Pakistan F-16 Discussions 2

[SQ8]

Some of us have been opening this thread for years waiting for news of a new F-16...

People buy lottery tickets all their lives without winning a single penny. But they still do it.

 

[kursed]

Some of us have been opening this thread for years waiting for news of a new F-16...

I will make it easy for you then, there are no new F-16s coming. Pakistan simply does not have enough funds for such buys. And Americans are not extending PAF any leeway on CSF payments. If PAF were to ever even buy any frames, they'd be used birds.

 

[Xone]

People buy lottery tickets all their lives without winning a single penny. But they still do it.

Pakistan chances of getting F16 are no more than a lottery ticket. We have to throw them in the dustbin at the end of this wistful insatiable expectation.
Sooner we get out of this nostalgic mania, the better for Pakistan

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

I will make it easy for you then, there are no new F-16s coming. Pakistan simply does not have enough funds for such buys. And Americans are not extending PAF any leeway on CSF payments. If PAF were to ever even buy any frames, they'd be used birds.

When a country is short on funds, it does 1 of 3 things:

1. take out loans, which we can't due to FATF and not-so-great credit ratings.

2. sell-off state properties, resources, etc, which we can't because the majority of valuable properties are under ill-gotten / shady ownership of former or current state-funded employees.

3. undertake a massive economic engineering project that focuses on producing and exporting valuable goods to foreign markets. The simplest solution for a country with a large population is to force domestic sourcing on all entities looking to sell to the local market.

E.g., if you want to sell anything to this 200-million-strong market, you must produce 51-90% of that thing's value (based on a gov't assessment using foreign benchmarks) in Pakistan.

If you enact this policy, there is no reason why Pakistan wouldn't become a top-10 or top-15 producer of cars, clothing, food, consumer goods, appliances, construction material, car parts, etc, etc.

I imagine a substantial chunk of your population will be employed, thereby enabling you to generate state revenue and buy the defence hardware you need. Of course, I wouldn't even do that, I would continue to re-invest in the local industry so that we create feeder industries and produce that hardware ourselves. Plus, I'd like to see Pakistani-owned businesses compete with other giants in the highest-value industries of today and tomorrow.

However, the fact that Pakistan can't or won't do number-3 is at this point just agonizing. There's no doubt that our leaders put as thought into this country as some chachi does in her 7/11 or gas station. It's not even corruption at this point -- at least the corrupt and broke countries in Latin America can produce great football teams, but in Pakistan, even our cricket is suspect.

Do we as a nation (including myself) have an undiagnosed cognitive disability? Are we so functionally incapable that we need Americans, Chinese, Arabs or Turks to take the lead for us? Be it the secular realm or the religious realm, why are we always -- without fail - deferring to others and not taking initiative?

 

[kursed]

When a country is short on funds, it does 1 of 3 things:

1. take out loans, which we can't due to FATF and not-so-great credit ratings.

2. sell-off state properties, resources, etc, which we can't because the majority of valuable properties are under ill-gotten / shady ownership of former or current state-funded employees.

3. undertake a massive economic engineering project that focuses on producing and exporting valuable goods to foreign markets. The simplest solution for a country with a large population is to force domestic sourcing on all entities looking to sell to the local market.

E.g., if you want to sell anything to this 200-million-strong market, you must produce 51-90% of that thing's value (based on a gov't assessment using foreign benchmarks) in Pakistan.

If you enact this policy, there is no reason why Pakistan wouldn't become a top-10 or top-15 producer of cars, clothing, food, consumer goods, appliances, construction material, car parts, etc, etc.

I imagine a substantial chunk of your population will be employed, thereby enabling you to generate state revenue and buy the defence hardware you need. Of course, I wouldn't even do that, I would continue to re-invest in the local industry so that we create feeder industries and that hardware ourselves.

However, the fact that Pakistan can't or won't do number-3 is at this point just agonizing. There's no doubt that our leaders put as thought into this country as some chachi does in her 7/11 or gas station.

Bilal, for us to be able to do even 20% of what you suggest - would need an unprecedented investment into raising the level of Human Resources available within the country. We do not have the labor to take on extensive high-tech projects and our investor / trader class is rentier. They survive on state largesse and unable to perform well on their own.

Pakistan's issue is a multi-generational issue, starting at the lack of creative ideas from the very top. For a country with a huge young population, the Gov/State simply has failed to provide them with opportunity or the tools to do better.

 

[Xone]

sourcing on all entities looking to sell to the local market.

Our rupee has lost competitive value, just because of this one factor our local buyers will be outclassed by foreign invertors.
growth of economy is heavily interlinked with political stability of the country, besides long term planning.
We are dagger drawn at present.

 

[GriffinsRule]

ACM Mushaf Ali Mir shaheed in front of 84708

 

[Yongpeng Sun-Tastaufen]

Some of us have been opening this thread for years waiting for news of a new F-16...

Not going to happen with the sanction the US put on Pakistan. Pakistan can't even get AH-1Z let alone a new F-16. As long as Pakistan is at odds with India and friendly with China, the US won't sell F-16 to Pakistan. J-10C is the replacement of F-16 once the frames run out after 50 years by 2030.

 

[ghazi52]

PAF F-16 Blk 52 | Vertical Rolls | Rehearsals | 2021

 

[untitled]

The PAF doesn't canabalise its Vipers,

They were before the MLUs happened

 

[airomerix]

The PAF doesn't canabalise its Vipers, it's only done that with used Mirages from Lebanon, Libya and Australia.

Every aerospace organization cannibalizes its assets on a temporary basis to make other assets serviceable. It's not like we have 100% serviceability for our F-16s. It is impossible.

 

[blain2]

Not going to happen with the sanction the US put on Pakistan. Pakistan can't even get AH-1Z let alone a new F-16. As long as Pakistan is at odds with India and friendly with China, the US won't sell F-16 to Pakistan. J-10C is the replacement of F-16 once the frames run out after 50 years by 2030.

US has no sanctions on Pakistan currently.

 

[ziaulislam]

US will never allow that considering Pakistan is under sanction. Not even AH-1Z are ever delivered after Pakistan paid for it. Once F-16 frames run out their lives in Pakistan they will be replaced by J-10C which has similar size as F-16.

We never paid for ah 1z

 

[Trailer23]

Here you go. #84708 inflight.

View attachment 726353

Aray wha..., sir jee.

You see, there is reason why I only tag a less than a handful of individuals when it comes to these sort of things. Brilliant find .

And Americans are not extending PAF any leeway on CSF payments.

You may be/could be right. Lets see how they get their junk out of Afg without the assistance of Pakistan. The only thing is Pakistan better play its cards right.

Not going to happen with the sanction the US put on Pakistan.

Sanctions ?!!

Sorry, but which 'Sanctions' are you referring to?

 

[The Raven]

Every aerospace organization cannibalizes its assets on a temporary basis to make other assets serviceable. It's not like we have 100% serviceability for our F-16s. It is impossible.

Wrong. The PAF has never cannibalised its Viper fleet, even during the height of the Pressler sanctions in the 90s. Happy to be proved wrong. So you're telling me the USAF cannibalises its Viper and Eagle fleet? Do you know what 'cannibalise' means in this context?

They were before the MLUs happened

Nope, they weren't, we never cannibalised an entire Viper airframe for the sake of any other, but happy to be proved wrong.