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PAF should think seriously with a new angle after Abbot Abad drama !!

arsalabbasi

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Although PAF suffered a lot to achieve technological edge in past two decades as Pakistan was one of the most sanctioned countries in the world and sanctions were focused mainly on military hardware. As a result of sanctions, PAF resorted to explore black market spares for existing fleet and made a turn towards Chinese emerging technology. The capability of air forces today is beyond the number and quality of jet fighters. Lets compare the capability of PAF Vs IAF based on various indicators.

Air Combat Capability

PAF today carries approximately 450 combat aircrafts on its fleet of different variants. IAF operates approximately 471 fighters and 269 bombers of British, Russian and French origin. IAF has always kept numerical superiority over PAF and today IAF has a technological edge over PAF as well. This is attributable mainly to a decade of sanctions imposed on Pakistan. PAF, being aware of this fact, is not far away from minimizing this technological gap and will be a much superior air force by 2015 in terms of technology.

IAF maintenance and air crews are not as diligent, their mainly Russian technology is generally less reliable than advertised, and a large part of their fleet of MiG-21s and MiG-27s are outdated. PAF aircrafts are either of Western stock or Chinese and are far more maintenance friendly.

A big technological gap was created once IAF claimed to have Beyond Visual Range (BVR) capability. On the other hand, PAF was denied this capability and thus was forced to continue relying on the short range IR missiles. Today, PAF has got the capability of launching BVRs on F-16s and JF-17s. PAF gained BVR capability after signing a biggest ever single export order deal with U.S in the history of AIM-120 AMRAAM programme. Pakistan is also expected to acquire the Chinese-developed SD-10 AAM with its JF-17 Thunder fighters. SD-10s would also be part of any potential Chengdu J-10 order.

Air Defense Capability

PAF has invested efficiently in this area by procuring a wide range of American and Chinese ground based modern radars. The aircraft mounted radar capability named AWACS (Airborne Early Warning and Control System) was also pursued largely by PAF in few recent years. Despite the up gradation of existing three DA-20 mounted state of the art platforms, PAF has added four SAAB-2000 (Swedish) and four ZDK-03 (Chinese) AWACS aircrafts to its inventory.

Indian Air Force has been pursuing a programme for the acquisition of AWACS capability for over twenty years. This quest finally ended when a contract was signed for supply of three Israeli built “Phalcon” radar systems. However, IAF AWACS platforms are still not sufficient in number to maintain a round-the-clock watch over Pakistan airspace and other borders.

Training

There seems to be a general consensus of opinion today that in a comparison of strength between the Indian and Pakistani air forces, the Indian advantage in numbers is counterbalanced by the Pakistani advantage in personnel, training, and tactics. In fact, some would argue that the Pakistani fighter pilot, his training, and his tactics are so superior that even though the Indians have now caught up in technology, the Pakistan Air Force still has an overall edge in combat capability as long as the quantitative edge does not proceed above 3:1.:azn:

BUT Wait a minute & think seriously

Now its time to think seriously with a new angle after Abbotabad attack that Americans are very sharp. They always knew our weakness & are making plans to grab/destroy our nukes with bogus excuses after Abbot Abad attack. Our Air Force dont have capability to counter against Stealths:undecided: Our latest radars cant find Stealths bombers or Helis. Thats why Air Chief Marchall clearly said to PM in the in-camera briefing that we cant stop these types of stealths attacks in future.

What should we do. our PAF officials should do against this technology barrier ?? This is really a threat to PAF sovereignty, a real big threat to our nukes & reactors. Please suggest seriously !!
 
Really gud thread. Now its the time to say no to US equipment and we have to consult china at this crucial time. We shud get H-Q9 as early as possible also have to produce more and more BVR capable JF-17's.
 
Now its time to think seriously with a new angle after Abbotabad attack that Americans are very sharp. They always knew our weakness & are making plans to grab/destroy our nukes with bogus excuses after Abbot Abad attack. Our Air Force dont have capability to counter against Stealths:undecided: Our latest radars cant find Stealths bombers or Helis. Thats why Air Chief Marchall clearly said to PM in the in-camera briefing that we cant stop these types of stealths attacks in future.

What should we do. our PAF officials should do against this technology barrier ?? This is really a threat to PAF sovereignty, a real big threat to our nukes & reactors. Please suggest seriously !!

