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Myanmar receives Thunders !

On topic, may be the next time I will congratulate the program, once again, will be when Nigeria receives its jets? I will request @Arsalan to give me a shout out once again. :D

The international defense market will never be easy for any player, and hence I will continue to maintain my honest and healthy reluctance.
Hmm, ok dear. I will let you know once those are delivered. :tup:

And yes, international defense market wont be easy, its not just the product and price but the diplomacy, international relations, lobbying!! It wont be easy. We all know that much.

Anyway, will let you know once those meant for Nigeria are delivered.
 
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Mayanmar is killing rohingya muslim brothers and sister and we are providing all fire it needs
 
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Hmm, ok dear. I will let you know once those are delivered. :tup:

And yes, international defense market wont be easy, its not just the product and price but the diplomacy, international relations, lobbying!! It wont be easy. We all know that much.

Anyway, will let you know once those meant for Nigeria are delivered.

And hence, each hard-fought sales victory will be sweeter, made sweeter still for certain people at PDF by my acknowledgment of it as such. :D
 
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I have always said that Rohingyas are a Zionist plot against Sino-Pakistan, Myanmar brotherhood. Glad that Pakistan did not fall for their 'hidden hands'. Myanmar should buy at least two squadron of Thunders along with training package from PAF. Thunder makes a good platform for ground support against terrorists like Rohingya and other insurgents supported by Bangladesh. I have no idea what Bangla Airforce has but pretty sure Thunder can take them on if needed thus helping to secure Myanmar against Dhaka's evil designs.


View attachment 506589


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@Aung Zaya
Just because Burma bought few jf because they r the most suitable option doesn't make em our t friends or strategic partner
There's hell of difference between business deal and friendship or strategic partnership

BTW genocide of rohinga Muslim is real UN bodies our friend and strategic partner turkey all have rsirai grave concerns
And Burma is also under Indian influence we should be careful that they don't leak jf spec to em
 
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Just because Burma bought few jf because they r the most suitable option doesn't make em our t friends or strategic partner
I did not say they were a strategic partner.

BTW genocide of rohinga Muslim is real UN bodies our friend and strategic partner turkey all have rsirai grave concerns
Who gives a flying fcuk about them? If you do then you better prepare a long list and get ready to grill -

  • Chia over Uighur Muslims
  • Russia over Chechen Muslim genocide
  • Turks over Kurdish Muslim oppression
  • etc

And Burma is also under Indian influence we should be careful that they don't leak jf spec to em
They are under greater Chinese influence.
 
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I did not say they were a strategic partner.

Who gives a flying fcuk about them? If you do then you better prepare a long list and get ready to grill -

  • Chia over Uighur Muslims
  • Russia over Chechen Muslim genocide
  • Turks over Kurdish Muslim oppression
  • etc

They are under greater Chinese influence.

Hi,

How about the US in AFG / Iraq / Libya / Syria---? The US has killed more muslims and made more homeless than the mongols---but we still buy from them and live in the US. Why are pakistani kids and young adults so stupid all the time---.
 
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Hi,

How about the US in AFG / Iraq / Libya / Syria---? The US has killed more muslims and made more homeless than the mongols---but we still buy from them and live in the US. Why are pakistani kids and young adults so stupid all the time---.
I entirely agree with you. They don't look through the prism of nationalism but the ummah which of course is oxymoron.
 
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Within six months, blk 3 will begin extensive system and weapons testing and can be seen at CFTE repeatedly.

This is a bit of a throwback, but are you sure that it'll be at CFTE? So far, all aircraft being tested at CFTE are for PLAAF/PLAN use.
 
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This is a bit of a throwback, but are you sure that it'll be at CFTE? So far, all aircraft being tested at CFTE are for PLAAF/PLAN use.

Hint, search zdk03 at cfte, you'll find this
ZDK-03A.jpg
 
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Hint, search zdk03 at cfte, you'll find this
ZDK-03A.jpg

Good catch, but keep in mind that CFTE indicates a fairly advanced level of testing. I have my reservations about the Block III being rolled out, flight-tested, and being shipped off to CFTE for acceptance trials merely within six months of your original post.

