India can do better? thats pretty evident from Tejas lol. Dont wana go there though anyway.
well i my self don't , agree
we have the potential to do better but its only potential , we realise very little of our own capability due to systemic bottlenecks.
I am not going to say we would do better , but i am not going to say what ever we djave to be inferior either , as result.
Its all subject really
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Nevertheless Tejas 'was' a failure as its an old story now. and don't even make me start about the missiles failures I hear on a regular basis about from the Indian media itself. I do not want this debate to go off topic
Great we have another Tejas and Missile pundit.
Harping on about how everything is failure.
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I would have loved to see Tejas being crushed by an f-16, If only the Tejas ever made it to the IAF lol. F-16s beat F-15s in dog fights my friend( search videos on the internet). so in that case u are trying to imply its even better than an F-15. Oh wait, its ever better than an F-22! whatever makes u sleep better at night.
I repeat, do not go off topic.
HAL Tejas, F-16, Eurofighter Typhoon
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Simple, to fool India and get the investment. Whatever India has achieved so far is by the help of Russians.
A foolish claim with no substance , you in no way back that up with substantial evidence.
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Perhaps then you could explain why after 31 years of R and D,
31 year ? , so you claim , India started the LCA development in the late 70's . And what a complete farce that statement is.
1983-DRDO obtained permission to initiate a programme to design and develop a Light Combat Aircraft
1984-Government of India set up Aeronautical Development Agency ADA in 1984 as the nodal agency for managing and developing the LCA.
1985-IAF submits Air Staff Requirements (ASR) for LCA in October This was initiated by the then Air Chief Marshal Idris Hassan Latif.
1986-Government allocates 575 crores for the LCA programme.
Programme to develop an indigenous powerplant (engine) was launched at GTRE.
1987-Project definition commenced in October 1987 with French Dassault Aviation as consultants.
1988-Project definition completed in September 1988.
1989-Government review committee expresses confidence in LCA programme. It was decided that the programme will be carried out in two phases.
The 80's were spent in most administration and pre work for building the plane it self. Most of the infrastructure and facilities and agency's responsible for the plane were being set up.
Actual work only begain in 1988 when the PD was completed.
1990-Design of LCA was finalised as a small delta winged reverse static stability aircraft.
Phase 1 of the development was commenced to create the proof of concept system. Financial problems within India prevented full scale operations from starting.
1993-Full funding started from April 1993 full-scale development work for phase 1 started in June.
1995-First technology demonstrator, TD-1, rolled out on 17 November 1995 and was followed by TD-2 in 1998. However, technical problems in flight control systems and structural deficiencies plagued the prototypes and they remained grounded.
1997-Multi-Mode Radar (MMR) for LCA design work started at HAL’s Hyderabad division and the LRDE.
2001
Development assistance sought from Snecma on the Kaveri engine.
4 January - LCA’s maiden flight successfully completed by Technology Demonstrator TD-1 , on , 2001. Prime minister Atal Bihari Vajpayee renames LCA as Tejas.
2002
6 June - TD-2 makes a successful maiden flight.
MMR system was reported to be not working as per the criteria laid down in requirements.
2003
25 November - PV-1 makes a successful maiden flight.
2005
1 December - PV-2 makes a successful maiden flight.
2006
13 May - The PV-2 went supersonic for the first time
14 May - The PV-2 went supersonic again, but this time in a weaponised state (i.e., carrying weapons such as missiles and an internal gun).
1 December - The PV-3 flew for the first time for 27 minutes at an altitude of 2.5 km and at a speed of Mach 0.8. The PV-3 was equipped with a more advanced pilot interface, refined avionics and higher control law capabilities compared with the previous versions.
2007
25 April - The first Limited Series Production LCA (LSP-1) made its first flight and it reached a speed of Mach 1.1.
PV-2 and PV-3 underwent sea-level trails at INS Rajali Naval Air Station, Arakkonam to study the effects of flying at sea-level, as all earlier trials have been conducted at Bangalore which is 3,000 feet above sea-level. The reliability of the LCA systems under the hot and humid conditions, as well as low level flight characteristics was tested. It is due to this intense flight testing schedule that the LCA was not able to fly at the Paris air show-2007, as was originally planned.
