Osmania University beef festival sparks violence

[Awesome]

So you support the freedom to draw cartoon of Mohammad?

I don't support the act, but people are free to do what they want. I'll boo them every chance I get, thats my freedom.

 

[Joe Shearer]

See,

I am not interested in what issues you have with him but i have noticed an anti upper caste edge in a lot of your comments.

It is true that a lot of dalits face discrimination even today but also true is the fact that they also gain a lot from affirmative actions.I have lived my whole life in a city and only discrimination i have seen is a reverse one.One get glimpses of hardship dalits face only if someone ventures into villages or small towns.

It has been 4-5 generations since institutionalised discriminations against dalits have ended and i for myself don't feel guilty of what my forefathers may have done.

It is a good time that people stop blaming upper castes for every evil afflicted upon dalits.They are more than empowered today to make a good life for themselves.

Please go through further comments by Subramanian and judge for yourself why I harbour a propensity to look on a particular sect with suspicion.

 

[Awesome]

Hey, smoking hashish is banned all over India.. Infringement of freedom ??

Strawman, the addictive substance is banned for health reasons not for religious reasons. The state has a stake in its nation's health not in its nations beliefs, it is the right of the state to control one thing over the other. Like that, stealing is banned, murder is banned. As I said secularism demands religion be irrelevant in consideration to governance.

 

[Joe Shearer]

it is all about respecting the sentiments of others. My freedoms and rights should not infringe upon that of others.

Sorry, it isn't. There is a constitution, there is an Indian Penal Code, and there is the Criminal Procedure Code. Whatever respecting sentiments and the rest of that you do, the law of the land comes first. Also last and all the positions in between.

 

[Awesome]

I am personally a vegetarian, but last weekend was spent with a friend in the city, where his wife made beef with oyster sauce. I had to make do with a thin-crust pizza, a classic Margharita. It was delicious, however.

It is difficult to understand where these Beef_is_not_available/not_eaten_in_India jokers are coming from.

Pizzas have been the undoing of many vegetarian Indians , but margharita should be fine for your beliefs or other vegetarian concerns (I understand religious convictions, but imagine those save the animals types !!).

I had a Brahmin colleague, she was stuck working with us Pakistanis. Poor thing had to run out each time we ordered Lebanese mixed grill in the office. With the hard core Brahmins who don't expose themselves to other eating cultures and can't sit in the same room where beef (heck even chicken) is being eaten, such a misconception is possible. Not saying they are being rude as my colleague was a nice person, its been grilled into their mindsets to not like the very smell of meat.

I am pretty sure I would have some eeky feelings if I am eating my food with the next guy eating pork.

Good on you, you can endure the smell of it.

 

[Joe Shearer]

Yea, and some here clearly prefer to talk through those holes.

We really, REALLY needed your contribution. You raise the tone of a discussion with such effortless ease.

Pizzas have been the undoing of many vegetarian Indians , but margharita should be fine for your beliefs or other vegetarian concerns (I understand religious convictions, but imagine those save the animals types !!).

Ummm....frank confession time. I don't like the taste of meat and loathe fish.

 

[notsuperstitious]

Strawman, the addictive substance is banned for health reasons not for religious reasons. The state has a stake in its nation's health not in its nations beliefs, it is the right of the state to control one thing over the other. Like that, stealing is banned, murder is banned. As I said secularism demands religion be irrelevant in consideration to governance.

Religion is no consideration, as people of all religions suffer when social harmony collapses.

Similar to why Satanic Verses is banned for all, or how morning azan is not banned even though it disturbs people of other faiths and probably breaches environmental laws.

Be reasonable Asim, I can not over emphasise the importance of social harmony. While I agree on principle with you that govt should not ban ANYTHING its not possible in our countries yet, is it?

 

[Joe Shearer]

Why are others getting sentimental on other people's food habits.

Because freedom and liberty does not mean my own freedom and liberty alone.

No man is an island.

Ask not for whom the bell tolls; it tolls for thee.

 

[A.Muqeet khan]

Beef festival turns Osmania into battlefied, student stabbed
Hyderabad, April 16, 2012, (IANS)

A student of the Osmania university here was stabbed for supporting a beef festival organised by several student groups opposing ''food fascism'' in hostels, police said Monday.


The beef festival saw clashes, which saw five students being injured, and even led to vehicles being burnt.

The situation in the university was tense as violence continued in the campus past midnight with a group of students attacking the 'C' hostel and stabbing a student for supporting the beef festival. Police said the injured student was admitted to Gandhi Hospital here.

