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Nothing Comes Without Conditions: China's Relationship With Pakistan

Stop trolling over a pic.

This article is posted in a blog with inputs taken from another article which was published almost 10 months back.

Though there are indications that China has a certain small level of reservations when it comes to funding (projects) and on international affairs which also concerns them, the fact remains that China and Pakistan will have a cordial relationship no matter what media cooks up.

The conditions and sustainability for an all out partnership is not that valuable to China as of Pakistan because Chinese interests is of a broader scale and China doesn't necessarily need an economic corridor through a volatile terrain when its already well connected to West Asia and is on fast pace to connect with them and to western side .............nor does Pakistan have in their possession anything of China's interest.
But for Pakistan China is considered as a strength in immediate neighborhood and upto a certain level in International forums and a reliable supplier and partner in the defence sectors.

The phase of dependency which started with US, later shifted to China and the sooner Pakistan realizes it has certain obligations to meet in order to seek reciprocity with partners the faster it finds it way to a positive graph towards prosperity.
 
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Am i looking Handsome:disagree::disagree::disagree::disagree:

DalbirSingh380IA.jpg

View attachment 189986


Ya right .He was soo handsome during last skirmish
 
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Zaaaaaalim......... the background is picturesque, however, the scene made me throw up! :D
Naaah, just a sweet loving couple. Nice frame too. :enjoy:

Note: Seriously speaking this is not a big deal. We know barracks eroticism. Not very uncommon. Very naughty photographer though.

Am i looking Handsome:disagree::disagree::disagree::disagree:

DalbirSingh380IA.jpg
This is rare. It's rare for a non Gorkha to be commissioned into the Gorkha regiment!
 
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In The China-Pakistan Axis, Small recounts China’s role in helping Pakistan obtain nuclear weapons and nuclear-capable missiles by supplying technology and expertise
First of all Pakistan build nukes on it's own never it was given any thing from china but Pakistan give some centrifugal information to china and as for missiles are concerned Pakistan did got help from North-Korea,Ukraine and china and for all Indians Information Pakistan's first unmanned space flight program was in 1962 .Pakistan had secured its distinction as the third country in Asia and the tenth in the world to conduct successful spaceflight so it was not new.Pakistan not only needs china but also china needs Pakistan.
 
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NOTHING COMES WITHOUT CONDITIONS: CHINA’S RELATIONSHIP WITH PAKISTAN
Myra MacDonald
Chinese_and_Pakistan_border_guards_at_Khunjerab_Pass_IMG_7721_Karakoram_Highway-470x260.jpg

In one of the many revealing anecdotes in Andrew Small’s new book on the relationship between China and Pakistan, a Chinese expert describes worries about the Islamization of the Pakistan Army. “We’re not worried about the generals, we’re worried the brigadiers,” the Chinese expert says. The generals were old enough to have established their habits by the time military ruler Muhammad Zia-ul-Haq seized power in a coup in 1977 and promoted a militant strain of Islam in the country and its army. “They drink, they send their children to study in the United States or Great Britain. The younger ones are sending their children to study in the Gulf.”

The comments highlight an often-overlooked ambivalence in China’s attitude to Pakistan. Though Beijing has always been willing to use Pakistan to counter India, its support is conditional. Like the United States and India, China worries about the threat posed by the rise of violent Islamism to the outside world and to Pakistan itself. That makes it a potential ally in helping to stabilize Pakistan. As Washington and New Delhi forge ever closer ties—highlighted by President Barack Obama’s visit to India—they will need careful diplomacy to avoid alienating China with talk of containing it and instead seek to enlist its help.

In The China-Pakistan Axis, Small recounts China’s role in helping Pakistan obtain nuclear weapons and nuclear-capable missiles by supplying technology and expertise—going as far as flying in supplies of highly enriched uranium—to help it keep pace with India’s nuclear weapons program. But China has never committed troops on Pakistan’s behalf, even during its many conflicts with India, and has often been more inclined to work with the United States to try to defuse a crisis than provide Pakistan with support.

