PAF in Libya during US confrontation

[Windjammer]

They dont oblige even to this day, when drones make a mockery out of the airspace of the said country. Oh wait this time its not Libya but Pakistan.
Windi no offence but we should really let this false bravado of ours to rest.

While we are at it, let's just put the blame on the PAF for the power shortages and the floods in the country.
My dear, do you expect the PAF to over ride the authority of your civilian set up and go gung ho.
Forget the OBL or the drone strikes, PAF was forced to hold back by the Zardari government even when the Indians once felt adventurous in 2008. Although the PAF had intercepted the intruding Indian aircraft and the images were shown to the US Commander Mike Mullen but Zardari clan were insisting it was a technical violation just to sweep the issue under the carpet....where as the PAF had the Indian aircraft in their gun sights and were just waiting clearance to fire.
In-fact the next message would have been splash-1. (Depicted)

 

[Tipu7]

While we are at it, let's just put the blame on the PAF for the power shortages and the floods in the country.
My dear, do you expect the PAF to over ride the authority of your civilian set up and go gung ho.
Forget the OBL or the drone strikes, PAF was forced to hold back by the Zardari government even when the Indians once felt adventurous in 2008. Although the PAF had intercepted the intruding Indian aircraft and the images were shown to the US Commander Mike Mullen but Zardari clan were insisting it was a technical violation just to sweep the issue under the carpet....where as the PAF had the Indian aircraft in their gun sights and were just waiting clearance to fire.
In-fact the next message would have been splash-1. (Depicted)

View attachment 317767

Same Su30 MKI while landing on ground

 

[IceCold]

While we are at it, let's just put the blame on the PAF for the power shortages and the floods in the country.
My dear, do you expect the PAF to over ride the authority of your civilian set up and go gung ho.
Forget the OBL or the drone strikes, PAF was forced to hold back by the Zardari government even when the Indians once felt adventurous in 2008. Although the PAF had intercepted the intruding Indian aircraft and the images were shown to the US Commander Mike Mullen but Zardari clan were insisting it was a technical violation just to sweep the issue under the carpet....where as the PAF had the Indian aircraft in their gun sights and were just waiting clearance to fire.
In-fact the next message would have been splash-1. (Depicted)

View attachment 317767

We all know what the civilian government really is in Pakistan, non existent and I thought military was beyond taking orders from the civilian leadership on strategic issues?
PS I don't understand why would you take me for someone wanting to blame PAF just for the sake of it? Let's face it when It came to security of Pakistan military leadership failed as miserably as any political would have. While I have no lost love for any political government in the last decade but Let's not put the entire blame on civilian government shall we.

 

[Raider 21]

Pakistani pilots in Libyan aircraft? Why were they not shot down?

Had the Americans taken this seriously then they would've shot them down anytime they wanted to. Also asked a couple of PAF guys, there were no PAF pilots posted to Libya in the 80s. Only chaps who were flying abroad were a few guys on F-16s and T-37s at Turkey.

 

[war&peace]

I dont understand this
Qaddafi was a scumbag . he actively supported terrorists Like Al Zulfiqar against Pakistan during Zia era. he was after all in the soviet camp. I cant understand how Pakistani pilots could be there when we had no military relations with them
if its the time when Americans launched an attack on his Palace killing some of his family members then I can safely say we were at odds with Libyans..

He was much better than rest of the leadership in the Muslim world and Pakistan has the worst leadership in the whole world.

 

[wiseone2]

Lol this whole story is strange
not buying it


I dont understand this
Qaddafi was a scumbag . he actively supported terrorists Like Al Zulfiqar against Pakistan during Zia era. he was after all in the soviet camp. I cant understand how Pakistani pilots could be there when we had no military relations with them
if its the time when Americans launched an attack on his Palace killing some of his family members then I can safely say we were at odds with Libyans..

it is highly doubtful pakistan would risk damaging relations with America when qadaffi was a whipping boy for the americans

 

[Irfan Baloch]

it is highly doubtful pakistan would risk damaging relations with America when qadaffi was a whipping boy for the americans

damaging relations my ***
this guy was funding Al Zulfiqar and his agents were actively involved in subversion and assassinations inside Pakistan during Soviet era. he was staunch Soviet ally and specially hated Gen Zia
the joke is that he at some point threw few bones and Pakistanis made a cricket stadium in his name and seem to have sold their behinds to him. even without America in the picture .. his regime back then was hostile towards Pakistan.

its really cringe worthy when some Pakistanis erect their Ummah banner because some Arab threw some bones to them which makes them feel we owe them our lives now.
Arabs are genetically racists and bigots and have pretty much remained as such before and after Islam .. their animosity towards Persians is just one example

 

[wiseone2]

damaging relations my ***
this guy was funding Al Zulfiqar and his agents were actively involved in subversion and assassinations inside Pakistan during Soviet era. he was staunch Soviet ally and specially hated Gen Zia
the joke is that he at some point threw few bones and Pakistanis made a cricket stadium in his name and seem to have sold their behinds to him. even without America in the picture .. his regime back then was hostile towards Pakistan.

its really cringe worthy when some Pakistanis erect their Ummah banner because some Arab threw some bones to them which makes them feel we owe them our lives now.
Arabs are genetically racists and bigots and have pretty much remained as such before and after Islam .. their animosity towards Persians is just one example

even ignoring Qadaffi's support for Al Zulfiqar the guy was a nut case
who wants to be associated with a nutcase ?

 

[shhh]

One thing all Pakistanis should understand. Things are not as "Ummah" as we think. There are 4 partitions in Muslim world and it is a general law of cooperation between different Muslim countries.

