More Helos For PA.

[Windjammer]

US provides new helicopters to Pak’s army
ISLAMABAD, (SANA): The United States government announced that it will provide two Bell 412 EP helicopters to assist the Pakistan military in its counterinsurgency efforts.

The U.S. will purchase the two enhanced-performance utility transport helicopters, valued at $24 million, to support Pakistan’s counterinsurgency operations. The U.S. will also provide $20 million in associated spare parts, special tools and other equipment to support the aircraft.

During the last three years, U.S. civilian and security assistance to Pakistan has totaled more than $4 billion. Assistance has included support for medical aid, school refurbishment, bridge and well reconstruction, food distribution, agricultural and education projects.

Specific security assistance includes 14 F-16 fighter aircraft, 10 Mi-17 helicopters, more than 450 vehicles for Pakistan’s Frontier Corps, hundreds of night vision goggles, day/night scopes, radios, and thousands of protective vests and first-aid items for Pakistan’s security forces.

The U.S. also provided training for more than 370 Pakistani military officers in a wide range of leadership and development programs covering topics such as counterterrorism, intelligence, logistics, medical, flight safety, and military law.

US provides new helicopters to Pak?s army

 

[razgriz19]

US provides new helicopters to Pak’s army
ISLAMABAD, (SANA): The United States government announced that it will provide two Bell 412 EP helicopters to assist the Pakistan military in its counterinsurgency efforts.

The U.S. will purchase the two enhanced-performance utility transport helicopters, valued at $24 million, to support Pakistan’s counterinsurgency operations. The U.S. will also provide $20 million in associated spare parts, special tools and other equipment to support the aircraft.

During the last three years, U.S. civilian and security assistance to Pakistan has totaled more than $4 billion. Assistance has included support for medical aid, school refurbishment, bridge and well reconstruction, food distribution, agricultural and education projects.

Specific security assistance includes 14 F-16 fighter aircraft, 10 Mi-17 helicopters, more than 450 vehicles for Pakistan’s Frontier Corps, hundreds of night vision goggles, day/night scopes, radios, and thousands of protective vests and first-aid items for Pakistan’s security forces.

The U.S. also provided training for more than 370 Pakistani military officers in a wide range of leadership and development programs covering topics such as counterterrorism, intelligence, logistics, medical, flight safety, and military law.

US provides new helicopters to Pak?s army

i think they will be armed, because i heard somewhere that US would arm bell 412 to fill the gap untill new gunships will arrive...
but im not very sure, any senior members' words would be great

 

[Windjammer]

i think they will be armed, because i heard somewhere that US would arm bell 412 to fill the gap untill new gunships will arrive...
but im not very sure, any senior members' words would be great

If you check the video from 3.00, you will see that Pakistan Army has armed it's 412s with a couple of MG-3 Machine Guns for suppression fire.

 

[TaimiKhan]

Some of the PA 412s have gotten crew served Gatling guns installed in place of the MG3, which are gonna make them one hell of a fire support platform.

 

[Windjammer]

Some of the PA 412s have gotten crew served Gatling guns installed in place of the MG3, which are gonna make them one hell of a fire support platform.

Indeed TK, footage of such weapon on PA Helos does exist.
I think this is the weapon in question.

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

Now thts wat we call arse kicking power.

 

[Blackpearl]

Some of the PA 412s have gotten crew served Gatling guns installed in place of the MG3, which are gonna make them one hell of a fire support platform.

No Gatling/M134 is fitted to any Bell 412 helos. yes there are some Gatling guns fitted with Ministry of Interior Helos (UH-1H), provided to Ministry under a special aid programme by USA.

 

[Blackpearl]

in my opinion, Gatling/M134 7.62mm gun is not a fire support gun, when installed on the doors. a helicopter cannot provide fire support until the weapon is bore sighted to pilot's line of sight, and pilot has some sort of magnification telescope to see things real far, considering 7.62 x 51 cartridge trajectory, it remains reasonably flat uptil 1500 meters max.
so what is the purpose of door mounted guns. their actual purpose is to provide suppressive fire, upto 500 meters range (this range a human eye may see and distinguish between targets), when utility helos like Bell412/UH-1H is comming to land or taking off to dropoff troops, or taking a medevac. so primarily the weapon is for the security of the ship itself, when it is in hot LZ.
The video above is impressive, but helo is doing some sort of picnic, fun shooting. Try doing this with doors open and flying 500 feet above ground level, in Orakzai agency. we have already lost a cobra due to ground fire (RPG-7/12.7mm).

In the video an MH-6/MD-500 helo was shown with Gatling fixed, boresighted with nose of ship. that may provide some suppresive fire in front, while helo remains at a safe distance.

