Pakistan F-16 Discussions 2

[blain2]

Can you please explain whats in the main difference (as in a typical war scenario we could face) between the upgraded blk 40s and the blk 52s? I ain't exactly an aviation expert so anything in layman's term would be highly appreciated especially if in view of the role the planes will play in our force.

thanks

Blk40s are no longer being produced. PAF F-16s would all be upgraded to blk 52 avionics and armament capability. This would allow us standardization on AI radar, targeting pods, AAMs and smart munitions. The only difference would be that blk52s would be JDAM and Harpoon AShM capable while the older A/Bs would not be (they would rely on LGBs albeit with much greater effectiveness thanks to Sniper pod allowing day/night/adverse weather delivery of the LG ordnance).

Airframe wise the two versions in use would be markedly different. Blk-52s would house more ECM gear and allow for much greater endurance than the blk-15s.

 

[Zob]

i wonder why pakistan cannot try and get licenced MLU's done in Pakistan. I mean this will help us in two things.firstly cost cutting secondly we wil get to know the technological know how which might benefit us in our JF-17's R&D. and i also want to know what F-16's is india being offered because if the do purchase them will there technology be upto block 60 or close to block 50.

 

[Myth_buster_1]

Blk40s are no longer being produced. PAF F-16s would all be upgraded to blk 52 avionics and armament capability. This would allow us standardization on AI radar, targeting pods, AAMs and smart munitions. The only difference would be that blk52s would be JDAM and Harpoon AShM capable while the older A/Bs would not be (they would rely on LGBs albeit with much greater effectiveness thanks to Sniper pod allowing day/night/adverse weather delivery of the LG ordnance).

Airframe wise the two versions in use would be markedly different. Blk-52s would house more ECM gear and allow for much greater endurance than the blk-15s.

blain with all due respect, i thought you knew better.
i dont know why people still have this presumption of MLU M3 being so much inferior to block52+. i can provide you a ebook link on F-16 MLU "M2" basic pilot training manual with JDAM AMRAAM coverage.
also in 1980s F-16 "block30" conducted Harpoon tests so yes, our MLU fleet can do anything that new Block52 will do. the only advantage i see of new block is that it has new air frame, more operational time and minor technical advantage.

 

[ajpirzada]

blain with all due respect, i thought you knew better.
i dont know why people still have this presumption of MLU M3 being so much inferior to block52+. i can provide you a ebook link on F-16 MLU "M2" basic pilot training manual with JDAM AMRAAM coverage.
also in 1980s F-16 "block30" conducted Harpoon tests so yes, our MLU fleet can do anything that new Block52 will do. the only advantage i see of new block is that it has new air frame, more operational time and minor technical advantage.

so this mean our F-16 MLU are almost as gud as F-16 block52+?

 

[Super Falcon]

is that F 16 block 52 would be the same in tha shape which israeli fighter jets has and uae fighter jets there is slight difference

 

[blain2]

blain with all due respect, i thought you knew better.
i dont know why people still have this presumption of MLU M3 being so much inferior to block52+. i can provide you a ebook link on F-16 MLU "M2" basic pilot training manual with JDAM AMRAAM coverage.
also in 1980s F-16 "block30" conducted Harpoon tests so yes, our MLU fleet can do anything that new Block52 will do. the only advantage i see of new block is that it has new air frame, more operational time and minor technical advantage.

I am not claiming that its an impossibility to have support for JDAM and Harpoon on MLU'd blk15s, however none of the reported upgrades in the MLU program cater to JDAM and Harpoon delivery. By the way, PAF F-16s are not getting M3 tape. We are getting M4/5 which includes support for JSOW as well. Harpoon is capable of being integrated with Block 20, 30/32, 40/42, 50/52, and 60 aircraft. The only blocks that have not been integrated with Harpoon are 10/15. Secondly, I recall that of the original MLU countries, only Norway was able to integrate an AShM and it was the Penguin AShM on their blk15s because the Harpoon integration was not forthcoming.

I also think that an MLU is a great thing. It gives our older aircraft parity with some of the most modern 4.5 gen aircraft. Even if we do not have Harpoon/JDAM capability, there is plenty of other stuff that these aircraft can do.

Here is a list of updates in the MLU program from open source.

DT&E software tapes 1 thru 4

The DT&E aircraft now use the MLU Tape-1 software. This version will be replaced in June 1996 by the more extensive Tape-2 at the beginning of the OT&E phase. Tape-4 denote the final version which will be used in the Mid Life Update of other aircraft to be modified.

