Pakistan blocks NATO supplies

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Actually, until the PNSC returns its formal proposal on how to take the bilateral relationship forward, the ball, presently, is in Pakistan's court.

The US does not need PNSC recommendations to apologize for its criminal and illegal military operations on Pakistani soil, and its unprovoked murder of Pakistani troops.

 

[VCheng]

The US does not need PNSC recommendations to apologize for its criminal and illegal military operations on Pakistani soil, and its unprovoked murder of Pakistani troops.

I can respect that statement as your personal opinion, even though I disagree with it. However, Pakistan will need to make the same statement as part of its official demand for it to have any possible impact with the US government.

Hence, I would suggest waiting for the PNSC's formal response, as you have been indicating too.

 

[BATMAN]

I'm surprised to see an American believing that it is Pakistan's civil govt. who is going to decide the fate of transit AID and not Pasha.

 

[VCheng]

I'm surprised to see an American believing that it is Pakistan's civil govt. who is going to decide the fate of transit AID and not Pasha.

Gen. Pasha is retiring March 18, and I am sure that the decision about bilateral US-Pakistan relations is much more important than to be left to just one man, powerful as he may be at the moment. Besides, PNSC has the requisite military input from its highest levels too, correct?

 

[BATMAN]

Gen. Pasha is retiring March 18, and I am sure that the decision about bilateral US-Pakistan relations is much more important than to be left to just one man, powerful as he may be at the moment. Besides, PNSC has the requisite military input from its highest levels too, correct?

Why are you mumbling? Once Pasha retires than some one else will be on your mind.

No one in Pakistan believe in your much triumphed PNSC.
This corrupt mafia work for US interest and not Pakistani.

While Gilani is known for his treacherous mind set.

'you Americans, keep up drone strikes and we'll keep protesting in assemblies'
'war casualties may matter to US but it does not matter to us'

What good such people can deliver to Pakistan?

 

[VCheng]

..................
No one in Pakistan believe in your much triumphed PNSC.
This corrupt mafia work for US interest and not Pakistani...................

Well, let's see, do you consider the following members in bold as part of the mafia that you do not believe in?:

PNSC has 21 members:

Chairman Asif Ali Zardari (President of Pakistan)

Vice Chairman Yousaf Raza Gillani (Prime minister of Pakistan)

Military Advisor General Khalid Shameem Wynne (Chairman of Joint Chiefs of Staff Committee)

Intelligence Advisor Lieutenant General Ahmad Shuja Pasha (DG of Inter-Services Intelligence)

Science Advisor Dr. Ishfaq Ahmad (Science Advisory Commission)

Cabinet Members Hina Rabbani Khar (Minister of State for Foreign Affairs), Ahmad Mukhtar (Defence Minister of Pakistan), Abdul Hafeez Shaikh (Finance Minister of Pakistan), Rehman Malik (Interior Minister of Pakistan)

Military Members General Ashfaq Parvez Kayani (Chief of Army Staff), Admiral Noman Bashir (Chief of Naval Staff), Air Chief Marshal Rao Qamar Suleman (Chief of Air Staff)

Civilian Members Farooq H. Naek Chairman of Senate, Dr. Fahmida Mirza Speaker of National Assembly, Nisar Ali Khan Leader of the Opposition

Additional Members Shahbaz Sharif (Chief Minister of Punjab), Aslam Raisani (Chief Minister of Balochistan), Qaim Ali Shah (Chief Minister of Sindh), Syed Mehdi Shah (Chief Minister of Gilgit-Baltistan), Ameer Haider Khan Hoti (Chief Minister of Khyber Pakhtunkhwa), Asif Farooki (Prime Minister of Kashmir)

 

[Developereo]

Defeating the terrorists and establishing the rule-of-law within Pakistan will go a long way towards resolving Pakistan's economic problems. The blockade stuff is a sideshow.

Your political class employs many distractions to keep the hoi polloi unfocused.

On the contrary, all these aspects are related.

The NATO blockade is a symbolic (and substantial) move to exercise Pakistani sovereignty and thwart foreign agendas inimical to Pakistan's long term interests. Just because Pakistan has abrogated sovereignty in other instances (drone strikes, Abbotabad) does not mean it should do so everywhere. Most sober people understand that Pakistan can not afford to get into a shooting match with NATO/US. Indeed, with its ongoing provocations, there is a possibility that that is exactly what the US wants so it can decimate Pakistan's military capability in order to neutralize Pakistan and install India as the regional hegemon. The NATO blockade is a 'cold' war that Pakistan can fight against NATO.

As for the economic mismanagement of Pakistan, that, too, is seen as part of the overall foreign control of Pakistan. American (and Arab) paid stooges play musical chairs in parliament with no ability, or desire, to solve Pakistan's problems. The charade of so-called democracy continues while the country bleeds.

 

[Icewolf]

our economy was better when generals ruled

---------- Post added at 11:55 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:54 PM ----------

i hate this democracy

 

[regular]

The resumption of NATO supplies is not going to resolve Pakistan's economic and FE problems, regardless of whether it results in the release of a few peanuts in US aid and US support for lending from IFI's.

It is in fact better for Pakistan to default, rather than continue to half-survive on the crutches of the peanuts in handouts from the US, as it has done for the past few years under the PPP government.

Yes! absolutely! Defaulting on the repayments of loans looks like a best option for our country.....we don't need no aid or any other stuff from outside world. We need to standup on our feet and control our expenses.....

 

[AbhimanyuShrivastav]

You are providing hearsay - how do I know you aren't concocting views out of thin air, or presenting the opinions of your local barber as 'trusted constituencies'?

