Musharraf to resign if ex-CJ restored

[dabong1]

Creating unrest , disturbance, taking law in his hands, invoking people to turn against the President and collecting sympathy from people all around Pakistan just to hide his own mistakes and cruelity and unconstitutional acts, is a proven charge. And all this was done while ignoring the national interest of Pakistan.
Anything else you want??

so nothing concrete....just allegations and smears!

 

[dabong1]

indeed as Perceptions are stronger than reality

dabong the question of proving the charges would have been asked only if the case in this regard was carried for hearing the Superme Court.
The charges levelled against the EX-CJ were never taken for hearing in the court so technically these are still to take up for hearing by the court as per rules of law.

And one thing more if Iftilkhat Chaudhry is all so honest he should have faced the charges in the court and should prove these as false if he has no corruption then he should not be afriad of pleading his case in the same court wherein he has been prosecuting others.

The irony is that the case was not taken for hearing in the court as the so-called lawyers started violent protests.

http://www.teeth.com.pk/blog/2007/02/26/letter-to-cj-from-naeem-bokhari/
I am not perturbed by your insistence on protocol (despite my belief that the Chief Justice would rise in the eyes of everybody if he walked from his residence to the Supreme Court and hooters, police escort, flags is just fluff, not the substance of an office).

I am mildly amused at your desire to be presented a guard of honour in Peshawar. I am titillated by the appropriation of aMercedes-Benz car or is it cars, the use of the Government of the Punjab’s airplane to offer Fateha in Multan, to Sheikhupura for Fateha on a Government of the Punjab helicopter, to Hyderabad on a Government of the Sind’s plane for attending a High Court function, the huge amount spent in refurbishing the chamber and residence of the Chief Justice, the reservation for yourself of a wing in Supreme Court Judges guest house in Lahore, the permanent occupation by the Supreme Court of the official residence of the Chief Justice of Sind, who per force lives in the basement of his father’s house. As his class fellow in the Government College, Lahore, I can vouch that living in the basement will do him no harm.

I am not perturbed that Dr. Arsalaan (your son) secured 16/100 in the English paper for the Civil Services Examination, that there is a case against him in some court in Baluchistan, that from the Health Department in Baluchistan he has shifted to the Federal Investigation Agency (FIA), that he has obtained training in the Police Academy, that he reportedly drives a BMW 7-Series car, that there is a complaint against him with the National Accountability Bureau (NAB).

The charges above do sound damaging and when i first became aware of this i also thought he deserves to go.
I looked into the "I am titillated by the appropriation of aMercedes-Benz car or is it cars," line by naeem-bokhari and found out that shaukat aziz had been sending mercs to pick up the CJ so they could sweeten him up for the steel mill sale....it didnt work...after all the pomp and show they put on for the CJ he stuck to his guns on the main issues and stick to his decision to strike down the sale of Pakistan Steel Mills; another ruling in 2006 that stopped the conversion of public parks to commercial ventures; the decision to ban kite-flying as unsafe; and the forced disappearances case, in which the chief justice directed the government to find and release missing people who their relatives allege are being illegally detained by intelligence agencies.
And if the first issue is a smear then i am pretty sure the rest is also half lies and truths thrown together......classic smear campaign.

well Musharraf will go one day that is for sure so that is not the point.
The point is will Chaudhary Iftikhar IF reinstated Could be Tursted by the people of Pakistan that he will put aside his personal interest and take up cases against Zaradari and Nawaz Sharif for honest hearing ?????????/

Will he be Honest enough to take Suo Motu action over NRO which is also "illegal" will he be able to act as independent and abolish NRO??


Or will he pay back his supporters and close his eyes towards their wrongdoings ?????

I think he will treat NS and AZ the same way he did mushy......i might be wrong but...... i dont think we have that long to wait before we find out.
If i do have any criticism of the CJ it is summed up in the quote below.

Amanullah Kanrani, vice chairman of the Balochistan Bar Council, said this events was the "expected culmination of the military-judiciary nexus".

