New provinces and provincial autonomy

[Kambojaric]

wow msami bro, you need to use some spaces atleast! Make some paragraphs as salman said. Read the first five lines and got lost.

 

[SekrutYakhni]

We should divide our provinces in order to get an effective leadership which can solve the local problems. There is no doubt about it at all!


Come up with a single solid rebuttal--

 

[muse]

We should divide our provinces in order to get an effective leadership which can solve the local problems. There is no doubt about it at all!

Come up with a single solid rebuttal--

Perhaps we can also ask, "Whose purpose do the present provinces serve"?? Regardless of what you call a administrative area, whether you call it district, precint, province or whatever, the function of a "administrative area" to provide basic government services - right or wrong? Are such services easier to provide to smaller administrativ areas or larger?? If larger, then why have provinces, the single unit is the largest administrative unit, isn't it?

So, really, a way in which to think of this is that while ordinary citizens are the "customer" of government services, Political parties and politiicans have become the gate keepers of who will get what services and what quality of services - this is where their power comes from.

 

[msami]

apropos of 'permalink' above views, it is reiterated that please come and float these Provincial division idea at Quetta, Peshawar or Karachi(though it is occupied by non-sindhi Urdu speaking vultures)...result would be declared on the spot...as far as Punjab is concerned, criminal ignorance of Punjabis have been capitalized on far before 1947...their ardent unlimited desire has turned them into such animals, who could not watch beyond their greedy lust for the sake of money and power at the cost of their dignity, honor and self-respect... the classic example of that could be observed in their inferiority complex, when they speak Urdu with their siblings at home and simultaneously address their parents, servants or downtrodden class in Punjabi having assumed them unethical and discarded species...what an irony!aping Urdu has neither gave them knowledge nor handsome bread and butter in this federation and across the globe rather this shift has made them a butt of jokes before their centuries old neighboring Pathan, Sindi and Baloch nations...if any individual or a nation disowns his fathers (Bullahay Shah, Khawaja Ghulam Fareed, Sultan Bahoo, Waris Shah, Mian Mohammad Buksh) and copy brothels' originated language (Urdu) and culture, how could that individual or nation pay respect to others' fathers (Shah Abdul Lateef Bhatti, Rehman Baba or Gul Khan Naseer)... May Allah either bless that individual or nation true cognizance/wit or perish it...so that a genuine nation could emerge from its ashes...

 

[Nahraf]

We have discussion on other forums about creating new provinces. The easiest solution is to dissolve provinces and upgrade Division into states. Each should have equal representation in the Senate and according to population in the National Assembly.

 

[msami]

NATIONS ARE NOT EMERGED BY ANNOUNCING OR PROMULGATING BY SOMEONE OVERNIGHT, RATHER IT IS AN EVOLUTIONARY PROCESS OF CENTURIES... COME OUT OF SUPERFICIAL WORLD AND TALK SOME SANE AND LOGICAL PLEASE...DON'T DIVERT MY LOGICAL IRREFUTABLE TRUTHS, AND IF YOU ARE LITERALLY HAVE COURAGE, PLEASE COME TO QUETTA AT YOUR OWN RISK... WHERE I LIVE AND FLOAT THE SUGGESTION OF DIVIDING BALOCHISTAN INTO 3 PROVINCES IN ANY PRIVATE OR PUBLIC GATHERING, AS YOU ADVISED... THEN SELF-EXPLANATORY RESULT WOULD COME OUT...

---------- Post added at 01:46 AM ---------- Previous post was at 01:45 AM ----------