As Small writes, “China would like to see the India-Pakistan relationship exist in a state of managed mistrust,” one which keeps India tied down in its own neighborhood rather than challenging China across their long land border or competing with it in the rest of Asia. But, particularly since India and Pakistan conducted nuclear tests in 1998, China has also fretted about the possibility of an all-out war between the two. Thus when Pakistan began a border conflict with India in the Kargil region of Jammu and Kashmir in 1999, China refused to provide military or diplomatic support. Significantly, Chinese officials were in regular contact with their U.S. counterparts during the Kargil crisis to ensure both Beijing and Washington delivered the same message to Pakistan about the need to pull back its troops. Those contacts would come as a surprise to many in Pakistan, which has tried to use its “all-weather friendship” with China to balance its often-antagonistic relationship with the United States, little realizing the two could also work together behind its back. Similarly, after the attack on Mumbai by the Pakistan-based Lashkar-e-Taiba (LeT) in 2008, China refused to use its veto in the United Nations Security Council to block sanctions against the Jamaat-ud-Dawa, the front organization for the LeT. It would, as Small notes, be ready to help Pakistan in the event of an unexpected Indian invasion. But there would be no blank check to underwrite Pakistani adventurism. “As with its enduring assistance to Pakistan’s nuclear program, the most significant backing that China provides does not come in the midst of the latest crisis, but from the steady, long-term commitment to ensure that Pakistan has the capabilities it needs to play the role China wants it to,” writes Small.

There is, of course, a level of trust and intimacy between China and Pakistan that comes from the sharing of military and nuclear secrets. China also worked closely with Pakistan to supply weapons, paid for by the United States and Saudi Arabia, to militants fighting the Soviet occupation of Afghanistan from 1979 to 1989. Until relatively recently, moreover, it was able to rely on Pakistan’s Inter-Services Intelligence (ISI) agency to gain access to the Afghan Taliban and other Islamist militants to ensure Chinese interests were left alone and Uighur militants from its Xinjiang region kept in check. But as Pakistan began to lose its grip on Islamist militants, China also lost some of its confidence in Pakistan. At home, China has faced increased attacks from Uighur militants; while in both Pakistan and Afghanistan, Chinese workers have been killed. Hence its worries about the Pakistan Army: it is one thing to support a national military against India and quite another to supply one being eaten away from within by a virulent strain of violent Islamism.

China’s concerns mean that while it had feared an outright U.S. victory in the Afghan war that would allow it to set up permanent military bases in the region, it also has common cause with Washington in its desire for regional stability. Indeed it was U.S. drone strikes rather than Pakistani troops that killed Uighur militant leaders wanted by China in the Federally Administered Tribal Areas (FATA) of Pakistan.

The coincidence of interests between China and the United States is perhaps best illustrated by their views of the potential threat posed by Islamist militants to Pakistan’s nuclear weapons. Their views are not the same—Small writes that efforts by Washington to draw Beijing into discussions about contingency planning to secure nuclear weapons in the event of a crisis have been routinely rebuffed. But they do overlap. “Would we accept a U.S. intervention to seize Pakistan’s nuclear weapons? No. Are we as worried as [the United States] about the security of Pakistan’s nuclear weapons? No,” Small quotes a Chinese expert as saying. “But China is willing to help Pakistan defend a Pakistani bomb. We won’t help them protect an Islamic bomb. If it’s under the control of a mullah, then everything changes. It’s not unconditional.”

China, like the United States and India, is obviously hoping it won’t come to that. It is still making plans for an economic corridor through Pakistan that would link western China with the Gulf. Those plans could anchor Pakistan into a more stable framework of rising economic growth if security is improved enough to permit it. Small’s book, however, is an important reminder that if Pakistan continues to slide into instability, China’s help will be sorely needed. It should be compulsory reading for anyone too carried away by the euphoria of warming U.S.-India ties and tempted to believe China can be nudged out of the picture.

Myra MacDonald is a former Reuters journalist who has reported on Pakistan and India since 2000. She is the author of “Heights of Madness”, a book on the Siachen war fought in the mountains beyond Kashmir on the world’s highest battlefield. She is now working on a book about how the relationship between India and Pakistan was changed by their nuclear tests in 1998. She lives in Scotland and can be found on Twitter @myraemacdonald.

