Pakistan Army APC Inventory

[Gryphon]

m113 roaming in new dress in islambad

This is one of the 600 VCC-1 Camillino's provided by Italy.

 

[Signalian]

^^ Need to get out of M-113 APC variants and move onto IFV's

 

[Windjammer]

Check out the new toy with digital camouflage to come out of HIT.

@DESERT FIGHTER @Horus @Irfan Baloch @Tipu7 @Arsalan @Path-Finder

 

[Tipu7]

Dragoon APC. It's few year old toy and have digital cameo from quite a time.
It's operational with Air port security forces in Pakistan already.

Check out the new toy with digital camouflage to come out of HIT.

View attachment 423701

@DESERT FIGHTER @Horus @Irfan Baloch @Tipu7 @Arsalan @Path-Finder

 

[Zarvan]

^^ Need to get out of M-113 APC variants and move onto IFV's

Exactly this is what I have been saying for long time

 

[Tipu7]

^^ Need to get out of M-113 APC variants and move onto IFV's

Come on yara, u know its not possible.
M113 is cheap effective & have enough carrying capacity for moving entire section in one APC to battle field.
IFVs on the other hand r expensive to buy, operate have limited carrying capability though credible fire power. We will need some big cash to make it happen and there r many other crucial areas where hard cash is needed.

 

[Signalian]

MRAP's are the need of the hour, have been actually for a long time.

 

[Arsalan]

Check out the new toy with digital camouflage to come out of HIT.

View attachment 423701

@DESERT FIGHTER @Horus @Irfan Baloch @Tipu7 @Arsalan @Path-Finder

Dragoon APC!

You will see them on airports and at some cantts as well (security vehicle). Saw some at HIT gate too (operating there i mean). However, just to mention, i am not sure if it is actually Digital Camo. It is made to look like digital camo but it is not actual digital camo.

 

[denel]

Check out the new toy with digital camouflage to come out of HIT.

View attachment 423701

@DESERT FIGHTER @Horus @Irfan Baloch @Tipu7 @Arsalan @Path-Finder

Another useless toy which is a danger to occupants.
Frankly i am shocked at the level of rubbish vehicles Pak army keep putting into service.

MRAP's are the need of the hour, have been actually for a long time.

mine proof vehicles as we say it.... i keep shaking my head everytime a photo shows up; these are all tin cans waiting to incapacitate the occupants.

 

[Zarvan]

Another useless toy which is a danger to occupants.
Frankly i am shocked at the level of rubbish vehicles Pak army keep putting into service.


mine proof vehicles as we say it.... i keep shaking my head everytime a photo shows up; these are all tin cans waiting to incapacitate the occupants.

Exactly and we have lost hundred of soldiers due to IED attacks and even Assault Rifle result in losses as our soldiers are travelling in these Hilux

 

[Signalian]

Another useless toy which is a danger to occupants.
Frankly i am shocked at the level of rubbish vehicles Pak army keep putting into service.


mine proof vehicles as we say it.... i keep shaking my head everytime a photo shows up; these are all tin cans waiting to incapacitate the occupants.

M113 was originally intended to operate behind cover of MBT's, dismount soldiers and stay in rear. M113 wasn't intended to directly engage enemy as the 12.7mm was supposed to give AF cover, oh well! Even Talha APC shouldn't be used in direct combat. The pickups and APC when sent in direct combat or when ambushed gave disastrous results.

The COIN war saw the need of IED/ambush proof vehicles in the MRAP class. PA still kept using light pick ups which couldn't even compare with HUMVEE in terms of some protection.

In most events FC was sent first, in pickups and that proved to be deadly. Now FC has given training, heavy weapons and equipment to manage combat.

Equipping half million army and paramilitary with MRAPs and light armoured transports has become a cumbersome job for PA.

 

[Zarvan]

M113 was originally intended to operate behind cover of MBT's, dismount soldiers and stay in rear. M113 wasn't intended to directly engage enemy as the 12.7mm was supposed to give AF cover, oh well! Even Talha APC shouldn't be used in direct combat. The pickups and APC when sent in direct combat or when ambushed gave disastrous results.

The COIN war saw the need of IED/ambush proof vehicles in the MRAP class. PA still kept using light pick ups which couldn't even compare with HUMVEE in terms of some protection.

In most events FC was sent first, in pickups and that proved to be deadly. Now FC has given training, heavy weapons and equipment to manage combat.

