Pakistan Army Aviation Corps - Updated

[Paul2]

This could be it probably, plus it's most likely easier to integrate a Kornet with the Mi-35 rather than a Baktar Shikan.

Let's hope they did, there's been an increase in use of MANPADS by terrorist groups around the world and as we rely more and more on air support, they'll be likely trying to get their hands on some MANPADS. Last thing we want is losing a gunship.

LoC maybe...

Kornet is a beamrider, it cannot be simply slaved to a random laser target painter, that will not work without special kornet only hardware.

Russians though were trying to sell a fire, and forget kornet version with an IR seeker for more than a decade.

Is Pakistan a first buyer?

 

[Moon]

Kornet is a beamrider, it cannot be simply slaved to a random laser target painter, that will not work without special kornet only hardware.

Russians though were trying to sell a fire, and forget kornet version with an IR seeker for more than a decade.

Is Pakistan a first buyer?

Could be, but seems unlikely we'd go for such a novel approach (which seems unnecessary) when Spiral missiles are already up for grabs.

What seems likely is that we've found a way to integrate the Kornet laser beam onto the helicopter and now we're using Kornets (which cost less).

Or, we're doing none of that and we've only bought Kornets to evaluate them on our neighbors in the East and compare their performances against Baktar Shikan. To either go for a new type of ATGM or improve upon the Baktar Shikan.

 

[iLION12345_1]

Could be, but seems unlikely we'd go for such a novel approach (which seems unnecessary) when Spiral missiles are already up for grabs.

What seems likely is that we've found a way to integrate the Kornet laser beam onto the helicopter and now we're using Kornets (which cost less).

Or, we're doing none of that and we've only bought Kornets to evaluate them on our neighbors in the East and compare their performances against Baktar Shikan. To either go for a new type of ATGM or improve upon the Baktar Shikan.

I doubt they’re being used with Mi35M, it’s possible yes, and there’s the little known heli-mounted variant too, but it’s unlikely PA has done either. PA purchased a massive amount of munitions with Mi35M. There’s probably 9M120M ATAKA among it for use with those helicopters, along with unguided missiles and the usual gun pods.

More likely they just bought it as a force multiplier, wherever it’s being used, East or west. PA has been doing that for a while, buying next gen variants of MANPADS (FN-6) and ATGMs (Kornet and possibly Milan) in small numbers to make up stockpiles. Likely to complement the large number of the older variants it has in service.

That’s how Kornet was intended to be used anyways, even Russia is not standardizing it, only buying it in small numbers to complement older systems, because it’s a very expensive missile.

 

[Paul2]

I doubt they’re being used with Mi35M, it’s possible yes, and there’s the little known heli-mounted variant too, but it’s unlikely PA has done either. PA purchased a massive amount of munitions with Mi35M. There’s probably 9M120M ATAKA among it for use with those helicopters, along with unguided missiles and the usual gun pods.

More likely they just bought it as a force multiplier, wherever it’s being used, East or west. PA has been doing that for a while, buying next gen variants of MANPADS (FN-6) and ATGMs (Kornet and possibly Milan) in small numbers to make up stockpiles. Likely to complement the large number of the older variants it has in service.

That’s how Kornet was intended to be used anyways, even Russia is not standardizing it, only buying it in small numbers to complement older systems, because it’s a very expensive missile.

Just googled it out. Mi 35M has a Vikhr ATGM kit. Vikhr, and Kornet have compatible target painting systems.

Hypothetically, all Russian beamriding ammo, from gun shells, to heli ATGMs can be guided with the same hardware.

 

[Akh1112]

I’m not going to lie, I don’t understand this;

why are people thinking that kornets are on mi35’s, you know the MoDP yearbook specifically said they procured 50 LAUNCHERS lol.

 

[iLION12345_1]

I’m not going to lie, I don’t understand this;

why are people thinking that kornets are on mi35’s, you know the MoDP yearbook specifically said they procured 50 LAUNCHERS lol.

