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Operation Moshtarak Thread: Afghan flag hoisted over Marjah

Latest from NYT-

Coalition Begins Major Offensive-NYT Feb. 13, 2010

In The Cold Of Morning, Descending Into Conflict-NYT Feb. 12, 2010

Afghan Offensive New War Model-NYT Feb. 12, 2010

There's been a lot of discussion about the virtues of prior warning to the militants.

First, the model for such is the Pakistani Army offensive in S. Waziristan. If one recalls, while the offensive didn't really start before late September, the talk of such was clear literally from the time the SWAT/Buner operations began to wind down in mid-June. With such, many IDPs took advantage of the warning and vacated SWA.

Second, it has had a marginal effect in de-populating the area. Only about 5% of the Marjah population is estimated to have left. The primary cause for that is believed to be the tremendous mining of the area. Nearly all comments by locals allude to the vast number of mines that the taliban have planted. It's simply too difficult to leave central Marjah.

Third, a number of fighters have left. Most notably the Afghan taliban District governor who was captured in a vehicle heading south through Kandahar last week. He's also believed to be the senior military commander in the area.

It'll be interesting to see what comes of this operation although troops have been in contact all day.

Thanks.:usflag:
 
Three US soldiers die as massive Afghan assault begins: NATO
Updated at: 1545 PST, Saturday, February 13, 2010
KABUL: Three US soldiers died Saturday in an improvised bomb attack in southern Afghanistan, NATO said, as thousands of American troops led an assault on an insurgent stronghold in the region.

A brief statement from NATO's International Security Assistance Force (ISAF) did not make it clear if the deaths were during the assault on Marjah, in the south's Helmand province, or a reported suicide bomb attack in neighbouring Kandahar.

"Three ISAF service members from the United States died following an IED strike in southern Afghanistan today," it said, referring to improvised explosive devices, the Taliban's main weapon.

The deaths bring to 69 the total number of foreign soldiers to die in Afghanistan so far this year, according to a French news agency tally based on that kept by the icasualties.org website, following a record 520 for 2009.

The vast majority have been killed by IEDs, which are planted by roadsides, can be detonated from up to two kilometres (one mile) away and pack up to 2,000 pounds of explosives, experts have said.
Three US soldiers die as massive Afghan assault begins: NATO
 
US, Afghan troops sweep into Taliban stronghold
13 FEBRUARY 2010

MARJAH, Afghanistan – Thousands of U.S. Marines and Afghan soldiers stormed the Taliban stronghold of Marjah by air and ground Saturday, meeting only scattered resistance but facing a daunting thicket of bombs and booby traps that slowed the allied advance through the town.

The massive offensive was aimed at establishing Afghan government authority over the biggest southern town under militant control and breaking the Taliban grip over a wide area of their southern heartland.

Maj. Gen. Nick Carter, NATO commander of forces in southern Afghanistan, said Afghan and coalition troops, aided by 60 helicopters, made a "successful insertion" into Marjah in southern Helmand province. He said the operation was going "without a hitch."

Thousands of British, U.S. and Canadian troops also swept into Taliban areas to the north of Marjah, seeking to clear a wide swath of villages that had been under Taliban control for several years.

No coalition casualties had been reported more than 12 hours after the initial airborne assault, but NATO said three U.S. soldiers were killed Saturday in a bombing elsewhere in southern Afghanistan.

At least 20 insurgents were reported killed in the Helmand operation, said Gen. Sher Mohammad Zazai, the commander of Afghan forces in the region. Troops have recovered Kalashnikov rifles, heavy machine guns and grenades from 11 insurgents captured so far.

The few civilians who ventured out to talk to the Marines said teams of Taliban fighters were falling back deeper into the town, perhaps to try to regroup and mount harassment attacks to prevent the government from rushing in aid and public services — a key step in the operation.

