myth of indian independence ?

[nForce]

laws in both countries and the system is still a British Legacy...so its another matter...

the person being the head of state is important, who Governor General was is important and ofcourse the wording of Oath...

Ok.. important.. agreed.How is it important and what next? Please clarify...

Please tell us about the wording of the oath,for both the countries,and I dont want your interpretation.Please provide the actual wordings and then you may show us whats wrong and whats right.

Also,you can enlighten us about the significance of the post of Governor general,which was created for the sake of transition from one phase to another in my opinion,and abolished thereafter.Please tell us what you think about it.I am sorry but I am having a hard time to understand what you are exactly trying to say.Why dont you write them in plain and simple assertive statements?

 

[ifesvr]

actions speak louder than words, he amended the document, and proclaimed very clearly that he is not loyal to crown, while the indian not only accepted the dominion status but also accepted the English man as their Governor General... so Pakistan from day one was not loyal to crown or accepted it...rest are the procedure adopted by the British, so who accepted it willingly, who otherwise sets the difference.... nobody is challenging how power was transferred, I have said that many times...

what is your point? that Nehru and Mountbatten took an oath of allegiance to the Crown. It's so easy to manipulate you. You do understand that in India and Pakistan the oath is taken in the presence of Chief Justice (and taken to GOD in India). Both the Governor-General and PMs in India and Pak took the oath to the Chief Justice of the respective countries and not the Crown. You don't even provide the reference where Jinnah doesn't say it and Nehru or Mountbatten says it(about the alleged allegiance to Crown part).

Secondly if Pakistan was not loyal to the Crown why did you accept Queen Elizabeth as Queen of Pakistan in 1952. Why was Pakistan one of only seven commonwealth countries to send an ambassador called the Standard of Pakistan on her coronation?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_participants_in_Queen_Elizabeth_II_coronation_procession#The_Standards

Why wasn't your PM Muhammad Ali Bogra simply referred as 'Mr' like PM Jawaharlal Nehru rather than 'Honorable' like the other 6 commonwealth PMs (by virtue of Pakistan being a dominion)?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_participants_in_Queen_Elizabeth_II_coronation_procession#The_Prime_Ministers_of_the_Members_of_the_Commonwealth

You are simply making this issue on who was first.....But however hard you try you cannot write away the fact that Pakistan indeed owed loyalty to the Crown till March 1956 (India too did it till Jan 1950) and not August 1947.

 

[ranja]

Here's the text from book Political Histroy of Pakistan by Zahid Choudry. It says that :
"....in Karachi, on the morning of August 14, the transfer of power ceremony for Pakistan was held without any religious practices. Mountbatten addressed the first Constituent Assembly of Pakistan; the proceedings of the assembly started without therecitation from Holy Quran. Next day Quaid-I-Azam Mohammad Ali Jinnah took oath as thefirst Governor General of Pakistan; the text of the oath given to him by the Britishgovernment had in the end the line saying “…So help me God”; Jinnah omitted this line fromthe text and took oath without it."
If it is true, as pakistani members on this forum say, Jinnah deleted/omitted the text saying allegiance to the crown, then why there was no mention in this book? Why only the part .."so help med God" was documented and rest left out be the writer? or he's not a credible historian from Pakistan?
Here is the video of Jinnah taking oath as Gov. General of Pakistan. can someone listen carefully and try to pen down text what he is saying. I couldn't hear properly what he's sayin (08-15 sec) about allegiance.

 

[Leader]

what is your point? that Nehru and Mountbatten took an oath of allegiance to the Crown. It's so easy to manipulate you. You do understand that in India and Pakistan the oath is taken in the presence of Chief Justice (and taken to GOD in India). Both the Governor-General and PMs in India and Pak took the oath to the Chief Justice of the respective countries and not the Crown. You don't even provide the reference where Jinnah doesn't say it and Nehru or Mountbatten says it(about the alleged allegiance to Crown part).

Secondly if Pakistan was not loyal to the Crown why did you accept Queen Elizabeth as Queen of Pakistan in 1952. Why was Pakistan one of only seven commonwealth countries to send an ambassador called the Standard of Pakistan on her coronation?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_participants_in_Queen_Elizabeth_II_coronation_procession#The_Standards

Why wasn't your PM Muhammad Ali Bogra simply referred as 'Mr' like PM Jawaharlal Nehru rather than 'Honorable' like the other 6 commonwealth PMs (by virtue of Pakistan being a dominion)?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_participants_in_Queen_Elizabeth_II_coronation_procession#The_Prime_Ministers_of_the_Members_of_the_Commonwealth

You are simply making this issue on who was first.....But however hard you try you cannot write away the fact that Pakistan indeed owed loyalty to the Crown till March 1956 (India too did it till Jan 1950) and not August 1947.

