Next Chief Of Army Staff - 2013 ?

[Panther 57]

It always was a fight for power, buray kartoot for PA is when politicians dare to make decisions on their own (exactly what they have been elected for). Anyway there is no one in Pakistani history having worse kartoot then Yahya Khan and he was given a burial with full army protocol

Its also funny when its Army which decides who is 'insaan ka bacha' bloody civilians are yet too stupid to elect the right person to power. How do you feel about Jinnah by the way, was he up to mark by PA standards?

As long as civilians take decision in the interest of the country no one will shun them. But things change when start taking decision in the own interest at the cost of country. Benazir gets the credit of draining the efforts of over two decades by shutting down Indian desk, NS was negotiating a joint venture with General Dynamics to annul atomic test. His stupidity of hijacking the aircraft with COAS was jewel in the crown. Defacto President Rehman Malik and Traitor Hussain Haqqani allowed black waters and CIA operatives to enter the country without immigration. This what they do when they come to power and no body checks them. They were even ready to clip the wings of ISI; until the warning shots were fired. When they mess it up they want PA to clear it up. Look at Karachi Amn Committee, it is their monster and who is clearing it up. NS is ghoof enough to repeat his mistakes. He should have become wiser now after the previous debacles. But still same fanfare, protocols, PKR800,000 hotel rooms, etc, etc. @batmannow

 

[batmannow]

As long as civilians take decision in the interest of the country no one will shun them. But things change when start taking decision in the own interest at the cost of country. Benazir gets the credit of draining the efforts of over two decades by shutting down Indian desk, NS was negotiating a joint venture with General Dynamics to annul atomic test. His stupidity of hijacking the aircraft with COAS was jewel in the crown. Defacto President Rehman Malik and Traitor Hussain Haqqani allowed black waters and CIA operatives to enter the country without immigration. This what they do when they come to power and no body checks them. They were even ready to clip the wings of ISI; until the warning shots were fired. When they mess it up they want PA to clear it up. Look at Karachi Amn Committee, it is their monster and who is clearing it up. NS is ghoof enough to repeat his mistakes. He should have become wiser now after the previous debacles. But still same fanfare, protocols, PKR800,000 hotel rooms, etc, etc. @batmannow

if one of them, was patriotic non of marshallaws could hve happened, a just small adition
whivh means it really doesnt matters who they select for the job, but if they think they can find another kiyani again, they should be living in fools paradise?

Shahbaz Sharif also lobbying for Lt Gen Rashid Mehmood.

apprantly thts the open secret!
& looks like, he is touching the finishing lines?

Shahbaz Sharif also lobbying for Lt Gen Rashid Mehmood.

apprantly thts the open secret!
& looks like, he is touching the finishing lines?

 

[BATMAN]

No politician have capacity or qualification enough to choose any post of any institution, including a simple post of a peon.

Almost every politician is morally corrupt.

 

[Bratva]

After the trip to USofA by Mr.Nawaz Sharif, we will know who the future chief is. He will be taking the decision for the future chief from the US.

Pathetic.

UsofA also wants a "Thanda Jenrail" like Kiyaani. Rashid Mehmood will win the raceunfortunately.

 

[Panther 57]

UsofA also wants a "Thanda Jenrail" like Kiyaani. Rashid Mehmood will win the raceunfortunately.

I am afraid you are right. We need a commander who can lead from front.

UsofA also wants a "Thanda Jenrail" like Kiyaani. Rashid Mehmood will win the raceunfortunately.

I am afraid you are right. We need a commander who can lead from front.

 

[Sedqal]

kya baat kar raha haey yar tu ... you are comparing our esteemed Jinnah to these suCker politicians ...

Our esteemed Jinnah was very blunt about role of Army in Pakistan:

"“Do not forget that the armed forces are the servants of the people. You do not make national policy; it is we, the civilians, who decide these issues and it is your duty to carry out these tasks with which you are entrusted.”

 

[Sedqal]

As long as civilians take decision in the interest of the country no one will shun them. But things change when start taking decision in the own interest at the cost of country. Benazir gets the credit of draining the efforts of over two decades by shutting down Indian desk, NS was negotiating a joint venture with General Dynamics to annul atomic test. His stupidity of hijacking the aircraft with COAS was jewel in the crown. Defacto President Rehman Malik and Traitor Hussain Haqqani allowed black waters and CIA operatives to enter the country without immigration. This what they do when they come to power and no body checks them. They were even ready to clip the wings of ISI; until the warning shots were fired. When they mess it up they want PA to clear it up. Look at Karachi Amn Committee, it is their monster and who is clearing it up. NS is ghoof enough to repeat his mistakes. He should have become wiser now after the previous debacles. But still same fanfare, protocols, PKR800,000 hotel rooms, etc, etc. @batmannow

If you recall Benazir and PMLN were never allowed to follow their policies. It is simply ridiculous to claim that PPP and PMLN were not taking decisions in favor of Pakistan. Correct thing to say is that those two took some decisions which were not in line with what establishment had planned.

