NATO versus SCO, which alliance is more powerful?

[Superboy]

@ Peter C

If Russia attacks Estonia, you think Germany would dare to fight Russia?

 

[Viper0011.]

Alliance = a number of countries that are allied with each other. Both NATO and SCO are alliances, no?

Dude, one is an alliance as a defense pact globally. The other one is a more regional, economy focused pact.

 

[Hamartia Antidote]

@ Peter C

If Russia attacks Estonia, you think Germany would dare to fight Russia?

They have no choice.

 

[Ragnar]

@Chinese-Dragon
A question about Energy security: Is the entry of India, Iran, and Pakistan meant to facilitate the IPI and TAPI pipelines? Or a pipeline through Xinjiang with reference to the article below? Which is more likely?

Oxford Analytica - Sample analysis from the Daily Brief

India turns to Russia and China for energy security
The Oxford Analytica Daily Brief ® - Monday, June 2 2014

India, Russia and China are exploring options to construct a 30 billion dollar overland pipeline that would transport hydrocarbons from Russia's western Siberian fields, via Russia's Altai region and China's Xinjiang province, to northern India. It is as yet unclear whether the pipeline project will be based on the supply of oil or gas, or both. In either case, the national oil and gas companies of Russia (Rosneft and Gazprom) and India (ONGC and GAIL) are likely to play a major role in operationalising the project. Talks are expected to conclude this year, with construction scheduled for completion between 2020 and 2022. Despite the economic and logistical challenges of the project, these tripartite discussions signal an important shift towards greater eastern cooperation, reflecting growing polarisation in the global geopolitics of energy.





By comparison, contracted long-term pipeline supplies have lower marginal costs, largely due to lower costs of transportation. Moreover, it would provide India with a relatively reliable supply source at a lower price risk since the volatility of importing through the international spot market would be mitigated (see INDIA: 'Pipeline diplomacy' faces tough road ahead - January 3, 2014).

Captive market
For Russia and China, India presents a huge market opportunity

The International Energy Agency's World Energy Outlook 2013 predicts that India's energy consumption will grow at an annual average rate of 3% to 2035 -- the fastest in the world, including China (1.6%). Compared with a predicted average rate of 0.1% for the OECD -- Russia's traditional consumer base -- the Indian market is particularly important to Russia.

Pricing arrangements?
However, the suppliers will seek clarity on whether Indian consumers can afford to pay import prices for hydrocarbons. Here, Indian policy trends are reassuring:

• Although the price of domestic gas is low, at 4.2 dollars per MMBtu, it is expected to increase to potentially 8.4 dollars this month.
• Oil subsidies have being progressively phased out since June 2010. Many petroleum product prices are now liberalised to the retail level.
• There is a substantial price inelastic segment among Indian consumers -- particularly in refineries, city gas and petrochemicals -- which can bear high import prices.

Pipeline gas -- likely to be priced at the lower end of import prices -- will probably find a market.

Constraints
Nonetheless, the project confronts multiple constraints.

Logistics

The route is likely to be challenging due to environmental and geographical constraints, rather than the security risks that have typically characterised other South Asian pipeline routes -- such as the Turkmenistan-Afghanistan-Pakistan-India (TAPI) pipeline and the Iran-Pakistan-India (IPI) pipeline. Around 35% of the route would fall within mountainous terrain.

Russia and China have previously discussed the construction of a 2,600 kilometre gas pipeline through the Altai region delivering 30 billion cubic meters (bcm) of gas to China's Xinjiang province (see RUSSIA: EU hurdles will not curb energy aims in China - May 1, 2014). The plan was strongly opposed by environmental groups as the Altai region is home to sensitive and endangered species.

Since early indications are that the Russia-India-China pipeline would follow the Altai-Xinjiang route, environmental risks are likely to remain a constraint.

Commercial terms
India and China favour gas-linked prices but Russia prefers oil-linked contracts

The commercial terms of the project have yet to be discussed. It is likely that Russia will push for oil-linked pricing -- linked to the price of Japan Customs Cleared (JCC) crude.

India has considered oil-linked pricing in previous pipeline negotiations -- for instance, prices being discussed for the IPI pipeline were 12% of JCC plus a margin. However, market dynamics are expected to change by 2020, which could strengthen India's bargaining position, though contingent on whether the primary source of supply is oil or gas.

