Pakistan F-16 Discussions 2

[Donatello]

10-0 Kill Ratio in Air Combat by PAF in Soviet Afghan War.

Totally asymmetric engagements. Huge technological gap between PAF F-16s and the Soviet/Afghan aircrafts. Nothing to be proud of, at least in my humble opinion. If these were shot down by F-6 or Mirages, perhaps than it would be considered 'kills'.

A kill is a kill.

Since Our arch enemy to the east still flys a lot of soviet era planes, it would be interesting to see how PAF matches up, considering BVR fighters like JF-17 and F-16 coming. Perhaps with the exception of Mirage 2000, Su30 and Mig29, rest are all cannon fodder.

But it also shows that PAF was a very proficient wvr/dog fighting force.

 

[syedali73]

A kill is a kill.

Since Our arch enemy to the east still flys a lot of soviet era planes, it would be interesting to see how PAF matches up, considering BVR fighters like JF-17 and F-16 coming. Perhaps with the exception of Mirage 2000, Su30 and Mig29, rest are all cannon fodder.

But it also shows that PAF was a very proficient wvr/dog fighting force.

Right, in Ex CM Balochistan Raisani's words "a degree is a degree, real or fake". I don't know what kind of proficiency is needed to shoot down ground attack and unarmed transport aircrafts. But if you say, a kill is a kill, so be it.

As far as canon fodder is concerned, why would Indians field those relics (many are already retired minus Bisons, which are still formidable due to BVR) in the first place? So that PAF shoot those down and bring down IAF's morale? In an event of war, IAF will field her front line fighters to quickly establish complete air superiority.

 

[Bilal.]

Right, in Ex CM Balochistan Raisani's words "a degree is a degree, real or fake". I don't know what kind of proficiency is needed to shoot down ground attack and unarmed transport aircrafts. But if you say, a kill is a kill, so be it.

As far as canon fodder is concerned, why would Indians field those relics (many are already retired minus Bisons, which are still formidable due to BVR) in the first place? So that PAF shoot those down and bring down IAF's morale? In an event of war, IAF will field her front line fighters to quickly establish complete air superiority.

By that measure non of the kills by the US and the allies can be counted in the two gulf wars and the yugoslavia.

 

[syedali73]

By that measure non of the kills by the US and the allies can be counted in the two gulf wars and the yugoslavia.

Yes, you are right. If someone insists to call 'duckshoot' a kill, then maybe.

Yes, when PAF pilots in their F-86s shot down superior Hunters and nimble Gnats, those were the kills.

 

[Inception-06]

A kill is a kill.

Perhaps with the exception of Mirage 2000, Su30 and Mig29, rest are all cannon fodder.

.

And what is than our Mirrage and J-7 Fleet, which is more than 60% of the PAF inventory also "cannon fodder" or "Air superiority fighter" ?

 

[Bilal.]

Yes, you are right. If someone insists to call 'duckshoot' a kill, then maybe.

Yes, when PAF pilots in their F-86s shot down superior Hunters and nimble Gnats, those were the kills.

Those were THE kills, afghan/soviet ones were just kills

 

[Donatello]

And what is than our Mirrage and J-7 Fleet, which is more than 60% of the PAF inventory also "cannon fodder" or "Air superiority fighter" ?

Technically the old F-7s and Mirages are cannon fodder. But At least they are being phased out.

Right, in Ex CM Balochistan Raisani's words "a degree is a degree, real or fake". I don't know what kind of proficiency is needed to shoot down ground attack and unarmed transport aircrafts. But if you say, a kill is a kill, so be it.

As far as canon fodder is concerned, why would Indians field those relics (many are already retired minus Bisons, which are still formidable due to BVR) in the first place? So that PAF shoot those down and bring down IAF's morale? In an event of war, IAF will field her front line fighters to quickly establish complete air superiority.

I think you are using the wrong analogy here. But nevermind. The aircraft were shot down and hence the kill recorded.

 

[nomi007]

finally pakistan got chinese f-16

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=687993431257002

 

[khanasifm]

Potential for additional F16 assuming these were used total 45000 hours / 34 = ~1300 hours during the period 2003-2010/12 by Italian and another 3000 by USAF there should be at least another 3000 or 4000 hours left on them

VMAS_F-16_index

Potential for additional F16 assuming these were flown for a total 45000 hours / 34 = ~1300 hours per a/c during the period 2003-2010/12 by Italian and another 3000 by USAF there should be at least another 3000 or 4000 hours left on them. With same engine as PAF i.e. 220E and all other bells and whistle

VMAS_F-16_index

 

[ziaulislam]

well with F-35 pouring in soon, we should expect more f-16s available from USAF but to get them we will need political support from USA which seems sketchy at the moment

 

[fatman17]

well with F-35 pouring in soon, we should expect more f-16s available from USAF but to get them we will need political support from USA which seems sketchy at the moment

3rd party route is best. jordan, dutch, belgium etc.

 

[fatman17]

Quote of the Day
Hold your stick, or lose your balls. -- Bumper sticker

 

[Luftwaffe]

3rd party route is best. jordan, dutch, belgium etc.

Jordan sold 13 f-16s to Pakistan at the same time they sold earlier some f-5s and kept in reserve/retired f-1s I suspect either advance block 50+ f-16s or the saudi funded typhoons could be arriving by 2017 but don't think so jordan can operate 2 squadons or more typhoons they are expensive...belgium/dutch sold some f-16s to jordan, how much life is left belgium/dutch falcons.

 

[fatman17]

Jordan sold 13 f-16s to Pakistan at the same time they sold earlier some f-5s and kept in reserve/retired f-1s I suspect either advance block 50+ f-16s or the saudi funded typhoons could be arriving by 2017 but don't think so jordan can operate 2 squadons or more typhoons they are expensive...belgium/dutch sold some f-16s to jordan, how much life is left belgium/dutch falcons.

after MLU they are good for another 4,000 hours minimum.

 

[drunken-monke]

10-0 Kill Ratio in Air Combat by PAF in Soviet Afghan War.

Totally asymmetric engagements. Huge technological gap between PAF F-16s and the Soviet/Afghan aircrafts. Nothing to be proud of, at least in my humble opinion. If these were shot down by F-6 or Mirages, perhaps than it would be considered 'kills'.

A kill is a kill irrespective of platform and opponent... Wouldn't Su22 or Su25 or Mig 21 fired on F16???