Dictator apologists have circular logic, Bhutto was bad because he started operation on Baluchistan. Zia was good because he brought every anti-bhutto force on board including Baluchistanis. Musharraf was good when he started an operation against the same forces which Zia brought in the mainstream and PMLN is bad when it tries to bring same baluchistanis on negotiation table. Its like a knee jerk reaction if a dictator does something it is by its very nature patriotic and well thought, if a civilian leader decides on something for you lot it is by nature anti=Pakistan and a blunder (even when the policy matches with some ex-dictator).

Pakistan was cut in half during Yahya's era, name one politician who had harmed this country as much? But easy way out blame bhutto and mujeeb and keep silent on man who was heading the whole disaster (Yahya). NS was traitor for trying to forge good relations with India but Musharraf becomes the icon of bravery for going to same Vajpai and cornering him into shaking hands with Musharraf. It was during Zia's era when we lost Siachen. What happened afterwards? where was 111 brigade which is so active when its a bloody civilian in power? Zia actually claimed that Siachen was useless even grass dosen't grow there. Today if a civilian takes a decision on Siachen it becomes the highest strategic value item for PA.

There is nothing in here but power struggle, during Ayub's era PA got the first taste of power and from that time onwards it is not willing to let go, country be damned. They have turned Pakistan into Congo, which other country in the world has that frequent martial laws, the whole system has been bastardized. Look at Jinnah and his vision and what PA has turned Pakistan into.

 

[Sedqal]

Top it off with the simple fact that during EVERY dictator role retired Army officers took the best jobs in public sphere. Almost every major ministry and public organization was headed by a retired army officer. Do you know that civilian officers from those places were groomed for the top job for decades? they took countless courses and training for the very reason. Yet their right is thrown out of the window and a freak who has nothing to do/ no experience in public policy is heading those organizations. Where was the discipline then? The civilians who were denied their rightful promotions and positions were Indians? or some inferior life form? You nitwits remember seniority when it comes to promotion of COAS (even when legally MoD sends the names to PM and he has every right to make anyone a COAS from that list) but where are the same freaking cries of seniority when retired thugs from PA occupy the top spots in civilian organizations? Everything is kosher then? Idiots.

 

[mikkix]

this forum is supporting Rashid and I am feeling scared. I guess Haroon is not good but after reading this thread I guess Haroon is better than Rashid.

 

[Panther 57]

If you recall Benazir and PMLN were never allowed to follow their policies. It is simply ridiculous to claim that PPP and PMLN were not taking decisions in favor of Pakistan. Correct thing to say is that those two took some decisions which were not in line with what establishment had planned.

Dictator apologists have circular logic, Bhutto was bad because he started operation on Baluchistan. Zia was good because he brought every anti-bhutto force on board including Baluchistanis. Musharraf was good when he started an operation against the same forces which Zia brought in the mainstream and PMLN is bad when it tries to bring same baluchistanis on negotiation table. Its like a knee jerk reaction if a dictator does something it is by its very nature patriotic and well thought, if a civilian leader decides on something for you lot it is by nature anti=Pakistan and a blunder (even when the policy matches with some ex-dictator).

Pakistan was cut in half during Yahya's era, name one politician who had harmed this country as much? But easy way out blame bhutto and mujeeb and keep silent on man who was heading the whole disaster (Yahya). NS was traitor for trying to forge good relations with India but Musharraf becomes the icon of bravery for going to same Vajpai and cornering him into shaking hands with Musharraf. It was during Zia's era when we lost Siachen. What happened afterwards? where was 111 brigade which is so active when its a bloody civilian in power? Zia actually claimed that Siachen was useless even grass dosen't grow there. Today if a civilian takes a decision on Siachen it becomes the highest strategic value item for PA.

There is nothing in here but power struggle, during Ayub's era PA got the first taste of power and from that time onwards it is not willing to let go, country be damned. They have turned Pakistan into Congo, which other country in the world has that frequent martial laws, the whole system has been bastardized. Look at Jinnah and his vision and what PA has turned Pakistan into.

No point arguing with those who have built in hatred for army. It was Bhutto indeed who was instrumental in dismemberment of Pakistan. Blame goes to Yahya because he was the head of state. Remember, governments are not run on the whims of one person. There are group of aides and advisers. Falling for the wrong advice is not something unnatural. Human is to err, however, there is difference between an erroneous decision or taking an erroneous advice and to take actual one sided decisions like BB and NS, for their personal interests.