But, as always, the CAC team has given us a few surprises in the past and this may be no exception. Time will tell.
 
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This is a bit of a throwback, but are you sure that it'll be at CFTE? So far, all aircraft being tested at CFTE are for PLAAF/PLAN use.

Since I brought this argument for the first time I think I need to correct myself ... So far, all aircraft painted with the PLAAF-symbol and being tested at CFTE are for PLAAF/PLAN use would be correct.
 
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China seeks big-ticket payback from Myanmar
Beijing is pressing to resume the controversial Myitsone dam and other stalled mega-projects in exchange for its diplomatic support of the again isolated nation
By BERTIL LINTNER CHIANG MAI, JANUARY 16, 2019 6:49 PM (UTC+8)
China-Myanmar-Xi-Jinping-Aung-San-Suu-Kyi-May-2017-960x576.jpg

China's President Xi Jinping (R) shakes hands with Myanmar's State Counselor Aung San Suu Kyi as they attend the welcome ceremony at Yanqi Lake during the Belt and Road Forum in Beijing on May 15, 2017. Photo: AFP/Pool
As China surges forward again in Myanmar, new pressure to restart a controversial dam project could represent a watershed moment for bilateral relations.

The Beijing-backed US$3.6 billion Myitsone dam project, which if built as previously designed would flood 600 square kilometers of forestland in northern Kachin state and export 90 % of the power produced to China, was suspended by Myanmar’s previous military-dominated government in September 2011.

The dailyReport

Must-reads from across Asia - directly to your inbox
In justifying the landmark decision, seen by many at the time as the beginning of a shift away from China, then Myanmar president Thein Sein said the project, “it was against the wishes of the people.”

The dam is designed to block a confluence that forms the culturally significant Irrawaddy River, the nation’s longest running from north to south. The project was previously strongly opposed by local Kachins and across the entire country.

Renewed Chinese pressure for the dam was in the news earlier this month, when The Irrawaddy news site reported that Hong Liang, the Chinese ambassador to Myanmar, had dispensed warnings and threats against local Kachin leaders during a visit to the state capital Myitkyina.

According to the report, Hong reportedly warned them against opposing the project and threatened them with “difficult consequences” if they had more frequent contacts with Western envoys and Christian church organizations.

Rendition_of_Myitsone_Dam.jpg

Artist’s rendition of the postponed Myitsone Dam project in northern Myanmar. Photo: Wikipedia
It was neither a new nor unprecedented threat. In 2016, the same Chinese ambassador urged his US counterpart in Yangon not to travel to northern Kachin State or certain parts of eastern Shan State because Washington “should respect China’s interests.”

Beijing’s interests in Myanmar are largely strategic, including as an outlet for its landlocked southwestern provinces to the Indian Ocean. A hydroelectric dam at Myitsone would provide power to Yunnan and other southern areas across the border where a proposed Myanmar-China Economic Corridor (MCEC) would feasibly begin.

The US-based Institute for Peace said in a report referring to the threat that China believes it “deserves to have predominant presence and influence in these areas, if not elsewhere in Myanmar, regardless of the wishes or interests of Myanmar, let alone the interests of other countries.”

Two years later, China is in a much stronger position to push its Myanmar-based policies and projects.

The US has imposed only limited sanctions on Myanmar’s military over its brutal “area clearance” operations against Muslim Rohingya in Rakhine state, which drove more than 700,000 people across the border into Bangladesh.

The European Union has leveled similar targeted sanctions against seven senior military, border guard and police officials accused of serious human rights violations against the Rohingya. The United Nations has said the expulsion may have had “genocidal intent.”

