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Pakistan has formally proposed Siachen pullback - India

Broadsword: Pak formally proposed Siachen pullback, says Antony

Pakistani president, Asif Zardari, had formally appealed to Prime Minister Manmohan Singh for a mutual withdrawal of troops from the Siachen Glacier sector. Defence Minister, AK Antony says the request was made on April 8 in New Delhi, a day after an avalanche buried 129 Pakistani soldiers and 11 civilians at Gyari, the headquarters of a Pakistani battalion near Skardu in Pakistan Occupied Kashmir (***).

While several Pakistani decision-makers, including the army chief, General Ashfaq Pervez Kayani and Pakistan Muslim League (Nawaz) chief, Nawaz Sharif, have issued media calls for a mutual withdrawal, only now has it emerged that Pakistan officially broached this proposal with New Delhi.

On Monday, Antony told the Lok Sabha, “In view of the recent avalanche resulting in heavy casualties at Siachen, Pakistan has requested India for withdrawal of their respective troops from the region.”

In his written reply to a parliamentary question, Antony further stated “The President of Pakistan, during his meeting with Prime Minister on April 8, 2012, pointed out the need for all issues in the bilateral relationship including Sir Creek, Siachen, and Jammu & Kashmir to be addressed. Both leaders felt need to move forward step by step and find pragmatic and mutually acceptable solutions to all those issues.”

A range of Pakistani leaders have supported General Kayani and Nawaz Sharif in calling for a mutual withdrawal from “the Siachen Glacier.” For the Pakistan Army --- say Indian experts like Lt Gen PC Katoch, former commander of the Siachen Brigade --- an early withdrawal would mask the stinging defeat they suffered here after the Indian Army established itself atop the towering Saltoro Ridge that gives India complete domination over the Siachen Glacier.

“The Pakistan Army has been badly beaten on the Siachen Glacier, but they hide that from their public. Kayani, like his predecessors, wants to demilitarise the glacier and end the dispute quickly so that the Pakistani people never get to know,” says Katoch.

Meanwhile the Siachen dialogue makes little headway. Through 12 rounds of talks, the most recent last May, New Delhi has insisted that it will pull back troops only after joint “authentication” of the frontline along the 109-kilometre Actual Ground Position Line (AGPL), as the de facto border is called. The AGPL has never been marked on the ground or on any document accepted by both sides. If Pakistan violated a demilitarisation treaty, says the Indian Army, it would enjoy easier geographical access to Siachen, leaving India at a serious disadvantage.

Pakistan resists “authentication” as a pre-requisite to demilitarisation, ostensibly because that would legitimise the AGPL, and India’s alleged “violation of the Simla Agreement” which restrains both sides from altering the status quo on the border. Pakistan wants demilitarisation, withdrawal and authentication to proceed simultaneously. Last month, after General Kayani’s call for a mutual withdrawal, Islamabad announced that it would stick to its traditional position.

Prime Minister Manmohan Singh, however, has earlier been willing to accommodate Pakistan in a Siachen settlement. In 2005, during a visit to Siachen, he stated that he would like to convert Siachen into “a mountain of peace.”

The Siachen became a military flashpoint in April 1984, when the Indian Army occupied Bilafond La, a pass above Siachen, narrowly beating a planned Pakistani occupation of the same pass. Although there has been a ceasefire in place since 2003, most casualties in the 16,000-21,000 foot battleground take place due to weather.

I certainly do not agree to Katoch's view, who are we to educate Pakistan, its upto the citizens of pakistan to realise the difference between the truth and cooked up story by its army and political fraternity. We should settle this issue with some innovative methods, well I did try to come up with some not sure whether these have been already suggested or not.

i) Get the recent satellite picture depicting the positions of both the armies and submit the same in UN and demilitarize the zone. Have those positions continuously monitored via satellites and if there is any change in position then we have a case for not trusting them any more. Not sure whether this is technically feasible.

ii) Add an additional clause to state to the AGPL agreement stating that these positions depict the areas occupied by the respective forces before demilitarization and not deemed to be a LOC, borderline or LAC. If any one party breaks the trust by violating this agreement the other party holds the right to claim the positions back by force. And make both the parties sign on them. It will make sure that it doesn't legalize any position and is mere reflective of the positions and the right to capture the same again if any one party violates the agreement.

iii) Agree to have a weekly once joint monitoring of positions post demilitarization with the satellite maps that has been submitted to UN ( point 1). And the frequency can be reduced over the period of time If there is an increase in trust, but any frequency change will have to be agreed mutually in written by both parties.

iv) set up high altitude heli-pads or use the existing base camp helipads to fly over every alternate day to observe any change in positions or any illegal occupation of lands. May prove costly for India and the cost may have to be shared by both the parties just to make this option work.

v) monthly once organize a civilian-military joint trekking expedition on both sides so that any illegal occupation can be easily noticed. However first option is mandatory for this to work.

I'm sure both Indian & Pakistani govt may have plenty of options on table and possibly some of these may have also been discussed already. But if there is a true intent to establish peace you can really achieve that. Atleast organize a meeting and discuss on all the options and release the resulting feedback/concerns/acceptance from either countries to the people of both countries and internationally too. This would actually bring out the parties who are not willing to make cooperate to create peace.

Please note that my meaning of cooperation doesn't necessarily mean concessions
 
hope India will think positively and pull back both sides from this cold hell after mark border once for ever and forget it .save 100s of millions dollars and 100s lives of brave men yearly.

No Idea Imran Bhai, nothing's been said so far about any pull back here.
 
Both India and Pakistan should stay as it is in Siachin. Demilitarization would set base for another military conflict b/w two nuclear armed nations(due to lack of faith) that could result to all out war next time.
 
:D No , They ar not thinlong of any war. War with India will make huge trouble for thm. Unlike 1971, in 2012 Most of the world is not backening thm.

No one want to end p with Nuke armagadon.

!971 Most of the world was backing Pakistan news to me but it will go off topic so i will eave it alone.

Both India and Pakistan should stay as it is in Siachin. Demilitarization would set base for another military conflict b/w two nuclear armed nations(due to lack of faith) that could result to all out war next time.

Neither indian or Pakistani guys controlling nukes are stupid or dumb that the first sign of fight they will nuke each other
 
Pakistan is showing that this is hurting them badly (Not that its hurting us any less)

By doing this, Pakistan has lost the chip to bargain.

Pakistan blinked first. Its advantage India.
 
hope India will think positively and pull back both sides from this cold hell after mark border once for ever and forget it .save 100s of millions dollars and 100s lives of brave men yearly.

I Strongly Recommend Imran Khan as a mediator left on siachen to look after both sides interest:rofl:

Pakistan is showing that this is hurting them badly (Not that its hurting us any less)

By doing this, Pakistan has lost the chip to bargain.

Pakistan blinked first. Its advantage India.

dude this is called politics at the world stage we have reached out for peace its chips gained not lost.
 
dude this is called politics at the world stage we have reached out for peace its chips gained not lost.

What politics?

You have taken the first step for troops withdrawal...you have now put the ball in India's court.

I dont see India softening its position now since we know that its hurting you so badly that you request a troop withdrawal despite the fact that you have only one third the no. of troops of what India has in that region.
 
indian stand has been clear for a while now. recognize current ground positions and IA will gladly move back.

Say as much in clear words and be done with it, pass the ball into Pakistan's court. But this isn't seem to be happening.
 

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