Source:- Nothing Comes Without Conditions: China’s Relationship with Pakistan

@ares @jaunty @sandy_3126 @Abingdonboy @sancho @Screambowl @OrionHunter @TimeTraveller @SrNair @C130 @Solomon2 @AUSTERLITZ @Echo_419 @SpArK @halfilhal @Srinivas @levina @45'22' @Sam Manekshaw @anant_s @Yogijaat @thesolar65 @CONNAN @PARIKRAMA @Armstrong @jaiind @NKVD @Ind4Ever @FNFAL @wolfschanzze @DRAY @kurup @janon @Norwegian @Oscar @Guynextdoor2 @Major Shaitan Singh @naveen mishra @itachiii @Brahmos_2 (Sorry to have missed anyone)
Classical crap based on western propaganda hardly any truth in it
 
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I see China as a very pragmatic country, all that it believes in is business.
But right now China is genuinely concerned about the terror attacks in China's north-west. It is indeed a close friend of Pakistan and would remain so for long, but Pakistan can not rely on China when it comes to attacking India. Pak-China would not attack India simultaneously, unless something goes really wrong between India & China.
Recent developments 've shown China in a diff light, for China has been vociferous about Pakistan's terrorism issue. If China indeed ditches Pakistan then Pakistan would turn to some middle eastern countries, which would be worse. I see 'em as a pack of wolves waiting to attack India.
 
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There is no such thing as free lunch.
China will use Pakistan as a card until it can stall India,till it modernizes its military and settles the issues in SCS.until then this facade of friendship will continue.It knows about the troubles created in Xinjiang and is aware of the threat of Radicals in Pak army,with ISIS not so far away.
If that is what Pakistan wants to be viewed and used as a tool to stall India, then so be it,No one can help them.They were used by USA once, they are used by China and USA both now. Who can help such Nation who wants to satisfy their ego that by stalling India they somehow achieved a great thing,Who are we to stop?

India is too big to be stalled by Pakistan,We have outgrown you this is not 1950's or 60's where we had parity,those days are over.Your role will only diminish in the future as India grows.

While you come to grips with reality that you were using your roof as firewood to sling, at Neighbours home and Setting your house on fire hoping that the wind will spread the fire to Neighbouring house,when the Neighbour is standing ready with a big firehose to douse any flames. :D
Your loss!:drag:
 
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Who in Pakistan would listen to this??? None, as they still believe China is their savior .
 
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Chinese_and_Pakistan_border_guards_at_Khunjerab_Pass_IMG_7721_Karakoram_Highway-470x260.jpg
[/CENTER]

In one of the many revealing anecdotes in Andrew Small’s new book on the relationship between China and Pakistan, a Chinese expert describes worries about the Islamization of the Pakistan Army. “We’re not worried about the generals, we’re worried the brigadiers,” the Chinese expert says. The generals were old enough to have established their habits by the time military ruler Muhammad Zia-ul-Haq seized power in a coup in 1977 and promoted a militant strain of Islam in the country and its army. “They drink, they send their children to study in the United States or Great Britain. The younger ones are sending their children to study in the Gulf.”

The comments highlight an often-overlooked ambivalence in China’s attitude to Pakistan. Though Beijing has always been willing to use Pakistan to counter India, its support is conditional. Like the United States and India, China worries about the threat posed by the rise of violent Islamism to the outside world and to Pakistan itself. That makes it a potential ally in helping to stabilize Pakistan. As Washington and New Delhi forge ever closer ties—highlighted by President Barack Obama’s visit to India—they will need careful diplomacy to avoid alienating China with talk of containing it and instead seek to enlist its help.

In The China-Pakistan Axis, Small recounts China’s role in helping Pakistan obtain nuclear weapons and nuclear-capable missiles by supplying technology and expertise—going as far as flying in supplies of highly enriched uranium—to help it keep pace with India’s nuclear weapons program. But China has never committed troops on Pakistan’s behalf, even during its many conflicts with India, and has often been more inclined to work with the United States to try to defuse a crisis than provide Pakistan with support.

