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No automatic visa for Modi as PM : US

You have run out of all logical reasonings.

and that's why you are getting mad .

It's all expected .

Very few people can digest that they have proven wrong and have lost debate ....

Bye ...Go to sleep.

I did not lose any debate. If anything I won the first round! There is no logical reason to consider visa denial as a relevant issue as far as Modi's win is concerned. Your continuous rambling does not prove anything. Good bye!
 
I did not lose any debate. There is no logical reason to consider visa denial as a relevant issue as far as Modi's win is concerned. Your continuous rambling does not prove anything. Good bye!

Your frustration is understood.

readers of this thread will know whether I have rebutted all your points logically and reasonably or not .

Bye , Bye now ...get some sleep .
 
Modi as PM won't need visa to visit Germany: German envoy

Modi as PM won't need visa to visit Germany: German envoy
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May 15, 2014 21:46
Germany today made it clear that if Narendra Modi becomes Prime Minister, he will not need any visa to travel to that country and he is "welcome" there. "An elected Prime Minister of India does not need a visa for Germany, he is welcome there," German Ambassador to India Michael Steiner said in a statement.

His statement assumes significance in the context of Modi being denied visa by the some countries so far because of the 2002 communal riots in Gujarat. The German Ambassador hailed the conduct of 9-phased Lok Sabha elections which will culminate with the counting of votes tomorrow.

"The election process in India was simply breathtaking '" passionate, powerful, vibrant, involving the whole country twenty four seven. It showed democracy is India's roots, is India's identity, is its common denominator.

"Ahead of the next government, whoever will form it, lay huge challenges. Modern Germany is an ideal partner for modern India in tackling these," he added.
 
denial of visa to constituitionally elected government official despite request of Central government just because of influence of biased lobbies working .. amounts to insult .

How will US react if Visa is denied to some US governor under similar pre texts ?

First of all GOI should not have tolerated such US stance ..but being congress government they did .

Visa denial has political relevance .

Visa was denied to modi not on personal ground but even as Chief minister of Gujarat .

Do you understand the difference ?

It was question of honor of democratic institutions in India .

after all Modi was legitimately elected constitutional authority ...not once but thrice that too despite intense media trial over a decade .


Even UPA government which is inimical to modi ..took this stance . it's different that they gave up easily for their own political gains .

The Visa denial was made issue by Congress ministers like Chidamabaram to belittle modi .

Even recently ..number of MPs resorted to sign campaign to request US state dept to deny visa to modi .


then how do you say that Visa denial has no relevance ?

It is relevance from every aspect ...as I have just illustrated you .


If Modi become PM ...it will be a big slap by Indian public on face of US .


they are being forced to mollycoddle man they despised !



You are just simplifying the facts of the matter too much.

do you even know how personal likes and dislikes of leaders have shaped history between nations ?

Do you know how much really Nixon and Kissinger hated Indira Gandhi ...and how their personal hatred influenced Indo-US relations for the longest time ???


It's very naïve of you to believe that diplomats do all work and leaders meet only to exchange pleasantries and handshake ....

As I said, policy is dictated by leaders, so of course if Mr. Modi had some ax to grind against the States he could effectively do so. There seems to be a persistent issue with comprehension, I clearly stated that leaders meet only a few times with any important issue at hand, generally when they do meet on sidelines of summits then nothing much gets done, this has nothing to do with the fact that respective leaders play their part in policy formulation of running external affairs. How is it that every time we cross paths you conflate two different issues erroneously. My statement is predicated more on the fact that Modi gives two hoots about such things than on anything else. His own words on the matter should take precedence even as per your own standards, no?


Watch from 30:22 mins into the interview onward, and then match that with my words, "As for Modi, I sincerely doubt that he cares too much about this, as for America, POTUS might find it a little awkward after all this to shake Modi's hand and sit down for a chat but it won't be anything that cannot be bridged"



Secondly, our system for ascertaining and enacting foreign policy is vastly different than that of the US- where historically their successive Presidents have taken the charge and actively run the state's foreign policy, in India it has always been an exercise of diplomats and a cohesive vision of the executive which involves the PM, FM, RM and MEA.
 
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As I said, policy is dictated by leaders, so of course if Mr. Modi had some ax to grind against the States he could effectively do so. There seems to be a persistent issue with comprehension, I clearly stated that leaders meet only a few times with any important issue at hand, generally when they do meet on sidelines of summits then nothing much gets done, this has nothing to do with the fact that respective leaders play their part in policy formulation of running external affairs. How is it that everytime we cross paths you conflate two different issues erroneously. My statement is predicated more on the fact that Modi gives two hoots about such things than on anything else. His own words on the matter should take precedence even as per your own standards, no?


Watch from 30 mins onward, and then match that with my words, "As for Modi, I sincerely doubt that he cares too much about this, as for America, POTUS might find it a little awkward after all this to shake Modi's hand and sit down for a chat but it won't be anything that cannot be bridged"



Secondly, our system for ascertaining and enacting foreign policy is vastly different than that of the US- where historically their successive Presidents have taken the charge and actively run the state's foreign policy, in India it has always been an exercise of diplomats and a cohesive vision of the executive which involves the PM, FM, RM and MEA.

Before even I begin to respond to your assertions ..Do you mind clarifying what do you mean by " There seems to be persistent issue with comprehension "

Is that what you throw at everybody who disagrees with you or questions you ???


I did not conflate any issues .

Your " assumptions " that Modi does not give two hoots about visa issue ..are your assumptions...which you may have formed based on his TV interview .

any sane person will know ...that Visa denial and the resultant insult that modi faced is going to be an issue - even if Modi denies it publically .
One has to have that much of common sense to understand that no self respecting man will ever forget the personal humiliation . Definitely not a man like Narendra modi ....