The long-awaited assault on Marjah is the biggest offensive since the 2001 U.S.-led invasion of Afghanistan and is a major test of a new NATO strategy focused on protecting civilians. The attack is also the first major combat operation since President Barack Obama ordered 30,000 U.S. reinforcements here in December to try to turn the tide of the war.

President Hamid Karzai called on Afghan and international troops "to exercise absolute caution to avoid harming civilians," including avoiding airstrikes in areas where civilians are at risk. In a statement, he also called on insurgent fighters to renounce violence and reintegrate into civilian life.

A Taliban spokesman insisted the insurgents were still resisting the allied assault and that the town remained under their control.

"The Taliban are there and they are fighting. All of Marjah is still under Taliban control," Qari Yousef Ahmadi told The Associated Press by phone. He declined to say how many Taliban fighters remained in the town but dismissed NATO accounts as "propaganda."

Lt. Col. Brian Christmas, commander of the 3rd Battalion, 6th Marines, said U.S. troops faced sustained gunbattles in four areas of the town, including the western suburb of Sistani where India Company faced "some intense fighting." To the east, Kilo Company was inserted by helicopter but was then "significantly engaged" as the Marines fanned out from the landing zone.

But the greatest threat came from the extensive network of mines, homemade bombs and booby traps that ground forces encountered as soon as they crossed a major major canal into the town's northern entrance.

Insurgents appeared to have withdrawn from their frontline positions but left boobytraps and explosives in their abandoned positions and in the network of canals built by the Americans in the 1950s and 1960s. Marines safely set off numerous bombs, as the sound of strong detonations reverberated through the dusty streets.

"It's just got to be a very slow and deliberate process," said Capt. Joshua Winfrey of Stillwater, Okla., a Marine company commander.

The bridge over the canal into Marjah from the north was so rigged with explosives that Marines erected temporary bridges to cross into the town.

Lance Corp. Ivan Meza, 19, was the first to walk across one of the flimsy bridges.

"I did get an adrenaline rush, and that bridge is wobbly," said Meza, a Marine combat engineer from Pismo Beach, California, who is with the 1st Platoon, Lima Company, 3rd Battalion, 6th Marines.

Several civilians hesitantly crept out of their compounds as the Marines slowly worked through a suspected mine field. The Marines entered compounds first to make sure they were clear of bombs, then called in their Afghan counterparts to interview civilians inside.

Shopkeeper Abdul Kader, 44, said seven or eight Taliban fighters, who had been holding the position where the Marines crossed over, had fled in the middle of the night. He said he was angry at the insurgents for having planted bombs and mines all around his neighborhood.

"They left with their motorcycles and their guns. They went deeper into town," he said as Marines and Afghan troops searched a poppy field next to his house. "We can't even walk out of our own houses."

Saturday's ground assault followed many hours after an initial wave of helicopters carrying hundreds of U.S. Marines and Afghan troops swooped into town under the cover of darkness before dawn. Cobra helicopters fired Hellfire missiles at tunnels, bunkers and other defensive positions.

Marine commanders had said they expected between 400 to 1,000 insurgents — including more than 100 foreign fighters — to be holed up in Marjah. The town of 80,000 people, about 360 miles (610 kilometers) southwest of Kabul, is the linchpin of the militants' logistical and opium-smuggling network.

The offensive, code-named "Moshtarak," or "Together," was described as the biggest joint operation of the Afghan war, with 15,000 troops involved, including some 7,500 troops fighting in Marjah. The government says Afghan soldiers make up at least half of the offensive's force.

Once Marjah is secured, NATO hopes to rush in aid and restore public services in a bid to win support among the estimated 125,000 people who live in the town and surrounding villages. The Afghans' ability to restore those services is crucial to the success of the operation and to prevent the Taliban from returning.

Carter said coalition forces hope to install an Afghan government presence within the next few days and will work to find and neutralize improvised explosive devices — homemade bombs — left by the militants.