As Small writes, “China would like to see the India-Pakistan relationship exist in a state of managed mistrust,” one which keeps India tied down in its own neighborhood rather than challenging China across their long land border or competing with it in the rest of Asia. But, particularly since India and Pakistan conducted nuclear tests in 1998, China has also fretted about the possibility of an all-out war between the two. Thus when Pakistan began a border conflict with India in the Kargil region of Jammu and Kashmir in 1999, China refused to provide military or diplomatic support. Significantly, Chinese officials were in regular contact with their U.S. counterparts during the Kargil crisis to ensure both Beijing and Washington delivered the same message to Pakistan about the need to pull back its troops. Those contacts would come as a surprise to many in Pakistan, which has tried to use its “all-weather friendship” with China to balance its often-antagonistic relationship with the United States, little realizing the two could also work together behind its back. Similarly, after the attack on Mumbai by the Pakistan-based Lashkar-e-Taiba (LeT) in 2008, China refused to use its veto in the United Nations Security Council to block sanctions against the Jamaat-ud-Dawa, the front organization for the LeT. It would, as Small notes, be ready to help Pakistan in the event of an unexpected Indian invasion. But there would be no blank check to underwrite Pakistani adventurism. “As with its enduring assistance to Pakistan’s nuclear program, the most significant backing that China provides does not come in the midst of the latest crisis, but from the steady, long-term commitment to ensure that Pakistan has the capabilities it needs to play the role China wants it to,” writes Small.

There is, of course, a level of trust and intimacy between China and Pakistan that comes from the sharing of military and nuclear secrets. China also worked closely with Pakistan to supply weapons, paid for by the United States and Saudi Arabia, to militants fighting the Soviet occupation of Afghanistan from 1979 to 1989. Until relatively recently, moreover, it was able to rely on Pakistan’s Inter-Services Intelligence (ISI) agency to gain access to the Afghan Taliban and other Islamist militants to ensure Chinese interests were left alone and Uighur militants from its Xinjiang region kept in check. But as Pakistan began to lose its grip on Islamist militants, China also lost some of its confidence in Pakistan. At home, China has faced increased attacks from Uighur militants; while in both Pakistan and Afghanistan, Chinese workers have been killed. Hence its worries about the Pakistan Army: it is one thing to support a national military against India and quite another to supply one being eaten away from within by a virulent strain of violent Islamism.

China’s concerns mean that while it had feared an outright U.S. victory in the Afghan war that would allow it to set up permanent military bases in the region, it also has common cause with Washington in its desire for regional stability. Indeed it was U.S. drone strikes rather than Pakistani troops that killed Uighur militant leaders wanted by China in the Federally Administered Tribal Areas (FATA) of Pakistan.

The coincidence of interests between China and the United States is perhaps best illustrated by their views of the potential threat posed by Islamist militants to Pakistan’s nuclear weapons. Their views are not the same—Small writes that efforts by Washington to draw Beijing into discussions about contingency planning to secure nuclear weapons in the event of a crisis have been routinely rebuffed. But they do overlap. “Would we accept a U.S. intervention to seize Pakistan’s nuclear weapons? No. Are we as worried as [the United States] about the security of Pakistan’s nuclear weapons? No,” Small quotes a Chinese expert as saying. “But China is willing to help Pakistan defend a Pakistani bomb. We won’t help them protect an Islamic bomb. If it’s under the control of a mullah, then everything changes. It’s not unconditional.”

China, like the United States and India, is obviously hoping it won’t come to that. It is still making plans for an economic corridor through Pakistan that would link western China with the Gulf. Those plans could anchor Pakistan into a more stable framework of rising economic growth if security is improved enough to permit it. Small’s book, however, is an important reminder that if Pakistan continues to slide into instability, China’s help will be sorely needed. It should be compulsory reading for anyone too carried away by the euphoria of warming U.S.-India ties and tempted to believe China can be nudged out of the picture.