1- Wahabbi Block (KSA, UAE, Qatar, Kuwait etc)
2- Shia Block (Iran, Syria, Kurds, Hezbollah etc)
3- Sunnis (Pakistan, Turkey, Jordan, Nigeria, Libya, "SYRIA", Indonesia, CARs etc)
4- Arab nationalism against Israel (Jordan, Libya, Syria, Iraq, Egypt among which major enemies of Israel are neutralized by proxies and direct invasions)

There are many countries with sunni population and shia governments or vice versa. Major diplomacy works on this principle which i stated above. Anyone can notice this factor if deeply study the near-past history. The shia and salafi factors against Sunnis and salafis against shias are problems we are still unable to identify. Ummah can be created but first of all we have to undo the plotting made by colonial powers and makers of TW Lawrence. Many Sunni dictators of Arab were bend towards Russia because deobandi Gen Zia ul Haq was in favor of America. We guys cannot watch the things as Arabs or Turks watch it. KSA and other salafis are close allies of each other. Iran helps all shia populations in the world and use them for their plans. Pure Sunni regimes help the Sunni agenda. It is we Pakistanis who consider this science as "sectarianism". This is not sectarianism but reality!

This is the most clear analysis of the situation I have ever read, clarifies a lot of things, thanks bro.

 

[khanmubashir]

It's a well established fact that in the 70s and 80s, PAF was very much present in the Middle East and North Africa.
In some of these countries, PAF was virtually running the show. Libya was one such example whose Mirage squadrons were mainly managed by ex or deputed PAF personal. In mid 80s, Libyan President, Colonel Qaddafi was in direct confrontation with US . Initially USAF F-111s based in UK carried out bombing raids hitting a Libyan airfield, later there was an issue with USN aircraft operating from aircraft carriers involved in border violations, the aircraft carriers were also allegedly patrolling within Libyan sea lanes. During these hostilities, a couple of Libyan MiG fighters were shot down by USN F-14 Tomcats. Historians have it that it was after these incidents, the Libyan leader personally approached the PAF contingent and requested them to bomb the American ships. The PAF was obviously having none of it however it continued with it's duties of flying regular missions including CAPs.
Although no further fighting took place but reportedly aircraft from both sides did confront each other, it's said that on 12 February 1986, PAF pilots flying in Libyan Mirages came across a pair of USN F/A 18 Hornets and although no air combat took place but both sides played Cat and Mouse with each other, the PAF pilots getting the better of the Hornets and returned to base with following gun camera images.
Note : Claims and detail provided by source.!!! @Oscar , @Horus @waz @Irfan Baloch. If there are any discrepancies, then kindly rectify them or if not appropriate, then delete the thread.

1sT pic is of f-18 super horneT model iT was made in 90s

 

[Bilal Khan 777]

They dont oblige even to this day, when drones make a mockery out of the airspace of the said country. Oh wait this time its not Libya but Pakistan.
Windi no offence but we should really let this false bravado of ours to rest.

Drones fly in Pakistan with the permission of the Pakistani government. There is no aircraft in our airspace that does not notify the CAA. If there is one, it becomes a bogey. All drones, recce or ucav, come in and leave with permission. This is the biggest lie for the people of Pakistan.

 

[SQ8]

Drones fly in Pakistan with the permission of the Pakistani government. There is no aircraft in our airspace that does not notify the CAA. If there is one, it becomes a bogey. All drones, recce or ucav, come in and leave with permission. This is the biggest lie for the people of Pakistan.

Please dont mislead. The PAF and the entire Pakistani ADGE does not possess the capability of shooting down a flying object with limited manoeuvrability and the RCS and cruising speed slightly higher than a Cessna 172. I swear on Rehman Malik's life and I pray he dies if I lie.

 

[Falcon26]

Drones fly in Pakistan with the permission of the Pakistani government. There is no aircraft in our airspace that does not notify the CAA. If there is one, it becomes a bogey. All drones, recce or ucav, come in and leave with permission. This is the biggest lie for the people of Pakistan.

How about the Abbottabad penetration? Did they notify the Pakistani CCA?

While its true that some drones fly with Pakistani permission, it's misleading to say that all drones fly with Pakistani permission. Case in point, the killing of Mullah Mansour which formed the basis of US withholding of military aid to Pakistan and which also invited a very embarrassing diplomatic outcome for Pakistan. The Americans simply waited for mullah Mansour to enter Pakistani territory from Iran before taking him out.

In my view, there are technical challenges Pakistan faces that allow the NATO forces in Afghanistan to nullify potential countermeasures. If unchecked, the day is not too far when even your Eastern neighbor gains this qualitative edge. The sooner Pakistanis come to terms with this reality, the better for them.

 

[HRK]

Case in point, the killing of Mullah Mansour which formed the basis of US withholding of military aid to Pakistan and which also invited a very embarrassing diplomatic outcome for Pakistan. The Americans simply waited for mullah Mansour to enter Pakistani territory from Iran before taking him out.

Sir I still need to know about such a modern drone which can make a CAR PARKED at the SIDE OF THE ROAD shoot the missile at that car WITHOUT CREATING A CRATER in the ground & can make a PASSPORT FLY UP TO 50-60 meters from the place of incident ..... UNSCRATCHED

plz don't go in those alleys which are much darker then they appear ...

regards ....

 

[Falcon26]

Sir I still need to know about such a modern drone which can make a CAR PARKED at the SIDE OF THE ROAD shoot the missile at that car WITHOUT CREATING A CRATER in the ground & can make a PASSPORT FLY UP TO 50-60 meters from the place of incident ..... UNSCRATCHED

plz don't go in those alleys which are much darker then they appear ...

regards ....

With all due respect, I am not interested in conspiracy theories.