Development of the M1-tape went through four phases of Flight Test Tapes (FTT). In each of these test tapes, other performances where met, including:

FTT-1 tape

* Radar performance evaluation

FTT-2 tape

* Weapon modes Air-Air and Air-Ground testing
* Navigation (INS and GPS)
* Basic MMC core functions integration

FTT-3 tape

* Datalink
* IFF interrogation
* Horizontal Situation Display
* DTS integration
* Cockpit color screen implementation

FTT-4 tape

* "Clean-up" tape (intended as correction to imperfections found in earlier phases)

After the M1 tape, the M2 tape followed in 2000, M3 tape in 2003, M4 tape in 2005 and M5 tape in 2009. All these tapes incorporate other features, including:

M2 tape

* Automatic Target Hand-off System (ATHS)
* Integration of anti radiation missile capability
* Integration of target designator system
* Further implementation of the Digital Terrain System

M3 tape

* Integration of the Link-16 system
* Integration of capability for GPS controlled weapons (GBU30/32)
* Introduction of Helmet Mounted/Cueing Sight
* Introduction of NVG compatible helmets

M4 tape

* Introduction of advanced short-range missile, as a replacement for the current Sidewinder (AIM-9X, IRIS-T)
* Integration of advanced Link-16 functions
* Integration of SNIPER targeting pods

M5 tape

* Integration of capability for stand-off weapons (AGM-154)
* Introduction of more advanced A/G weapons (EGBU-12)
* Introduction of advanced Stores Management System

 

[Quwa]

PAF F-16s will also have JHMCS.

 

[TOPGUN]

Yea wonder wat shape they gona be good point??

 

[superbikez]

wil pak purchase new F16s Block 60 or 50/52 in 2009 or 2010 ??? anychance ?? anyone know ?

 

[TOPGUN]

Can we some pic's of the new Paf f-16 shapes to come ? thx

 

[RS4]

question?

I know there is already a thresd about this, but as Paf are getting 18 blk 52 F16s, what will Paf do if IAF choose the more advanced F16 IN for its MRCA programme. Will we still look to F16 blk/52/60 to give us a high tech edge?

 

[Neo]

We're sticking with the plan to buy 18 block 52 F-16CD and to upgrade existing fleet plus 32 surplus ex-USAF to MLU3 level. The deal will really boost PAF's capabilities.

PAF's near future plans include the acquisition of FC-20, a more powerful 4.5 gen fighter in the league of Typhoon that will meat any threat from our eastern border.

Tough its still too early to reveal details I can only tell you that we're in contact with Russia for the delivery of a Russian powerplant, I can't reveal more detalis as yet.
This variant has increased thrust and TVC capability, very suitable for the single engined FC-20.

 

[RS4]

We're sticking with the plan to buy 18 block 52 F-16CD and to upgrade existing fleet plus 32 surplus ex-USAF to MLU3 level. The deal will really boost PAF's capabilities.

PAF's near future plans include the acquisition of FC-20, a more powerful 4.5 gen fighter in the league of Typhoon that will meat any threat from our eastern border.

Tough its still too early to reveal details I can only tell you that we're in contact with Russia for the delivery of a Russian powerplant, I can't reveal more detalis as yet.
This variant has increased thrust and TVC capability, very suitable for the single engined FC-20.

IS the j10 really in the same league as the Typhoon, it is one of the most tech advanced aircraft in the woorld and can super cruise and has a powerful x band radar, so how can the two be compared my friend.

 

[Neo]

IS the j10 really in the same league as the Typhoon, it is one of the most tech advanced aircraft in the woorld and can super cruise and has a powerful x band radar, so how can the two be compared my friend.

Too early to tell about its capabilities but the FC-20 is a further development of the J-10B (not the basic J-10A) which is widely considered as 4.5 gen MRCA. Its being tested in China as we speak.

 

[IceCold]

We're sticking with the plan to buy 18 block 52 F-16CD and to upgrade existing fleet plus 32 surplus ex-USAF to MLU3 level. The deal will really boost PAF's capabilities.

PAF's near future plans include the acquisition of FC-20, a more powerful 4.5 gen fighter in the league of Typhoon that will meat any threat from our eastern border.

Tough its still too early to reveal details I can only tell you that we're in contact with Russia for the delivery of a Russian powerplant, I can't reveal more detalis as yet.
This variant has increased thrust and TVC capability, very suitable for the single engined FC-20.

Neo can you please shed some more light on the engine of the JFs. I know this isnt the thread however since your post is related to all the related developments, are we going with the same RD-93 or perhaps we might opt for a better engine with more thrust and smoke free from Russia perhaps the RD-93B.