7 September - Tejas Prototype Vehicle (PV-1) made a successful maiden flight with two 800 litre drop tanks.
25 October - Tejas PV-1 fired a Vympel R-73 missile for first time. The trials were conducted off the Goa coast at INS Hansa Naval Air Station.
11 December - LITENING Pod was successfully tested on Tejas PV-2.
2008
7 February - Tejas Prototype Vehicle (PV-1) made a successful flight powered by fuel from two 800 litre drop tanks. It made a one hour and 24 minute long sortie. On internal fuel LCA can perform a 40-minute sortie.
April - First Flight with HMDS
LCA Tejas prototypes PV-2 & PV-3 underwent hot weather flight trials at Air Force Station, Nagpur from 28 May 2008 to 4 June 2008. The trials were declared successful.
16 June - Tejas second Limited Series Production LCA (LSP-2) made
its first flight and it reached a speed of Mach 1.1.
7 November - LCA Prototype Vehicle-3 made first successful night flight.
13 December - PV-3 and LSP-2 completed the high altitude at the Leh air base.
2009
22 January - Tejas completed 1000 flights.
February - the live bombs test were successfully carried out.
October - PV-3 and LSP-2 completed visual target elimination and air-to-ground weapons delivery trials.
26 November - Two seater (Trainer) version of Tejas(PV-5) made its maiden flight on 26 Nov 09.
7 December - Tejas passed flight flutter test diving from an altitude of four kilometers to almost sea level at 900 feet. Tejas recorded a speed over 1350 kmph. These tests were conducted at INS Hansa, Goa.
15 December - Indian government sanctioned Rs 8,000 crores to begin production of the fighter jet for the Indian Air Force and Indian Navy.
2010
23 April - LCA Tejas LSP-3 Makes Maiden Flight. LSP-3 is almost the final configuration including the new air-data computers, Israeli Elta multimode radar, new communication and navigation equipment and radar warning receiver. With this the LCA programme has completed 1350 test flights logging about 800 flying hours.
So what have We achieved in the last 20 odd years of development, still a very long time.
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India still does not have the so called Indigenous engine to power it.
A failing , yes but only one amongst so many other success.
But the engine it self still works , IAF simply changes its requirements to higher trust engine.
But the Engine it self is still functional
Plans are also already under way for derivatives of the Kaveri, including a non-afterburning version for an advanced jet trainer and a high-bypass-ratio turbofan based on the Kaveri core, named as Kabini. i
GTX-35VS Kaveri-MK1 - Unmanned Aerial Vehicles
GTRE/SCHEMA Kaveri MKII - Dassult Rafael (India's own , if purchased.), HAL Tejas (planned for production models)
KAVERI NG - concept Based on the Kaveri MKII , to power the
HAL Medium Combat Aircraft and beyond.
Derivatives:
The Indian government plans to adapt and further develop the Kaveri engine design and technology to create a gas-turbine powerplant for armoured fighting vehicles such as the Arjun tank.
Kaveri Marine Gas Turbine (KMGT), a recently developed derivative of the GTX-35VS Kaveri engine for ships.
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Also to note , the GTX-35VS Kaveri mk1(produces more trust than current Tejas engine GE-404) can be installed and used on the Tejas. IAF however is not happy with its own requirements set down in 1996 and have classified it as underpowered, meaning there are altitude and weight restrictions(important when operating in the high altitudes of Kargil or Saichen). If you are wondering why the Kaveri is not used. its becuase the GE engines have already been bought as of 2006 , when the Kaveri project showing no signs of progress. The Kaveri MkI is not to late for the Tejas MkI .
Since the GE-404 it self is unsatisfactory , a new more powerfull engine is being selected(GE-414 (f-18) or the EJ-2000 (Eurofighter)) and the Kaveri MKII is being built around those specifications.
So is they wanted to they could make a combat worthy Tejas.
They can still make one using the Current Kaveri MkI . It will just suffer from Altitude and weight restrictions
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the nmber of times i get this , i keep a response ready
On the generations of Planes. I only intend to present my side of the argument, Your free to make your own choice.
