Non-Christians 'not my brother,' 'not my sister'

[webber]

america, germany are chistian countries basically

britain, france are secular countries with chistian tradition

but there is no distinct line

 

[roadrunner]

I don't think America even has Christian tradition if the Treaty of Tripoli is to be believed.

 

[American Eagle]

The Treaty of Tripoli was with a government which no longer exists.

The US by it's earliest declarations in writing is a nation under God, leaving further breakdown of one's personal faith up to each person indiviudally.

President Eisenhower had the phrase "In God We Trust" put onto US currency and coinage. This was not inconsistent with the earliest documents founding the US as a nation under God.

Thanks for bringing up this ancient now expired as the nation involved as then defined long ago ceased to exist. This dates back to the days of the Barbary Pirates.

 

[roadrunner]

It doesn't matter if it's expired or not.

The US Senate ratified that treaty in 1797 denying any Christian traditions of the US.

Whether it expired or not is irrelevant since the US was founded in 1783, the Treaty of Tripoli accepted in 1797, so it was an admission by the US government that the US was not founded on religion.

I don't see where a motion was passed in the US senate to declare the Treaty void but it doesn't matter.

What the Treaty does do is void the Declaration of Independence excuse the Christian Right usually use.

 

[Awesome]

It is "OK" to have a religious state and to have blasphemy laws to suppress and put down all other religions.

Obviously its not okay, but it would be dishonest of me to accept that and not reprimand this instance where its due. It also throws my own fight against Mullahs suspect when your country oh so often claims to support secularists in my country. I don't want secularism to be classified as an anti-Muslim movement - or a Christian one.

The drive for secularism should and always be about Freedom and Equality. Everything else is a fraud.

But is it not OK for a man who is first and foremost a Christian, a Deacon in his Baptist denomination, having been sworn in as Governor, to then on Martin Luther King Day have him as a Christian all his adult life speak to a Black Baptist Church audience?

His remarks were not broadcast, only some nitwit newspaperman, which newspaper opposed him politically from the start of his race for Governor, tries to take out of context, the setting was inside a church, this alter call to his in person, present at that moment audience?

When I was growing up in Woodmont Baptist Church in Nashville, Tennessee we used to have then young Governor Frank Clement come preach a sermon about twice a year. Governor Clement was in fact a Methodist, but he was popular with all folks who voted for him from many different backgrounds across Tennessee. And he knew his Holy Bible and gave good sermons, too. You clearly do not understand this concept and that is your problem, not ours.

Personally I would frown upon that too, since it needlessly raises suspicions whenever somebody becomes a religion thumper sitting in a secular office. However, the content of the sermon would truly tell me if this person is a secular professional practicing his/her religion or is he hypocritical theocratic ruler...

You're giving him way too much room...

Imagine if he would've said "Those who don't hate blacks are not my brother, nor my sister... But I want be your brother".

It wouldn't matter if he said it to one person, a bunch or just thought about it... If that's known about him - while he is in office, it would be completely unacceptable to have him there.

No, we do not repress anyone from freely expressing their non-violent religious opinions, which expressions are guaranteed in the US Constitution long before anyone in the US ever knew we would develop a large secondary Muslim population and religious community. But the same US Constitution which guarantees Muslims in America freedom of religion and religious speech likewise grants Governor Bentley as a Deacon, a Lay Leader in his Baptist denomination, the right to express his religious convictions and testimoney, concluding with an alter call to those not yet saved in his immediate, physical, inside the church audience.

But he is a powerful person, he is in office and he holds the capacity to be violent... at least to the extent where his brother's might receive nepotism benefits...

Our US guaranteed freedoms enable the US to be prosperous and creative which is where the bucks come from to help the developing world, which was and remains the case from my service in Pakistan in the mid 1960s down to today.

Which is why the US must set a standard in secularism that countries like Pakistan must strive for. We have similar notions of Muslim brotherhood - thus everyone in Pakistan is a brother or sister except non-Muslims. I have often wondered how that would make my fellow non-Muslim countrymen feel.

From your comments I seem to gather you might think I'm hating on the US - In fact I'm merely worried about it, acts of intolerance are on the rise in the US and what gambit only joked about (jumping on the Christian crusade bandwagon for a little while) does seem like a possibility.

This is just as bad for you, as it is bad for me.

 

[American Eagle]

Your lawerly analysis is appreciated.

However, you have to look at the whole context of January 17, 2011, Inaugural Day for Governor Robert Bentley and concurrently celebrated on the Inaugural Stand first and foremost as our national federal holiday, Martin Luther King, Jr. Day.

That said, all your allegations or fears of hate, violence, and discrimination are washed away with the statements made by the first two speakers who were Black, Representatives John Knight and Alvin Holmes.

Governor Bentley was the last person to speak at the Inaugural Ceremony, as we swore in 7 or 8 other statewide constitional officers first.

In short, no basis whatsoever to then find fault with a separate event in a Black Baptist Church by white and black Baptists commemorating Dr. King's Holiday. Dr. King was an evangelical, proselitizing Christian minister whose entire non-violent civil rights drive was Chritianity and Bible based, pure and simple.

If I were you I'd stay focused on religious political parties inside Pakistan, and Afghanistan, whose focus is very openly discriminatory, violence fraught, and anti-democratic by their mere existance. Using "Blasphemy Laws" to kill/murder innocents who have differing religious beliefs.

ASIDE: All public officials in the US from lowest to highest have personal religious beliefs and such beliefs strengthen rather than diminish their ability to objectively do their secular jobs by giving them a better "sense of values."