chalous contained around 3.5 trillion cubic meters (Tcm) of gas in place. This equated to around one-quarter of the 14.2 Tcm of gas reserves contained in Iran’s supergiant South Pars natural gas field that already accounts for around 40 percent of Iran’s total estimated 33.8 Tcm of gas reserves and about 80 percent of its gas production.


As it now stands, though, revealed exclusively to OilPrice.com, following further studies by Russia, the Chalous discovery is now seen as essentially a twin-field site, nine kilometers apart, with ‘Greater’ Chalous having 5.9 trillion cubic meters (Tcm) of gas in place, and ‘Lesser’ Chalous having 1.2 Tcm of gas, giving a combined figure of 7.1 Tcm of gas. Therefore, the new Chalous figures would give Iran a total natural gas reserves figure of 40.9 Tcm, whilst Russia – for a long time, the holder of the largest gas reserves in the world – officially has just under 48 Tcm. That Russian figure, though, has not been revised to account for usage, wastage, and gas field degradation for many years, and, according to Russian gas sources, is around 38.99 Tcm as of the end of 2020. Consequently, the Chalous find makes Iran the biggest gas reserves holder in the world.

These new estimates, on top of recent developments in the European gas market, have led to a change in the plan that had been agreed on between Iran and Russia and had remained in play up until around a month ago. The plan had been for Iran’s side of the development to be led by the Khazar Exploration and Production Company (KEPCO), with the additional principal participation of then-to-be finalized Russian companies. Following both the upgrading of the gas reserves estimates in Chalous and spiraling gas prices across Europe in the previous weeks, the new stake split in the combined Chalous twin-sites is as follows: Russia’s Gazprom and Transneft will together hold a 40 percent share, China’s CNPC and CNOOC together a 28 percent share, and KEPCO a 25 percent share only. “Gazprom will have overall responsibility for managing the Chalous development, Transneft will do the transportation and related operations, CNPC is doing a lot of the financing and providing the necessary banking facilities, and CNOOC will be doing the infrastructure parts and engineering,” said one of the sources.

Related: Biden’s Baffling Oil Policy Faces Backlash From All Sides

Bad as this may seem for Iran, it is actually much worse than that for two key reasons, according to the sources close to the deal. First, although KEPCO will nominally be in charge of Iran’s limited operations on the Chalous site, the real management on Iran’s side will be in the hands of hydrocarbons companies closely associated with the Islamic Revolutionary Guards Corps (IRGC). Second, and the explanation as to why the IRGC has suddenly taken over the Iranian side of the project, is that the 7 percent left over after the stake splits above have been removed from 100 percent, is destined to be paid into two corporate accounts – one in Shanghai and the other in Macau – that are ultimately under the control of the IRGC. This is also the reason why the IRGC has played down the true level of the reserves in Chalous since OilPrice.com’s exclusive first report on the subject was published.

Although the IRGC has stated in a series of internal discussions within the Iranian government recently that the new terms of the Chalous deal that have placed Russian and Chinese interests above those of Iran are ‘the price we have to pay for Iran’s access to the technology and manufacturing capacity required for our missile program’, the ramifications of it are much greater than the size of future IRGC slush funds in Shanghai and Macau. Russia’s Transneft in just the past two weeks projected that Chalous alone can provide up to 72 percent of all of the natural gas requirements for Germany, Austria, and Italy every year for the full 20 years that the Chalous deal is set to run. Transneft has also reported to Moscow that Chalous alone could supply up to 52 percent of all of the European Union’s gas needs over the period as well. To gain effective control over these new Iranian gas flows through securing such a stake in Chalous, Russia privately assured Iran that, in addition to development and exploration expertise, and some funding, it will also ‘seek to support Iran’s interests in the matter of the JCPOA [Joint Comprehensive Plan of Action] and in other matters at the UN’.

Aside from the enormous geopolitical value for Russia in adding the Chalous gas streams to the current gas supplies over which it has control, especially into the EU, Moscow is looking at an enormous financial payoff from its involvement in this field. Russia has calculated that, using an annual mean average figure of US$800 per 1,000 cubic meters of gas (it has been much higher than this, of course, in recent weeks), the value of exports from Chalous at a comfortable rate of recovery from the site is at least US$450 billion over the 20-year duration of the deal, which coincides with the next 20-year Iran-Russia deal. After the 20-year deal is up, the agreement currently is that the IRGC corporate vehicle Khatam al-Anbiya will take over ownership of Chalous for the next 50 years. Given the likely length of gas recovery at Chalous – and the fact that Russia intends to take less than 10 percent of it out over the course of its 20-year deal - sources close to the deal estimate the total value of the Chalous gas site at US$5.4 trillion.

By Simon Watkins for Oilprice.com



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If LNG is expensive so Pakistan should use Furnace oil and diesel for electricity generation??
 
کبھی قطری شہزادہ کبھی قطری گیس۔
Looks like Pakistan is stuck with Qatar in a bad way.
 