Tribal elders have pleaded for NATO to finish the operation quickly and spare civilians — an appeal that offers some hope the townspeople will cooperate with Afghan and international forces once the Taliban are gone.

Still, the town's residents have displayed few signs of rushing to welcome the attack force.

"The elders are telling people to stay behind the front doors and keep them bolted," Carter said. "Once people feel more secure and they realize there is government present on the ground, they will come out and tell us where the IEDs are."





1st Battalion, 3rd Marines seizes a key junction of roads just outside of Marjah.
 
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according to Sky News, the Taliban have not 'confronted' the ISAF/Nato advance - the militant casaulties have been low - all is well according to UK-MoD.
 
fatman17, we've a proliferation of threads going on right now WRT to this operation that are scattered in the U.S. foreign affairs section as well as World affairs, I believe.

Need to watch creating more, sir.

Thanks.:usflag:
 
according to Sky News, the Taliban have not 'confronted' the ISAF/Nato advance - the militant casaulties have been low - all is well according to UK-MoD.
Hmmm I hope they don't vacate Helmand and cross over to Pakistan. This tactic was expected, they'd vacate to fight another day or at another place.
 
fatman17, we've a proliferation of threads going on right now WRT to this operation that are scattered in the U.S. foreign affairs section as well as World affairs, I believe.

Need to watch creating more, sir.

Thanks.:usflag:

my biggest peeve with members of this board - they post where they feel like without finding the proper segment.
 
Threads merged

Can members please pay attention to the section they start threads in?

All Afghanistan, Iraq, North Korea_US relations, Iran-US relations etc. threads go in this section.

Domestic US events related threads go in World Affairs - this is for US Foreign Affairs ONLY

US-Pakistan relations go in the Strategic affairs section or the Pakistan War section if related to Pakistan's war against the Taliban

Thanks
 
This is an excellent backgrounder to Operation Moshtarak provided by the Institute For The Study Of War-

Operation Moshtarak Briefing- Feb. 5, 2010 ISW

It explains the rationale as well as the operational intent. Further the maps are very good. I encourage those who've downloaded google-earth to type Marjah, Helmand into the search. There's been a lot of detailed satelliate coverage of this area that's opensource and you can drop to about 500 ft. From there you can orient yourself to the maps provided by ISW and find the highway from Lashkar Gah west to Marjah. It shows the buildings, canals, and bridges in detail. The area is extensively networked with canals and this channelization poses severe engineering problems both now and later for ISAF forces.

The mining is extensive and it will months before they can all be lifted. Civilians WILL DIE from these unless they actively assist by informing their locations. Why? Because what they've seen their neighbors likely have not. They must help one another by identifying all that each person knows about.

The rationale for alerting both the taliban and civilians came from Raj-I-Nijat. The success of alerting the SWA civilians was integrated into ISAF ops. We don't care half as much about how many taliban we kill. It's irrelevant so long as they are ejected, the area secured and de-mined, and the Afghan government able to assert itself.

It actually appears that the afghan government has made a concerted effort to provide troops, police, and administrators to take over in Marjah. They'll all need time to get settled and they must be watched closely by ISAF to assure that they are at least honest and well-intentioned. Let us all hope so.

We're in no hurry here and can move as slowly as necessary to assure civilian safety. If hostages are taken, we'll simply back away. Sooner or later the taliban must make a run for it.

Many have already left. O.K. It doesn't matter. The ink-blotch will be stained in Marjah and, once stabilized, we'll move to the next place. There are a number of towns along the Helmand river as it arches south that must be attacked. They are just like Marjah and there's still plenty of opium centers left that will need to be eradicated.

I hope those here will take the long view. Some with agendas opposing the stabilization will not. Please note whom they are and ask yourselves why they care so deeply for the taliban.

Thanks.:usflag:
 
A couple of questions for those informed. This op is being spearheaded by the US/NATO forces, and they look serious for business. This means that the offer to negotiate is off the table, at least for the next few months.