 

[Sedqal]

No point arguing with those who have built in hatred for army. It was Bhutto indeed who was instrumental in dismemberment of Pakistan. Blame goes to Yahya because he was the head of state. Remember, governments are not run on the whims of one person. There are group of aides and advisers. Falling for the wrong advice is not something unnatural. Human is to err, however, there is difference between an erroneous decision or taking an erroneous advice and to take actual one sided decisions like BB and NS, for their personal interests.

- Please spare me the sermons of built in hatred of Army. As a Pakistani you can expect respect from me for the soldiers on battlefield, don't expect me to respect dictators and thugs who conduct coups and indulge in harming my country actively. I don't differ the thugs of TTP from the thugs in Khaki who hold radio Pakistan and PTV on gunpoints. They are exactly doing the same thing. TTP also thinks that public is too dumb and doesn't know anything. Only TTP commanders have the grand insight in running the state and only TTP knows the real Islam.

- At least you have accepted the role of Yahya, pray tell how did Yahya got any bad advice? Yahya was notorious for his love for fat meat (prostitutes) and alcohol. Infact there is documentary evidence that before the breakup of Pakistan he was spending more time with prostitutes and drunk then acting like a head of state. You referred Shahab-Nama in an earlier post, have you read what the same Qudrut Ullah Shahab had to say about Yahya? And here in lies the main question. IF according to you PA is so patriotic why was there no coup against Yahya? Where was the bloody 111 brigade which is boiling in self righteous fury when there is a bloody civilian in charge? Where was 111 brigade when Siachen was lost during Zia's tenure? Why no coups? Zia took the whole affair in a stride not considering it worth his time to even properly condemn the incident. But today if a civilian leader negotiates on same Siachen he/ she becomes the greatest traitor to state and 11 brigade can't wait to jump[ over the walls of parliament.

- Ofcourse at the end of the day ONLY you and your ilk know Ilm-e-Ghaib. Only you know that politicians were after personal interest and Zia, Ayub, Yahya and Musharraf were always after greater good of nation. The bloody black Pakistanis were in the wrong when Zia appeared with a whip and whipped these shodars into jehad mode. Public was also in wrong when Musharraf appeared with all guns blazing and started shooting the same public into modern enlightenment mode. Ofcourse public will also be in wrong when tomorrow situation in Afghanistan changes and more cheap pashtoons are needed to play cannon fodder for grand strategic design, another adventure for 111 brigade another messiah will appear with a blazing sword to circumcise the bloody enlightened ones into religious fury. You know what, **** you. I've had it.

 

[MuZammiL Dr. s[1]n]

No politician have capacity or qualification enough to choose any post of any institution, including a simple post of a peon.

Almost every politician is morally corrupt.

brother , can you point out those Lt.gens.in Pak.army who have got green eyes ? Or perhaps any major generals for that matter ?

 

[Sedqal]

brother , can you point out those Lt.gens.in Pak.army who have got green eyes ? Or perhaps any major generals for that matter ?

For the love of God are you talking about the myth of 'green eyed' ruler who will bring prosperity to Pakistan? Dude these lame myths are dime a dozen and carefully made to shape public opinion in favour of dictators. That is why there are numerous myths about 'nojawanoun kee hakoomat' and 'danday wali sarkar'. No freaking Danday wali sarkar is going to come, we will only move ahead when we have a clearly defined system and that system is allowed to mature.

 

[batmannow]

For the love of God are you talking about the myth of 'green eyed' ruler who will bring prosperity to Pakistan? Dude these lame myths are dime a dozen and carefully made to shape public opinion in favour of dictators. That is why there are numerous myths about 'nojawanoun kee hakoomat' and 'danday wali sarkar'. No freaking Danday wali sarkar is going to come, we will only move ahead when we have a clearly defined system and that system is allowed to mature.

your noora mind only has ,NOORA SARKAR, NOORAY KAA DANDAA, NOORAA SYSTEM & off course NOORAY KA PAKISTAN?
bad boys, bad boys , bad boys!
what you gona do, what you gona do!
when they come for you?

 

[Kompromat]

Pakistani army chief Ashfaq Kayani's successor faces a host of challenges

Date | October 20, 2013 - 3:16PM

Ben Doherty

Read more: Pakistani army chief Ashfaq Kayani's successor faces a host of challenges

Who will be next ... General Ashfaq Kayani, right, with then president Pervez Musharraf, took over command of the army in November, 2007. Photo: Reuters

Read more: Pakistani army chief Ashfaq Kayani's successor faces a host of challenges

Rawalpindi: Fourteen years ago, when Nawaz Sharif was last prime minister of Pakistan, he thought he had his man in uniform. He was wrong. In 1998, over several more senior officers, Sharif chose to appoint Pervez Musharraf as his chief of army staff. It was to prove neither a happy, nor a long, union. Sharif must choose a man he can work with ... but not so pliant he will not have the respect of his forces. Within a year, with both men's reputations damaged by Pakistan's provocation of fighting with India in Kashmir, Sharif sought to sack his general.