Myra MacDonald is a former Reuters journalist who has reported on Pakistan and India since 2000. She is the author of “Heights of Madness”, a book on the Siachen war fought in the mountains beyond Kashmir on the world’s highest battlefield. She is now working on a book about how the relationship between India and Pakistan was changed by their nuclear tests in 1998. She lives in Scotland and can be found on Twitter @myraemacdonald.

Source:- Nothing Comes Without Conditions: China’s Relationship with Pakistan

@ares @jaunty @sandy_3126 @Abingdonboy @sancho @Screambowl @OrionHunter @TimeTraveller @SrNair @C130 @Solomon2 @AUSTERLITZ @Echo_419 @SpArK @halfilhal @Srinivas @levina @45'22' @Sam Manekshaw @anant_s @Yogijaat @thesolar65 @CONNAN @PARIKRAMA @Armstrong @jaiind @NKVD @Ind4Ever @FNFAL @wolfschanzze @DRAY @kurup @janon @Norwegian @Oscar @Guynextdoor2 @Major Shaitan Singh @naveen mishra @itachiii @Brahmos_2 (Sorry to have missed anyone)
the pic :D
two men holding hands,,looking beyond with mountains behind thm:p:

reminds me of the movie,,,,,broke back mountain :D
 
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Well honestly this reservation should not anger our friends across the border. Like any country, the national interest of chinese is far far above to the maintaining of friendship. Even if certain provinces are radicalised and extremist nature/terrorist activities surface, at first you may not see China openly saying or doing anything against Pakistan or any country whom they hav suspicion of supporting such extremism. But over a period of time, you would surely see by way of actions - covert or overt diplomatically and later assertively.

ATM Pak is important friend for china but still as was pointed out, the dependency on pak for fulfilling its economic corridor is still not thr. May be a new silk route may make it a bit more dependent of rise in investments in port infrastructure with roadways connecting it to china may make them dependent a bit.

Well frankly Pak thinks china as the natural supporter of its foreign policy and believes its to be the rock of Gibraltar in every kind of situation. Its good of course but as i had posted earlier that world is multipolar and economic interest today drives foreign policies. This is where this mentality of only having one natural supporter may backfire the moment China backtracks a bit due to any reason.

btw for all trollers

3.jpg



pls then decide why u felt like that after seeing just "2 brothers"
 
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There are no permanent friends, only permanent interests. Take for example these latest issues....

The Express Tribune reported:

China and Russia decided on Monday to back the Comprehensive Convention on International Terrorism (CCIT) — a resolution supported by India and heavily biased against Pakistan.”

The report further says:

The CCIT was proposed by India in 1996 in lieu of Pakistan backing Kashmiri separatists.

The international media has reported that in the 13th meeting of RIC (Russia, India and China) foreign ministers Asian heavy weights Russia and China has agreed to support the Resolution.

Photo of the Day: China, Russia backs India on UN resolution against Terrorism | Pak Tea House

And then...

ISLAMABAD: The government said on Tuesday that Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif’s signature mega power project – 6,600MW coal-based Gadani Power Park Project had been put on the back burner because of changing priorities of the Chinese government.

6,600MW Gadani power project put on back burner - Pakistan - DAWN.COM

Changing priorities of the Chinese Government? So it seems that all is not hunky dory in the Sino-Pak relationship. Nothing lasts, as decay finally starts setting in.
 
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What a ridiculous article, full of crap.

a Chinese expert... Who?

China also worked closely with Pakistan to supply weapons, paid for by the United States and Saudi Arabia... Really, Chinese weapons were paid by the US and KSA?

But as Pakistan began to lose its grip on Islamist militants, China also lost some of its confidence in Pakistan... Is that correct? Who is conducting Zarb-e-Azb? India I guess!

Pakistan also supplied weapons to Taliban to fight against soviets, or India did once not sure for LTTE, do they become strategic partner? No. They just become proxies.

Thing just don'T revolve around weapons! Which country has given you any economic benefit, or a invested in Pakistan to set up a manufacturing plant in bulk, or foreign investments? Is there any?

World knows, that economy of Pakistan is going to be similar to afghan economy. Economy of war.
 
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