Pakistan Army Aviation Corps - Updated

[Zarvan]

I'm sure that Pakistan’s baktar shikan can be integrated on the Z10 which would be a immediate advantage.

We should fit something similar to hellfire

 

[imtiaz nabi]

Does that z10 contains advanced sensors like that of apache?

 

[Arsalan]

I'm sure that Pakistan’s baktar shikan can be integrated on the Z10 which would be a immediate advantage.

Well that is a different thing from getting Turkish weapon package, and as you suggested, will be an immediate advantage. The point is talks of replacing the Chinese weapons (that we do not know all about) with Turkish weapons (that again we don't know much about) at this point is a bit too early. Let the Chinese weapons fail (if that is what people are thinking) and then we can go for Turkish systems. Army wont be buying just to please people. Baktar Shikan offers a different advantage all together as you have rightly suggested.

We should fit something similar to hellfire

Z-10 carries HJ-10, it is reportedly similar to HELLFIRE. The advantage that Baktar Shikan will offer immediately is of a different nature. However we may see HJ-10 as the primary anti-Armour weapon (IF we get Z-10) and may have local production setup. HJ-10 production/technology will also be of great help considering the long list of derivatives meant to equip UCAV, and lighter longer range derivative meant for non-armored targets etc.

 

[Zarvan]

Well that is a different thing from getting Turkish weapon package, and as you suggested, will be an immediate advantage. The point is talks of replacing the Chinese weapons (that we do not know all about) with Turkish weapons (that again we don't know much about) at this point is a bit too early. Let the Chinese weapons fail (if that is what people are thinking) and then we can go for Turkish systems. Army wont be buying just to please people. Baktar Shikan offers a different advantage all together as you have rightly suggested.



Z-10 carries HJ-10, it is reportedly similar to HELLFIRE. The advantage that Baktar Shikan will offer immediately is of a different nature. However we may see HJ-10 as the primary anti-Armour weapon (IF we get Z-10) and may have local production setup. HJ-10 production/technology will also be of great help considering the long list of derivatives meant to equip UCAV, and lighter longer range derivative meant for non-armored targets etc.

Pakistan should slowly keep increasing WZ-10 numbers in its arsenal and Pakistan should get WZ-10 with wz16 engine and the other upgrades which were done in WZ-10 recently by China. With this engine and other up grades it pretty much matches Apache in performance. I don't know about manufacturing but for sure we need to develop full maintenance sight in Pakistan for our helicopters fleet. These helicopters along with massive artillery and MRL will be our backbone to counter India's cold start doctrine

 

[Arsalan]

Does that z10 contains advanced sensors like that of apache?

Surely it have advance sensors, it is an attack helicopter. What sensors are you actually pointing to?

It have HOTAS control system, the first Chinese helicopter with that capability. The helicopter is built to Chinese GJV289A standard, the Chinese equivalent of MIL-STD-1553B enabling rapid deployment of western systems after addition of a single module or interface.

A radar incorporating ground mapping, terrain-avoidance, and terrain-following radar capabilities

It have a pretty decent YH-96 EW suite that integrates the radar, radar warning receivers, laser warning recivers, electronic support measures and ECM together. Plus there is the ability to carry a wide range of navigational/targeting/protection and jamming PODs.

The Z-10 have a primary optronics FCS with TV camera, night vision and thermal imaging camera, the Chinese call it Airborne Stabilized Aiming System. The latest version has a laser ranger / designator for semi-active laser guided missiles such as HJ-10. A further development incorporates a laser ranging / targeting system that can perform all of the functions previously handled by separate system. All this is compatible with pilot’s HMS.

About the radar, yes there is a Milli-meter wave fire control radar. Light weight compared to some other systems such as the one of Ka-50 or the Mi-28N, uses a single antenna similar to the AN/APG-78 used for AH-64D Apache. Also there is a mast mounted optronics FCS tested aboard Z-9 that might come in with Z-10 as well in future.

So yes, overall, it have a pretty decent avionic and sensor suite.

 

[imtiaz nabi]

Surely it have advance sensors, it is an attack helicopter. What sensors are you actually pointing to?

It have HOTAS control system, the first Chinese helicopter with that capability. The helicopter is built to Chinese GJV289A standard, the Chinese equivalent of MIL-STD-1553B enabling rapid deployment of western systems after addition of a single module or interface.

A radar incorporating ground mapping, terrain-avoidance, and terrain-following radar capabilities

It have a pretty decent YH-96 EW suite that integrates the radar, radar warning receivers, laser warning recivers, electronic support measures and ECM together. Plus there is the ability to carry a wide range of navigational/targeting/protection and jamming PODs.

The Z-10 have a primary optronics FCS with TV camera, night vision and thermal imaging camera, the Chinese call it Airborne Stabilized Aiming System. The latest version has a laser ranger / designator for semi-active laser guided missiles such as HJ-10. A further development incorporates a laser ranging / targeting system that can perform all of the functions previously handled by separate system. All this is compatible with pilot’s HMS.

About the radar, yes there is a Milli-meter wave fire control radar. Light weight compared to some other systems such as the one of Ka-50 or the Mi-28N, uses a single antenna similar to the AN/APG-78 used for AH-64D Apache. Also there is a mast mounted optronics FCS tested aboard Z-9 that might come in with Z-10 as well in future.