Now, we know the Taliban will likely melt away after a little bit of resistance, unless they abandon the basic rules of geurilla warfare. Hence gaining ground shouldn't be that much of a problem. My question is this, who will lead efforts to "hold" this ground. Afghan National Army or NATO/US? NATO/US seem the obvious choice, but they won't be there for long enough (assuming a 2011 exit). The ANA, on the other hand, isn't equipped to hold that ground on its own against the Taliban.

Secondly, where will the Taliban go after this? Will they try to push further West (away from their strongholds along the Durand Line) or will they try to come East? Also, what efforts are being made to ensure that they are unable to get to their strongholds in the East and prevent them for trying to seek sanctuary in Pakistan?
 
"My question is this, who will lead efforts to "hold" this ground. Afghan National Army or NATO/US?"

PAFAce, there are more ANA troops in this operation than ISAF according the NYT article I've linked earlier. There are also teams of ANP and civilian administrators ready to move into the city that have already been identified and assigned.

Have you done the requisite reading that's been made available or are you seeking rhetorical opportunities to snipe?

"NATO/US seem the obvious choice, but they won't be there for long enough (assuming a 2011 exit)."

Consider that for a moment in light of this speculation of mine- Did Obama make clear to you that conditions on the ground will dictate the rate of withdrawal? If so, did he make clear that the forces presently in Afghanistan shall GROW throughout the summer? I know you are well-read so I'm certain that you know that those troops identified for deployment in his speech last November are only now BEGINNING to arrive and shall continue to do so for some time yet.

If all the above is true and accepted by you, how many troops must we withdraw before even reaching our present levels? 30,000? Over how long just to do that, ground conditions permitting? How long might that take? How many more beyond the present level to reach ZERO? All Obama needs to do to satisfy his liberal political constituency prior to the 2012 elections is show that the forces are being withdrawn. The rate for such seems very open to question, no?

"The ANA, on the other hand, isn't equipped to hold that ground on its own against the Taliban."

Is that something you know? If so, I'd like to know how you are able to determine the ANA's condition one and one-half years hence as well as the taliban's condition relative to them. I hope you're not projecting a personal hope of failure as it seems the world is working very hard to give the ANA the best chance possible.

Of course, it will certainly be harder for the ANA to grow if an insurgency directed by those like Haqqani, Hekmatyar, and Omar can continue from ELSEWHERE. That will absolutely complicate matters, don't you agree? Is it your hope that such complications continue? I hope not.

"Secondly, where will the Taliban go after this?"

The shadow district governor was captured in a car travelling south through Kandahar. Where do you think he was headed? This will take time as I know you read my above post that speculated the taliban will run for other towns further south in the Helmand valley. Would you wish us to snap our fingers and make it all better now?

"Will they try to push further West (away from their strongholds along the Durand Line) or will they try to come East?"

West? This is confusing. West from where, sir? Kurram? Orakzai? West from Nuristan and Konar? The Helmand river valley is the discussion here along with an operation in Marjah. Are you dissembling?

"...what efforts are being made to ensure that they are unable to get to their strongholds in the East and prevent them for trying to seek sanctuary in Pakistan?"

Stick to Marjah and Helmand please. Otherwise you dissemble with strawmen for an agenda. Let me suggest politely that sanctuary has existed aplenty in Pakistan for eight years. In time with hard work, luck, and sacrifice an afghan government, army and police that is seventy years younger than your country's considerable talents might rise but they'll need your cooperation to do so. Permitting their enemies sanctuary isn't a good definition of that cooperation.

Read the articles and links provided, if you don't mind before you commence with this exercise in dissemblance. Your military pleads being "overstretched". Fine. You're not the only ones.

Thanks.:usflag:
 
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Any development regarding Operation Mushrik ???

Casualties, advances ??? anything.

There was some news that there is first Taliban casualties in the operation Mushriq
 

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