First generation jet fighters
The early aircraft of this group entered production during the closing years of World War II with planform similar to their piston counterparts. Later transonic aircraft, such as the MiG-15, are sometimes referred to as a "second generation" and the end of this generation is very loose.
Second generation jet fighters
The beginning of this generation is blurry, but aircraft that were designed for missile armament and supersonic speed are generally considered to be at least second generation.
India's unsatisfactory "HAL HF-24 Marut" falls into this category.
Third generation jet fighters
Third generation aircraft were based on the wrong assumption that air to air missiles would replace dogfighting, and many were initially built without internal gun armament.
Fourth generation jet fighters
Fourth generation fighters had a renewed focus on maneuverability and many were again designed with an internal gun armament.
Now i hope we can agree that the Tejas is in this category or above.
4.5th generation jet fighters
This "half generation" is a term defined by the United States Government as fourth generation aircraft that have vastly improved avionics (digital fly-by-wire), sensors (Active Electronically Scanned Array radars), high speed data links and the ability to carry the latest weapons. Some sources refer to some members of this group as fourth or 4++ generation aircraft instead.
Now being a 4++ aircraft to put it simply, largely depends on the gadgets within the plane.
So the US classifies a plane 4.5 gen if it has:
(1): Digital fly-by-wire
Since the Tejas is a "relaxed static stability" design, it is equipped with a quadruplex digital fly-by-wire flight control system to ease handling by the pilot.
(2):Electronically Scanned Array radars
Due to delay in development of MMR, government have come out with the collaboration with IAI for development of Radar the sensor for the new radar is supposed to be EL/M-2052 AESA from Elta and the remaining item and software will be combination of MMR and IAI developed products. Varadarajan, (Director — LRDE) has said that LRDE has initiated development of active electronically scanning array radar for airborne applications. And that these radars will be integrated with Tejas light combat aircraft-Mark II by 2012-13.
(3):High speed data links
India's Light Combat Aircraft tests its teeth
Each aircraft, from the time it started up, was being monitored in detail, the data transmitting live from the aircraft over a high-speed data link
Now i know for a fact that the IAF would reject any plane that did not have this feature. But just to make sure, i can back it up. I went and found an article that made specific reference to high speed data links.
(4):The ability to carry the latest weapons
Originally intended to serve as an air superiority aircraft with a secondary "dumb bomb" ground-attack role, the flexibility of this design approach has permitted a variety of guided air-to-surface and anti-shipping weapons to be integrated for more well-rounded multirole and multimission capabilities.
All weapons are carried on one or more of seven hardpoints with total capacity of greater than 4,000 kg: three stations under each wing and one on the under-fuselage centreline. There is also an eighth, offset station beneath the port-side intake trunk which can carry a variety of pods (FLIR, IRST, laser rangefinder/designator, or reconnaissance), as can the centreline under-fuselage station and inboard pairs of wing stations.
(Additional 4++ features)
(5):Trust vectoring and super cruise
In September 2008, it was announced that the Kaveri would not be ready in time for the Tejas, and that an in-production powerplant would have to be selected The ADA plans to issue a request for proposal (RFP) for a more powerful engine in the 95 to 100 kilonewton (kN) (21,000–23,000 lbf) range. The contenders are likely to be the Eurojet EJ200 and the General Electric F414. The Eurojet EJ200 propulsion offer has thrust-vectoring.
This would be the case if the
Euro-fighter is chosen for the MMRCA contract.
If However the
Dassault Rafale is chosen
ADA awarded a contract to SNECMA for technical assistance in working out the Kaveri's problems.
Dassault has also offered to fit the Kaveri engine into the Rafale, which, if chosen, which would greatly improve commonality with the Tejas aircraft that will enter service into the IAF by 2010. India and France have recently agreed to "go beyond a buyer-seller relationship".[
If Dassault and SCHEMA can work with GTRE to help finish the Kaveri
Scientific Advisor to Defence Minister M Natarajan said nearly 90 to 93 per cent of the expected performance had been realised and the government had recently floated an expression of interest to seek partners to move the programme further(that partner would be SCHEMA)
Then the Project goals of the KAveri can finally be achieved.