Protestors set afire a bus of state-owned Andhra Pradesh State Road Transport Corporation (APSRTC).

The clashes broke out Sunday night after some Dalit and left-wing student groups organised a beef festival on the campus, to highlight their demand for including beef in the hostel menu. Over 200 students and some professors attended the festival and ate various dishes made of beef.

Akhil Bharatiya Vidyarthi Parishad (ABVP) activists staged a protest against the festival and clashed with the organisers. The two groups attacked each other with stones and sticks. Five students were injured in the clashes. Two vehicles were also set afire.
Police used teargas shells and batons to disperse the clashing groups. The campus, which witnessed many violent protests over separate Telangana state during last two years, turned into a battlefield.

The beef festival was organised by Telangana Students Association, Progressive Democratic Student Union, Student Federation of India and student groups from English and Foreign Languages University.

The organisers claimed that beef is the part of their cultural identity and an affordable source of nutrition. They said the festival was to oppose 'food fascism' in university hostels.

Supporting the demand, P.L. Visweswara Rao, former professor of communication and journalism at the university, said students have a right to seek a particular food. He alleged that the police and the university administration failed to protect the students participating in the festival.

Th ABVP, which opposed the beef festival, called for university shutdown Monday.
Police have sealed all the routes leading to the university and deployed additional police and paramilitary forces on the campus to prevent further clashes.

Beef festival turns Osmania into battlefied, student stabbed

I guess human life is of less value than Beef in India.

well i wonder if it was pork day in Pakistan how would people react (not to differently i think ) well even then rip to dead

 

[Awesome]

Religion is no consideration, as people of all religions suffer when social harmony collapses.

Similar to why Satanic Verses is banned for all, or how morning azan is not banned even though it disturbs people of other faiths and probably breaches environmental laws.

Be reasonable Asim, I can not over emphasise the importance of social harmony. While I agree on principle with you that govt should not ban ANYTHING its not possible in our countries yet, is it?

Religion alone cannot maintain social harmony, nor is it even a requirement. Instead of respecting each others beliefs (which always clash hence the different religions), respect each others freedom rights. Practice your freedom up to the point where your freedom doesn't impact the others freedom.

 

[Manas]

Strawman, the addictive substance is banned for health reasons not for religious reasons. The state has a stake in its nation's health not in its nations beliefs, it is the right of the state to control one thing over the other. Like that, stealing is banned, murder is banned. As I said secularism demands religion be irrelevant in consideration to governance.

Grossly wrong . The state also has to look after the law and order situation . It can't allow social disharmony in the name of unbridled religious freedom. Thats why Satanic verses was banned in India to pacify anger of the Muslim community.

Similarly eating Beef is a contentious issue and religious sentiments of Hindus are attached to the issue to which every elected govt must give due consideration in order to remain alive in politics. We are a democracy where sentiment of people counts.

 

[Joe Shearer]

dude lot of things.

TN is not so simple as you might think.

In fact by divorcing the 2% of us,it is TN which has lost out and not us.They are slaves to many fallacies of the leaders they chose and how things have gone bad,

I can go on and on about the fallacies,

1.Mullai Periyar loss of face-1979 agreement to Kerala for lowering the water level

2. Loss of water bodies/agricultural land/river bed sand smuggling

3. Unlawful construction and no proper law and order

4. Heavy law and order issue including the assassination of a PM and lethal violence in the streets

5. Not to forget heavy corruption

6.Biggest loss is the amount of investment and development lost out to Bangalore/Hyderabad after Chennai lost out on the great advantage it had pre liberalization

7. Heavy alcohol abuse by youth and Tasmac shops affecting and posing a health problem in a state which had successful prohibition once


I can go on and on and on......

TN had so many advantages that it gained from the heavy British presence and the culture of knowledge and learning that the elite had developed from before but this fraud revolution screwed it big time and ended up now as an also ran behind Karnataka and AP and there also has been a heavy brain drain of Civil service officers to outside the state.

Starting from all that right until the current power crisis,the frauds have failed completely that the sole proprietors of linguistic emotions in a charged up state end up paying 1000 bucks for a vote.

how the mighty have fallen?

Whereas all of us who got prosecuted in the 1960s are all well good and much more prosperous and better off than we would have been by being teachers and officers in the TN govt.

On the other hand,those village kids now go to their schools with no learned teachers and end up paying money for institution to the same teacher later in the evening.

