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Naipaul’s wife finds Pak ‘horror’ now stalking UK

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Honor killings is part of Hindu culture and pre-islamic Subcontinent. It is very much a common occurrence in India even today.:coffee:



You are misinformed, Its not Hindu culture. Let me clear some air

1. Satyawati, Grand mother of Kaurav and Pandavas, was from fishermen family.
2. The greatest kingdoms of India Mauryans and Guptas were from so called low caste.
Like wise there are many such figures which married to so called low caste and there was no honor killing...


So question is from where this Honor killing came to India:

As we know down the time every culture get to its low. So does Hindus. After Muslim invasion (which was Mongolic in nature) Hindus felt there girls unsafe (Muslims invaders were/are notorious for...). So there came the Purda/Ghoonghat. The veil is dominant in western india where Muslims invaded many time. Southy Indian Hindus not use veil.

Internal and External (predominantly barbaric mongolic Muslim culture) affect aqdversly indian (Hindu) culture.


How is future?

Future of Indian (hindu) civilization is bright. Castism in Hinduism is taking its last breath, so does medivial (mis)Culture.
 
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Mr. Naipaul had endorsed BJP and destruction of Babri Mosque by Hindu fundamentalists. He prescribes hatred against Muslims which has surprised many intellectuals and historians in the west and even India. No wonder his wife would also display hate against Pakistani Muslims as if the honour killings are only specific to Pakistanis and Muslims.

I respect the views of Hindu Indians even if I don’t agree with them. They stand with their own. Lady Naipaul, left her own, does not see the wrongs of her husband’s negativity of intellectual views and joins him in slamming peoples of her birthplace. This shows the shallowness of her character and non-ethics of her so-called ethicized ethics.

People like her, who lack credibility amongst their own are destined to a life of ignominy. And just to show their presence, and to get accolade from others, do of-and-on insult their own, just to remain visible.

I just pity her.

You are misinformed, Its not Hindu culture. Let me clear some air

1. Satyawati, Grand mother of Kaurav and Pandavas, was from fishermen family.
2. The greatest kingdoms of India Mauryans and Guptas were from so called low caste.
Like wise there are many such figures which married to so called low caste and there was no honor killing...


So question is from where this Honor killing came to India:

As we know down the time every culture get to its low. So does Hindus. After Muslim invasion (which was Mongolic in nature) Hindus felt there girls unsafe (Muslims invaders were/are notorious for...). So there came the Purda/Ghoonghat. The veil is dominant in western india where Muslims invaded many time. Southy Indian Hindus not use veil.

Internal and External (predominantly barbaric mongolic Muslim culture) affect aqdversly indian (Hindu) culture.


How is future?

Future of Indian (hindu) civilization is bright. Castism in Hinduism is taking its last breath, so does medivial (mis)Culture.

Good luck to you and your views of blaming all ills at Muslims.

Is this the reason you didn't perform satti, after becoming a widow or was satti also an outcome of post Muslim rule in India.
 
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I believe she has a point, but talks in a condescending and unhelpful way, sounds like she feels superior to the other backward pakistanis from her point of view.
 
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Indians trolling again. My my, what else is new?

Wife of Indian writer: 'I can still see the horror that made me flee Pakistan - in the haunted eyes of girls raised HERE': Nadira Naipaul exposes arranged marriages and honour killings in the UK


By NADIRA NAIPAUL

PUBLISHED: 21:13 GMT, 18 August 2012 | UPDATED: 21:19 GMT, 18 August 2012

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Campaigner: Nadira Naipaul, pictured, has witnessed first-hand the torture inflicted on women in Pakistan


When I married V.  S. Naipaul and moved to England in 1996, I thought I had left the horror behind.

Pakistan had drained my resolve, and I was tired of fighting a losing battle. To me, England, for all its ills, was the promised land.

Instead, I have found the horror I fled has followed me here. It is all around, eroding the very core of everything Britain believes in.

I see it everywhere. In the haunted eyes of young Pakistani girls, brought up in Britain, who know nothing but a Westernised life: young women who work happily behind beauty counters in our department stores, yet must return home to parents who refuse to emerge from their cultural ghettos.