The Kaveri is a low-bypass-ratio (BPR) afterburning turbofan engine featuring a six-stage core high-pressure (HP) compressor with variable inlet guide vanes (IGVs), a three-stage low-pressure (LP) compressor with transonic blading, an annular combustion chamber, and cooled single-stage HP and LP turbines. The development model is fitted with an advanced convergent-divergent ("con-di") variable nozzle, but the GTRE wants to fit production Tejas aircraft with an axisymmetric, multi-axis thrust-vectoring nozzle to further enhance the LCA's agility
The general arrangement of the Kaveri is very similar to other contemporary combat engines, such as the Eurojet EJ200, General Electric F414, and Snecma M88. At present, the peak turbine inlet temperature is designed to be a little lower than its peers, but this is to enable the engine to be flat-rated to very high ambient temperatures. Consequently, the bypass ratio that can presently be supported, even with a modest fan pressure ratio, is only about 0.16:1, which means the engine is a "'leaky' turbojet" like the F404.
The Kaveri engine has been specifically designed for the demanding Indian operating environment, which ranges from hot desert to the highest mountain range in the world. The GTRE's design envisions achieving a fan pressure ratio of 4:1 and an overall pressure ratio of 27:1, which will permit the Tejas to "supercruise" (cruise supersonically without the use of the afterburner). The Kaveri is a variable-cycle, flat-rated engine and has 13% higher thrust than the General Electric F404-GE-F2J3 engines equipping the LCA prototypes.
These features are just the cherry on late but good cake.
To all those critics of the Kaveri, India can just choose the typhoon and get the EJ2000, Which will give the Tejas both super cruise and trust vectoring, with out a shadow of a doubt.
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We'll see the day its in ACTIVE service with the IAF until then please let it go..
developed it from scratch and then scrapped it.. I mean whats the point of putting so much investment in a design for 30 years and not putting it into service when you can easily do it in 5 years.
keep watching
IAF orders more Tejas LCAs to replace MiG-21s
Ajai Shukla / Bangalore November 23, 2009, 0:45 IST
The Indian Air Force is taking a crucial step towards accepting the indigenous Tejas Light Combat Aircraft (LCA) as a replacement for its ageing MiG-21 fighters.
Senior air force officers told Business Standard that IAF was ordering a second Tejas squadron (20 aircraft), in addition to the 20 fighters already on order.
Ashok Nayak, chairman of Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd, which will manufacture the Tejas, has confirmed this development. “
The Ministry of Defence (MoD) tender for 20 additional Tejas fighters is on track,” he told Business Standard. “After it is issued, we will sit down with MoD and negotiate a price.”
The order for a second squadron is a vital expression of IAF’s confidence in the future of the long-running Tejas programme.
So far, IAF had insisted on evaluating the performance of the first squadron before ordering a second, by 2015-2016. That would allow the Tejas to be upgraded to the Tejas Mark II, which would have a new, more powerful engine. But now, with its fighter fleet dwindling, as the old MiG-21s are retired, IAF is taking the Tejas as it is.
WHY LAF URGENTLY NEEDS A SECOND SQUADRON
* Against a sanctioned requirement of 39.5 squadrons, IAF is down to just 32
* By 2015, another 6 squadrons of MiG-21s and two squadrons of MiG-27s would have finished their service lives
* HAL is manufacturing Sukhoi-30MKIs, but the current production is just 14 per year. By 2015, IAF will have just 29 squadrons of fighters
* The shortfall becomes more worrisome with the new requirement of five IAF squadrons for the North-East
“
The Tejas, even with its current GE-404 engine, is a better fighter than the MiG-21,”
explained a senior IAF officer who is familiar with equipment policy. “By 2015, the first Tejas squadron will be ready for IAF. HAL’s assembly line will be free; while the Tejas Mark II finishes testing, HAL can build a second squadron with the GE-404 engine,” he added.
So far, the plan was to produce 12 twin-seater Tejas trainers after the first squadron was built. The new order will be for 18 single-seater and 2 twin-seater Tejas: exactly what equips a fighter squadron.
Here’s why IAF urgently needs that second squadron: Against a sanctioned requirement of 39.5 squadrons (each squadron has 21 fighters), IAF is now down to just 32 squadrons. By 2015, another six squadrons of MiG-21s and two squadrons of MiG-27s would have finished their service lives. Meanwhile, HAL is manufacturing Sukhoi-30MKIs, but the current production is just 14 per year. The mathematics is clear: By 2015, IAF will have just 29 squadrons of fighters.
