Muslims in America, Christians in Pakistan?

[Solomon2]

"Zionist powers", that's a good one!

I think it was a joke.
Don't be so paranoid.

I'm not being paranoid here. I find it funny because while I haven't used the phrase a large part of what I'm trying to communicate to Pakistanis is that there are indeed such things as "Zionist powers" and that Pakistanis and Pakistan itself can benefit from them - they just aren't what Pakistanis think they are.

 

[SHAMK9]

These are not even 1% of the Stuff that happens to us Muslim AMericans

How come you are still in America thn? Please accept the fact that we treat our minorities like sh*t and complain when someone else does it to us.

 

[474474]

I'm not being paranoid here. I find it funny because while I haven't used the phrase a large part of what I'm trying to communicate to Pakistanis is that there are indeed such things as "Zionist powers" and that Pakistanis and Pakistan itself can benefit from them - they just aren't what Pakistanis think they are.

If we can both put our biases aside and accept each other as equal member of the human race, I don't see any reason why not.
It's amazing what Israel has accomplished, we can learn a lot from the zionist powers.

 

[ARSENAL6]

I'm not being paranoid here. I find it funny because while I haven't used the phrase a large part of what I'm trying to communicate to Pakistanis is that there are indeed such things as "Zionist powers" and that Pakistanis and Pakistan itself can benefit from them - they just aren't what Pakistanis think they are.

Zionist is gonna lie period !

 

[474474]

Zionist is gonna lie period !

hilarious.

 

[Solomon2]

@Cloakedvessel : I note your comment was heavily recommended for one so far down in the thread.

 

[Solomon2]

If we can both put our biases aside and accept each other as equal member of the human race -

First issue: Pakistanis have biases against Israel. Israelis rarely think about Pakistan at all and have little or no hard-and-fast opinions about Pakistan or Pakistanis. (I didn't go to the AIPAC meeting this year because last year people were willing to talk about Arab countries, Azerbaijan, and Iran but nobody was interested in Pakistan. So why would I go?)

It's amazing what Israel has accomplished, we can learn a lot from the zionist powers.

Second issue: Pakistanis accepting they have a lot to unlearn in order to acquire and wield "zionist powers". And at the rate unjust and unpunished violence is increasing in Pakistan, it's going to be a rough path to travel. Perhaps expat Pakistanis can lead the way?

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

I think islam is better followed in USA than in Pakistan... nough said..

 

[American Pakistani]

These are not even 1% of the Stuff that happens to us Muslim AMericans

Sir i think you are wrong...there is absoulutely no comparision between US & Pakistan. Muslims here is US live happily & there is no major case of discrimination(may be few minor incidents), on the other hand the exteremist in Pakistan are spreading their influence all over the beautiful land of Pakistan, they need to be controlled at all costs. Ignoring the facts will make our motherland Pakistan suffer more.

 

[Cloakedvessel]

@Cloakedvessel : I note your comment was heavily recommended for one so far down in the thread.

I don't know why... According to this author I was way too lenient in my dismay:

Pakistan

This guy gives even a more glooming picture in his reproof of the situation, by means of a satirical scenario:

A modest proposal

For preventing the religious minorities in Pakistan from being a burden to their country

It is a melancholy object to those, who are the champions of humanity, when they see the state of the minorities in this country. They see misery, discrimination and intolerance as non-Muslims continue to suffer at the hands of their religious identity. Mothers, instead of praying for the sustenance of their family, beg the deity to ensure their children return home alive. These children are nurtured in religious revulsion, and as they grow up, they either acquiesce to the bigotry and accept their status as second-class citizens or leave their dear native country to fight for their right to be recognised as human beings.

I think it is unanimously agreed by all sane parties that the plight of religious minorities, that has seen them being reduced to unproductive citizens, is indeed one of the greatest grievances of the country. And so anyone, who can come up with an inexpensive method of making the minorities useful and sound members of Pakistan, would deserve a statue to be erected in their name. However, my intention is not merely limited to enhancing the utility of non-Muslims in Pakistan. The idea can eventually be extrapolated to include non-Muslims all over the globe.

On my part, I have gone through every concerned scripture – divine or otherwise –throughout the past many years that I’ve mulled the issue. Many connoisseurs have come forward with their theories to answer the minority question, but every one of them, in my humble opinion, has fallen short of coming up with a well-rounded scheme to ensure that minorities become fruitful state members and in turn see their social status climb up the pecking order.