But the general had the army, and on October 12, 1999, even as the prime minister ordered a plane carrying Musharraf to be prevented landing on Pakistani soil, his troops seized control of the airport and, by evening, the government. Musharraf was in charge. The episode, while dramatic, was sadly unexceptional in Pakistan which, in its short independent history, has known three coups and 33 years under military rule.

In 2013, Sharif is back in residence at the Prime Minister's Secretariat, inheriting a well-regarded, apolitical, Chief of Army Staff, General Ashfaq Kayani. But after six years in the post, Kayani will stand down next month, and Sharif must choose his replacement carefully. Pakistan is different now. The old aphorism that the head of the army was "the most powerful man in Pakistan" is heard less often. While Kayani wields undoubted influence, he has been praised for keeping the army "in barracks" and recognising the primacy of Pakistan's elected civilian government.

This year, for the first time since independence, a civilian government in Pakistan completed its full term, went to an election, and a new administration was voted in: a matter of routine for most democracies but a significant victory in a country where governments are generally ended by tanks in the streets, and politicians in jail or on gallows. A coup now seems, if not an impossibility, certainly highly unlikely in Pakistan. But a new army chief is a balancing act for Sharif. He must choose a man he feels he can work with, and control, but not one who is so pliant he will not have the respect, or command, of his forces.

The General-Secretary of the Pakistan Ex-Servicemen's Association, Brigadier Syed Masud ul-Hassan told Fairfax Media in the garrison city of Rawalpindi that by keeping the army out of politics, Kayani had established a template for whoever followed him into the post. "This is the way it will be – and the way it should be. The first objective must be the rule of law and respect for the constitution. Whatever happens, the army should not come into politics." The most senior lieutenant-general when Kayani retires will be Haroon Aslam, who won acclaim for leading the highly successful operation to clear the Swat Valley of the Taliban in 2009.

Lieutenant-General Rashad Mahmud is a former director of counter-terrorism for Pakistan's spy agency, the Inter-Service Intelligence, a qualification of supreme significance as Pakistan tries to quell the insurgent violence on its north-west frontier. Other senior officers reportedly under consideration are Lieutenant-General Raheel Sharif (no relation to the Prime Minister) and Lieutenant-General Tariq Khan.

"The army is a disciplined force," Mahsud said. "Any of the lieutenant-generals who might be promoted will have experience and will be capable". But whichever three-star general inherits the extra pip now on Kayani's shoulders will face a host of challenges. The most immediate is the seemingly intractable battle against militant extremists who wash back and forth across the mountainous border with Afghanistan as the seasons and fighting dictate. A third of Pakistan's army has been posted there for a decade.

In a position that might seem anathema to a military man, the new head of the army will have to be willing to sit down to talk with the Taliban. Sharif is in favour of talks (though a recent bomb attack on a church has cooled his enthusiasm), and Kayani has been similarly disposed. The Taliban are not negotiators, and the new army chief will have a difficult time winning any concessions towards peace. The Taliban are refusing to disarm, demand their prisoners be released and say they will never recognise the constitution of the country.

Despite this, talk the new chief must.

The relationship with the US is fragile. The assassination of Osama bin Laden – only about two kilometres from Pakistan's West Point – was an immense embarrassment for Pakistan's military establishment, and comments like those of the former chairman of the Joint Chiefs Admiral Mike Mullen that the Haqqani terrorist network is "a strategic arm of Pakistan's Inter-Services Intelligence Agency" are a demonstration of just how little trust remains between the two countries.

But new faces on both sides of the relationship bring hope. Before he became US Secretary of State, John Kerry was his country's point man on Pakistan and is well respected in Pakistan's political and military institutions.

And, of course, for Pakistan's new military chief, there remains the country's fractious relationship with fellow nuclear-armed neighbour India, the usual tensions exacerbated this year by regular outbreaks of violence on their contested border in Kashmir.

India does not believe Pakistan's efforts on terrorism are genuine. Masud said that if the terrorist attacks could be diminished, other issues would become easier to manage. "But fighting the terrorists is not an easy job. We are not fighting an enemy sitting in front of us. The enemy is hard to identify. They are in the mountains and in the cities, among the people."

He said the military leadership should be prepared to negotiate with the Taliban rebels it's been fighting so long. "Everybody wants peace. If that can be achieved without further fighting, then everybody is happy. Peace will be good for all in Pakistan."


Read more: Pakistani army chief Ashfaq Kayani's successor faces a host of challenges