With reference to our indoor closed session of the Armed forces with the parliament...and our Airchiefs interview about the facts and figures....Our Airchief shold be forced to resign cuz he got no planz to counter any kinda US Airforce intrusion into our country at any time...He tried to reason for lack of fundz , is complete rubbish and tried to misguide our public....What he be doing with the money our Airforce getting for modernization, just putting in their pockets...If he is unable to defend our airspace against US invasion then he shold be kicked out and sent to serve his US masterz....He is another biggest sellout after our COAS.....I am damn sure that we got plenty of capable and genius pplz in our PAF to create successful planz to defend against any kinda US invasion in Pakistan at any time...Alhamdolillah...
We must consult our Chinese brotherz at this moment ....
We must get rid of the black sheepz in our forces right away.....Insha-Allah....:)
 
Air Combat Capability

PAF today carries approximately 450 combat aircrafts on its fleet of different variants. IAF operates approximately 471 fighters and 269 bombers of British, Russian and French origin. IAF has always kept numerical superiority over PAF and today IAF has a technological edge over PAF as well. This is attributable mainly to a decade of sanctions imposed on Pakistan. PAF, being aware of this fact, is not far away from minimizing this technological gap and will be a much superior air force by 2015 in terms of technology.

IAF maintenance and air crews are not as diligent, their mainly Russian technology is generally less reliable than advertised, and a large part of their fleet of MiG-21s and MiG-27s are outdated. PAF aircrafts are either of Western stock or Chinese and are far more maintenance friendly.

A big technological gap was created once IAF claimed to have Beyond Visual Range (BVR) capability. On the other hand, PAF was denied this capability and thus was forced to continue relying on the short range IR missiles. Today, PAF has got the capability of launching BVRs on F-16s and JF-17s. PAF gained BVR capability after signing a biggest ever single export order deal with U.S in the history of AIM-120 AMRAAM programme. Pakistan is also expected to acquire the Chinese-developed SD-10 AAM with its JF-17 Thunder fighters. SD-10s would also be part of any potential Chengdu J-10 order.


What should we do. our PAF officials should do against this technology barrier ?? This is really a threat to PAF sovereignty, a real big threat to our nukes & reactors. Please suggest seriously !!


not sure why you divided indian planes into fighters and bombers and then highlighted the fighters part to boost our ego..

the fact of the matter is paf is 20 years behind iaf--
our pilots deserve such fighters which give them a fighting chance of coming back alive:pakistan:

1
even now , paf is trying to equilize [by 2014-2015] with what iaf has on the ground right now[2011]-- just an indicator of the foresight in pakistan [atleast with what the info is made public in pakistani media]

2
paf is doing now, what it shouldve done ATLEAST 10 years ago [buy m2k when they had the money] or buy what they had planned at that time [100-300 f16s]
paf lost the qualitative edge and inducted number fillers j-7s as low end criteria at that time--


3
in 2014 the backbone [low end] of iaf would be rafale ,mig29 ,m2k --- the high end would be mki
our jft can take on only half of the low end iaf fighters [m2k/mig29]--- makes me wonder if jft would be written in history as another numbers filler or a fighter that can take the offensive to india


4
now lets talk about high end ---- we dont have any fighter to counter the mki at this moment, letalone any fighter to counter the pakfa in the forseable future

5
The singled engined doctrine of paf [j10b included] has further crippled the offensive capability of paf

6
the f16 mlu will upgrade our f16s to a decent level [52+] but the question remains if it remains a force to be reckoned with , after the su30 aesa upgradation
 
7
i consider this event as an eye opener for our militery planners who are taking pakfa lightly assuming its induction is light years away -- as india will have compareable stealth capability by the end of this decade - and she wont just poke us lightly rather would go on all out attack before we even know whats happening

8
apart from radars , i dont think we even have any high altitude SAMs either -- whats are the leaders waiting for?:what:

9
We need paf leaders with foresight--- i know we are a poor country , but we should invest intelligently--- it would be far more effective to induct stealth like versions of two 4.5+ fighters , which could hold there own infront of whatever iaf has to offer , than to induct number fillers , all of which become ineffective thanks to effective countermeasures and stealth capabilities of the opponent

10
jft stealth version is a welcome development , however it should be inducted as blk2 rather than after another year as blk3

11
now that mmrca is almost decided , we can tune in the j10b specifically to counter the strong aspects of the rafale-- however it would be wise to induct a silent flanker version of j10b so that it can hold its own against any indian fighter even in indian airspace -- Afterall it is supposed to be our flagship fighter , so to speak

however i give credit to the previous airchief on the relatively quick induction of awacs / refuellers without sacrificing much on quality and ofcourse the numerous foreign exercises that paf has participated in over the past 5 years
 
Pakistan training is so far ahead of INDIA he says.