And who expect their daughters to accept traditional arranged marriages to distant cousins brought up in rural Pakistan.

Desperate to integrate, these young girls change their names to sound more British. They are happy to have white boyfriends, to go clubbing. They certainly do not want forced marriages.

When I talk to them they are seething with anger that their parents – some semi-literate – insist upon entrenching themselves in Muslim ghettos, erecting cultural barriers and refusing to integrate, rejecting any semblance of a British way of life.

I see the same anger in young Muslim men who desperately want to join the mainstream, but cannot because deeply traditional parents expect strict adherence to traditional Islamic family life. It is easy to see how the clash between the generations can become corrosive, how at its most destructive extreme it can culminate in ‘honour killings’.


Take the recent case in Warrington of Iftikhar and Farzana Ahmed, who murdered their Westernised daughter Shafilea, 17, because she refused to accept a forced marriage.
Honour killing: Iftikhar Ahmed, 52, and his wife Farzana, 49, of Warrington, Cheshire, suffocated their 17-year-old daughter Shafilea with a plastic bag because she refused an arranged marriage

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Honour killing: Iftikhar Ahmed, 52, and his wife Farzana, 49, of Warrington, Cheshire, suffocated their 17-year-old daughter Shafilea with a plastic bag because she refused an arranged marriage
Inside the courtroom: Iftikhar Ahmed stood impassively as the verdicts were given while his spouse wiped tears from her eyes with a tissue

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Inside the courtroom: Iftikhar Ahmed stood impassively as the verdicts were given while his spouse wiped tears from her eyes with a tissue

For a decade, while in Pakistan, I wrote extensively about women enmeshed in the restrictions of Islamic law and traditions of honour. Witnessing the torture inflicted on women by husbands, fathers, brothers and even female relatives with the seeming sanction of Islam gradually transformed me into a borderline heretic. It took me years to realise how deeply ingrained these beliefs are. And how difficult it is to combat them.


The tales of two women affected me deeply. While living on my farm in rural Bahawalpur with my first husband, I met Rani, a young woman whose husband was one of my seasonal labourers. I employed her as a maid.

A few months later, we were visited by a minister in the government who was one of the biggest landowners in the area and an old friend of my husband. He arrived with an entourage demanding that I hand over Rani, her husband and her five-year-old son.

Missing: Shafilea Ahmed disappeared in September 2003 and her body was found on the bank of the River Kent in Cumbria the following February

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Missing: Shafilea Ahmed disappeared in September 2003 and her body was found on the bank of the River Kent in Cumbria the following February

Rani had been a beautiful child. At the age of ten, her parents, tenants of the minister’s grandfather, ‘gave’ her to the old man. She was regularly sexually abused by the minister, his father and grandfather. The women of the house did not protest, provided the men were discreet.

But when Rani became pregnant they married her off to an old man who often beat her and her son.


A few years later Rani fell in love with a local boy and eloped with him and the child. Now the minister wanted her back.

What, I asked my husband, would happen if we handed her over? He told me they would strip her, tie her to a carriage wheel, flog her, then rape her. She would be defiled in public.

He insisted, however, that we must hand her over. Not to do so would offend an old family friend. If not chastised properly, it would encourage other women to question their lot.

My husband had been educated in England and was the scion of an old, respected family, yet he accepted such things. When he realised I wouldn’t give Rani up, the minister said his ‘face must be saved’. He insisted upon taking the boy. Rani wailed like a banshee. The heartrending sight and sound of her has never left me.

On another occasion, a young woman was doused in petrol and set alight by her father and brother in front of her terrified mother and sisters because she would not marry a man who had abducted her. The family considered her defiled. She had stayed overnight with this man. She must marry him or they would be shamed. When she tried to run away, they murdered her.

These are extreme examples, but stark reminders of the hold these beliefs have on entrenched communities – communities that have, for five decades, been relocating to Britain.