"The CJP was bound to meet such a humiliating fate given the fact that he agreed to act under a president who violated the Constitution. If the former CJP did not protest against the violation of the Constitution by Musharraf, why should one protest against his dismissal? The people of Balochistan are not bothered about this move," he said.

 

[Interceptor]

Well said. Wether people believe he is illegal or not as of right now the Supreme Court says he is the Chief Justice. We must get the terminology right. Wether people say he is illegal will be decided latter and the President of Pakistan is General(r) Pervez Musharraf. Their legality will be decided later but they are at their respective positions.

The people gave their verdick last year but musharraf triator didn't accept it so he went against the constitution of Pakistan and suspended it this is violation of the constitution and Article 6 is inforced on who ever dares so he due for a hanging.

 

[mujahideen]

The people gave their verdick last year but musharraf triator didn't accept it so he went against the constitution of Pakistan and suspended it this is violation of the constitution and Article 6 is inforced on who ever dares so he due for a hanging.

Which people are you talking about? One bad thing about our people and including myself is that we have a very short term memory. We voted for Benazir and she was removed for corruption, then we voted for Nawaz and he was removed for corruption, then again we brought in Benazir and once again she was removed on corruption charges, then again Nawaz was brought into power and for the third time in our history the military came into power because the civilian government could not handle power. And might I remind you when the military did come to power in 1999 their were celebrations in Pakistan because people were happy that the civilians had left, because even the people know what little development has happened in Pakistan has only happened during the rule of the military.
Now let us come back to the election of 2008. Once again we have voted for the same people who ruled and the only thing we got was mismanagement. But I am willing once again to forgive them, but this forgivness is pending on wether they serve the country and help to develop the country. But one thing is for sure they were corrupt, they are corrupt and always will be corrupt. And I can say this with full confidence this government is not going to last for more then 2 years, and again let me say that in the next elections President Musharraf's allies will be brought into power. So you see this is a cycle which will continue our people have a short term memory.

 

[Spring Onion]

Letter to CJ from Naeem Bokhari | Teeth Maestro
I am not perturbed by your insistence on protocol (despite my belief that the Chief Justice would rise in the eyes of everybody if he walked from his residence to the Supreme Court and hooters, police escort, flags is just fluff, not the substance of an office).

I am mildly amused at your desire to be presented a guard of honour in Peshawar. I am titillated by the appropriation of aMercedes-Benz car or is it cars, the use of the Government of the Punjab’s airplane to offer Fateha in Multan, to Sheikhupura for Fateha on a Government of the Punjab helicopter, to Hyderabad on a Government of the Sind’s plane for attending a High Court function, the huge amount spent in refurbishing the chamber and residence of the Chief Justice, the reservation for yourself of a wing in Supreme Court Judges guest house in Lahore, the permanent occupation by the Supreme Court of the official residence of the Chief Justice of Sind, who per force lives in the basement of his father’s house. As his class fellow in the Government College, Lahore, I can vouch that living in the basement will do him no harm.

I am not perturbed that Dr. Arsalaan (your son) secured 16/100 in the English paper for the Civil Services Examination, that there is a case against him in some court in Baluchistan, that from the Health Department in Baluchistan he has shifted to the Federal Investigation Agency (FIA), that he has obtained training in the Police Academy, that he reportedly drives a BMW 7-Series car, that there is a complaint against him with the National Accountability Bureau (NAB).

The charges above do sound damaging and when i first became aware of this i also thought he deserves to go.
I looked into the "I am titillated by the appropriation of aMercedes-Benz car or is it cars," line by naeem-bokhari and found out that shaukat aziz had been sending mercs to pick up the CJ so they could sweeten him up for the steel mill sale....it didnt work...after all the pomp and show they put on for the CJ he stuck to his guns on the main issues and stick to his decision to strike down the sale of Pakistan Steel Mills; another ruling in 2006 that stopped the conversion of public parks to commercial ventures; the decision to ban kite-flying as unsafe; and the forced disappearances case, in which the chief justice directed the government to find and release missing people who their relatives allege are being illegally detained by intelligence agencies.
And if the first issue is a smear then i am pretty sure the rest is also half lies and truths thrown together......classic smear campaign.

debong the question of if these charges are wrong or write could only be raised in the court and the final verdict on the nature of these if CJ is guilty or innocent can only be proved after the case is taken up for hearing in Court.