Again, unless you have some facts our sources whose credibility can be established, your argument is just speculation.

I think, sir, you are being over hostile here. I have multiple threads here that talk of reports from members' relatives in ISI, PAF and what not, talking of stuff that they claim to have heard from their "reliable sources". How is this any different?

But given that you are an administrator, I will take your direction on face value, even if I dont like it or consider it fair.

 

[fd24]

The US does not need PNSC recommendations to apologize for its criminal and illegal military operations on Pakistani soil, and its unprovoked murder of Pakistani troops.

This is it - They violate OUR land, they are informed on numerous occassions that its a case of blue on blue, they hold an investigation investigating themselves into their own crime and find it within themselves NOT to officially apologize - yet Cheng believes "the ball presently is in Pakistan court". If he viewed the world by removing his tinted stars and stripes spex - he would realize that to attempt to build relations an apology is paramount. The reason why they are hostile to this suggestion is an apology is an acceptance of blame and liability - and they cant do that. Who else was their to blame??
I feel Cheng has clearly a lack of respect for the spilt blood of Pakistani soldiers. This disrespect is paralleled with the views of his beloved USA.

 

[VCheng]

This is it - They violate OUR land, they are informed on numerous occassions that its a case of blue on blue, they hold an investigation investigating themselves into their own crime and find it within themselves NOT to officially apologize - yet Cheng believes "the ball presently is in Pakistan court". If he viewed the world by removing his tinted stars and stripes spex - he would realize that to attempt to build relations an apology is paramount. The reason why they are hostile to this suggestion is an apology is an acceptance of blame and liability - and they cant do that. Who else was their to blame??
I feel Cheng has clearly a lack of respect for the spilt blood of Pakistani soldiers. This disrespect is paralleled with the views of his beloved USA.

Let's take this point by point, shall we?

They violate OUR land,

... because parts of that land are used for exporting terror, and this needs to be stopped. If you clean up your own house, then we don't need to do it ourselves. But cleaned it shall be.

they are informed on numerous occassions that its a case of blue on blue,


It is a case of blue on blue, with the causes known, described, and acknowledged.

they hold an investigation investigating themselves into their own crime and find it within themselves NOT to officially apologize


There is no crime, but an accident, as the report reveals.

- yet Cheng believes "the ball presently is in Pakistan court".


Of course it is, since Pakistan is taking all the time it needs to set the conditions from its side to proceed with bilateral relations, or not, as the decision may be.


If he viewed the world by removing his tinted stars and stripes spex - he would realize that to attempt to build relations an apology is paramount.


There are many more grounds to build relations that are not contingent upon the Salala incident, and are quite important as well.

The reason why they are hostile to this suggestion is an apology is an acceptance of blame and liability - and they cant do that. Who else was their to blame??


There were multiple factors that formed the root causes of the accident.

I feel Cheng has clearly a lack of respect for the spilt blood of Pakistani soldiers. This disrespect is paralleled with the views of his beloved USA


I have expressed my regrets and respect for the soldiers in the field, and I mean that. However, I have no respect for those whose policies and decision expose these brave men to these undue risks, without proper equipment, training or tactics, while perpetuating the lawless condition that only compound these errors of judgement.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

I think, sir, you are being over hostile here. I have multiple threads here that talk of reports from members' relatives in ISI, PAF and what not, talking of stuff that they claim to have heard from their "reliable sources". How is this any different?

But given that you are an administrator, I will take your direction on face value, even if I dont like it or consider it fair.

Sir,

Once you have established yourself on the forum with consistent and constructive posts/commentary, your 'hearsay reports' will also be given some credibility (even if we may disagree with the content of the hearsay) - but you surely cannot expect us to believe you right off the bat, with no established history.

 

[OrionHunter]

Some suggestions:
- Green ribbon campaign to raise awareness and funds (PTI, college campuses).
- Set up a fund to support volunteers (expats can help).
- 24/7 webcam at each crossing site (Pakistani web server).
- Enlist national media to promote and monitor the blockade.
- Celebrity endorsements for the campaign.

Do you think all this would make any difference? The question is, what is in the country's national interest? Continued blockade of the supply routes will result in:

> Further isolation of Pakistan especially by Western countries.
> A continuous bad press from them resulting in lesser foreign investment and trade affecting Pakistan's economy in the long run.
> American and Western pressure on aid organizations like the IMF and World Bank on which Pakistan is highly dependent as China, though considered an 'all weather friend' cannot and will not prefer to bail out Pakistan as what happened earlier (when it had to approach the IMF instead for an aid package of $7 billion as China refused to bail it out).
> Stoppage or delay in supply of spares for military equipment like the F-16s, Cobras and other American supplied assets that will have a tremendous impact on the operational preparedness of Pakistan's Defence Forces, per se.

These are some of the consequences that Pakistan will have to weather if it decides to block NATO's supply routes. Empty rhetoric, emotionalism and waving a few flags is just plain jingoism and not related to the reality of international relations today.

It's a big bad world out there - a world ruled by the neo-cons, the Illuminati and the Bilderbergs who are striving to build a New World Order according to their rules.

In a nutshell, Pakistan's national interests will not be served by a green ribbon campaign, or setting up a fund to support volunteers, or a 24/7 webcam coverage at each crossing site etc. These are all non issues and too mundane to be considered in the overall scheme of things.

 

[VCheng]

The blockade is 2 months and counting.

Wow, I was very wrong in my estimate of a 30 day interruption. Way to go Pakistan, there is hope for you yet!