So why, then, have successive Governments refused to acknowledge the incestuous cultures that have evolved in these ghettos? Why does no one challenge the existence of the so-called ‘Islamic Parliaments’, with their retrogressive laws, that exist in cities such as Bradford and Leicester?

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Time for change: Nadira Naipaul believes Muslim women, pictured here outside Bangor Street Community Centre in Blackburn, England, should not be forced to wear veils


In these cities, teams of vigilantes terrorise Pakistani communities. They turn up unannounced to homes, insisting that Ramadan is respected and checking that everyone has come to prayers. They force shops to close, they check that the community is fasting, that women wear the veil.

Let me be clear. No Muslim woman should be forced to wear a veil. No woman wore it in the era of the Prophet. These Muslims may see themselves as community champions, but they are fanatics who make life a misery for young people who want to integrate.


It is time for liberal Muslims to speak out. The defenders of our precious multiculturalism must get real. My message to those who promote these entrenched ghetto ideas is this: go home if you want to practise your form of Islam. There is no place for it here.

Read more: 'I can still see the horror that made me flee Pakistan - in the haunted eyes of girls raised HERE': Nadira Naipaul exposes arranged marriages and honour killings in the UK | Mail Online

'I can still see the horror that made me flee Pakistan - in the haunted eyes of girls raised HERE': Nadira Naipaul exposes arranged marriages and honour killings in the UK | Mail Online
 
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You are misinformed, Its not Hindu culture. Let me clear some air

........

why even reply to Luffy do you seriously think he needs or seek information. Such persons sre here to insult indian culture let them bask in their efforts.
 
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Honor killings is part of Hindu culture and pre-islamic Subcontinent. It is very much a common occurrence in India even today.:coffee:
yes i believe that too......in the places where u find a strict-patriarchal (sorry if i have used the wrong word)-society-where-women- subjugated, u shall find collective male ego forming societal laws which hamper the collective growth of women as a whole. they commit murder with insanity and cloak it/glorify in the name of "izzat/honor".
imo, if u consider (NE of INdia + bengal n BDesh+orissa), society ranges from somewhat matriarchal to somewhat patriachal as we go towards west. although contrasting behavior mite be present too.
from there, the more u move westwards, the more eccentricities of patriarchal societies occur...which ends with the most when it reaches the afghan lands.

and about ur comment.....yes it happens a lot....it was full in newspapers about these things, although a year later i feel these decreased a bit due to police action and media, or maybe now they are simply less reported.

And abt the hindu jabbing, seriously dada, apnere keou taka dei neki hindu go bishoye baajey kotha kowa.....????.
 
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No obviously you haven't.

In Mahabharata, over 6 billion were supposed to have been killed. Mythology or otherwise.
Surprised you know the name of something called mahabharata related to indian subcontinent.
To further your knowledge;facts:
1)the story involved kingdom from kandara, punjab, sind to bihar. So 40% of india and 80% of Pakistan (sans Balochistan).
2) Death toll in the war 18 lakh i.e. 1.8 million i.e. .03 % of your figure of six billion
3) Regret to state that as per my knowledge and research the killings were not honor killing but a result of a really complicated problem regarding the the succession of most powerful kingdom.It culminates into a very big war of its time (considering the technology and times) as almost all the kingdoms took one side or other; something that happened in world war I and II.
4) Kindly enlighten me how the honor was involved in the Mahabharata?
 
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Oh scions of peaceful myths, legends, folklore or traditions, killings are killings, for honour, for expansion of kingdom, for religion or for anything else.

hahhahahah.....:rofl:

but seriousely, yes, killing is killing , no matter wat....whether it be killing for honor, expansion, jihaad
 
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So according to you it is Pakistani culture that if a Pakistani Muslim girl falls in love with a non-Muslim guy, then she should be killed? Because that is what Naipaul's wife is speaking out against...

A Pakistani can fall in love with however they like, including E.T. for all i care, my point is on the basis of generalising any mundane issues regarding honour etc for muslims and not even discussing honour for all other communities.

If you read my point as stated you will only think of honour and respect if you have any.