Making this shortfall even more worrisome is the new requirement of five IAF squadrons for north-east India, as a result of an increased threat assessment from China. Senior IAF officers have recently declared that India actually needs 45 squadrons.
In this context, IAF cannot wait to induct the Tejas as the next light fighter, a role that the MiG-21 has long performed. Medium fighters are as urgently needed, and IAF is currently evaluating six aircraft for this role. But the new Medium Multi-Role Combat Aircraft (MMRCA), even if the contract is placed expeditiously, is unlikely to enter service before 2015-16. Only in the heavy fighter segment is IAF well placed, with the superlative Sukhoi-30MKI steadily joining the fleet.
The Tejas is currently undergoing weapon trials to obtain its Initial Operational Clearance, most likely by early 2011. Then starts the two-year process for obtaining Final Operational Clearance, after which it can enter service in early 2013. Then, if HAL can deliver 10 Tejas fighters per year, the first squadron will be ready by the end of 2014. And, if all of that goes smoothly, the second Tejas squadron will join IAF by the end of 2016.
IAF has decided that No 45 Squadron, which operated MiG-21M fighters until they were recently retired, will be the first Tejas squadron. It will be based in Sulur, near Coimbatore. It is still not clear where the second Tejas squadron will be based.
Tejas to be stationed at new IAF base in Rajasthan
Ajay Banerjee/TNS New Delhi, April 10 India’s self-developed Light Combat Aircraft (LCA) Tejas will be based at the IAF’s brand new forward-operating base at Phalodi in Rajasthan.
Medium-lift choppers, Mi-17s will also be stationed at the base which will be 102 km from the India-Pakistan border, said sources. Uniquely, the new air base that was inaugurated four days ago is the first forward-operating airbase to be commissioned by the IAF in more than two decades.
The first lot of the LCA -- a squadron of 20 aircraft -- is scheduled to be handed over to the IAF in 11 months from now. The second squadron will follow a year later -- both are being built at the Hindustan Aeronautics Limited (HAL) unit at Bangalore.
Once handed over to the IAF, the LCA’s first base, briefly, will be at a station in South India, from where the fighters will move in batches to Phalodi, the sources said. Moving planes in small batches is a normal IAF procedure. Phalodi has the capacity to handle other aircraft besides deep penetration radars.
ASIAN DEFENCE: Tejas to be stationed at new IAF base in Rajasthan
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and please dont reply with 'The indigenous expertise' linerr..
Not every body like's the option of going to China when they need things built.
Some of us have to actually do it our selves with what is that word "indigenous expertise" .
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better you could ve imported the engines and the radar ect from Russia and one it in 5-7 years.. however i would still doubt it..
in other words you have your mind made up and there no point in trying to convince you otherwise
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CAN anyone provide me a source to what and how the Indians have contributed to this PAK-FA?
Sukhoi/HAL FGFA - HAL, UAC Sign Pact to Develop Fifth Generation Fighter Jet | India Defence
Hindustan Aeronautics Limited and Russia's United Aircraft Corporation (UAC) inked a pact to jointly develop and produce a fifth generation fighter aircraft, a top HAL official said on Tuesday. "We (HAL and UAC) are moving forward as per schedule. We (have) just done the general contract yesterday. I went to Delhi and signed the general contract," HAL Chairman Ashok K Baweja said.
HAL officials noted that under a preliminary inter-governmental agreement signed in October last year, the advanced multi-role fighter is being developed by Sukhoi, part of UAC, along with the Bangalore-headquartered defence PSU.
According to reports, Russia and India would simultaneously develop two versions of the aircraft -- a two-seat version to meet the requirements of India and a single seat version for Russian Air Force. UAC had begun building a prototype of the jet fighter which would feature high manoeuvrability and stealth to ensure air superiority and precision in destroying ground and sea targets, reports said.
Asked about the proposed investment in the venture, Baweja said it was very difficult to say at this stage and added: "It will be quite a lot". He told reporters on the sidelines of the celebrations of HAL Day that the Navratna company has put on the back burner its MRO (maintenance, repair and overhaul of civil aircraft) venture plans at HAL airport following a slowdown in the world civil aviation market.