The pros and cons; the rationalities and absurdities; the economics, mathematics, geography, religion and ethics; everything has been factored into this plan that would benefit both the country as a whole and the condition of the minorities. The scheme would help Pakistan overcome many of the predicaments that it faces – namely religious extremism, energy crisis, fiscal deficit, corruption, population growth, air pollution, etc – and give the religious minorities the opportunity to finally get the acknowledgement of the Muslims.

There is likewise another great advantage in my scheme: it will prevent the suicide bombings and that horrid practice of targeted killings, which is, alas, too frequent in this country. The religious divisions and animosities would also be sorted out, which would convert this shambolic country into a hub of tranquility.

The number of souls in this Islamic republic being usually reckoned 190 million, of these I calculate around 35 million Shias, 2.1 million Christians, 1.1 million Hindus, 300,000 Ahmadis, 100,000 Baha’is and 20,000 Sikhs, Buddhists and Parsis each. Furthermore there are many atheists, agnostics and apostates in the country whose count is unknown. I calculate the total population of the minorities to be around 40 million – which is over 21 percent of the total population – from which I subtract 10 million, who can be manipulated or coerced into converting to the right kind of Islam. Of the remaining 30 million I further subtract 5 million that can be compelled to hide their religious identity and to pretend to be the right kind of Muslims. Of the 25 million that would remain, around two million can be driven out of the country for good.

There should only remain around 23 million people who would be classified as religious minority. The question therefore is: how this number can be involved in doing something constructive for the country that also results in national peace, which under the current state of affairs is absolutely impossible by every single scheme hitherto proposed? For, they can neither be employed in the clergy nor as religious teachers. They cannot be relied upon as doctors or engineers. They cannot be assigned a role in the media, politics, education, bureaucracy, law enforcing authorities, or in any other sector where they would have any sort of power or any inkling of influence over the public opinion.

Taking the average weight of a Pakistani to be around 50kg, which when multiplied by 23 million, gives us 1.150 billion kilograms (1.150 million tonnes) of human resource. Taking estimation errors into account, we should have at least 1 million tonnes of mass available.

I shall now humbly put forward my own plan, which I hope would not be liable to the least objection.

I have been assured by a very knowing Saudi physicist that a non-Muslim corpse after undergoing chemical conversion, is an invaluable source of energy. It has an energy content of around 35 megajoules (MJ)/kg, which puts it in the middle of coal (25 to 30 MJ/kg) and crude oil (42 MJ/kg) on the energy scale. And hence from 1 million tonnes of the aforementioned human resource, we can extract 35 billion MJ of energy.

An average power plant produces 1,000 megawatts or 1,000 MJ per second. 35 billion MJ of energy would give an average power plant 35,000,000 seconds (405 days) worth of power. This number is derived from merely those non-Muslims that are alive, when one factors in the graveyards, this number jumps to around 700 days (around two years) worth of power from a national power plant. This should considerably reduce power outages, and bridge the energy deficit in the country.

A truly worthy religious scholar and an expert on non-Muslims, was extremely pleased after hearing my plan. He was of the opinion that if his definition of a non-Muslim is used in this energy generation process, the sample mass would prodigiously increase, giving us up to three years worth of power. Another well-reputed personality revealed his master-plan to unveil the Ahmadis, apostates, atheists and agnostics, since these are the hardest to detect.

I am fully aware of the fact that some scrupulous people might want to censure this thesis on energy generation and tout is as slightly bordering on cruelty (although unjustly so), but they aren’t aware of the multi-pronged prosperity that the project would bring to Pakistan.

First of all the plan would reduce the population of Pakistan by at least 13 percent, and maybe more, depending on which non-Muslim classification is used. This would ensure that the resources available per person would increase. Secondly, load shedding would be curtailed. Thirdly, with the energy input increasing, the Consumer Price Index (CPI) would become favourable in the long run and inflation would decrease from the current 11 percent to around 4.5 percent. Fourthly, depending on fuel utility the rates of CNG, petrol and dollar would plummet from around Rs 90, 105 and 97 to Rs 15, 19 and 18 respectively. Fifthly, the whole talk of Kalabagh Dam and increasing work on other dams would be shelved. Sixthly, you would have religious harmony in the country since every single deviant would be flowing from the national grid in the shape of electrons. Seventhly, all forms of terrorism would be curbed since the project’s supervision requires the expertise of the likes of the Taliban who would then have to be an integral part of the government.

