Not my boys: Gen Kiyani Rejects Operation in Karachi

[Edevelop]

Why would they take on for example MQM when it was created by them ? They have not taken action against any group that was part of their creation historically so it only makes sense rather very clearly what Mr kayani is saying. ..... "not my boys"

 

[tarrar]

Good move by the chief. No need to involve PA in internal issues, what the heck civil security services are doing? Despite such law and security conditoins in the country what has the government done tostrengthen in ternal security apparatus?

Gen. Kayani is doing the right thing by keeping Pak Army away from such corrupt operations which is only meant to hurt Pak Army & spoil Pak Armies image. Gen. Musharraf said in one of his recent interview that Pak Army should not get involved in Karachi operation. These operation should be carried out by Rangers but without pressure & they should be clean operations because we know these are political war thats taking place in Karachi.

As far as the police goes it's filled with politicians brothers, friends or relatives etc. So police is useless & one of the most corrupt department in Pakistan.

 

[Thorough Pro]

Correction! he said, there is no need for army operation in Karachi. There is a difference in "No Need" and "Will not do".

He says Army will not do operation in Karachi & on the other hands he says he will if Civilian Govt says him to ..

 

[somebozo]

Than the likes of you will say.. only army which conquer its own people.

Army has a history of nurturing terrorist, the today TTP were once good boys of IJI.

 

[VCheng]

Army has a history of nurturing terrorist, the today TTP were once good boys of IJI.

Sometimes it is far more convenient to forget facts like that.

 

[chitti]

I honestly think only way out for Pak, is to turn truly secular. accept all religion as equal. and within muslims sects like sunni will be the same as ahmabdi muslims and shia muslims. that will only be the first step to heal.
after that things like democracy can take shape.

 

[Majnun]

The Army Chief wants the Govt to start taking responsibilities for actions taken. Govt has to order the Army in by orders. He is right in this aspect.

After all, with power comes responsibility - if the Army is slowly shedding unquestioned power, they will also shed the baggage that came with it - criticism!

I don't understand. How is criticism with unquestioned power possible? Isn't unquestioned power by definition power without criticism?

 

[Majnun]

Reject Operation in NWO
Reject Operation in Karachi
Fails to take action against border intrusion.

Pak Army - the most decorative army a state can have!

So any time there's a problem is the Pakistan Army supposed to step in? Then what are the civilian government and the law enforcement agencies doing?
And please don't talk about decorative armies. I've lived in Saudi Arabia, I've seen the fat soldiers who have to catch their breath after running.

 

[Solomon2]

I honestly think only way out for Pak, is to turn truly secular. accept all religion as equal. and within muslims sects like sunni will be the same as ahmabdi muslims and shia muslims. that will only be the first step to heal.
after that things like democracy can take shape.

Hmm, a "pure" secular military dictatorship like Frederick the Great's Prussia? The tricks that made that work were (1)the willingness of the State to suppress both sectarian violence and the nationalism of its component peoples by armed force and (2) the expansion of the comparatively corruption-free Junker military class into the bureaucracy and school system whose members owed their positions and honors to the monarch.

Without ideological reform will the Pakistani Army, police, and courts ever be willing to protect the weak against the strong? The Christians and Jews from the mullahs? If not, it all breaks down into anarchy once more.

Prussia enjoyed great successes on its road which led to democracy, empire, and dictatorship but millions of people inside and outside Prussia died along the way. Eventually the Soviets captured all of Prussia and evicted the Germans from the eastern half.

 

[chitti]

Hmm, a "pure" secular military dictatorship like Frederick the Great's Prussia? The tricks that made that work were (1)the willingness of the State to suppress both sectarian violence and the nationalism of its component peoples by armed force and (2) the expansion of the comparatively corruption-free Junker military class into the bureaucracy and school system whose members owed their positions and honors to the monarch.

Without ideological reform will the Pakistani Army, police, and courts ever be willing to protect the weak against the strong? The Christians and Jews from the mullahs? If not, it all breaks down into anarchy once more.

Prussia enjoyed great successes on its road which led to democracy, empire, and dictatorship but millions of people inside and outside Prussia died along the way. Eventually the Soviets captured all of Prussia and evicted the Germans from the Easter half.

anything carried to extrme is dangerous. there is a saying in Tamil" even nectar will be poison if taken excessively"
the root cause in Pak today is the wrong use of religion. and this is causing sectarian problem(with ahmadi and shia) and communal suppression.(hindus and xtians). to address this root cause there should be seapration of religion and govt. and then of course army should be just a services of the govt and not the govt itself.

 

[somebozo]

So any time there's a problem is the Pakistan Army supposed to step in? Then what are the civilian government and the law enforcement agencies doing?
And please don't talk about decorative armies. I've lived in Saudi Arabia, I've seen the fat soldiers who have to catch their breath after running.

Despite Saudi security apparatus is far more effective and efficient than Pak.
We must hire some of these fat breath catching soldiers too.

 

[Solomon2]

anything carried to extrme is dangerous. there is a saying in Tamil" even nectar will be poison if taken excessively"
the root cause in Pak today is the wrong use of religion. and this is causing sectarian problem(with ahmadi and shia) and communal suppression.(hindus and xtians). to address this root cause there should be seapration of religion and govt. and then of course army should be just a services of the govt and not the govt itself.

Oh, I'm not saying a Prussian-type system can't work. I'm saying that as far as Pakistan is concerned it won't work. Pakistanis aren't Germans; as Anatol Lieven put it, any Pakistani in a position of power, no matter how petty, abuses his authority. You can't build the Prussian system in such a society; each corrupt Junker would have to be shown the door and there would be no one left to do administration - no one who would respond to the State's authority, anyway.

 

[Safriz]

Sometimes it is far more convenient to forget facts like that.

and most of the time its far more practical to move on with changing situations and change priorities instead of remaining stuck in the distant past..

 

[zip]

Army should not grow brain ..its just a weapon in the hand of civilian govt voted by people ..

 

[muse]

I would rather send these jawans-officers prematurely homes with early retirements-pensions and call upon educated sensible men-women recruited on merit. There are thousands of boys-girls 20-25 without Job I would fairly want to see them being employed. Remember we need quality feeling pity won't solve problems. Ofcouse there are many who are on merit but there are many who are not. Police Force should never be poorly equipped.

No I don't want this police..

Train and pay and protect them - you will see an immediate improvement -- in other places the death of a single policeman is cause for the entire nation to going into alert and to capture and arrest and try and convict those responsible - but alas in Pakistan this is not the case.