Myanmar-Aung-San-Suu-Kyi-Myitsone-Dam-River-2011-Facebook.jpg

Aung San Suu Kyi in front of an anti-Myitsone dam poster in 2011. Photo: Facebook
Aung San Suu Kyi, lauded as a civil rights and pro-democracy icon before she became State Counselor in 2016, has since been stripped of several of the accolades and prizes she received in the West because of her refusal to condemn the carnage against the Rohingya. That’s pushed her away from her previous backers in the West and increasingly into China’s welcoming embrace.

On December 7, 2018, she was appointed chairperson of a Myanmar government steering committee tasked with implementing the establishment of the MCEC, a venture under China’s Belt and Road Initiative (BRI).

During his meetings in Myitkyina, Chinese ambassador Hong told Kachin community leaders that Suu Kyi, once a staunch and vocal opponent of the Myitsone project, has changed her mind and that they should follow suit.

Suu Kyi has made no official announcement indicating that is her position and people close to her have said rather bluntly that any such move to resurrect the deeply unpopular project would be tantamount to “political suicide.”

That’s definitely the case among Kachin activists. Lahpai Seng Raw, a Kachin community worker and Ramon Magsaysay Award winner — which honors former Philippine President Ramon Magsaysay’s example of integrity in governance and public service — said in a recent commentary piece that the BRI is “a form of neo-colonialism, a thinly-veiled attempt at gaining dominance on the world stage.”

She argued that clear mechanisms need to be put in place for resource-sharing and evaluating the social and environmental impacts of any MCEC projects before they are implemented.

“Unless such steps are taken, the trust deficit in China-backed economic ventures will only intensify. China also stands to lose credibility as an honest mediator in the peace process” between central authorities and the country’s various ethnic armed groups, Seng Raw warned.

The lack of local consultation has backfired on China’s designs for Myitsone in the past. In 2010, the dam site was hit by several bomb blasts detonated by disgruntled locals that injured and killed Chinese workers. At the time, an estimated 300 Chinese workers were employed at the project site.

Myanmar-Myitsone-Dam-China-Protest-September-22-2011.jpg

A protest against the Myitsone dam project on September 22, 2011. Photo: Reuters/Bazuki Muhammad
But is Myanmar, now isolated again from the West, in a position to withstand Chinese pressure? China accounted for nearly 40% of Myanmar’s trade in 2017, according to World Bank figures, while Chinese official sources say between 40%-50% of foreign investment came from China, including Hong Kong and Macau.

Now, Myanmar is likely even more economically dependent on China, a reliance that has been compounded by the need for Beijing’s political and diplomatic support at the United Nations and against Western nations critical of the Rohingya issue.

China has also managed to outmaneuver other foreign interlocutors and emerge as the main broker in Myanmar’s staggering peace process, which is a major reason why Hong is opposed to Western diplomats visiting Myanmar’s war-torn north that borders on China.

Beijing clearly enjoys closer connections with the ethnic armies operating in Myanmar’s north than any of the Western-backed peacemaking outfits that have tried to influence the peace process.

China is also wielding a carrot and stick in the conflict areas. A four-month pause in fighting, announced by the Myanmar military on December 21, is widely seen as a result of Chinese pressure on the Myanmar government.

That announcement, however, has been ignored by ethnic armed groups in the area because it does not cover Rakhine state, where fighting against the rebel Arakan Army has recently intensified. During his meeting in Myitkyina in January, Hong offered to initiate negotiations between the Myanmar military and the Kachin Independence Army (KIA), which has been under attack since 2011.

Myanmar-Kachin-State-IDPs-Tanai-June-16-2017.jpg

Internally displaced people at a Christian church in Tanai township, Kachin state, June 16, 2017. Reuters/Soe Zeya Tun
An estimated 120,000 people have fled the fighting and are living in makeshift camps in KIA-controlled areas along the Chinese border or near government-administered centers such as Myitkyina and Bhamo. Refugees in KIA-controlled areas are dependent on food and medical supplies from China, which makes the Kachin rebels especially vulnerable to Chinese pressure.

