Non-Arab Muslim Nations Need to Unite

[Ahmad]

yes because of the same puppets who were given power by British after divided Muslim Lands

yes, lets blame everything on the others, that is the way forward.

 

[Zarvan]

yes, lets blame everything on the others, that is the way forward.

sir you read history for yourself were these lands not divided by the british

 

[FaujHistorian]

....
Sir as a Muslim we have to be loyal to Islam and Ummah not a country Islam is not limited to Pakistan Sir these concept of countries was introduced by kafirs sir how can you say being loyal to it is being loyal to Islam sir Kafirs divided us in 57 countries and you are saying be loyal to country
Sir their is no concept of countries in Islam how can a Muslims be loyal to a country

OK dear poster. Show me where Islam wants us to be "dis-loyal" to our country of residence? Any reference, any hadees? or it is just a village-Mullah talk.

If you don't believe in the country, whose passport and ID card do you carry?

Do you know that ordinary Saudis will kick your @rse 1000 times if you show up in their country without passport and without proper visa and without proper ID.

Which world do live dear poster? Mars perhaps?

Peace.

 

[FaujHistorian]

sir you read history for yourself were these lands not divided by the british

hahahaha. Have you seen the maps before the British times?

For your British are perhaps gods.

FYI, many of the modern countries in the middle East were in fact "provinces" or "principalities", or "local regions of administration" of Ottoman empire. British just "formalized" the borders due to the new surveying techniques and scientific knowledge.

The provinces and princely states of Pakistan and India existed long before British came to town. What British did was to make proper maps, conduct survey, and put things in proper documentation.

The line that goes between India and Pakistan is pretty much the line between the pre-British provinces and principalities with some adjustment such as division of Punjab as per the wishes of local people.

Blaming British for the wishes of local tribes, nationalities, and groups is pathetic indeed.

Thank them that Pakistan and India have proper rail link, roads, bridges, education system, a modern army, police, and system of political and government.

Instead of improving upon the things that British left for us, we have ruined it due our shortsightedness. Look at the Pak railway. This was a gem in 1940s and now rusting hulk of metal. Should we blame this on Brits too.

It is time you started living in 21st century. Study of history my dear poster is not your forte.

peace.

 

[Zarvan]

OK dear poster. Show me where Islam wants us to be "dis-loyal" to our country of residence? Any reference, any hadees? or it is just a village-Mullah talk.

If you don't believe in the country, whose passport and ID card do you carry?

Do you know that ordinary Saudis will kick your @rse 1000 times if you show up in their country without passport and without proper visa and without proper ID.

Which world do live dear poster? Mars perhaps?

Peace.

Mr for your kind information Islam is against Nationalism Mr you can only be loyal to Islam and Muslims Ummah not one country I only love Pakistan because majority of live here are Muslims and Mr go check maps for yourself sir their were no visas before the british divided us in 57 countries Sir correct you history plz I didn't asked for passport this system of gora had it Mr

---------- Post added at 08:51 AM ---------- Previous post was at 08:50 AM ----------

OK dear poster. Show me where Islam wants us to be "dis-loyal" to our country of residence? Any reference, any hadees? or it is just a village-Mullah talk.

If you don't believe in the country, whose passport and ID card do you carry?

Do you know that ordinary Saudis will kick your @rse 1000 times if you show up in their country without passport and without proper visa and without proper ID.

Which world do live dear poster? Mars perhaps?

Peace.

Mr we are checked in Saudi Arabia because the Gora Sahah after dividing Muslims into lands created this passport and visa stuff which when Muslims will unite back INSHALLAH will finish

 

[Black Widow]

Mr for your kind information Islam is against Nationalism Mr you can only be loyal to Islam and Muslims Ummah not one country I only love Pakistan because majority of live here are Muslims and Mr go check maps for yourself sir their were no visas before the british divided us in 57 countries Sir correct you history plz I didn't asked for passport this system of gora had it Mr

Mr we are checked in Saudi Arabia because the Gora Sahah after dividing Muslims into lands created this passport and visa stuff which when Muslims will unite back INSHALLAH will finish

You sound Ultimate Radicalized. First you need to understand what is nation and how many form of nation exists in world. The concept of world today we live in is called "Nation state"concept. It was french revolution which gave concept of nation state (Life Liberty and Humanity). nation state provide us a definite boundary where ppl from different tribes,caste,religion live togather. Nation states should be welfare state.

Prior to french revolution There were two kind of states 1. Theological state and 2. Kingdoms. Theological state was based on religion, A special privileged was given to state religion, other religion ppl were second class citizen.