 

[fatman17]

^in the PAA update thread, its states that al-least 25 Bell 412's in the armed reconn role are to be provided to the PA as a 'stop-gap' measure until the AH-1Z's are made available.

further new Mi-17s (at last 10 examples) are in the process of delivery (source:AFM-April).

 

[Super Falcon]

wellll it is nothing they are giving to pakistan what have pakistan done for them old bell helicopters if i had been COAS i have asked them keep them we dont need rusted stufff and only 2 i thought they are giving 10 to 20 cobras brand new

 

[TaimiKhan]

No Gatling/M134 is fitted to any Bell 412 helos. yes there are some Gatling guns fitted with Ministry of Interior Helos (UH-1H), provided to Ministry under a special aid programme by USA.

Buddy, if you look at some of the video clips of the operation, you will clearly see the Gatling guns mounted at the door of 412s and manned by Pakistan Army soldiers and not by some interior ministry people.

This has not only been confirmed by the video clips but people with inside knowledge have also confirmed it. As the MG3s don't provide enough fire support.

 

[TaimiKhan]

in my opinion, Gatling/M134 7.62mm gun is not a fire support gun, when installed on the doors. a helicopter cannot provide fire support until the weapon is bore sighted to pilot's line of sight, and pilot has some sort of magnification telescope to see things real far, considering 7.62 x 51 cartridge trajectory, it remains reasonably flat uptil 1500 meters max.
so what is the purpose of door mounted guns. their actual purpose is to provide suppressive fire, upto 500 meters range (this range a human eye may see and distinguish between targets), when utility helos like Bell412/UH-1H is comming to land or taking off to dropoff troops, or taking a medevac. so primarily the weapon is for the security of the ship itself, when it is in hot LZ.
The video above is impressive, but helo is doing some sort of picnic, fun shooting. Try doing this with doors open and flying 500 feet above ground level, in Orakzai agency. we have already lost a cobra due to ground fire (RPG-7/12.7mm).

In the video an MH-6/MD-500 helo was shown with Gatling fixed, boresighted with nose of ship. that may provide some suppresive fire in front, while helo remains at a safe distance.

The Gatling gun even with 7.62 round can provide very deadly fire support to troops moving into specific areas, to convoys or even can do some kind of assault on a specified position.

rather the door mounted gunner can bring more devastation under his area of observation, even if its at 1000 meters, as from air the view is pretty clear compared to the ground. The pilots can keep the aircraft flying and evade any incoming fire, while the gunner with help from ground spotters work perfectly and bring its firepower on the intended targets. If used with ground troops moving on some village or mountainous location, such manned guns can give them perfect cover and engage enemy which it can see moving around, or even troops can fire color grenades at the intended targets and the heli can be asked to bring its fire at the area of the smoke, just like what we see in movies. And if the Gatling guns fire power is increased to 12.7 caliber, just image what it is gonna do to its target.

The helicopter can hover at a same distance and when required to attack, can come down to 1000 or 1500 meters, and do its part and then go up again to safe height.

Such platforms can be used perfectly at night time operations, where we have the advantage of seeing at night, equip the gunner with night vision glasses with limited magnifying capability and see what wonders it will provide to the ground forces. Even the gunner can be provided telescopic sights with the helmet and he can identify targets and target them.

This kind of platform can take more ammo compared to a Cobra's Gatling ammo capacity and be with troops for a long period of time due to more ammo capacity and engage targets for a longer period of time, compared to a Cobra.

And if such platform is to be seriously considered, then proper protection to the gunner and the pilots and the aircraft can be arranged. Bullet proof glass to resist minimum 12.7mm rounds, armor plating to resist 12.7mm rounds and other stuff like that.

Rather such platforms combined with Cobra can be a deadly combination.

If utilized properly, this platform can be one hell of a nightmare for the militants, and we can keep the Cobra's for critical missions.

 

[Super Falcon]

americans are giving uselesss stuffff and in small numbers

 

[Blackpearl]

Indeed TK, footage of such weapon on PA Helos does exist.
I think this is the weapon in question.

It seems to be a portable version of 7.62 Gatling. one can see the shoulder straps with magazine box and a carrying handle over barrel cluster. Practically, its not possible to make it man portable as the gun requires en external drive system (DC motor), to complete it firing cycle. however, such guns are suited for helos as a mechanism of external drive exists, from aircraft electrical system.

 

[shining eyes]

The U.S. also provided training for more than 370 Pakistani military officers in a wide range of leadership and development programs covering topics such as counterterrorism, intelligence, logistics, medical, flight safety, and military law.

i dont think its a very good thing........
OUR ARMY is already doing better work than them against terrorism....
am i very wrong? wont they try to espoinage through weaklinks??