So yes, overall, it have a pretty decent avionic and sensor suite.

Thank you so much for your kind info

 

[imtiaz nabi]

Actually i was talking about the helmet mounted systems as well as is it able to carry AESA radar?

 

[Donatello]

Surely it have advance sensors, it is an attack helicopter. What sensors are you actually pointing to?

It have HOTAS control system, the first Chinese helicopter with that capability. The helicopter is built to Chinese GJV289A standard, the Chinese equivalent of MIL-STD-1553B enabling rapid deployment of western systems after addition of a single module or interface.

A radar incorporating ground mapping, terrain-avoidance, and terrain-following radar capabilities

It have a pretty decent YH-96 EW suite that integrates the radar, radar warning receivers, laser warning recivers, electronic support measures and ECM together. Plus there is the ability to carry a wide range of navigational/targeting/protection and jamming PODs.

The Z-10 have a primary optronics FCS with TV camera, night vision and thermal imaging camera, the Chinese call it Airborne Stabilized Aiming System. The latest version has a laser ranger / designator for semi-active laser guided missiles such as HJ-10. A further development incorporates a laser ranging / targeting system that can perform all of the functions previously handled by separate system. All this is compatible with pilot’s HMS.

About the radar, yes there is a Milli-meter wave fire control radar. Light weight compared to some other systems such as the one of Ka-50 or the Mi-28N, uses a single antenna similar to the AN/APG-78 used for AH-64D Apache. Also there is a mast mounted optronics FCS tested aboard Z-9 that might come in with Z-10 as well in future.

So yes, overall, it have a pretty decent avionic and sensor suite.

Pretty decent? I'd say it is killer combo....because take a look at how long the Russians and Americans/Europeans have been building helicopters and how long has it been since China started?
The best part about such weapon systems from China is that, unlike Europe/America based products, Pakistan can benefit from the continuous advancement of the technology and tailor things like it wants. If Chinese are builing Z-10s today, imagine what they'll have in 10 years....20 years.

 

[Zarvan]

5

Pretty decent? I'd say it is killer combo....because take a look at how long the Russians and Americans/Europeans have been building helicopters and how long has it been since China started?
The best part about such weapon systems from China is that, unlike Europe/America based products, Pakistan can benefit from the continuous advancement of the technology and tailor things like it wants. If Chinese are builing Z-10s today, imagine what they'll have in 10 years....20 years.

WZ-10 specially with most recent upgrades which China did and are part of the latest squadron of WZ-10 which China got include new engine and other upgrades have made it as dangerous and capable as Apache

 

[Arsalan]

Actually i was talking about the helmet mounted systems as well as is it able to carry AESA radar?

HMS is a Yes,
AESA Radar is a NO for now!

Pretty decent? I'd say it is killer combo....because take a look at how long the Russians and Americans/Europeans have been building helicopters and how long has it been since China started?
The best part about such weapon systems from China is that, unlike Europe/America based products, Pakistan can benefit from the continuous advancement of the technology and tailor things like it wants. If Chinese are building Z-10s today, imagine what they'll have in 10 years....20 years.

I would say pretty decent based on the fact that even though these systems look comparable with the latest tech on Apache or Ka-50 however this is yet to be put through its paces. Once the systems see actual hostile environment operations and they are tested and proven on battlefield, they surely are/will be a killer combination.

 

[fatman17]

Pakistan should slowly keep increasing WZ-10 numbers in its arsenal and Pakistan should get WZ-10 with wz16 engine and the other upgrades which were done in WZ-10 recently by China. With this engine and other up grades it pretty much matches Apache in performance. I don't know about manufacturing but for sure we need to develop full maintenance sight in Pakistan for our helicopters fleet. These helicopters along with massive artillery and MRL will be our backbone to counter India's cold start doctrine

No it does not match the apache but mangusta and rioovaak (spell check Pl )

 

[Zarvan]

No it does not match the apache but mangusta and rioovaak (spell check Pl )

@Horus says it would match Apache with wz16 engine and other recent upgrades done by China

 

[Arsalan]

No it does not match the apache but mangusta and rioovaak (spell check Pl )

Avionics and weapon package wise it is on par with the Apache specially once the new WZ16 engine comes in. The are in same weight class and i suppose do have on par protective armor. One thing that do make Apache surpass the Z-10 is the actual battle experience. They have tested there systems and upgraded/improved them based on feedback from actual war scenario. Z-10 will need time and experience to achieve that. T-129 hand is light weight attack helicopter with empty weight almost half as that of an Apache or Z-10. The Rooivalk lacks a MMW-FCS.

 

[fatman17]

the Chinese themselves claim that the Z-10 is inferior to the AH64 while the Z10 matches the capabilities of most other attack helos. we have to compare what is available not future upgrades. remember the US also keeps upgrading the AH64.

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

From what point of view , one can say that its inferior


If you have 14 Soldiers on ground , and then this beast comes infront of them armed with rockets , missiles and machine gun ....

What choice do the troops on ground have ...

So , how can it be inferior


If we had serial production of these units , we can properly safe guard military on ground with support from air


Its highly unlikely that the Apache will go 1 vs 1 with Z10 , they choppers most fear aniti gunship missiles from ground the most.

But in term of fire power the Z-10 also has air-air missiles and its pretty equal the chances which copter would win Apache or Z-10