At the same time, huge shipments of Chinese weapons have been moved across the border to select rebel outfits, putting even more pressure on the Myanmar government and military. The 20,000-strong United Wa State Army (UWSA) is now equipped with new, sophisticated Chinese weapons which it has shared with ethnic Kokang, Palaung, Shan and Rakhine rebels, with much smaller quantities also being given to the KIA.

Yangon-based diplomats speculate that China is now, as ever, playing a sophisticated “good cop, bad cop” routine to win concessions in Myanmar, including for the Myitsone dam.

Hong’s sharp warning stands in contrast to the approach of Sun Guoxiang, a smooth-talking Chinese diplomat who has attended several meetings with the Myanmar government’s peace commission as well as talks between the central authorities and ethnic rebels.

When Myanmar opened to the West and permitted unprecedented political freedoms in 2011-2012, the policy shift was driven by a desire of the then ruling military to mitigate its dependence on China.

That reliance had steadily grown since a brutal military crackdown on pro-democracy demonstrators in 1988, which led to the imposition of Western sanctions and boycotts, and raised concerns about sovereignty among the top brass.

Myanmar-Myitsone-Dam-China-Protest-April-5-2017.jpg

Graffiti on a stone at the confluence of the Mali and Nmai river at Myitsone, outside Myitkyina, capital city of Kachin state, Myanmar March 30, 2017. Photo: Reuters/Soe Zeya Tun To
The Rohingya crisis has restored the country’s previous pariah status after a brief period of Western engagement that saw the lifting of a previous generation of sanctions imposed for rights abuses.

That new shift, analysts say, could have devastating consequences for the country’s political future and sovereign interests. Since last year, China has strongly lobbied for new economic concessions and for previously promised projects to be swiftly implemented.

The previous Thein Sein government allowed a 2011 memorandum of understanding with China to build a high-speed railway from its southern Yunnan province to Myanmar’s Kyaukphyu port to elapse without any track laid.

Now, the project is back on the table, as are a number of smaller hydroelectric power projects Beijing aims to build. But China’s new push for the Myitsone dam represents a gamble, one that could reignite the popular anti-China movement that swept the country in 2011, and one that even Suu Kyi would be hard-pressed to stop once started.
http://www.atimes.com/article/china-seeks-big-ticket-payback-from-myanmar/

I've said it before that China is going to get what it "paid" for. The truth is consistent.
 
.
China seeks big-ticket payback from Myanmar
Beijing is pressing to resume the controversial Myitsone dam and other stalled mega-projects in exchange for its diplomatic support of the again isolated nation
By BERTIL LINTNER CHIANG MAI, JANUARY 16, 2019 6:49 PM (UTC+8)
China-Myanmar-Xi-Jinping-Aung-San-Suu-Kyi-May-2017-960x576.jpg

China's President Xi Jinping (R) shakes hands with Myanmar's State Counselor Aung San Suu Kyi as they attend the welcome ceremony at Yanqi Lake during the Belt and Road Forum in Beijing on May 15, 2017. Photo: AFP/Pool
As China surges forward again in Myanmar, new pressure to restart a controversial dam project could represent a watershed moment for bilateral relations.

The Beijing-backed US$3.6 billion Myitsone dam project, which if built as previously designed would flood 600 square kilometers of forestland in northern Kachin state and export 90 % of the power produced to China, was suspended by Myanmar’s previous military-dominated government in September 2011.

The dailyReport

Must-reads from across Asia - directly to your inbox
In justifying the landmark decision, seen by many at the time as the beginning of a shift away from China, then Myanmar president Thein Sein said the project, “it was against the wishes of the people.”

The dam is designed to block a confluence that forms the culturally significant Irrawaddy River, the nation’s longest running from north to south. The project was previously strongly opposed by local Kachins and across the entire country.

Renewed Chinese pressure for the dam was in the news earlier this month, when The Irrawaddy news site reported that Hong Liang, the Chinese ambassador to Myanmar, had dispensed warnings and threats against local Kachin leaders during a visit to the state capital Myitkyina.