Asia Times Online :: South Asia news - India, Russia still brothers in arms
India, Russia to make 5th generation fighter jets - Specials - Home - The Times of India
The Hindu : Karnataka / Bangalore News : Indo-Russian agreement soon on PAK-FA
The joint-venture borrows heavily from the success of the Brahmos project. Russia and India had agreed in early 2007 to jointly study and develop a Fifth Generation Fighter Aircraft Programme (FGFA). On October 27, 2007, Asia Times quoted Sukhoi's director, Mikhail Pogosyan, "We [India and Russia] will share the funding, engineering and intellectual property [of the new project] in a 50-50 proportion." The Indian version, according to the deal, will be different from the Russian version and specific to Indian requirements. While the Russian version will be a single-pilot fighter, the Indian variant will have a twin-seat configuration based on its operational doctrine which calls for greater radius of combat operations. The wings and control surfaces need to be reworked for the FGFA.
The PAK FA and the FGFA will have minimal common technology. Further the FGFA will be predominantly using weapons of Indian origin such as Astra, a Beyond Visual Range missile being developed by India, although in keeping with the Russian BVR doctrine of using a vast variety of different missiles for versatility and unpredictability to countermeasures, it can be expected to have compatibility with many different missile loadouts. The Indian FGFA is significantly different from the Russian PAK FA because a second pilot means the addition of another dimension, development of wings and control surfaces.
India to develop 25% of fifth generation fighter idrw.org
Scrutinising the Sukhoi Corporation’s work on the Fifth Generation Fighter Aircraft (FGFA) — a project that India will soon sign up to co-develop — gives one an idea of Russia’s size, and its aerospace expertise. During daytime, in Moscow, the Sukhoi Design Bureau conceptualises FGFA components; by 10 pm the drawings are electronically transmitted over 5,000 kilometres to a manufacturing unit in Siberia. Here, at KnAAPO (Komsomolsk-on-Amur Aircraft Production Organisation) — seven time zones away — it is already 5 am next morning. Within a couple of hours, the drawings start being translated into aircraft Production.
Having designed over 100 aircraft (including India’s Su-30MKI), built over 10,000 fighters, and with 50 world aviation records to its credit, Sukhoi understandably regards Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd (HAL) — its partner-to-be in designing the FGFA — as very much the greenhorn.
But the newcomer wants its due. Bangalore-based HAL has negotiated firmly to get a 25 per cent share of design and development work in the FGFA programme. HAL’s work share will include critical software, including the mission computer (the Su-30MKI mission computer is entirely Indian); navigation systems; most of the cockpit displays; the counter measure dispensing (CMD) systems; and modifying Sukhoi’s single-seat prototype into the twin-seat fighter that the Indian Air Force (IAF) wants.
THE FIFTH GENERATION FIGHTER
Cost of development $8-10 billion
India’s requirement 250 fighters
Russia’s requirement 250 fighters
Cost per aircraft $100 million
Indian name FGFA
Russian name PAK FA
India will also contribute its expertise in aircraft composites, developed while designing the Tejas Light Combat Aircraft (LCA). Russia has traditionally built metallic aircraft; just 10 per cent of the Su-30MKI fuselage is titanium and composites. The FGFA’s fuselage, in contrast, will be 25 per cent titanium and 20 per cent composites. Russia’s expertise in titanium structures will be complemented by India’s experience in composites.
With India’s work share almost finalised, the 2007 Russia-India Inter-Governmental Agreement (IGA) to build the FGFA will soon evolve into a commercial contract between Russia’s United Aircraft Corporation (UAC) and HAL. Ashok Baweja, until recently the chairman of HAL, told Business Standard: “When HAL and UAC agree on terms, they will sign a General Contract. This will include setting up a JV to design the FGFA, and precise details about who will fund what.”
This contract will mark a significant shift in the aeronautical relationship between India and Russia. For decades, HAL has played a technologically subordinate role, assembling and building fighters that Russia had designed. Now, forced to accept HAL as a design partner, the Russians have negotiated hard to limit its role.