The case about the charges against him is never taken up for such hearing hence we can not say if these charges whatever their nature is wrong or right.

Anyone can go the court against anyone. It is only at the conclusion of the hearing in any case that who was right if the respondent or the defendent.

Under the Constitution the president can file references against the CJ hence protesting over this right is not at all justified.

[I think he will treat NS and AZ the same way he did mushy......i might be wrong but...... i dont think we have that long to wait before we find out.
If i do have any criticism of the CJ it is summed up in the quote below.

Amanullah Kanrani, vice chairman of the Balochistan Bar Council, said this events was the "expected culmination of the military-judiciary nexus".

"The CJP was bound to meet such a humiliating fate given the fact that he agreed to act under a president who violated the Constitution. If the former CJP did not protest against the violation of the Constitution by Musharraf, why should one protest against his dismissal? The people of Balochistan are not bothered about this move," he said.

Time will tell if Chudhary Iftikhar after reinstatment will carry his duties as a judge even if he has to take action the sitting PM. But this is the big Question mark, as will he be doing so or not.
For that we had to wait hence as you said one can only think that he might do so.

About the last part of your post well that is the main point Chaudhry Iftikhar did approved the first PCO and he did take oath under the PCO earlier.

SO at latter stage he is considred by many as carrying his own personal grudge.

 

[araz]

Creating unrest , disturbance, taking law in his hands, invoking people to turn against the President and collecting sympathy from people all around Pakistan just to hide his own mistakes and cruelity and unconstitutional acts, is a proven charge. And all this was done while ignoring the national interest of Pakistan.
Anything else you want??

My friend
I dont think you could prove this in a court of Law. The problem with this whole fiasco is that it has been made a battle of Musharraf v/s CJ. Nobody has gone above personalities and asked the 2 questions which would have at least taken the thought process in the right direction.
a) was Musharrafs second appointment legal according to the constitution
b) All the issues that the CJ took suo motto notice of, were they within his jurisdiction to do so or not?
If you think logically the story will unfold and the person in the wrong will come out in the open in no time at all.
In this issue as in all , we have all been guilty of thinking with our hearts rather than our minds and that is why there are conflicting views.
WaSalam
Araz

 

[Always Neutral]

I would feel bad for the Gen M to go in such a way. Whats done by him is done ( and I personally feel the General should have retired 6 months ago) however now its time for re-conciliation Nelson Mendala stye for the betterment of Pakistan.

Regards

 

[relent8]

My friend
I dont think you could prove this in a court of Law. The problem with this whole fiasco is that it has been made a battle of Musharraf v/s CJ. Nobody has gone above personalities and asked the 2 questions which would have at least taken the thought process in the right direction.
a) was Musharrafs second appointment legal according to the constitution
b) All the issues that the CJ took suo motto notice of, were they within his jurisdiction to do so or not?
If you think logically the story will unfold and the person in the wrong will come out in the open in no time at all.
In this issue as in all , we have all been guilty of thinking with our hearts rather than our minds and that is why there are conflicting views.
WaSalam
Araz

No Araz, what i wanted to say was that if a CJ does all these things after whatever rite or wrong things which happened to him, then atleast MY thoughts would certainly shift in favour of the other man.
I m not saying that he should be caught on these things i said above, but after watching him do these actions, it becomes clear atleast in my mind as to where is right and where wrong. Just shoes his intentions and character.

If something unjust happened with him, then he should have fought his war in the courts/(or in lawful manner), not like coming out on streets and propagandizing and politicising matters. He is the CJ, not any common person.

As far as your metioning above is

Your two points can only be talked about when people like Aitezaz Ahsan, NS, stop propagandizing everything just because they dont like Mr.Musharraf or because they have their own personal agendas.And this is very important for them to stop. Why ?? Because our people have not matured upto the stage where they can understand and judge any matter as a civilised naiton. i.e it is very easy to brainwash them, which NS and co. are continuously doing. And if you do something against their self-interested and country damaging rallies and protests, then our people think it is against constitution, when in reality it is not agianst consitution to beat-up the law breakers and the ones who are creating unneccessary disturbances which are giving nation a bad name and image.