According to the report, Hong reportedly warned them against opposing the project and threatened them with “difficult consequences” if they had more frequent contacts with Western envoys and Christian church organizations.

Rendition_of_Myitsone_Dam.jpg

Artist’s rendition of the postponed Myitsone Dam project in northern Myanmar. Photo: Wikipedia
It was neither a new nor unprecedented threat. In 2016, the same Chinese ambassador urged his US counterpart in Yangon not to travel to northern Kachin State or certain parts of eastern Shan State because Washington “should respect China’s interests.”

Beijing’s interests in Myanmar are largely strategic, including as an outlet for its landlocked southwestern provinces to the Indian Ocean. A hydroelectric dam at Myitsone would provide power to Yunnan and other southern areas across the border where a proposed Myanmar-China Economic Corridor (MCEC) would feasibly begin.

The US-based Institute for Peace said in a report referring to the threat that China believes it “deserves to have predominant presence and influence in these areas, if not elsewhere in Myanmar, regardless of the wishes or interests of Myanmar, let alone the interests of other countries.”

Two years later, China is in a much stronger position to push its Myanmar-based policies and projects.

The US has imposed only limited sanctions on Myanmar’s military over its brutal “area clearance” operations against Muslim Rohingya in Rakhine state, which drove more than 700,000 people across the border into Bangladesh.

The European Union has leveled similar targeted sanctions against seven senior military, border guard and police officials accused of serious human rights violations against the Rohingya. The United Nations has said the expulsion may have had “genocidal intent.”

Myanmar-Aung-San-Suu-Kyi-Myitsone-Dam-River-2011-Facebook.jpg

Aung San Suu Kyi in front of an anti-Myitsone dam poster in 2011. Photo: Facebook
Aung San Suu Kyi, lauded as a civil rights and pro-democracy icon before she became State Counselor in 2016, has since been stripped of several of the accolades and prizes she received in the West because of her refusal to condemn the carnage against the Rohingya. That’s pushed her away from her previous backers in the West and increasingly into China’s welcoming embrace.

On December 7, 2018, she was appointed chairperson of a Myanmar government steering committee tasked with implementing the establishment of the MCEC, a venture under China’s Belt and Road Initiative (BRI).

During his meetings in Myitkyina, Chinese ambassador Hong told Kachin community leaders that Suu Kyi, once a staunch and vocal opponent of the Myitsone project, has changed her mind and that they should follow suit.

Suu Kyi has made no official announcement indicating that is her position and people close to her have said rather bluntly that any such move to resurrect the deeply unpopular project would be tantamount to “political suicide.”

That’s definitely the case among Kachin activists. Lahpai Seng Raw, a Kachin community worker and Ramon Magsaysay Award winner — which honors former Philippine President Ramon Magsaysay’s example of integrity in governance and public service — said in a recent commentary piece that the BRI is “a form of neo-colonialism, a thinly-veiled attempt at gaining dominance on the world stage.”

She argued that clear mechanisms need to be put in place for resource-sharing and evaluating the social and environmental impacts of any MCEC projects before they are implemented.

“Unless such steps are taken, the trust deficit in China-backed economic ventures will only intensify. China also stands to lose credibility as an honest mediator in the peace process” between central authorities and the country’s various ethnic armed groups, Seng Raw warned.

The lack of local consultation has backfired on China’s designs for Myitsone in the past. In 2010, the dam site was hit by several bomb blasts detonated by disgruntled locals that injured and killed Chinese workers. At the time, an estimated 300 Chinese workers were employed at the project site.

Myanmar-Myitsone-Dam-China-Protest-September-22-2011.jpg

A protest against the Myitsone dam project on September 22, 2011. Photo: Reuters/Bazuki Muhammad
But is Myanmar, now isolated again from the West, in a position to withstand Chinese pressure? China accounted for nearly 40% of Myanmar’s trade in 2017, according to World Bank figures, while Chinese official sources say between 40%-50% of foreign investment came from China, including Hong Kong and Macau.