Equipping half million army and paramilitary with MRAPs and light armoured transports has become a cumbersome job for PA.

Even 1500 MRAP in operational ares would have been enough if we would have started to induct them on right time we would have 1500 MRAP by now but for some genius reason we use MRAP to keep them on Air Force bases instead of giving them to soldiers who are in operational areas

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

Another useless toy which is a danger to occupants.
Frankly i am shocked at the level of rubbish vehicles Pak army keep putting into service.


mine proof vehicles as we say it.... i keep shaking my head everytime a photo shows up; these are all tin cans waiting to incapacitate the occupants.

The tragedy here isn't just that they inducted them, but somehow, HIT was made to license the design and produce it as one of its products! It has to be asked, of all the designs one could find to license, they chose the Dragoon.

Yes there is the commonality with the M113 and all, fair, but licensing is a cost in of itself and an open bid for that (i.e. the cost of licensing the design and building the capacity top produce at HIT) might have yielded interesting results. Ultimately, it's a matter of getting the license today and then gradually inducting over the long-term.

Paramount Group could have come to the table with the Mbombe 4 MRAP, Mbombe 6x6 and Mbombe 8 AFV, which share 80% in parts (source)! That alone could have resolved several distinct armed forces needs and we could have had a joint marketing, co-production and third-party export partnership built on the Mbombe.

 

[Mumm-Ra]

The tragedy here isn't just that they inducted them, but somehow, HIT was made to license the design and produce it as one of its products! It has to be asked, of all the designs one could find to license, they chose the Dragoon.

Yes there is the commonality with the M113 and all, fair, but licensing is a cost in of itself and an open bid for that (i.e. the cost of licensing the design and building the capacity top produce at HIT) might have yielded interesting results. Ultimately, it's a matter of getting the license today and then gradually inducting over the long-term.

Paramount Group could have come to the table with the Mbombe 4 MRAP, Mbombe 6x6 and Mbombe 8 AFV, which share 80% in parts (source)! That alone could have resolved several distinct armed forces needs and we could have had a joint marketing, co-production and third-party export partnership built on the Mbombe.

Since, we don't know the circumstances in which this licence was acquired, we can't really comment on the other options that may have been explored at the time. But, a gut feeling tells me that the gentlemen involved in this deal will be financially very well off now.

 

[denel]

The tragedy here isn't just that they inducted them, but somehow, HIT was made to license the design and produce it as one of its products! It has to be asked, of all the designs one could find to license, they chose the Dragoon.

Yes there is the commonality with the M113 and all, fair, but licensing is a cost in of itself and an open bid for that (i.e. the cost of licensing the design and building the capacity top produce at HIT) might have yielded interesting results. Ultimately, it's a matter of getting the license today and then gradually inducting over the long-term.

Paramount Group could have come to the table with the Mbombe 4 MRAP, Mbombe 6x6 and Mbombe 8 AFV, which share 80% in parts (source)! That alone could have resolved several distinct armed forces needs and we could have had a joint marketing, co-production and third-party export partnership built on the Mbombe.

Bilal

Frankly Mbombe is too much of an overkill; you are needing basic Mamba/RG-32 there are tonnes in surplus and the beauty is they have interchangable iveco or toyota dyna engine/transmissions which a client can opt for. I spent years before in Casspir/Buffels/Ratels and then transitioned to Mambas.

M113 was originally intended to operate behind cover of MBT's, dismount soldiers and stay in rear. M113 wasn't intended to directly engage enemy as the 12.7mm was supposed to give AF cover, oh well! Even Talha APC shouldn't be used in direct combat. The pickups and APC when sent in direct combat or when ambushed gave disastrous results.

The COIN war saw the need of IED/ambush proof vehicles in the MRAP class. PA still kept using light pick ups which couldn't even compare with HUMVEE in terms of some protection.

In most events FC was sent first, in pickups and that proved to be deadly. Now FC has given training, heavy weapons and equipment to manage combat.

Equipping half million army and paramilitary with MRAPs and light armoured transports has become a cumbersome job for PA.

No it is not a cumbersome task; there are too many vested interests at play. They should just have taken a decision to look into local or joint ventures for mineproof vehicles with paramount or even armscor or other vendors from SA. Instead, it is all about lining up selfinterest at the expense of lives.
With respect to humvees; they just belong in a GM dealership and not on battlefield. Even those i would not touch with a spagetti- plenty of surplus mambas are available for around rands 80,000.