Many other advantages can also be enumerated, for example the project would once and for all bury the oxymoron that “secular Pakistan” is. The tiring debate on what exactly is Jinnah’s Pakistan would also be laid to rest, and of course the increase in energy sector investment would boost the economy.

I can really think of not one objection that can be raised against the scheme, unless it is raised by those that are against the well-being of this country. Everyone wants a Pakistan that is self-sufficient in its energy needs, and everyone wants a Pakistan without religious fundamentalism. Two birds, one stone and all that…

A modest proposal | Pakistan Today | Latest news | Breaking news | Pakistan News | World news | Business | Sport and Multimedia

 

[474474]

First issue: Pakistanis have biases against Israel. Israelis rarely think about Pakistan at all and have little or no hard-and-fast opinions about Pakistan or Pakistanis. (I didn't go to the AIPAC meeting this year because last year people were willing to talk about Arab countries, Azerbaijan, and Iran but nobody was interested in Pakistan. So why would I go?)

Second issue: Pakistanis accepting they have a lot to unlearn in order to acquire and wield "zionist powers". And at the rate unjust and unpunished violence is increasing in Pakistan, it's going to be a rough path to travel. Perhaps expat Pakistanis can lead the way?

I don't know about the villages or the particular communities that your media portrays, but Pakistanis (at least everyone I've met in my life) don't ever discuss Israel, but of course unlike others VERY few of the corrupted new generation would actually be against the Israeli people and want to kill them.
Also, I assume since most white people think pakistan is part of the middle east - so your opinion would be similar to what you think of 'a-rabs'.
Of course, from what I understand the main concern of zionism is aquiring a state and expanding it - it might be immoral in some ways but that's what we need so it's best if we cooperate.
NOTE: Expat pakistanis depending on where, are more exposed to propaganda websites/channels/uncontrolled extremist preachers so starting at home is better since they are more likely to have an open mind.
The **** expat Pakistanis, particularly in europe, is really embarrassing, make ruin our reputation - real pakistanis are more diverse than you can ever imagine.

I don't know why... According to this author I was way too lenient in my dismay:

Pakistan

This guy gives even a more glooming picture in his reproof of the situation, by means of a satirical scenario:

A modest proposal

For preventing the religious minorities in Pakistan from being a burden to their country

It is a melancholy object to those, who are the champions of humanity, when they see the state of the minorities in this country. They see misery, discrimination and intolerance as non-Muslims continue to suffer at the hands of their religious identity. Mothers, instead of praying for the sustenance of their family, beg the deity to ensure their children return home alive. These children are nurtured in religious revulsion, and as they grow up, they either acquiesce to the bigotry and accept their status as second-class citizens or leave their dear native country to fight for their right to be recognised as human beings.

I think it is unanimously agreed by all sane parties that the plight of religious minorities, that has seen them being reduced to unproductive citizens, is indeed one of the greatest grievances of the country. And so anyone, who can come up with an inexpensive method of making the minorities useful and sound members of Pakistan, would deserve a statue to be erected in their name. However, my intention is not merely limited to enhancing the utility of non-Muslims in Pakistan. The idea can eventually be extrapolated to include non-Muslims all over the globe.

On my part, I have gone through every concerned scripture – divine or otherwise –throughout the past many years that I’ve mulled the issue. Many connoisseurs have come forward with their theories to answer the minority question, but every one of them, in my humble opinion, has fallen short of coming up with a well-rounded scheme to ensure that minorities become fruitful state members and in turn see their social status climb up the pecking order.

The pros and cons; the rationalities and absurdities; the economics, mathematics, geography, religion and ethics; everything has been factored into this plan that would benefit both the country as a whole and the condition of the minorities. The scheme would help Pakistan overcome many of the predicaments that it faces – namely religious extremism, energy crisis, fiscal deficit, corruption, population growth, air pollution, etc – and give the religious minorities the opportunity to finally get the acknowledgement of the Muslims.

There is likewise another great advantage in my scheme: it will prevent the suicide bombings and that horrid practice of targeted killings, which is, alas, too frequent in this country. The religious divisions and animosities would also be sorted out, which would convert this shambolic country into a hub of tranquility.