Coming to your point if it is a non muslim, ask them to revert if not, Adios to them. I will hold my principles weather you like it or not. Those with no honour will never understand.

Pakistani or not, she is still a woman, show some respect at least.

Respect is earnt son, her actions/articles etc attribut her to being a kanjri nuff said. Where respect is due it will be given.

now we really can't be calling you innocent angles can we ? you guys have earned that title outright by your sheer stupidity and love for talibanisation of Pakistan. introspext first before crying and whinging about the world demonising you.

Where does it look like i'm whinging, can't you read we don't give a sh1t what she has to say, only you bhartis are arsed.

So what if we are so called talibanised, i would rather be called talibanised than a dalit without any toilet facilties.

A pakistani muslim talking about medieval mindset of Pakistani diaspora in UK and kids on this forum need to drag India into it.. Talk about obsession..

Why do mods only act on deflection when its done by Indian members ?

Pakistani muslim? she lost that title when she married hindu. She been disowned brother hence her BS article.

Obsession? You idiot look who brought up the article first, a bharti. Deflection? The truth always hurts
 
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British Pakistanis make us all look bad. I wonder how they even got visas to get into that country anyway. I mean it's okay to have your own little areas where Pakistani restaurants and shops are like some areas of Brooklyn and Queens but the way it's there is just disgusting and pathetic with their own sharia wannabe enforcing thugs.
 
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British Pakistanis make us all look bad. I wonder how they even got visas to get into that country anyway. I mean it's okay to have your own little areas where Pakistani restaurants and shops are like some areas of Brooklyn and Queens but the way it's there is just disgusting and pathetic with their own sharia wannabe enforcing thugs.

I didn't need no visa brother, this is the almighties land where he wishes you will go. How the hell are we making you look bad? You wannabe liberal, secularists make us look bad, don't call yourself pakistani when you say others make you look bad. Please define shariah wannabe, no such thing exists.

I live according to shariah every day of my life, i have no need or want to enforce it on muslims or non muslims.

"Over there its disgusting/pathetic" would you to care to explain how.
 
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I didn't need no visa brother, this is the almighties land where he wishes you will go. How the hell are we making you look bad? You wannabe liberal, secularists make us look bad, don't call yourself pakistani when you say others make you look bad. Please define shariah wannabe, no such thing exists.

I live according to shariah every day of my life, i have no need or want to enforce it on muslims or non muslims.

"Over there its disgusting/pathetic" would you to care to explain how.

Sorry to burst your bubble Tribal sahib but using religion to justify breaking laws is pathetic. Unlike south asia where there is no law and order here in the west you follow the laws or get put in jail and sent back.

What makes it even funnier is you are in the UK and are trying to insult me for being a liberal and secular. Talk about being hypocritical. Move to Saudi Arabia or Iran if you want to live under real sharia.


And by pathetic and disgusting is when British Pakistanis bar non Muslims from predominately muslim areas, hand out leaflets proclaiming sharia law, and call for the death of british soldiers returning home from war.
 
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Surprised you know the name of something called mahabharata related to indian subcontinent.
To further your knowledge;facts:
1)the story involved kingdom from kandara, punjab, sind to bihar. So 40% of india and 80% of Pakistan (sans Balochistan).
2) Death toll in the war 18 lakh i.e. 1.8 million i.e. .03 % of your figure of six billion
3) Regret to state that as per my knowledge and research the killings were not honor killing but a result of a really complicated problem regarding the the succession of most powerful kingdom.It culminates into a very big war of its time (considering the technology and times) as almost all the kingdoms took one side or other; something that happened in world war I and II.
4) Kindly enlighten me how the honor was involved in the Mahabharata?

Firstly, I accept my mistake regarding they typo of 6 Billion. It was over 1.6 Billion.