 

[mujahideen]

Restored judges can reopen uniform case

Assad Hameed

ISLAMABAD - Former Chief Justice Saeeduz Zaman Siddiqui has said that the deposed judges of apex court can resurrect the case against the qualification of Pervez Musharraf to run for presidency despite wearing military uniform once the new Parliament restores them.
The deposed judges have absolute power to reopen the case of Musharraf’s candidature, which they were hearing when the whole judiciary was bundled away on November 3, 2007, after restoration, Justice Siddiqui said while talking to TheNation here on Tuesday.
When asked about the judgement that was given by present judges which legitimised Musharraf’s candidature for contesting presidential elections in October last, Siddiqui said the ruling would become automatically null and void once the steps under emergency rule are undone by the future Parliament.
He also pointed out that Pakistan People’s Party (PPP) leader Amin Fahim, after events of November 3, withdrew one of petitions questioning candidature of Pervez Musharraf, while the other, filed by Justice (Retd) Wajihud Din Ahmed, was dismissed by default.
Thus, the apex court can resurrect the plea against military uniform of Pervez Musharraf while contesting the presidential polls.
Replying to a query regarding the fate of present judges, Siddiqui said the appointments of present judges after November 3 can be examined in view of Judges Case (Al-Jihad Trust Case).
“A similar situation arose in 1996 when the cases of 28 judges of High Courts were reopened after the Judges Case and the appointments found in accordance with the Constitution were retained while the rest were seen off,” he pointed out.
Referring to judgement of apex court in Asma Jilani’s Case (Supreme Court, 1972 Page 139), Siddiqui said a full court of the apex court headed by Justice Hamoodur Rehman upheld that the Supreme Court was fully competent to strike down any act of usurper, which was found to be taken outside the Constitution of Pakistan.
All acts of Pervez Musharraf in the wake of November 3, 2007 were extra constitutional and illegitimate, Siddiqui observed. Even the rulings of apex courts in Nusrat Bhutto Case (SC 1979) and Syed Zafar Ali Shah (SC 2000) have also validated the observation of apex court in Asma Jilani’s Case which fully holds its ground even till today.
Born on December 1, 1973, Justice (Retd) Saeeduz Zaman Siddiqui left his office on January 25, 2000 shortly after the military takeover of General Pervez Musharraf when the latter asked top judiciary to take oath under Provisional Constitutional Order.
Except a small group of judges, rest of the judiciary, including deposed Chief Justice Iftikhar Muhammad Ch, had preferred to take oath under the PCO of the then General Musharraf.

The Nation

 

[araz]

No Araz, what i wanted to say was that if a CJ does all these things after whatever rite or wrong things which happened to him, then atleast MY thoughts would certainly shift in favour of the other man.
I m not saying that he should be caught on these things i said above, but after watching him do these actions, it becomes clear atleast in my mind as to where is right and where wrong. Just shoes his intentions and character.

If something unjust happened with him, then he should have fought his war in the courts/(or in lawful manner), not like coming out on streets and propagandizing and politicising matters. He is the CJ, not any common person.

As far as your metioning above is

Your two points can only be talked about when people like Aitezaz Ahsan, NS, stop propagandizing everything just because they dont like Mr.Musharraf or because they have their own personal agendas.And this is very important for them to stop. Why ?? Because our people have not matured upto the stage where they can understand and judge any matter as a civilised naiton. i.e it is very easy to brainwash them, which NS and co. are continuously doing. And if you do something against their self-interested and country damaging rallies and protests, then our people think it is against constitution, when in reality it is not agianst consitution to beat-up the law breakers and the ones who are creating unneccessary disturbances which are giving nation a bad name and image.