The number of souls in this Islamic republic being usually reckoned 190 million, of these I calculate around 35 million Shias, 2.1 million Christians, 1.1 million Hindus, 300,000 Ahmadis, 100,000 Baha’is and 20,000 Sikhs, Buddhists and Parsis each. Furthermore there are many atheists, agnostics and apostates in the country whose count is unknown. I calculate the total population of the minorities to be around 40 million – which is over 21 percent of the total population – from which I subtract 10 million, who can be manipulated or coerced into converting to the right kind of Islam. Of the remaining 30 million I further subtract 5 million that can be compelled to hide their religious identity and to pretend to be the right kind of Muslims. Of the 25 million that would remain, around two million can be driven out of the country for good.

There should only remain around 23 million people who would be classified as religious minority. The question therefore is: how this number can be involved in doing something constructive for the country that also results in national peace, which under the current state of affairs is absolutely impossible by every single scheme hitherto proposed? For, they can neither be employed in the clergy nor as religious teachers. They cannot be relied upon as doctors or engineers. They cannot be assigned a role in the media, politics, education, bureaucracy, law enforcing authorities, or in any other sector where they would have any sort of power or any inkling of influence over the public opinion.

Taking the average weight of a Pakistani to be around 50kg, which when multiplied by 23 million, gives us 1.150 billion kilograms (1.150 million tonnes) of human resource. Taking estimation errors into account, we should have at least 1 million tonnes of mass available.

I shall now humbly put forward my own plan, which I hope would not be liable to the least objection.

I have been assured by a very knowing Saudi physicist that a non-Muslim corpse after undergoing chemical conversion, is an invaluable source of energy. It has an energy content of around 35 megajoules (MJ)/kg, which puts it in the middle of coal (25 to 30 MJ/kg) and crude oil (42 MJ/kg) on the energy scale. And hence from 1 million tonnes of the aforementioned human resource, we can extract 35 billion MJ of energy.

An average power plant produces 1,000 megawatts or 1,000 MJ per second. 35 billion MJ of energy would give an average power plant 35,000,000 seconds (405 days) worth of power. This number is derived from merely those non-Muslims that are alive, when one factors in the graveyards, this number jumps to around 700 days (around two years) worth of power from a national power plant. This should considerably reduce power outages, and bridge the energy deficit in the country.

A truly worthy religious scholar and an expert on non-Muslims, was extremely pleased after hearing my plan. He was of the opinion that if his definition of a non-Muslim is used in this energy generation process, the sample mass would prodigiously increase, giving us up to three years worth of power. Another well-reputed personality revealed his master-plan to unveil the Ahmadis, apostates, atheists and agnostics, since these are the hardest to detect.

I am fully aware of the fact that some scrupulous people might want to censure this thesis on energy generation and tout is as slightly bordering on cruelty (although unjustly so), but they aren’t aware of the multi-pronged prosperity that the project would bring to Pakistan.

First of all the plan would reduce the population of Pakistan by at least 13 percent, and maybe more, depending on which non-Muslim classification is used. This would ensure that the resources available per person would increase. Secondly, load shedding would be curtailed. Thirdly, with the energy input increasing, the Consumer Price Index (CPI) would become favourable in the long run and inflation would decrease from the current 11 percent to around 4.5 percent. Fourthly, depending on fuel utility the rates of CNG, petrol and dollar would plummet from around Rs 90, 105 and 97 to Rs 15, 19 and 18 respectively. Fifthly, the whole talk of Kalabagh Dam and increasing work on other dams would be shelved. Sixthly, you would have religious harmony in the country since every single deviant would be flowing from the national grid in the shape of electrons. Seventhly, all forms of terrorism would be curbed since the project’s supervision requires the expertise of the likes of the Taliban who would then have to be an integral part of the government.

Many other advantages can also be enumerated, for example the project would once and for all bury the oxymoron that “secular Pakistan” is. The tiring debate on what exactly is Jinnah’s Pakistan would also be laid to rest, and of course the increase in energy sector investment would boost the economy.

I can really think of not one objection that can be raised against the scheme, unless it is raised by those that are against the well-being of this country. Everyone wants a Pakistan that is self-sufficient in its energy needs, and everyone wants a Pakistan without religious fundamentalism. Two birds, one stone and all that…

A modest proposal | Pakistan Today | Latest news | Breaking news | Pakistan News | World news | Business | Sport and Multimedia

Bull*
Pakistanis can be the coolest people in the world if you only knew

Zionist is gonna lie period !

@Solomon2 you were saying something?