It is really pathetic... you have coal; why dont you invest in Sasol's technology and be independent with Coal to Liquid. Convert Coal to syngas and then what ever distilate you need.
 
The details of contract never became public and hence internet speculations.

But i heard from an Iranian official that Iran had suggested Pakistan with free gas in Exchange for allowing Iran to access Indian market. Almost free, i mean.

An other publicized detail was that Iran was ready to build the Pakistani section of pipeline providing Khatam Al Anbia with 500 million dollar loan to do the job.

The only thing that Pakistan had to do was, sitting on a table and enjoy the show.

Hi,

The GSPA (Gas Sale & Purchase Agreement) was signed between Iran and Pakistan. India backed out of the project in 2009 and didn't sign the GSPA.

"India quit the project in 2009, citing costs and security issues, a year after it signed a nuclear deal with Washington."


Iran did offer $500m loan for construction of Pakistan's portion but had later backed out.

"Pakistan in October asked Iran to shoulder the entire $2 billion cost of building the Pakistani part of the pipeline, but Iran declined. Iran had earlier assured Pakistan $500 million for the gas pipeline, but later backed out of that deal. "


hi

NG intl 'spot ' ( market ) price as of today is = 5.14 USD / MMbtu


LNG intl 'spot' ( market) price as of today = around 30 USD / MMBtu


oilprice.com


-------------

even if iranian gas is expensive , its still way cheaper than LNG . Iran cannot sell above mkt spot rate anyway

Hi,

The price of Iranian Gas through Iran-Pakistan Pipeline after proposed amendments in earlier signed GSPA was around equivalent to 12% (1) of Brent. Iran did not sign this amendment and only gave verbal commitments. So, the earlier signed GSPA linked to JCC (Japan Crude Cocktail) still stands with price equivalent to 14.25% (2) -13.4% (3) of Brent. Even if they had signed the amended GSPA (at 12% Brent), the price was outrageous and made no sense (even in 2017) and was even higher than Pakistan Lng contracts with Eni and Gunvor (priced at 11.6247-12.14% & 11.6247%) (5), that were signed in 2016. Their signed offered price stands at equivalent to +13.4% Brent, even higher than Qatar (13.37% Brent) 2016 Lng contract. Our new Qatar contract is priced at 10.2% Brent (4).

(1) https://www.thenews.com.pk/amp/180093-Pakistan-in-talks-with-Iran-to-renegotiate-IP-project-GSPA


"Shahid Khaqan Abbasi, minister for petroleum and natural resources, told the upper house that the government has requested Iranian authorities to bring changes in the gas sale and purchase agreement (GSPA). The price of natural gas, under GSPA, was agreed at $12 per million metric British thermal unit (MMBtu), if crude oil price stood at $100/bbl in the international market."

(2) https://www.dawn.com/news/1238783

"Compared with the natural gas import options, the government claimed the delivery price at border under the Iran-Pakistan gas pipeline was $5.70 per MMBTU at $40 Brent price and that of Turkmenistan-Afghanistan-Pakistan-India was $5.90."

(3) https://www.oxfordenergy.org/wpcms/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/NG-77.pdf
Page 37 of 87 (or 30)

1637307766748.png


(4) http://www.ogra.org.pk/download/6761

1637308750557.png


(5) http://www.ogra.org.pk/download/6568

1637308598684.png



If you are interested, please read following for Eni, Gunvor and IP GSPAs.

As much as I want that pipeline to be constructed, the pricing formula linked to JCC makes this gas totally unfeasible for Pakistan, specially when the world is moving to price LNG on gas-linked benchmarks (Henry Hub and TFF).

Current Price = (a x JCC) + b,

where,
a = 0.063 (6.3%), when JCC is between $30-70,
0.05 (5%), when JCC falls outside $30-70 range.

b (fixed component) = $1.15/mmbtu, when JCC is between $30-70,
$1.54/mmbtu, when JCC is below $30,
$2.06/mmbtu, when JCC is above $70.

It would be a sad day for Pakistan, if IK government moves forward with construction phase, without renegotiating a gas-linked pricing formula linked to HH, and reducing, preferably completely dropping this 'b' fixed component. Pakistan must not be bearing the operational cost of the Iranian portion of the pipeline, the same way Iran will not be shouldering operational cost for Pakistan's side of the pipeline. This fixed cost is totally unacceptable, and must go.
Eni contract is another prime example of the corrupt practices followed by PMLN government, but unfortunately is not discussed as much as Qatar. The contract is for 1cargo/ month for 15 years with PLL, total 180 cargoes, but the price breakup makes it very interesting.
i) 11.6247% for the first two years (2017 through 2019 - 24 cargoes),
ii) 11.95% for the following two years (2019 through 2021 - 24 cargoes),
iii) 12.14% for the remaining 11 years (2021 till 2032, 132 cargoes). (Also, keep in mind, PLL-Gunvor, 5 year term contract for 1 cargo/ month, priced at 11.6247%, signed at the same time as this Eni contract)
 

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