Now, Myanmar is likely even more economically dependent on China, a reliance that has been compounded by the need for Beijing’s political and diplomatic support at the United Nations and against Western nations critical of the Rohingya issue.

China has also managed to outmaneuver other foreign interlocutors and emerge as the main broker in Myanmar’s staggering peace process, which is a major reason why Hong is opposed to Western diplomats visiting Myanmar’s war-torn north that borders on China.

Beijing clearly enjoys closer connections with the ethnic armies operating in Myanmar’s north than any of the Western-backed peacemaking outfits that have tried to influence the peace process.

China is also wielding a carrot and stick in the conflict areas. A four-month pause in fighting, announced by the Myanmar military on December 21, is widely seen as a result of Chinese pressure on the Myanmar government.

That announcement, however, has been ignored by ethnic armed groups in the area because it does not cover Rakhine state, where fighting against the rebel Arakan Army has recently intensified. During his meeting in Myitkyina in January, Hong offered to initiate negotiations between the Myanmar military and the Kachin Independence Army (KIA), which has been under attack since 2011.

Myanmar-Kachin-State-IDPs-Tanai-June-16-2017.jpg

Internally displaced people at a Christian church in Tanai township, Kachin state, June 16, 2017. Reuters/Soe Zeya Tun
An estimated 120,000 people have fled the fighting and are living in makeshift camps in KIA-controlled areas along the Chinese border or near government-administered centers such as Myitkyina and Bhamo. Refugees in KIA-controlled areas are dependent on food and medical supplies from China, which makes the Kachin rebels especially vulnerable to Chinese pressure.

At the same time, huge shipments of Chinese weapons have been moved across the border to select rebel outfits, putting even more pressure on the Myanmar government and military. The 20,000-strong United Wa State Army (UWSA) is now equipped with new, sophisticated Chinese weapons which it has shared with ethnic Kokang, Palaung, Shan and Rakhine rebels, with much smaller quantities also being given to the KIA.

Yangon-based diplomats speculate that China is now, as ever, playing a sophisticated “good cop, bad cop” routine to win concessions in Myanmar, including for the Myitsone dam.

Hong’s sharp warning stands in contrast to the approach of Sun Guoxiang, a smooth-talking Chinese diplomat who has attended several meetings with the Myanmar government’s peace commission as well as talks between the central authorities and ethnic rebels.

When Myanmar opened to the West and permitted unprecedented political freedoms in 2011-2012, the policy shift was driven by a desire of the then ruling military to mitigate its dependence on China.

That reliance had steadily grown since a brutal military crackdown on pro-democracy demonstrators in 1988, which led to the imposition of Western sanctions and boycotts, and raised concerns about sovereignty among the top brass.

Myanmar-Myitsone-Dam-China-Protest-April-5-2017.jpg

Graffiti on a stone at the confluence of the Mali and Nmai river at Myitsone, outside Myitkyina, capital city of Kachin state, Myanmar March 30, 2017. Photo: Reuters/Soe Zeya Tun To
The Rohingya crisis has restored the country’s previous pariah status after a brief period of Western engagement that saw the lifting of a previous generation of sanctions imposed for rights abuses.

That new shift, analysts say, could have devastating consequences for the country’s political future and sovereign interests. Since last year, China has strongly lobbied for new economic concessions and for previously promised projects to be swiftly implemented.

The previous Thein Sein government allowed a 2011 memorandum of understanding with China to build a high-speed railway from its southern Yunnan province to Myanmar’s Kyaukphyu port to elapse without any track laid.

Now, the project is back on the table, as are a number of smaller hydroelectric power projects Beijing aims to build. But China’s new push for the Myitsone dam represents a gamble, one that could reignite the popular anti-China movement that swept the country in 2011, and one that even Suu Kyi would be hard-pressed to stop once started.
http://www.atimes.com/article/china-seeks-big-ticket-payback-from-myanmar/

I've said it before that China is going to get what it "paid" for. The truth is consistent.

I'm shocked bro!
 
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