I WONDER AS SOON AS I ENTER IN MY MOTHER LAND...I FIND SUNNIS, SHIAS, CHRISTIANS, JATS, ARIANS, RANAS, CHUHADARIS, MALIKS, KAMEES BLAH BLAH BLAH....ALAS! I CAN'T FIND A SINGLE PUNJABI, WHO LOVES HIS MOTHERLAND, LANGUAGE AND CULTURE... AS I CLAIMED BY EVERY SECT THAT ISLAM IS A RELIGION 100 % SYNCHRONIZES WITH NATURE... IF IT IS REALLY SO THEN WHY RELIGIOUS OR NON RELIGIOUS PUNJABIS DON'T OWN THEIR LANGUAGE...??? IN DIFFERENT BOOKS LIKE 'THE SPIRIT OF ISLAM by Syed Ameer Ali; PERTAINING TO THE LIFE OF MUHAMMAD (PBUH), IT IS TOLD THAT THOUGH THE LANGUAGE OF MUHAMMAD (PBUH) AND ALL ARABIAN PENINSULA WAS ARABIC, YET WHEN MUHAMMAD (PBUH) USED TO ADDRESS A PARTICULAR TRIBE OF ARAB, HE WOULD STRIVE HIS LEVEL BEST TO USE THAT TRIBE'S PECULIAR DIALECT...THERE IS NO NEED TO EXPLAIN IT WHY...! IN THIS SO-CALLED ISLAMIC REPUBLIC, WHICH IS NOW IN FACT A FEDERATION OF FOUR MAJOR NATIONS, NOT TO SPEAK OF DIALECTS, EVEN THE CENTURIES OLD RICH LANGUAGES OF NATIVES HAVE BEEN SUBJUGATED BY THE HEGEMONY OF AN ALIEN LANGUAGE URDU...SO HOW COULD ONE EXPECT PEACE PREVAILING IN THIS COINED FEDERATION...NEVER...!UNTIL AND UNLESS THE LINGUISTIC, CULTURAL, ECONOMICAL AND POLITICAL RIGHTS OF AN INDIVIDUAL OR ALL FOUR NATIONS ARE RESTORED, PEACE WOULD ALWAYS BE A DREAM FOR VULTURES INFILTRATING AND RULING THE POOR MASSES OF ALL FOUR UNITS OF THIS FEDERATION...PUNJABIS BEING IN MAJORITY WILL HAVE TO HAVE THE COGNIZANCE OF THE SITUATION...AND URDU SPEAKING HYENAS IF LITERALLY INTEND TO LIVE IN ANY UNIT OF THIS FEDERATION, THEY WILL HAVE TO OWN THE LANGUAGE AND CULTURE OF THE LAND IN ITS TRUE LETTER AND SPIRIT RATHER IN A WINDOW DRESSING MANNER AS THEIR RACIST LEADER HAS BEEN PORTRAYING BY WEARING SINDI CAP AND AJRAK...OTHERWISE HOWEVER CUNNINGLY THEY MAY PROJECT THE NAME ISLAM AND A SUPERFICIAL NATIONALITY OF PAKISTANI, THEY MIGHT DECEIVE FEW PEOPLE FOR SOME TIME, BUT CAN NEVER MAKE FOOL MANY PEOPLE SO MANY TIME...

 

[pak-marine]

Dividing up Punjab
By Ayesha Siddiqa
Published: April 2, 2011

ayesha.siddiqa@tribune.com.pk
Suddenly there seems to be greater conversation about creating a Seraiki or, alternatively, a Bahawalpur province. These are two independent movements with independent dimensions. But why is there sudden talk of new province/s in Punjab? What makes it even more interesting is that there is no real popular movement that could make it look like a public demand.
Recently, Prime Minister Yousaf Raza Gilani talked of his party including the demand for a Seraiki province in the PPP manifesto. His critics would immediately see this as his bid to stay politically relevant. But he is not the only one endorsing the new province project. The demand for a Seraiki province was endorsed by Pervaiz Elahi as well, who is a hardcore central Punjabi and should, technically speaking, have not supported such a move. However, who says leaders have to be wise all the time? For Pervaiz Elahi or Yousaf Raza Gilani, the main objective is to push the Sharif brothers. Once threatened with a division of the larger province that they rule, they might agree to shake hands with the establishment. An indicator of whether there is appeasement between the establishment and the Sharif brothers will be if Nawaz Sharif, who is not liked by the establishment, will take a back-seat in his own party.
Ideologically, there are many forces, including the MQM, that would like to see Punjab divided, as that would reduce the power of the larger province and the Sharif brothers as well. Such a division will also set the principle of more divisions elsewhere which, in turn, supports the MQM’s plan to carve out something for itself in urban Sindh. The establishment itself may not be totally averse to the idea, as it will deflect attention from the issue of Punjabi dominance of the state and the security establishment.
Needless to say, the Bahawalpur and Seraiki province indicate two different approaches. In many ways, the establishment in Pakistan is far more comfortable with the idea of a Bahawalpur province than a Seraiki one, mainly because the former is ethnic-neutral. Notwithstanding the legal claim regarding Bahawalpur’s status as a province, the fact is that in the past 60 years and more, the former state of Bahawalpur has become a melting pot for all ethnic groups. The main powerhouse is no longer the Nawab family but Punjabis like Tariq Basheer Cheema — a turncoat who defected from the PPP to the PML-Q. The very people who vociferously opposed the movement for the restoration of Bahawalpur province (1969-71) and were party to the killing of hundreds of innocent people, are now supporting the idea. The very fact that the movement is spearheaded by a person like Mehmood Durrani, who has the reputation of being close to the establishment, indicates the way the winds are blowing.
The Seraiki province, on the other hand, is an ethnicly-potent concept which the establishment does not like. It recognises the concept of Pakistan woven around its multiple identities. Sadly though, the country’s establishment is extremely nervous of a national narrative based on multiple identities.
In any case, both movements deserve attention because they protest the highly skewed distribution of resources, especially in the largest province. For instance, a glance at the development budget for the financial year shows that the highest share goes to Lahore. The district’s development budget is about Rs75 billion. This is in stark comparison to DG Khan’s Rs20.6 billion, Bahawalpur’s Rs17.7 billion, Bahawalnagar’s Rs8.7 billion, and Bhakkar’s Rs4.8 billion. Interestingly, it’s not just a matter of south Punjab. Even north Punjab seems to be suffering vis-à-vis central Punjab. For instance, Attock’s development budget is Rs5.7 billion and Chakwal’s Rs6.5 billion. In fact, Multan, DG Khan, Faisalabad, Gujranwala and Kasur are comparatively better.
Surely the development budget is skewed in favour of the big cities of central Punjab, especially Lahore. But a glance at official figures shows that some cities of south Punjab have done equally well. For instance, the prime minister has put in an effort in recent years to develop Multan due to which the city’s development budget seems to have gone up. Such examples may not absolve the Sharifs of their skewed distribution policy, but it also says something about the lack of capacity of local leaders who were unable to vie for resources. Hence, it is necessary for intellectuals from these areas to look at the errors of their own leadership before they propose the creation of a new entity.
Published in The Express Tribune, April 03rd, 2011.