.

that is all procedural...this is how they transferred power ? you took loyalty oath, which Jinnah didnot... moreover you kept a British as your Governor General, which he always offered to Jinnah, but Jinnah refused it by saying it will kill the meaning of freedom for our Nation...if you dont like to accept the fact, its your choice...but the reality is you were still directly ruled by a Britisher for a year...

 

[ranja]

@Leader : Do you by any chance have original text of oaths taken by Nehru and Jinnah? or you listened to video I posted above and heard what Jinnah said?

Every State/County has a constitution according to which it is goverened. We all know that till 26th Jan 1950 India didn't have its own and it wasn't till 1956 that Pakistan got its. Untill India and Pakistan got their constitution they were being run on British India set of laws.

 

[DarK-LorD]

Sorry only Pakistanis believe in the Myth,not Indians.

 

[MINK]

.

that is all procedural...this is how they transferred power ? you took loyalty oath, which Jinnah didnot... moreover you kept a British as your Governor General, which he always offered to Jinnah, but Jinnah refused it by saying it will kill the meaning of freedom for our Nation...if you dont like to accept the fact, its your choice...but the reality is you were still directly ruled by a Britisher for a year...

Yes, India kept its loyalty to British Crown (King George VI) until 26th January 1950. From 15th August 1947 to 26th 1950 India was a dominion (By the way, many people think Dominion means slavary to British, but it's not. Canada, Australia and New Zealand are still Dominion today, yes their Queen is Elizabeth II). That means Government of India Act 1935 continued the day before India became republic. When India turned into Republic on 26th 1950 the Government of India Act 1935 was replaced by Constitution of India.

 

[Leader]

@Leader : Do you by any chance have original text of oaths taken by Nehru and Jinnah? or you listened to video I posted above and heard what Jinnah said?

Every State/County has a constitution according to which it is goverened. We all know that till 26th Jan 1950 India didn't have its own and it wasn't till 1956 that Pakistan got its. Untill India and Pakistan got their constitution they were being run on British India set of laws.

ofcourse I have read S. Mehmood has given a great detail account on it. what parts were omitted with "pen" are a reported fact . the point which all the indians are bypassing is that you still opted a British/English Governor General... he could have been chosen as a advisor he was so vital...and INC felt it cannot run the affairs of the country...

 

[ranja]

ofcourse I have read S. Mehmood has given a great detail account on it. what parts were omitted with "pen" are a reported fact . the point which all the indians are bypassing is that you still opted a British/English Governor General... he could have been chosen as a advisor he was so vital...and INC felt it cannot run the affairs of the country...

Why bypass it has been recorded that a British was Gov. gen. of India and India till 1950 was being run according to Govt. Of India Act 1935 and so was Pakistan till 1956. How was Pakistan run till 1956? wasn't it according to the same act? what laws were governing pakistan till you got constitution in place? So in other words we can say that Zahid Choudry well noted the fact that Jinnah omitted words "...so help me God" but did stay quiet about the penned omission or he dosn't have any credibility as historian? Listen to video again what Jinnah says in the first few sentences of his oath taking ceremony.

 

[mitth]

Pakistan believe the dependent...............

 

[Leader]

Why bypass it has been recorded that a British was Gov. gen. of India and India till 1950 was being run according to Govt. Of India Act 1935 and so was Pakistan till 1956. How was Pakistan run till 1956? wasn't it according to the same act? what laws were governing pakistan till you got constitution in place? So in other words we can say that Zahid Choudry well noted the fact that Jinnah omitted words "...so help me God" but did stay quiet about the penned omission or he dosn't have any credibility as historian? Listen to video again what Jinnah says in the first few sentences of his oath taking ceremony.

still laws in your country and mine are same, its same British legacy, for how long govt of india act 35 remained by its name is not the point... however what you choose on the day was to be loyal to the british crown, while Jinnah amended it. thats the whole point...and ofcourse india also choose a British governor general...

 

[gubbi]

however what you choose on the day was to be loyal to the british crown, while Jinnah amended it. thats the whole point...and ofcourse india also choose a British governor general...

And your point being?

 

[Zabaniyah]

We should have bowed to our superiors for all eternity - The British.

lol, joking

 

[IndoCarib]

And your point being?

He is here with an agenda. Somehow he wants to prove that Pakistan is more independent than India ! So lets all agree and make him happy !

 

[notsuperstitious]

Leader we chose Mountbatten as governor general because he gave us Gurudaspur, it was a conspiracy of unbelievers against Pakistan and its still going on.

We are to this day taking instructions from our former master, its true, but its OK as long as they are not bombing us daily. We as a weak palit nation have learned to survive this way, with foreign clutches, while Pakistan has earned a name in independence, sovereignty and self sufficiency by excluding a couple of words and forcing a power shunning great soul to become governor general.

We salute you.