PAF detected US planes near Jalalabad border before OBL operation

[pakdefender]

I think we'll have to bring to closure this debate about 'what really happened' since we will never fully know what actually happened , why do I say this that’s because from the word go after the news of the alleged killing of OBL came out there has been lack of concrete information.

Starting from dumping OBL in the sea , there was a fire fight there was no fire fight , there was live feed for the POTUS there was not live feed. Picture will be released then no picture but funny videos, supposedly of OBL , were released.

On the operational details, there are a lot of holes in every aspect of the operation, like from the destroyed tail of the chopper we know that they used stealth choppers so we could not detect them but they are saying there were Chinooks also in the air which is a very large and noisy machine. So were we complicit or did the Americans really dodge us.

If some how they conjure up the story that Pakistan was involved in harbouring bin laden , what then ? Will they launch an attack on Pakistan ?

Or if they label us to be incompetent , what then ? They will be bad mouthing us fro sure and perahps will they attack us to ‘secure our nuclear weapons’ ?

My point is where do we go from here, leaving behind who knew what, where do we go from here and what’s the worst case scenario here in either case

To my mind worst case scenario is America declaring war on Pakistan and this leads to the next question that if such and event does happen what will be our strategy against such an attack?

 

[Rafi]

There is no chance of a war between Pakistan and the US - it would be folly for either country to take that step.

 

[AAtish]

Could you elborate the bold part please? How would it be ruinous for a country that has about 2 alternates for supply routes at hand just waiting for a nod and whose mainland is about half the world away? You think 10 years of handling guerilla war hasn't taught them anything? Think again mate.

If indeed OBL was your enemy, then how come your government let him enter the country and by the accounts of his wives, stay just about a few meters away from your national military academy? For 5 years OBL was sitting pretty inside your country while neither your ISI nor Pak Army knew anything about him, sending US on a wild goose chase everywhere from Iraq to Iran to Afghanistan.

Come on, seriously. We're not joking here.

We are seriously asking.. can you prove he was there?

 

[seekers]

But why PAF did not get alert even after crossing border of US choppers

 

[umair86pk]

Mods plz remove these fcukin indians from this forum as its a local matter these morons are not welcomed here.

 

[Najam Khan]

PAF scramble its fighters each time any a/c start heading towards 12nm international border before Pakistan's air space, the role of a scrambled a/c is to inform incoming a/c about Pakistan's air space.

Because of our Govt's 'No Drone Shooting' policy PAF has to obey the ROEs. Frequnet volations from Western border are un conciously considered as 'Friendly violations' in our soldier's mind.

In OBL op, its could be the drones factor that PAF didn't scrambled (provided that they get the sound reading from any Radar from the area).

The other reason could be a good flight path of US helicopters, they may have picked a route with difficult terrain for radars....stealth and low altitude were the additional features of their flight.

 

[S.M.R]

I think we'll have to bring to closure this debate about 'what really happened' since we will never fully know what actually happened , why do I say this that’s because from the word go after the news of the alleged killing of OBL came out there has been lack of concrete information.

Starting from dumping OBL in the sea , there was a fire fight there was no fire fight , there was live feed for the POTUS there was not live feed. Picture will be released then no picture but funny videos, supposedly of OBL , were released.

On the operational details, there are a lot of holes in every aspect of the operation, like from the destroyed tail of the chopper we know that they used stealth choppers so we could not detect them but they are saying there were Chinooks also in the air which is a very large and noisy machine. So were we complicit or did the Americans really dodge us.

If some how they conjure up the story that Pakistan was involved in harbouring bin laden , what then ? Will they launch an attack on Pakistan ?

Or if they label us to be incompetent , what then ? They will be bad mouthing us fro sure and perahps will they attack us to ‘secure our nuclear weapons’ ?

My point is where do we go from here, leaving behind who knew what, where do we go from here and what’s the worst case scenario here in either case

To my mind worst case scenario is America declaring war on Pakistan and this leads to the next question that if such and event does happen what will be our strategy against such an attack?

This is substantiating the fact that the operation was more against Obama rather than PA / ISI. Lolz.

 

[nwmalik]

This is substantiating the fact that the operation was more against Obama rather than PA / ISI. Lolz.

?obama
everyone seems to be mixing them up\ha ha

 

[S.M.R]

?obama
everyone seems to be mixing them up\ha ha

Yes, Obama, just go through the loopholes of the Operation, you will find silly mistakes, further there are series of mistakes by US like announcement by US president, then changing statements one after another, thats why it seems to more against Obama.

 

[mjnaushad]

They detected planes. Not Choppers... Still a failure... On detecting Chopper and OBL.....

Also this if true proves that US was ready to take on Pakistani Aircrafts if needed......

Thank god that they were not intercepted because if US planes and PAF ever come to real fight it will be a walk in the park for US.