The reason: Russia is sceptical about India’s design ability in such a cutting edge project. In June 2008, Business Standard interviewed Vyacheslav Trubnikov, then Russia’s ambassador to India, and an expert on Russia’s defence industry. Contrasting the Su-30MKI with the Tejas LCA, Trubnikov pointed out snidely, “I know perfectly well the Russian ability. But I don’t know what contribution the Indian side might make. So, one must ask the question to the Indian designers, to HAL…what is their claim for building a fighter of the fifth generation type? Either avionics, or engine? What might be India’s contribution? To be absolutely frank, I don’t know.”
For long, the UAC argued that HAL could not expect a major role in the FGFA because Sukhoi had finished much of the work while New Delhi dithered about joining the project. UAC asserts that 5,000 Sukhoi engineers have worked for five years to design the FGFA. Such claims are hard to verify, but it is known that the Sukhoi Design Bureau has about 8,000 engineers, distributed between many different programmes.
With Sukhoi’s ploughing on alone, Minister of State for Defence Pallam Raju admitted to Business Standard: “The longer India waits to join the project, the lesser will be our contribution. But, we are not sitting idle. Through the defence ministry’s existing programmes [such as the Tejas LCA] we are building up our capabilities.”
Most Indian officials agree that India has not lost much. Even if the FGFA makes its much-anticipated first flight this year, it is still at a preliminary stage of development. Ashok Baweja assessed in early 2009, “The FGFA’s first flight is just the beginning of the programme. My understanding is that the Russians are going ahead (with the test) to validate the FGFA’s “proof of concept” (conceptual design). Whatever composite materials they have now, they’ll use. But, because the composites will change… the FGFA will keep evolving for a fairly long time.”
A top ministry official estimates, “It will take another 4-5 years to develop many of the FGFA’s systems. Then, the aircraft will undergo at least 2000 hours of certification flying and, possibly, some reconfiguration. The FGFA should not be expected in service before 2017. And the twin-seat version may take a couple of years longer.”
With just a 25 per cent share of design, South Block policymakers still believe that the FGFA project is a vital step towards India’s emergence as a military aeronautical power. “Developing 25 per cent of this fighter is far better than just transferring technology to build it in India, as we did with the Su-30MKI,” points out a defence ministry official.
Ashok Baweja puts the project in context. “India can only (develop the FGFA) by partnering with Russia. They have so much experience. It’s not just the design… you must also have materials… maraging steel, titanium, composite alloys, and the industrial base to convert these into high-tech components like gyros, sensors and optics. The FGFA will give us important experience for building fighters hereafter.”
Russia, India to develop joint 5G-fighter by 2016 | Top Russian news and analysis online | 'RIA Novosti' newswire
Russia, India to develop joint 5G-fighter by 2016
02/03/2010
A Russian-Indian fifth-generation fighter jet could be developed by 2015-2016, a Russian defense industry official said on Tuesday.
Moscow and New Delhi are expected to sign a contract on a joint development of the new fighter in the near future, focusing on the design concept and technical requirements put forward by India.
"I hope that we will be able to build a joint fifth-generation aircraft in the next five to six years. It is a time-consuming and complex project," said Alexander Fomin, first deputy head of the Federal Service for Military and Technical Cooperation.
The new aircraft will be most likely based on Russia's T-50 prototype fifth-generation fighter, which has already made two test flights and is expected to join the Russian Air Force in 2015.
India's Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd (HAL) was reported to be seeking a 25% share in design and development in the project.
Fomin said the fighter for the Indian Air Force could incorporate several integrated on-board systems developed by third parties.
"The integration is good because we will not have to invent a bicycle and can use the things that our neighbors already have, but it is also a difficult task because we will have to combine all the elements in a unified system," the official said.
The new fighter for the Indian Air Force is expected to feature a two-seat cockpit, advanced electronics and could be armed with BrahMos supersonic missiles.
Russia has been developing its fifth-generation fighter since the 1990s. The current prototype, known as the T-50, was designed by the Sukhoi design bureau and built at a plant in Komsomolsk-on-Amur, in Russia's Far East.
Russian officials have already hailed the fighter as "a unique warplane" that combines the capabilities of an air superiority fighter and attack aircraft.
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