My Bother.
Iunderstand what you are saying. i am not asking for the masses to judge this issue. it is for you to judge and determine. I would caution you to use logic and not your heart and give me a straight answer that you think is right. It will solve the problem.
wasalam
Araz

 

[Spring Onion]

My friend
I dont think you could prove this in a court of Law. The problem with this whole fiasco is that it has been made a battle of Musharraf v/s CJ. Nobody has gone above personalities and asked the 2 questions which would have at least taken the thought process in the right direction.
a) was Musharrafs second appointment legal according to the constitution
b) All the issues that the CJ took suo motto notice of, were they within his jurisdiction to do so or not?
If you think logically the story will unfold and the person in the wrong will come out in the open in no time at all.
In this issue as in all , we have all been guilty of thinking with our hearts rather than our minds and that is why there are conflicting views.
WaSalam
Araz

Sir i feel that somehow Chaudhry Iftikhar and others were made scap goats by many players including the politicians and the outside powers.
I feel sorry that as you said the issue was not taken for handling on logics and facts.

I wonder why on earth the lawyers did not take the right path despite being legal community that knows the rules and laws.

According to law the President can send references if forwarded by the Prime Misnister against the sitting chief justic. Thats what Musharraf did.

Now the only question which arised was that if all those charges true or wrong.

And to find answer to that the lawyers should have taken the case to court for hearing.

That is never done and the lawyers instead of taking the legal path for fighting the case resorted to politicising it at the behest of political parties.

 

[solid snake]

I would feel bad for the Gen M to go in such a way. Whats done by him is done ( and I personally feel the General should have retired 6 months ago) however now its time for re-conciliation Nelson Mendala stye for the betterment of Pakistan.

Regards

Do you really think Nawaz Sharif wants reconciliation? He is hell-bent upon restoring the judges not because he gives a crap about the judiciary, but because he wants revenge on Mushy for ousting him in a humiliating fashion and then putting him under life in prison. I don't understand why Mushy commuted his sentence, it was the biggest mistake.

This bastard ganja should have rotted in jail forever and today we wouldn't have this problem.

This guy is a dangerous lunatic terrorist sympathizer. He met with Osama Bin Laden many times in the 90s who tried to convince him to topple the PPP government.

He is only after Mushy's head and he will not rest until Mushy is gone. His main wish is to see Mushy behind bars.

 

[Spring Onion]

Do you really think Nawaz Sharif wants reconciliation? He is hell-bent upon restoring the judges not because he gives a crap about the judiciary, but because he wants revenge on Mushy for ousting him in a humiliating fashion and then putting him under life in prison. I don't understand why Mushy commuted his sentence, it was the biggest mistake.

This bastard ganja should have rotted in jail forever and today we wouldn't have this problem.

This guy is a dangerous lunatic terrorist sympathizer. He met with Osama Bin Laden many times in the 90s who tried to convince him to topple the PPP government.

He is only after Mushy's head and he will not rest until Mushy is gone. His main wish is to see Mushy behind bars.

100% agree with you.

Intrestingly he is cleaning his backyard at the cost of PPP.
Nawaz was the one who was involved in attacking Supreme Court.

Plus he is keen to reinstate the judges beacuse only they can reverse the verdict about his Ineligibility to take part in election.

Thus if they reverse it it will enable Nawaz to contest byelection and come to the Parliament.

 

[mujahideen]

100% agree with you.
Intrestingly he is cleaning his backyard at the cost of PPP.
Nawaz was the one who was involved in attacking Supreme Court.
Plus he is keen to reinstate the judges beacuse only they can reverse the verdict about his Ineligibility to take part in election.
Thus if they reverse it it will enable Nawaz to contest byelection and come to the Parliament.

I think right now the two diseases we have in our politics are the Sharif's and Mr.10%. If the PPP is smart they will reject Zadari as their leader and and also not form a coalition with the PML-N and if the PML-N is smart they will admit to their past mistakes.

 

[Lahori paa jee]

The kind of power hunger person Mush is he would not resign. But the time demands that he leaves the office for good and let the elected people govern the country their way. This point has been proved in the recent elections and an absolute defeat for the Mushy's Q League.

If he has some honour and respect he would resign soon before the reinstatement of the deposed CJ.

I feel the CJ after he is restored and proved his innocence should also resign