Pakistan F-16 Discussions 2

[nightrider_saulat]

US yes....israel, no.

in fact, Egypt only gains from israeli tourism (e.g. Sharm El Sheikh and other parts of Sinai)

we are pretty dependent on U.S. for F-16 after-sales service.

i have heard that the israeli influence is so much that they even don't have the right to buy precision guided bombs from US for their F-16....

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

i have heard that the israeli influence is so much that they even don't have the right to buy precision guided bombs from US for their F-16....

oh, no doubt about it!

but that is just due to strong lobbying, and diplomatic bias. But i dont think Egypt is reliant on israel for survival.....even though diplomatic TIES with israel are to its convenience. It gives some "assurance" to the U.S. that they wont pose threat to israel. We could also talk about how it puts pressure on Egypt government NOT to allow the opening of Rafah border, which would provide some relief to Gazans under blockade.


you know how it is with the Americans, when it comes to defence related acquisitions. Unless they REALLY need you ---there is always a catch; always strings attached, etc.

and it still appears that israeli lobby groups like AIPAC are pretty powerful, and can block high tech goods to countries within its neighbourhood and even beyond.



In fact, i'm surprised that Lockheed Martin was allowed to sell Egypt the LANTIRN/Sniper targetting pods (it was either one, or the other, or both).

 

[blain2]

The only thing that Egyptians are being held back from on the F-16s is AMRAAMs. Aside from that all armament is allowed and this includes PGMs.

 

[nightrider_saulat]

oh, no doubt about it!

but that is just due to strong lobbying, and diplomatic bias. But i dont think Egypt is reliant on israel for survival.....even though diplomatic TIES with israel are to its convenience. It gives some "assurance" to the U.S. that they wont pose threat to israel. We could also talk about how it puts pressure on Egypt government NOT to allow the opening of Rafah border, which would provide some relief to Gazans under blockade.


you know how it is with the Americans, when it comes to defence related acquisitions. Unless they REALLY need you ---there is always a catch; always strings attached, etc.

and it still appears that israeli lobby groups like AIPAC are pretty powerful, and can block high tech goods to countries within its neighbourhood and even beyond.



In fact, i'm surprised that Lockheed Martin was allowed to sell Egypt the LANTIRN/Sniper targetting pods (it was either one, or the other, or both).

despite of all these lobies and pressure throuh US even in today scenario i think egypt can't sustain israeli air dominance.......in one on one fight....
egypt 240 falcon+mirage 2000
v/s
israel 299 falcons + 68 eagles

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

israel has a pretty powerful airforce...nobody is denying that

in fact, the only Air Force in the region that could actually challenge israel 1-on-1 would be Turk Hava Kuvvetleri

and they are licensed under Lockheed Martin to modify and produce the falcons...



cut the military aid to israel, and they wouldnt last too long. But it seems Egypt, Jordan, israel, Pakistan, Turkiye --we all rely on U.S. to much extent as far as Air Force is concerned.

 

[blain2]

despite of all these lobies and pressure throuh US even in today scenario i think egypt can't sustain israeli air dominance.......in one on one fight....
egypt 240 falcon+mirage 2000
v/s
israel 299 falcons + 68 eagles

Depends on pilot training and effective employment, otherwise the Egyptians have the hardware to not only put up a great fight, but also seriously damage Israeli ground offensive.

It would be a shame if even with 240 F-16s and additional Mirage 2000s, E2 Hawkeyes, Mirages and F-7s, the Egyptians were unable to hurt Israelis in the air and on the ground.

 

[nightrider_saulat]

Depends on pilot training and effective employment, otherwise the Egyptians have the hardware to not only put up a great fight, but also seriously damage Israeli ground offensive.

It would be a shame if even with 240 F-16s and additional Mirage 2000s, E2 Hawkeyes, Mirages and F-7s, the Egyptians were unable to hurt Israelis in the air and on the ground.

and also their track records in previous wars doesn't put them in the driving seat

 

[ice_man]

with all the latest gadgets i am sorry the egyptians are no match for the israelis! it has been proven gadgets alone don't win you wars! the israeli air defence force is the best trained & highly qualified! and the egyptians will not be able to put up a strong fight it has been proven in the past once the Egyptian airforce in the previous wars left its friendly SAM coverage they got massacred!

 

[SBD-3]

with all the latest gadgets i am sorry the egyptians are no match for the israelis! it has been proven gadgets alone don't win you wars! the israeli air defence force is the best trained & highly qualified! and the egyptians will not be able to put up a strong fight it has been proven in the past once the Egyptian airforce in the previous wars left its friendly SAM coverage they got massacred!

well Israel doesn't consider Egyptians as a threat, honestly. Turks, well there is something not friendly going on between Turks and Israel these days....the relationships are deteriorating. Even Turks use Israeli weaponry...so no real threat from there as well. Saudis and UAE, already "half-Allies".....no threat from there as well. the threat is from.....Palistine, secondly Iran (which i honestly think don't have the capability to challenge IAF in conventional war. Pakistan, well far enough to be a threat....also busy with its own business. So its an open Ground for Zionists all around. Egypt has also shown interest in JF-17. Wangrong once posted that they want 100 fighters manufacturing facility any updates on this?

 

[Windjammer]

Each and every country has it's own vested interests at heart, until and unless they are directly threatened, they will not even twitch. Attack on Lebanon and the constant Palestinian cleansing are just two examples as how the Muslim World buries it's head in the sand. Perhaps many of you are unaware that early in 80s, when Iraq's nuclear plant was attacked, the Israelis actually flew through Saudi air space to reach their target. The lame excuse put out by the Saudis was that the transmissions (by Israelis) were in Arabic so it was difficult to distinguish.

 

[SBD-3]

Each and every country has it's own vested interests at heart, until and unless they are directly threatened, they will not even twitch. Attack on Lebanon and the constant Palestinian cleansing are just two examples as how the Muslim World buries it's head in the sand. Perhaps many of you are unaware that early in 80s, when Iraq's nuclear plant was attacked, the Israelis actually flew through Saudi air space to reach their target. The lame excuse put out by the Saudis was that the transmissions (by Israelis) were in Arabic so it was difficult to distinguish.

yes i remember and that too with refuling facility from Saudi Air Bases ( Just in case needed) .....even though there was a lot of buz in the media about the same thing few days ago when a repot surfaced stating that Saudis have given Israel permission to use Saudi Airspace for a possible attack on Iranian Nuke Installations.

 

[fatman17]

ACM Qamar today indicated that 8 F-16 C/D will be delivered by June 2010. rest by Dec - 2010.

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

ACM Qamar today indicated that 8 F-16 C/D will be delivered by June 2010. rest by Dec - 2010.

really? i missed it....

 

[M_Saint]

really? i missed it....

Could anyone please inform whether it would require congress to vote for the selling of AESA and DFRM in future?

 

[fatman17]

really? i missed it....

r we being sarcastic!