Islam was born under the time when theological states were getting formed. The Kingdoms were choosing state religion. Your prophet saw it as an opportunity and gave a concept of boundryless theological state.

In current day Theological states are obsolete.

 

[Zarvan]

You sound Ultimate Radicalized. First you need to understand what is nation and how many form of nation exists in world. The concept of world today we live in is called "Nation state"concept. It was french revolution which gave concept of nation state (Life Liberty and Humanity). nation state provide us a definite boundary where ppl from different tribes,caste,religion live togather. Nation states should be welfare state.

Prior to french revolution There were two kind of states 1. Theological state and 2. Kingdoms. Theological state was based on religion, A special privileged was given to state religion, other religion ppl were second class citizen.

Islam was born under the time when theological states were getting formed. The Kingdoms were choosing state religion. Your prophet saw it as an opportunity and gave a concept of boundryless theological state.

In current day Theological states are obsolete.

Our PROPHET SAW only gave us that which ALLAH told him secondly theological states are never obsolete but nation state is it is corrupt and divide people in the name of ethnicity we Muslims what ever is the race are brothers of each other and we have to help each other when any of us needs it and in Islam their are two areas one area is of Muslims and other areas of Kafirs Muslims can't be divided into nation states

 

[Fracker]

You sound Ultimate Radicalized. First you need to understand what is nation and how many form of nation exists in world. The concept of world today we live in is called "Nation state"concept. It was french revolution which gave concept of nation state (Life Liberty and Humanity). nation state provide us a definite boundary where ppl from different tribes,caste,religion live togather. Nation states should be welfare state.

Prior to french revolution There were two kind of states 1. Theological state and 2. Kingdoms. Theological state was based on religion, A special privileged was given to state religion, other religion ppl were second class citizen.

Islam was born under the time when theological states were getting formed. The Kingdoms were choosing state religion. Your prophet saw it as an opportunity and gave a concept of boundryless theological state.

In current day Theological states are obsolete.

What the hell you are doing in Muslim's discussion? scared of something?

 

[FaujHistorian]

Our PROPHET SAW only gave us that which ALLAH told him secondly theological states are never obsolete ...

I hate to start a religious discussion in a forum for defense and military.

But your comment is so out of date that I have to say few words. These comments are based on love and tolerance. So please do not think I'm trying to hurt anyone's feelings.


Why my dear poster you ignore the basic fact that our Prophet pbuh followed specific steps ONLY for the Ibadah based on Allah's direction.

For the worldly matters though, things were not specific. They can never be. The only thing Allah directed him pbuh to do was to use Justice and Tolerance. Here are some examples:

1. Allah tells you to use justice and tolerance (Nahal: 90)
2. Allah's nearest are those who are cautious and tolerant (Nahal: 128)
3. Be just and tolerant. It is the closest thing to a careful and cautious life (Maida: 8)

And I could go on an on.


By using the yardstick of justice and tolerance, Prophet pbuh was free to use the "existing worldly systems" common among the people at that time.

For example, Prophet pbuh used camels, donkeys, and horses as a means to travel. He did not use Ford explorer or Toyota Corrolla.

Prophet pbuh lived in straw mud brick houses and sometimes in tents. He did not live in high rise apartments. Was that Allah directed him to be in mud brick house? No! Not at all! It was the way people lived back in those times.

Allah didn't direct him to use a donkey for transportation. This was the way to transport goods back then.

Prophet pbuh did not use passport and visa because people back then had no idea about specific ID and travel documents.

No wonder Saudis lived back then by looting the pilgrim's caravans.


People like you Sir are Lakeer kay faqeer. You guys think that sleeping on dirt floor is Prophet pbuh's way so bedding and mattress is haram. This is funny at best, and primitive tribal at worst.


Enforcing Prophet pbuh's specific life steps that were unique to his era, is pretty close to idol worship if not exactly that.

Prophet pbuh was the most forward looking man of his time who emphasized on Justice, and tolerance.

You guys on the other hand ignore the most basic of his teaching. Instead of following his teaching of truth and honesty, you all are preaching hate, and deceit, and hypocrisy that was so common among the people of Makkah before He pbuh came in this world.

No wonder the more Pakkah the Islamist state is the more unjust and intolerant it gets.

So sad that you claim to follow Him pbuh, and yet you preach the ways of Munafiqeen. With your outdated ways you bring nothing but shame to the Prophet pbuh.



Peace.

 

[alphamale]

oh bhai in today's world a nation should think of itself only. this brotherhood, that brotherhood are just sweet terms to console. in reality no brotherhood exists between group of nations.

