Musharraf ka ab kiya banay gaa?

[Awesome]

Yaar its obvious you are following the party line on this issue. The truth now is that with the killing of Nawab Bugti, this thing is now beyond recovery. He was the only Sardar willing to talk to these thugs in Islamabad. The other two big ones (marri/ Mengal) don't want anything to do with paksitan. Also by kiling an 80 year old man with 20 of his followers, these cowards have made a martyr of him in our eyes. Asim yaar in all honesty the way things have been going on in balochistan there is really no way out for us except to continue the struggle. Either we do it, or we get swamped. Here is a new article from our website; Baloch Voice and my website Balochunity:

Man BalochUnity... I used to run urbanpakistan.com remember? Idiots had that DDoSed because it carried several articles about development in Balochistan and expose's by Balochis into the life of Bugtis and the Marris.

I received several death threats to me and my family. They were all like "How dare you people say anything against our Sardar. He has told us what you people are like". That's what they are like.

I was in Dubai, so I was like what'd they do to me anyway. Lol, a little while later Marri's son and some of his friends got arrested in Dubai at the request of the Pakistani government and I'm like "oookay gulp" . Point is, to do things at gun point is THEIR style. Their style for decades now.

Killing Bugti was good because he was their main point man. The most militant of all Sardars. Marri, Mengal gave up, Bugti did not and if they won't I'd want to see them shot as well. Point is we don't want to talk to Sardars. Who are they? The rest of the Pakistan is working towards kicking out feudal lords from politics even though they are members of the parliament. I don't like the top brass of any of the PMLs. I would definitely not have any respect nor want to give any respect to feudal lords of Balochistan.

Balochistani Sardars have nullified the value of the Balochi. Keep Sardars happy and Balochistan is happy, upset them and Balochistan is supposedly unhappy. Who are they that we should treat them as superior beings?

Ek ek Sardar k sar pe goli maarke distribute their wealth amongst the Balochis.

The only way out is not an armed resistence. When NS and BB were there, at that time no one did anything. Because they spoke the Pakistani national language of "Ghooss" and showered a ton of Quaid-e-Azam ki naiki (for people who didn't get it, I was talking about bribes) onto the Sardars. Baloch were getting a lot less. Gwadar issue was being discussed for 10 years without any result. But Baloch were happy then? No independence calls, no nothing.

The only way out is for the Baloch to give up their tribal culture. They don't have a "mai-baap" to look upto. They should be empowered. The Sardars have forcibly kept the Baloch literacy rate sooooooo down that they won't get these things. Every other person bears heavy duty arms. Kids are handed guns and its considered a matter of pride that they know how to use an AK-47. Is this right? Our kids yearn for video games, movies, the latest Superman/Spiderman toys, why should it be different for the Baloch kids?

Right from childhood if you feed hatred crap that the Pakistani state is the enemy and the Sardars are your Gods then naturally what's obvious to us would be insane to them. On the BU forums it was like "Haw hai, Sardar ji ko kuch kehdia? Ab toh nahi choroonga"

 

[sparten]

Baloch middle class? Thats a joke. I go to Balochistan almost every couple of months and the only middle class that place has is either in Pakhtun areas or in mor developed places like Hub. Which are anti-Menghal and the rest.

 

[Awesome]

What about other regions? The poor?

 

[sparten]

Look besides the Pashtun areas there are only two places where you have development. One is near the Indus river especially after the 1990 water accord where the Punjab agreed to give up its share of the indus water. The other is basically near the Delta, in Hub, which is now a bigger industrial town than ever Gujrawala.

Else, its sparsely populated and nomadic and poor. I doubt our local nationalist has ever set eyes on it.
People are friendly.

 

[Neo]

Look besides the baloch areas there are only two places where you have development. One is near the Indus river especially after the 1990 water accord where the Punjab agreed to give up its share of the indus water. The other is basically near the Delta, in Hub, which is now a bigger industrial town than ever Gujrawala.

Else, its sparsely populated and nomadic and poor. I doubt our local nationalist has ever set eyes on it.
People are friendly.

There are several towns with potential to become industrial hubs; Bela, Khuzdar, Turbat and Pasni and Sonmiani are already being developped.
We'll be looking at a totally different picture within a decade. :flag:

 

[sparten]

Sonmiani is now a naval base IIRC. So thats well on the development index.

 

[Contrarian]

you know, inspite of everything, musharraf is the best man for the job, he has improved pakistan a hell of a lot, things are obviously better than they were before.
i sincerely hope to god, that the kashmir issue can be solved by both the countries accepting ground reality...

Some people say that indian kashmir should be an independent nation....have any of these people thought how a nation like kashmir would SURVIVE?? no industries to speak of, no forex, how would they live, abject poverty, with only wood and other natural resources to export...no sir, they are far better off in india where they get lot of money for development.Atleast they are far better than what they would be otherwise...