 

[Ahmad]

there was a demand for hazara province, what happend to that?

 

[Thorough Pro]

I honestly believe the only problem in Pakistan are these stupid politicians. They changed the name of NWFP to KPK. Ok good, but did that solved the real problem of the population. Did the name change improved the law and order situation, did the name change brough economic stability or growth, did it solve the energy crisies, did it brought ht einflation under control?

I have lost all hope in the Pakistani poloticians, all they can think of is come up with ideas which only help to bring some attention to them no one is bothered or even capable to comprehend what are the real problems, what are their causes and how to address them, what is happening in the world around them, whhere is this world going? all these ninkumpoops can thinnk of is change the name of a province, divide a province, create controversy over projects of national intrest and surviival.

 

[bc040400065]

there was a demand for hazara province, what happend to that?

It is still there and next election would be disaster for PMLN in hazara division for sure. But one difference we have here is that people in hazara division are not asking for seperate province on the bases of any ethnic nationalism but because of economics issues and hatred for ANP's past. If The name was not changed on linguistic & ethinic lines i don't think people in hazara would have even demanded a seperate province.

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

there was a demand for hazara province, what happend to that?

Nothin the movement is dead.

 

[Ahmad]

Nothin the movement is dead.

i think they shouldnt have changed the name in the first place, and once they did it, they should have considered Hazarawals as well.

 

[Tiger Awan]

apropos of 'permalink' above views, it is reiterated that please come and float these Provincial division idea at Quetta, Peshawar or Karachi(though it is occupied by non-sindhi Urdu speaking vultures)...result would be declared on the spot...as far as Punjab is concerned, criminal ignorance of Punjabis have been capitalized on far before 1947...their ardent unlimited desire has turned them into such animals, who could not watch beyond their greedy lust for the sake of money and power at the cost of their dignity, honor and self-respect... the classic example of that could be observed in their inferiority complex, when they speak Urdu with their siblings at home and simultaneously address their parents, servants or downtrodden class in Punjabi having assumed them unethical and discarded species...what an irony!aping Urdu has neither gave them knowledge nor handsome bread and butter in this federation and across the globe rather this shift has made them a butt of jokes before their centuries old neighboring Pathan, Sindi and Baloch nations...if any individual or a nation disowns his fathers (Bullahay Shah, Khawaja Ghulam Fareed, Sultan Bahoo, Waris Shah, Mian Mohammad Buksh) and copy brothels' originated language (Urdu) and culture, how could that individual or nation pay respect to others' fathers (Shah Abdul Lateef Bhatti, Rehman Baba or Gul Khan Naseer)... May Allah either bless that individual or nation true cognizance/wit or perish it...so that a genuine nation could emerge from its ashes...

What the .....

never ever saw a punjabi with such ________ thinking

 

[Tiger Awan]

Make 1000 provinces. I don not mind

But just think can this country afford 5,6 provinces with 30,40 ministers ( to be very positive)

Can you guess Number of other government officials to be appointed in case of a new province is made

 

[bc040400065]

there was a demand for hazara province, what happend to that?

The demand is still there. but people may not be hearing it on news channels but believe me people are really angry and it will be really hard time for PMLn in next election in hazara division. If name was not changed on linguistic and ethnics bases people would not have demanded seperate province.