 

[Solomon2]

...Pakistanis (at least everyone I've met in my life) don't ever discuss Israel, but of course unlike others VERY few of the corrupted new generation would actually be against the Israeli people and want to kill them...
Of course, from what I understand the main concern of zionism is aquiring a state and expanding it -

Why, given the fact that Israel and its Jews has reverted control to Arabs of so much of the territory it purchased or acquired, do people still think "the main concern of zionism is aquiring a state and expanding it?

Zionist is gonna lie period !

@Solomon2 you were saying something?

I dunno, does A6's comment even require a response? Perhaps one of the first "Zionist powers" one acquires is better grammar and clearer communication. Certainly an improvement in reasoning skills is part of the package.

 

[474474]

Why, given the fact that Israel and its Jews has reverted control to Arabs of so much of the territory it purchased or acquired, do people still think "the main concern of zionism is aquiring a state and expanding it?

I dunno, does A6's comment even require a response? Perhaps one of the first "Zionist powers" one acquires is better grammar and clearer communication. Certainly an improvement in reasoning skills is part of the package.

He assumed that I think zionist powers are gonna lie

 

[Viper0011.]

First issue: Pakistanis have biases against Israel. Israelis rarely think about Pakistan at all and have little or no hard-and-fast opinions about Pakistan or Pakistanis. (I didn't go to the AIPAC meeting this year because last year people were willing to talk about Arab countries, Azerbaijan, and Iran but nobody was interested in Pakistan. So why would I go?)

Second issue: Pakistanis accepting they have a lot to unlearn in order to acquire and wield "zionist powers". And at the rate unjust and unpunished violence is increasing in Pakistan, it's going to be a rough path to travel. Perhaps expat Pakistanis can lead the way?

Pakistanis do have biases against Israel. Sad part is, they don't know why or can't link anything to their own internal or external safety or security. It is the Palestine brotherhood anthem that the mullah's been singing unfortunately. Interesting part is, the next door Egypt, Saudis and others are cool with Israel, whether directly or indirectly.
I think Pakistanis need to realize that they share no goal of any sort or beef with Israel. I think accepting this reality will help establishing relationships and it'll be beneficial for the Pakistanis.
Post 911, there were a ton of immigration and other cases on Muslims and specially on Pakistanis due to close proximity to Afghanistan - Taaliban, etc. Guess who came up and help fight the cases in the US courts.....? American Jewish attorneys and organizations! Speaks volumes for their ethics. Pakistanis should learn and establish good relations with everyone. Sitting inside a room and hating is very easy. Getting out there and establishing bilateral relations is a bit harder but much worthier cause!

 

[Rusty]

Pakistanis do have biases against Israel. Sad part is, they don't know why or can't link anything to their own internal or external safety or security. It is the Palestine brotherhood anthem that the mullah's been singing unfortunately. Interesting part is, the next door Egypt, Saudis and others are cool with Israel, whether directly or indirectly.
I think Pakistanis need to realize that they share no goal of any sort or beef with Israel. I think accepting this reality will help establishing relationships and it'll be beneficial for the Pakistanis.
Post 911, there were a ton of immigration and other cases on Muslims and specially on Pakistanis due to close proximity to Afghanistan - Taaliban, etc. Guess who came up and help fight the cases in the US courts.....? American Jewish attorneys and organizations! Speaks volumes for their ethics. Pakistanis should learn and establish good relations with everyone. Sitting inside a room and hating is very easy. Getting out there and establishing bilateral relations is a bit harder but much worthier cause!

We know perfectly well why dislike them. They came to Palestine on boats and committed genocide agaist the palistinians. After that, they have made life a living hell for the survivers. If any other nation treated a people like that they would be wiped off the planet, ie Nazi Germany. But because the zionists are backed by you, they can do no wrong. Also, only the governments of Egypt, Saudi, etc have accepted Isreal, the same governments your country loves to tell us are undemocratic. Do you know what that means? that means these governments don't represent their people, they represent American interests and little else.
And I think that Americans should have established diplomatic links to Nazi Germany instead of declaring war on them. After WW2 it was these very Nazi scientists who allowed America to develop jet engines, airliners, and rockets that took them to the moon.
That that sounds just as retarded as what you said.
At the end of the day, there can be no peace until there is justice. Once White Europeans and their decedents realize that non white have human rights, including the right to justice, too then the world will be a much better place.