The gound reality being that the status quo will remain FOREVER. The LoC should be converted to an IB, and life should go on...the religious leaders in Pakistan should accept the fact that pakistan will never get the whole of kashmir, and pakistan can never take it militarily from India. Same should go for some of the political parties here...who believe that the entire kashmir should come in India...India cannot take kashmir forcibly because of international pressure and the possible casualties of war. The best thing is to settle it the way it is and try to develop both the countries.

 

[sparten]

Not mention nukes.

 

[lulldapull]

you know, inspite of everything, musharraf is the best man for the job, he has improved pakistan a hell of a lot, things are obviously better than they were before.
i sincerely hope to god, that the kashmir issue can be solved by both the countries accepting ground reality...

Some people say that indian kashmir should be an independent nation....have any of these people thought how a nation like kashmir would SURVIVE?? no industries to speak of, no forex, how would they live, abject poverty, with only wood and other natural resources to export...no sir, they are far better off in india where they get lot of money for development.Atleast they are far better than what they would be otherwise...

The gound reality being that the status quo will remain FOREVER. The LoC should be converted to an IB, and life should go on...the religious leaders in Pakistan should accept the fact that pakistan will never get the whole of kashmir, and pakistan can never take it militarily from India. Same should go for some of the political parties here...who believe that the entire kashmir should come in India...India cannot take kashmir forcibly because of international pressure and the possible casualties of war. The best thing is to settle it the way it is and try to develop both the countries.

Musharraf Dunya ka sub say barra chamcha hae.

He takes his orders from the White House, virtually a proxy for the West. A good analogy for him would be these other bekaar muslim leaders like Hasan's and Mobarak's of jordan and Egypt.....Totally worthless and sold out.

Yesterday he was fighting for his "enlightened moderate" islam indoctrinated by Uncle Sam....Aur aaj saala "Taliban say maafian maang raha hae"....one day moderate chamcha...next day withdrawn chamcha, and then backtracking on everything. Typical wishy washy spineless leader of Pakistan. He is in denial about the nature of his own ppl, and actually believed for a brief bit that he can make a difference (under the gun)..although privately it might have been a different Musharraf.

From the looks of it....his failed policies and utter failure in Waziristan, and failing to implement the 'writ of the Neo-cons' look like the signs of him throwing in the towel and might have prompted him to retire early. Hence that stupid and embarrassing book. Now some other jahil and yet again uninvited jarnail hand picked by the well entrenched CIA apparatus might be called upon to hold the wheel. He has zero credibility INMO.

 

[lulldapull]

Baloch middle class? Thats a joke. I go to Balochistan almost every couple of months and the only middle class that place has is either in Pakhtun areas or in mor developed places like Hub. Which are anti-Menghal and the rest.

The ones that are Anti mengal/ Magsi/ Marri are small communities on the dole from the ISI. In all honesty the Baloch have a lot of legroom in afghanistan, and freely operate from their bases deep in Helmand, Ghazni and Loghman. Lots of money and weapons are flowing in from India and the NA....The whole 9 yards, including IED's and remote mines, shaped charge technology from Afghanistan. Musharraf sahb better tread carefully or he'll lose another of his provinces to his policies of hate, distrust, and sheer arrogance.. And with the defeat of pakistani forces in Waziristan and Bajaur agencies, these troops have now moved into Kohlu areas. The Baloch have been considering alliances with these militants to evict Pakistani soldiers from Baloch areas.

 

[sparten]

You really need to get yourself educated on the Baloch problem. There are two districts where there is a problem, Kohlu and Dera Bugti, which is now quiet.

And "technology from Afganistan" is a joke. IED and remote mines will be a problem not a anything else. And anyhow we have jammers that make these things obsolete.

ANd like I said before Hub and most of the areas near the Indus river are anti-Secession. Hub is an industrial city which feels a greater affinity for Karachi than it dose for Marri and his jokers. The ones on the Indus have greater affinity for the Punjab. You have clearly never been to Balochistan.

 

[bobloblaw]

No matter how much one dislikes Musharraf or Zia ( all readers of the forum know that I disliked Zia Ul Haq immensely), I would never use the words '******' or '******'.

Regardsless of of how bad they are/were, both of them are/were Presidents of Pakistan. I feel by using such words, one is showing the kind of disrespect for one's President which is unbecoming of a Pakistani.

Out of all the people in this thread, this guy made the most sense...

 

[Keysersoze]

I Don't know much about the Balochi situation (other than mainstream organisations such as the BBC) However I must say that Lulladapull. lost the arguement, when he degenerated his point into name calling from his first post.

Oh and I would like to make a point. You may make the point about how hard it is gonna be for the Pakistani army. If you care so much for Balochistan. I suggest you worry about the innocents who will invariably be caught up in the resulting mess, before you spout off about such matters.

From a slightly different perspective Any society that relies on tribal leaders is never gonna get as much progression.