 

[Bobshouse]

Religious people just dont get it. Your religion, nationality, race, sex or if you were born on the moon has nothing to do with your moral outlook. Humans are born as empty jars, you can pour whatever you want into one. We are just dumb animals that need to be educated. There is a reason children from poor, dysfunctional and uneducated families are more likely to commit crimes later in their lives. Religion is a personal choice and should not be imposed on anybody, it would be better to combine like minded tolerant peaceful people rather that divide along those old religious lines.

 

[Chogy]

Humans are born as empty jars, you can pour whatever you want into one.

I disagree a bit. We are mostly empty, and 99% of what we become is taught to us, but "as born", humans are pretty wicked. All you need to do is watch a group of toddlers. There are always a few who will do whatever they want. If a little girl has a toy, or a cookie, another toddler will almost always steal the cookie or attempt to take away the toy. And they'll bite, punch, or kick each other to get what they want. This isn't learned or taught, it's how we are wired.

People must be taught morality, and religion has been a powerful force along those lines.

 

[fd24]

I disagree a bit. We are mostly empty, and 99% of what we become is taught to us, but "as born", humans are pretty wicked. All you need to do is watch a group of toddlers. There are always a few who will do whatever they want. If a little girl has a toy, or a cookie, another toddler will almost always steal the cookie or attempt to take away the toy. And they'll bite, punch, or kick each other to get what they want. This isn't learned or taught, it's how we are wired.

People must be taught morality, and religion has been a powerful force along those lines.

Agree. The teaching i believe should be not influenced by external forces...

 

[Zarvan]

I hate to start a religious discussion in a forum for defense and military.

But your comment is so out of date that I have to say few words. These comments are based on love and tolerance. So please do not think I'm trying to hurt anyone's feelings.


Why my dear poster you ignore the basic fact that our Prophet pbuh followed specific steps ONLY for the Ibadah based on Allah's direction.

For the worldly matters though, things were not specific. They can never be. The only thing Allah directed him pbuh to do was to use Justice and Tolerance. Here are some examples:

1. Allah tells you to use justice and tolerance (Nahal: 90)
2. Allah's nearest are those who are cautious and tolerant (Nahal: 128)
3. Be just and tolerant. It is the closest thing to a careful and cautious life (Maida: 8)

And I could go on an on.


By using the yardstick of justice and tolerance, Prophet pbuh was free to use the "existing worldly systems" common among the people at that time.

For example, Prophet pbuh used camels, donkeys, and horses as a means to travel. He did not use Ford explorer or Toyota Corrolla.

Prophet pbuh lived in straw mud brick houses and sometimes in tents. He did not live in high rise apartments. Was that Allah directed him to be in mud brick house? No! Not at all! It was the way people lived back in those times.

Allah didn't direct him to use a donkey for transportation. This was the way to transport goods back then.

Prophet pbuh did not use passport and visa because people back then had no idea about specific ID and travel documents.

No wonder Saudis lived back then by looting the pilgrim's caravans.


People like you Sir are Lakeer kay faqeer. You guys think that sleeping on dirt floor is Prophet pbuh's way so bedding and mattress is haram. This is funny at best, and primitive tribal at worst.


Enforcing Prophet pbuh's specific life steps that were unique to his era, is pretty close to idol worship if not exactly that.

Prophet pbuh was the most forward looking man of his time who emphasized on Justice, and tolerance.

You guys on the other hand ignore the most basic of his teaching. Instead of following his teaching of truth and honesty, you all are preaching hate, and deceit, and hypocrisy that was so common among the people of Makkah before He pbuh came in this world.

No wonder the more Pakkah the Islamist state is the more unjust and intolerant it gets.

So sad that you claim to follow Him pbuh, and yet you preach the ways of Munafiqeen. With your outdated ways you bring nothing but shame to the Prophet pbuh.



Peace.

Sorry Sir those things can't be tolerated which are against Islam Sir and one person went to hell because his niyat was that he was fighting for his tribe not Muslims so Sir Islam says give peace to those who want peace but who wants war take him out

 

[FaujHistorian]

Sorry Sir those things can't be tolerated which are against Islam Sir and one person went to hell because his niyat was that he was fighting for his tribe not Muslims so Sir Islam says give peace to those who want peace but who wants war take him out

Dear Poster you keep on repeating Islam says this or that.

But you haven't answered a simple question.

Where does Islam teach you to be "dis-loyal" to your country of residence.
When does Islam tell you to disobey the local laws like stopping at the red light, or not committing crimes?

huh?

Any Hadees that tell you to blow up public places? Any ayat? Any Fiqah?

Just enlighten us please.

peace.