There is evidence that oil-linked pricing is breaking down for long-term gas contracts, which are increasingly beginning to be indexed to gas hubs:

• In Europe, about 50% of contracted supplies could soon be on hub-based prices.
• India's GAIL recently contracted 3.5 million tonnes per annum of LNG from US-based Cheniere's Sabine Pass terminal at a price equal to 115% of Henry Hub plus a margin.
• The current tightness in the global LNG market is predicted to ease by 2020, around the same time as the proposed pipeline, implying that Russian pipeline supplies may have to compete with LNG.

Therefore, negotiations between India and China over the contract price could prove a sticking point as Russia will be keen to maintain its traditional preference for oil-linked prices, whereas India will seek the most favourable terms based on changing market dynamics.

China is also likely to seek a favourable transit fee for its participation in the project, which will add to the price India pays.

Diplomatic consequences
China may accept India's membership of the SCO

The pipeline is part of India's recent attempts to revive the 'southern silk road' through greater cooperation with China:

• It fits into Delhi's efforts to gain entry to the Shanghai Cooperation Organization (SCO) -- previously supported by Russia but not China. The SCO aims to establish a unified energy market among its six core members: Russia, Kazakhstan, Uzbekistan (three energy producing countries), China, Kyrgystan, Tajikistan (three energy consuming countries).
• The pipeline project has reportedly been linked with potential Russian investment in petrochemicals plants.

China's participation in the pipeline could therefore potentially clear India's path for membership to the SCO.

Alienating the West?
However, the project could affect India's diplomacy:

• India's TAPI pipeline was revived through US backing, as a potential counter to Russian influence in Asian energy supply. The United States is unlikely to lend its support to a Russia-India-China pipeline.
• These tensions could increase given that cooperation with the West over potential diversification of energy supplies has run into obstacles -- for instance due to India's nuclear liability legislation.
• The potential for US LNG imports is contingent on export permissions, complicating US leverage over India's energy policy.

The pipeline project could signal India's willingness to prioritise its energy security over ties with the West.

 

[cloud_9]

For your next thread......Which one is a muscle car,Ford Mustang vs Chery QQ ?

 

[Superboy]

They have no choice.

Why is that?

For your next thread......Which one is a muscle car,Ford Mustang vs Chery QQ ?

Chery QQ for me. If Americans think they are so tough, come have a taste of our Type 99A2

 

[cloud_9]

Why is that?




Chery QQ for me. If Americans think they are so tough, come have a taste of our Type 99A2

You are trying to box in the wrong weight class.

Are sure you are Chinese because it's pretty unusual for a Chines to brag about something or do these comparison threads.

 

[mbg]

Forget NATO, the USA can take on every other military in the world by itself

 

[Superboy]

For your next thread......Which one is a muscle car,Ford Mustang vs Chery QQ ?

Actually, a better comparison would be between Ford Mustang and 2015 Volvo XC90 from the Volvo division of Geely 400 hp baby

 

[cloud_9]

Actually, a better comparison would be between Ford Mustang and 2015 Volvo XC90 from the Volvo division of Geely 400 hp baby

Sure,If you think SCO is a XC90

 

[Superboy]

Sure,If you think SCO is a XC90

SCO = next gen Geely Emgrand EC9 wheelbase 113.3 inches, shares platform and drivetrain with next gen Volvo S80

 

[nvKyleBrown]

For your next thread......Which one is a muscle car,Ford Mustang vs Chery QQ ?

Hey, the sport model QQ has 67 horsepower! My mom had a Ford Festiva that was about in that class. Got great mileage, nice little car. Interestingly, I was driving a Mustang at the time...

On a serious note, anyone know what kind of 0-60 time that equals? (0-100km for you metric guys) The only notes I could find were mocking the car, not trying to figure out what it can actually do. I found one suggestion of a 17 second 0-60, but only a suggestion.

 

[he-man]

Nato is atleast 10 times more powerful owing to USA alone

SCO = next gen Geely Emgrand EC9 wheelbase 113.3 inches, shares platform and drivetrain with next gen Volvo S80

Till sco admits india and india grows at 8-9 percent for next 15 years SCO will remain a joke.
India is a must to give it muscle but right now we are too weak to count much

 

[faisal6309]

They have no choice.

Attack on one NATO country is attack on all NATO countries. So, if germany got in problems with Russia, will other NATO countries come to rescue her?

 

[he-man]

Attack on one NATO country is attack on all NATO countries. So, if germany got in problems with Russia, will other NATO countries come to rescue her?

yes