Above all those 98% are those who display crazy linguistic feel and are dying to develop,learn english and say,i dont speak tamil.

whereas the 2% still speak tamizh and nothing else.

I think your self-pitying elegy for a dead hegemony is its own best critic.

There are many who hark back to the good governance under the British, and to their neutrality and unbiased development of talent, no matter where it was found. Unfortunately, freedom and independence comes with a price tag attached, the price of having to make one's decisions oneself, not having them made for one by a nanny state. Freedom is worth that price.

The same thing applies to you and to your domination of Tamil Nadu. My mother used to relate the story of eating lunch with her friends the daughters of the local collector, an Iyer like you. Suddenly, the girls started gobbling their food, to my mother's bewilderment, but within minutes the food was cleared, long before they had finished, and thrown away. The explanation: their ayah of twenty years' service had passed across the verandah within sight of the lunch party. Seeing her was enough to make them lose their purity, and they had to bathe again.

Anything, a list twenty times as long as you have mentioned above, is better than that utter contempt, that repression.

 

[notsuperstitious]

Religion alone cannot maintain social harmony, nor is it even a requirement. Instead of respecting each others beliefs (which always clash hence the different religions), respect each others freedom rights. Practice your freedom up to the point where your freedom doesn't impact the others freedom.

`

Agreed on principal, but govt bans a lot of things for wider benefit of society.

Killing wild bucks is banned on environmental grounds - benefits society through preservation of environment

Consuming heroin banned on health grounds - - benefits society by preserving health standards

Hurling caste based abuse at low caste person banned, insulting other religions banned, cow slaughter banned, satanic verses banned - benefits society by preserving harmony and law and order

Now the last category is overal a grey area, and I completely agree with you on that. But the underlying principle is still a positive one, don't you agree?

 

[Joe Shearer]

Yes easier said than done. Either you become a communist country and ban every thing religious or you look after religious sensitivities of different religious groups till the society matures and educated enough to deal with these situation amicably.

Not at all.

Every western democracy, including the Scandinavian socialisms, is neutral towards religion.

No,the opposite,mostly it is sasta meat and few places have it good.

Gold-Silver vs Beef-Mutton,again not a relevant debate or a relevant metaphor.

as usual verbosity.

Of course. SOP.

Anything you can't answer is verbosity. As usual.

 

[Joe Shearer]

@joeshearer

What you are advocating for is an idealistic culture.
And why not? Would you have me propose a culture of compromises and the line of least resistance instead? That is exactly what we did, for 65 years. Do you like what we are today? And please don't compare us with Pakistan.

It is a right of every person to eat what he want to eat and nobody should interfere in it but if things like cow slaughter is openly allowed,it would certainly lead to some religious nutjob doing in in front of temples to instigate riots.
This is not about cow-slaughter in the open road, at random; this is about animal slaughter in licensed and registered slaughterhouses designed for humane slaughter.
The laws governing society have to be designed taking normal people into consideration, not fearing what religious, or linguistic, or ethnic nut jobs are likely to do. They will do it anyway.

If you think that people go on riot just because they have such a deep love for cows,you are wrong in this respect.
If you mean it is a political game, played by some cynical people in the hope of getting political power, we all know that, I think. That is why the RSS and VHP are religious bigots, but the BJP is fascist, not necessarily bigoted, but fascistic.

If you understand human pysche you will know that people have strong tendency to do what they are told not to do.
The particular act would be equivalent to showing middle finger to hindus and even the non hindutva variety one are going to feel insulted by it.
I'm sorry, I can't take this argument very seriously. It effectively means surrendering to every passing schoolboy with a sling-shot.

Either it would result in riots or counter insulting vitalating social atmosphere.
And?
Not allowing freedom will result in what, other than the peace of the grave?


And yes i am scared of such a future because people who believe in small state are an absolute minority in India.
Change is always scary. We need to face it and cope with it, not hope it will go away on its own if we ignore it and pretend for long enough that it isn't there.

My comments in red interspersed with your remarks.

Wow , First you describe whoever falls for an right Hindu identity is an idiot.

Then you go on nonchalantly describing what and how religious, caste, or political identity dominates which state or region of country as if its most normal thing to occur ,better if at the cost of a right wing hindu party like BJP . Well, Carry on with your hypocrisy .

What? A paraphrase of my response and that's it? Is that all? And have you nothing to say in that respect? Nothing at all?