Yet 4 American choppers walked in undetected.

PAF traing so far ahead YET INDIA DEPLOYED BVR capable fighters in 1990s esp during KARGIL and PAF only 3 years ago (20 years later)

India depolyed flight refullers 10 years ago PAF last year.

India has TVC engines and PESA radars on SU30MKI PAF is yet to acquire such technology.

------------------------------

SO MY QUESTION how the hell we get so far ahead in training than IAF

how ????????

When ???????

Why ??????

Demonstrate this plz ????????

ITS NOT A RANT OR RAVE just a challenge plz EXPLAIN HOW THIS TRAINING is so far ahead.
 
Training
There seems to be a general consensus of opinion today that in a comparison of strength between the Indian and Pakistani air forces, the Indian advantage in numbers is counterbalanced by the Pakistani advantage in personnel, training, and tactics. In fact, some would argue that the Pakistani fighter pilot, his training, and his tactics are so superior that even though the Indians have now caught up in technology, the Pakistan Air Force still has an overall edge in combat capability as long as the quantitative edge does not proceed above 3:1.:azn:
How absurd!! 3:1 ratio?? IAF is not any Syrian Air Fore or Algerian Air Force. How many exercises has PAF carried out and how many IAF carried out over the past 10 years? How many sorties did IAF fly and how many did PAF fly? Living in dreamland is not always good when the enemy is sharpening the claws.
 
Pakistan training is so far ahead of INDIA he says.

Yet 4 American choppers walked in undetected.

PAF traing so far ahead YET INDIA DEPLOYED BVR capable fighters in 1990s esp during KARGIL and PAF only 3 years ago (20 years later)

India depolyed flight refullers 10 years ago PAF last year.

India has TVC engines and PESA radars on SU30MKI PAF is yet to acquire such technology.

------------------------------

SO MY QUESTION how the hell we get so fat ahead in training than IAF

how ????????

When ???????

Why ??????

Demonstrate this plz ????????

Oh there he is or whatever you are the biggest troll of them all here... man you have some serious haterd issues don't you lolz you seriously are hurting your health go get your self checked out no cares what you write and how you write it but you are full of hate in every damn thread, post you have nothing useful to give rather love and live to bash Pakistan what a waste of life show some respect you are a guest here this aint your home. :angry:
 
NO DISRESPECT meant Top Gun.

I just find the superior training more professional LINES a load of ****

And a bit tiresome.

we are all smart enough to realise what south asians are capable of including INDIA.

For godsake this is india & pakistan NOT some NATO TRAINED equipped Air power. WE STILL FLY MIG21s its laughable
 
I am really hoping that JFT Block II and IIIs turn out to be a miracle and come out sooner than expected. Otherwise at the rate that we are going, i think i am being polite when i say this, WE ARE SCREWED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
Pakistan did not proceeded work on Veera Air defence system after leasing one system, PAF has no potent long range Air defence system. So thats mean if something comes above 25000 feet, it is impossible by PAF to hit by air defence missels. HQ-2 is already old system und u need to fuel it before use, so it is liquid fuel system not solid fuel system. In this sistuation we are sitting ducks. Sapada is medium range and is not still integrated.
 
U people always think of aircrafts and BVR..... If I were U I would think more of air defence system after the Abbottabad incident.
 
During OBL raid's stealth helicopter, there are at least 20 F-18s including AWACs sitting in Western border , how they are useful to counter attack on our F-16s (i know it is still upgrading MLU) and future JF-17s (Blk 2,3). What will Pakistan respond to it in near future?

F-18s is more advantages than these jets? I think, PAF is very weak against US aggression.

More information and debates is appreciated in facts.
 
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