The number killed in the Mahabharata War « Anandatirtha Prathishtana

Let me also cite a bit of the details:

The number killed in the Mahabharata War
April 9, 2009 — Hariprasad
My previous article on the Akshouhini gave rise to some interesting discussions in the comments section. Sri Chiraan rightly pointed out that the actual number of people who participated in the war had to be much more. It was, after all, the “Maha”bharata war!
I recalled reading in the Tatparya Nirnaya that the number 18 Akshouhinis was just the core army. The actual army *had* to be much bigger! So I got down to doing some research on this and yes, the Bhaarata has captured this detail as well. We find details of the actual fatalities (and survivors) in the war in the Stri Parva. The Pandavas, along with Krishna, come to meet Dhritharashtra and Gandhari. At one point, Dhritharashtra asks Yudhishthira if he knows the number of people dead and number of survivors. The numbers that Dharma reveals are
• Fatalities : 1 billion, 660 million and 20,000!!!
• Survivors : 240,165
Today’s world population is 6 billion, 700 odd million. Even in today’s terms, about 25% of the population got wiped out in the war!
This piece of information is in the Stri Parva (11th Parva) of the Mahabharata. I reproduce below the original shloka(s) and Ganguly’s translation of the same.
dashayutanam ayutam sahasrani cha vimshatihi |
kotyah shashtishcha shat chaiva ye asmin rajamrudhe hataha ||
alakshyaanam tu veeraanam sahasraani chaturdasha |
dasha chaanyani rajendra shataam shashtis cha pancha cha ||

“One billion 660 million and 20,000 men have fallen in this battle. Of the heroes that have escaped, the number is 240,165″
Truly, the war was a Maha Yuddha!

Secondly, I mentioned the killings that occurred during the so-called peaceful Hindu rule in India. Ashoka in his rampaging invasion of the eastern province of Kalinga, more than 100,000 men were slain by his forces in this battle alone.

I merely talked about the killings, and not only honour killings.
 
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hahhahahah.....:rofl:

but seriousely, yes, killing is killing , no matter wat....whether it be killing for honor, expansion, jihaad

Honor killings have been carried out by followers of all religions in the world, including Hindus. Even in UK, there have been many many cases of honor killings amongst the Hindus as well, as has been the case amongst Pakistanis, Bangladeshis and local whites.

During 2009, officials in Haryana alone recorded about 100 honor killings of young people caught in the war between clan, caste, culture and cupid. There are many other Indian states where this practice occurs and is equally reprehensible as it may occur in Pakistan, UK or any other part of the world.

However, specifying a particular community as has been done by Lady Naipaul is highly inappropriate and smacks of a clear bias.
 
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Sorry to burst your bubble Tribal sahib but using religion to justify breaking laws is pathetic. Unlike south asia where there is no law and order here in the west you follow the laws or get put in jail and sent back.

What makes it even funnier is you are in the UK and are trying to insult me for being a liberal and secular. Talk about being hypocritical. Move to Saudi Arabia or Iran if you want to live under real sharia.

And by pathetic and disgusting is when British Pakistanis bar non Muslims from predominately muslim areas, hand out leaflets proclaiming sharia law, and call for the death of british soldiers returning home from war.

Where have i used religion to justify breaking laws, nowhere nada zilch.

South Asia has no law? so they make prisons, courts and other laws/regulations for a TV show or are these things simply concocted for show.

So according to your viewpoint anyone living in the west is liberal and secular, there are christians, jews, different ethnicities that are NOT secular/liberal. Living in the west doesn't automatically make you liberal/secular these are viewpoints something which i can only assume is above your comprehension. No such case of hypocrisy on my part here son. Saudi and Iran do not have a true islamic system, only idiots like you who only know cnn fox news think its real sharia.

Didn't you read i actually live with shariah without enforcing it on anyone else.

Bar non muslims from entering muslim areas? Haha you are definately in kookoo land, no one bars anyone form going anywhere. You clearly don't know the ground realities and are watching too much cnn and fox news.

Those who you are referring to with regards to the leaflets I put in the same boat as you. Idiots who don't know what they are talking about, al mujahroun, muslims against crusades DO NOT REPRESENT muslims in the UK or EU. Good riddance to these loonie as well as liberals like you. Both sides are a small minority.

Lesson for you son, read up on issues before thinking you know it all. Ground realities are usually a lot different to what the media is reporting.
 
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