People started assuming that possibly because there was no other guided missile sale listed specifically for Pakistan from Russia. Many of the ones assuming they would be for Mi35s probably don’t know why the term launchers matters here (as in, the difference between missiles and launchers).
Others might have been assuming they would be used on both the helicopters and in ground roles.
PKs comment just caused a bit more confusion because it implied they were being used off Mi35s but he clarified it later.

Before that I already explained how it probably wasn’t true and the large amounts of ammo PAA purchased with the Mi35s probably had ATAKA or VIKHR in it for use with the Helos. Kornet is strictly a ground based system, unless PA became the first customer of Kornet-DA (the helicopter launched variant once proposed). which is already little known, so unlikely.

 

[Moon]

On a completely unrelated note, won't CAATSA stop us from getting more Hinds?

 

[syed_yusuf]

Last we know PA ordered 5 more after first 4 was delivered, any idea what happened to it ?

 

[iLION12345_1]

Last we know PA ordered 5 more after first 4 was delivered, any idea what happened to it ?

I don’t recall more being ordered after the first 4. PA will order if it needs more. They’re looking at the other options instead. Z-10ME will probably be here sooner or later.

 

[Raja Porus]

To either go for a new type of ATGM or improve upon the Baktar Shikan.

We have shifted to HJ-8D. @iLION12345_1 will you share some of its info, thanks.

 

[bananarepublic]

We have shifted to HJ-8D. @iLION12345_1 will you share some of its info, thanks.

Quick question
Is baktar Shikan a true fire and forget missile or does it need continuous target lock and guidance?

 

[PanzerKiel]

Quick question
Is baktar Shikan a true fire and forget missile or does it need continuous target lock and guidance?

It's SACLOS, continuous tracking by the gunner is required.

 

[iLION12345_1]

We have shifted to HJ-8D. @iLION12345_1 will you share some of its info, thanks.

Quick question
Is baktar Shikan a true fire and forget missile or does it need continuous target lock and guidance?

Baktar Shikan is not fire and forget. Unless PA has bought The “EM” variant of the Kornet, then PA does not operate any Fire-and-forget ATGMs currently.

Baktar Shikan has been upgraded from its original form, currently the one used is with Tandem warheads as found in the Chinese HJ8D and E variants. Though some older warheads may be in service too.
A lighter, portable and upgraded version of the Baktar Shikan, analogous to the Chinese HJ-8L, was also displayed at IDEAS 2014. Thought I’m unaware if it’s in service with the PA.
The range of the current models is either 3000M or 4000M, depends on what missiles PA is using, penetration is 600MM of RHA with the Tandem Charges to defeat ERA.

The Baktar Shikan can be equipped with thermal sights and other guidance systems if required, but their availability in PA is unknown to me, PK can tell better.

PA also tested IIR or MMW based guidance ATGMs back in 2010, unsure if any were procured.

 

[PanzerKiel]

The Baktar Shikan can be equipped with thermal sights and other guidance systems if required, but their availability in PA is unknown to me, PK can tell better.

Sophie thermal sights with each one of them, detection range of more than 6 kms.

 

[Sifar zero]

Baktar Shikan is not fire and forget. Unless PA has bought The “EM” variant of the Kornet, then PA does not operate any Fire-and-forget ATGMs currently.

Baktar Shikan has been upgraded from its original form, currently the one used is with Tandem warheads as found in the Chinese HJ8D and E variants. Though some older warheads may be in service too.
A lighter, portable and upgraded version of the Baktar Shikan, analogous to the Chinese HJ-8L, was also displayed at IDEAS 2014. Thought I’m unaware if it’s in service with the PA.

The Baktar Shikan can be equipped with thermal sights and other guidance systems if required, but their availability in PA is unknown to me, PK can tell better.

PA also tested IIR or MMW based guidance ATGMs back in 2010, unsure if any were procured.

You and @Desert Fox 1 usually post very informative messages.