And as far as enacting foreign policy is concerned From Nehru to MMS we have seen how deep impression leaders have left of foreign policies .


You may think that leaders just meet to shake hands and exchange pleasantries ...but history - past and present - Indian or otherwise is replete with numerous examples as to how individuals have shaped and spearheaded course of foreign policy and international matters
 
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Before even I begin to respond to your assertions ..Do you mind clarifying what do you mean by " There seems to be persistent issue with comprehension "

Is that what you throw at everybody who disagrees with you or questions you ???

No, because every time we do cross paths, in any given paragraph if I mentions two separate points I have noticed that you seem to conflate said separate points when you reply or else ignore the preceding or following point to paint an incomplete picture.

For example, in my previous post which you quoted-

You completely ignored the the latter assertion of the point I stated-

"with heads of states interacting only when a policy initiative or some really big bilateral shift is to occur"

You picked on only my comment on the other meetings which occur on the sidelines of various summits which have no actual bearing on any landmark decisions so as to conflate my argument that day to day MEA operations are run in bulk by our diplomats "foreign relations are primarily conducted through diplomats" with some supposed assertion on my part that the executive or heads of state has no role to play in MEA.
 
Before even I begin to respond to your assertions ..Do you mind clarifying what do you mean by " There seems to be persistent issue with comprehension "

Is that what you throw at everybody who disagrees with you or questions you ???


I did not conflate any issues .

Your " assumptions " that Modi does not give two hoots about visa issue ..are your assumptions...which you may have formed based on his TV interview .

any sane person will know ...that Visa denial and the resultant insult that modi faced is going to be an issue - even if Modi denies it publically .
One has to have that much of common sense to understand that no self respecting man will ever forget the personal humiliation . Definitely not a man like Narendra modi ....

And as far as enacting foreign policy is concerned From Nehru to MMS we have seen how deep impression leaders have left of foreign policies .


You may think that leaders just meet to shake hands and exchange pleasantries ...but history - past and present - Indian or otherwise is replete with numerous examples as to how individuals have shaped and spearheaded course of foreign policy and international matters

As I stated, AGAIN, Modi's own words have led to my conviction that he does not care. Are you calling him a liar?

He clearly states that there is no cause for bitterness in relations due to the VISA issue, in HIS OWN WORDS, is he lying?

@Indo-guy Furthermore, for the sake of any exchange, when you edit a post do mention the other member so that the re-edited post can be brought to his/her attention.
 
Can anybody explain what will be the scenario if Narendra Modi as PM will not attend the UN General Assembly in America.
 
No, because every time we do cross paths, in any given paragraph if I mentions two separate points I have noticed that you seem to conflate said separate points when you reply or else ignore the preceding or following point to paint an incomplete picture.

For example, in my previous post which you quoted-

You completely ignored the the latter assertion of the point I stated-

"with heads of states interacting only when a policy initiative or some really big bilateral shift is to occur"

You picked on only my comment on the other meetings which occur on the sidelines of various summits which have no actual bearing on any landmark decisions so as to conflate my argument that day to day MEA operations are run in bulk by our diplomats "foreign relations are primarily conducted through diplomats" with some supposed assertion on my part that the executive or heads of state has no role to play in MEA.

I did not ignore that part. It was simply not relevant .

and it does not change my stance .

Leaders whenever they meet whether they are about to announce landmark shift or meeting socially on sidelines of major meetings ...they are always in charge of situation.

Yes bulk of foreign relations are conducted through diplomats ..so what's big deal about it ?

Irrespective of that it's leaders who influence the direction of the course .

You are trying to portray bottom up approach ..but to a large extent it is Top down approach


Unless you are talking about Robotic PM /leaders like MMS who have no sense of what is happening around .

Most leaders are in charge ..even when they are being guided by their diplomats ...
 
NO one can Ignore MODI............. USA ka Baap bhi nahi kar sakta to aur koi to door tak nahi:police:
 
As I stated, AGAIN, Modi's own words have led to my conviction that he does not care. Are you calling him a liar?

He clearly states that there is no cause for bitterness in relations due to the VISA issue, in HIS OWN WORDS, is he lying?


Off course Modi is a shrewd politician.

and that is the most remarkable and indivisible part of being politician .

Ever read about Chankya niti ?


You must be too naïve to believe everything that Modi may have said publicly ...
 
I did not ignore that part. It was simply not relevant .

and it does not change my stance .

Leaders whenever they meet whether they are about to announce landmark shift or meeting socially on sidelines of major meetings ...they are always in charge of situation.

Yes bulk of foreign relations are conducted through diplomats ..so what's big deal about it ?

Irrespective of that it's leaders who influence the direction of the course .

You are trying to portray bottom up approach ..but to a large extent it is Top down approach


Unless you are talking about Robotic PM /leaders like MMS who have no sense of what is happening around .

Most leaders are in charge ..even when they are being guided by their diplomats ...

No one is portraying any approach. Its a fact that leaders handle policy and diplomats handle the day to day work.

If you ignore one assertion and stick only to the one that follows it or precedes it then it paints an incomplete picture wrt dealing with the concerned statement in its totality.
 
Can anybody explain what will be the scenario if Narendra Modi as PM will not attend the UN General Assembly in America.

There are many instances where Head of state couldn't visit UNGA...any member of cabinet nominated by Head of state can visit on their behalf ....

It's not a big deal ...

It's kind of Page 3 event for most head of states ...except off course that of Pakistan's ..because they get to rant about Kashmir there ... ( which nobody listens now a days )
 

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