 

[Last Hope]

Maybe we were looking onto the planes, and must be scared or what?? I think it was a vwise decision not to respond to them. But the choppers, must be stealth.

 

[krash]

Do you know how long it actually take for a fighter to get airborne? Assuming that the pilot is on base, in his flight suit, and is qualified to fly...

- Try at least five minutes to don his personal gear,
- his crew chief needs another five-ten minutes to prep the aircraft,
- two-five minutes to strap in the pilot,
- two-five minutes for the engines to spool up,
- two-five minutes for the aircraft's INS to align itself,
- two-five minutes to taxi to the runway.

All of this is assuming nothing goes wrong. Ground controllers perfectly directed all aircrafts out of their spots and onto the runway. But what if the pilots are not on base? How long will that take to hunt them down and get them on base? You are assuming that an airbase has someone in gear and on alert at all time.

Mr.Gambit what I speak from is the experience of a dozen PAF personnel also serving duties as my family personnel. I will give you a specific example....PAF base Minhas in Kamra has a response time of 8 min max to get its boys airborne irrespective of the pilots being asleep, dancing, watching a movie or just indisposed in the bathroom. These timings are taken very seriously in every air force. And at least in PAF there are pilots and aircrafts always on the ready. Our airbases do have 'someone in gear and on alert at all time'. They have to be, considering the close proximity of our high value strategic assets to a hostile border. The short response time of PAF is something the air force is quite proud of and has boasted about numerous times. You might also remember the bashing the (Im seriously sorry to bring the IAF in this but this is a well known example. No offence intended indeed) IAF got from the hands of certain USAF personnel for having gotten 6 of their aircraft airborne in 20 min. Though this time was when these 6 jets and their pilots were prepped and ready where as your premise states an unprepared scenario but still this example shows how seriously these timings are taken.

And for the 30 min stated to reach the interception point: Well it takes a 737 30 min to get from Lahore to Islamabad. So unless the interception point was somewhere on the Chinese border (The PAF jets were reportedly scrambled from Sargodha which is a shorter distance away from Islamabad than Lahore is) im not buying this time either. And also what happened to the boys stationed in Minhas and Peshawar???? On a "boys' night-out" perhaps, as Gambit put it?

 

[Jango]

Do you know how long it actually take for a fighter to get airborne? Assuming that the pilot is on base, in his flight suit, and is qualified to fly...

- Try at least five minutes to don his personal gear,
- his crew chief needs another five-ten minutes to prep the aircraft,
- two-five minutes to strap in the pilot,
- two-five minutes for the engines to spool up,
- two-five minutes for the aircraft's INS to align itself,
- two-five minutes to taxi to the runway.

All of this is assuming nothing goes wrong. Ground controllers perfectly directed all aircrafts out of their spots and onto the runway. But what if the pilots are not on base? How long will that take to hunt them down and get them on base? You are assuming that an airbase has someone in gear and on alert at all time.

i dont know about your airforce....but in PAF....there are at least two pilots on all the bases....in the flight suit....in the cockpit...there is a GPu and APU right next to the aircraft all wired up.....and the pilot sits in the cockpit for two hours until a shift ends and then other pilots take his place.....and the plane is right next to the runway....a bit to the side of the taxiway...if there is sunlight...the pilot is suplied and umbrella and also a magazine....the pilot even has his helmet on....and this is a witness account....not from some sotry or newspaper.....GET YOUR FACTS RIGHT!

 

[F86 Saber]

Do you know how long it actually take for a fighter to get airborne? Assuming that the pilot is on base, in his flight suit, and is qualified to fly...

- Try at least five minutes to don his personal gear,
- his crew chief needs another five-ten minutes to prep the aircraft,
- two-five minutes to strap in the pilot,
- two-five minutes for the engines to spool up,
- two-five minutes for the aircraft's INS to align itself,
- two-five minutes to taxi to the runway.

All of this is assuming nothing goes wrong. Ground controllers perfectly directed all aircrafts out of their spots and onto the runway. But what if the pilots are not on base? How long will that take to hunt them down and get them on base? You are assuming that an airbase has someone in gear and on alert at all time.

If this is the response time of USAF no wonder they were not able to stop 911 from happening.
I agree with Krash because i know that PAF response time for an incursion in Lahore area is under 6 minutes from Sargodha (The travel time for the jet once it's air borne is less than 2 mins) and i believe Islamabad is nearer to Sargodha than Lahore.

 

[lkozhi]

i dont know about your airforce....but in PAF....there are at least two pilots on all the bases....in the flight suit....in the cockpit...there is a GPu and APU right next to the aircraft all wired up.....and the pilot sits in the cockpit for two hours until a shift ends and then other pilots take his place.....and the pilot is suplied and umbrella and also a magazine....the pilot even has his helmet on....and this is a witness account....not from some sotry or newspaper.....GET YOUR FACTS RIGHT!

Probably someone forgot to tell him to start the plane and face those helis