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MiG-23MF still easily prevails over most of the PAF

thanks mate for sharing such a nice experience

well mig planes have whole heartedly serve our airforce for a very long time .Really i salute to their service for IAF.
Glad you liked it.
Yup, they did.


Top man on the totem pole


Shoulder patch of No. 14 Squadron The remaining three kills were all claimed by Flight Lieutenant Khalid mahmood, who in the space of just over seven weeks, established himself as 'top man on the totem pole' when it came to the F-16 community. There is every possiblity that he could have surpassed Squadron Leader Mohammad Mahmood Alam's celebrated 1965 feat of destroying five aircraft in a single sortie. Khalid's first success came on:

September 12th, 1988

Khalid recieved an order to scramble from the ADA facility at Kamra at 0700 hours. On getting airborne, Khalid ( who was flying as lead in F-16A 85-728) and his wingman were directed by GCI to head a north-west towards the border in the vicinity of Nawagai. As they moved towards the designated area, word was passed by GCI that radar revealed the presence of a pair of hostile aircraft at around 32,000 ft on a heading og 90 degrees and behaving in such a way that a voilation appeared likely. To head off this threat, the two F-16s were vectored almost north on a heading of 330 degrees, only to learn that the radar contacts had also turned on to a northernly course and were now flying parallel to the border but remaining inside Afghanistan. At this point, the the F-16s swung right to an easterly heading and 'shackled' (performed a cross-over manoeuvre). Within a few moments of taking up this new course, GCI reported three more enemy aircraft at about 33,000 ft. The two fighting Falcons performed roughly a 180 degrees turn and headed towards the fresh contacts. Still at 10,000 ft, Khalid very quickly brought his own radar into play. This revealed the enemy flight to be four-strong, in echelon starboard with about 3,000 ft of separation between each member of the formation . Khalid proceeded to lock up the No. 4 at a range of 16 nm and saw that his own heading was 280 degrees. He then engaged afterburner and told GCI that he was accelerating to 550 kt before instructing his wingman to begin climbing. As they ascended, both aircraft passed

Flight Lieutenant Khalid Mehmoodthrough broken cloud at 20,000 ft, Khalidthen observing a RHAW (Radar Homing and Warning) indicating which alerted him to the fact that the hostile aircraft were Mig-23s. He notified GCI of this and then succeeded in gaining a visual 'tally' at a range of 7 nm, subsequently noticing that the four Afghan warplanes were in clean condition (i.e., no drop-tanks or bombs) and that they all featured a basically khaki camouflage colour scheme. At about the same time the first two MIGs reversed their course and began heading back towardsthe F-16s at about 33-34,000 ft. It was also apparent that this pair was rapidlyoverhauling the front four, which would seem to indicate that the latter had decelerated, perhaps in an attempt to place F-16s under threat. If it were indeed a tactical ploy, it failed dismally to succeed in its objective. Khalid chose to press on with his pursuit of the larger group and at a arange of 1.3 nm while in an attitude of 135 degrees of bank (i.e. near inverted) at 33,000 ft, he launched an AIM-9L at the No. 4 aircraft. Quickly rejecting the lock, he rolled out into level flight and turned to look for the original pair which was now much too close (about 5,000ft/1524 m away) as they overshot the four-ship. Since the pair clearly posed no immediate danger, Khalid turned his attaention back to the larger group and locked on to the No. 3 from almost directly astern at a distance of about 13,500 ft. It was now that Khalid worked out a cunning plan which, if executed correctly, would allow him to kill all six enemy aircraft. Basically, it envisaged using his three remaining Sidewinders (one AIM-9L and two AIM-9Ps) to 'splash' the last three of the four-ship element before disposing of the other two with the Vulcan M61 cannon.

In accordance with that plan, Khalid launched an AIM-9P at the No. 3 aircraft while at 34,000 ft on a heading of 40 degrees, and then began moving towards the No. 2. At this moment, GCI intervened with a warning call to break right. Khalid responded immediately and in doing so lost his chance of outdoing Alam's earlier achievement. Perhaps the most frustrating thing about this call was that it was subsequently found to be unnecessary and was probably prompted by 'clutter' on GCI's radar display.Whatever the reason, that manoeuvre cost Khalid precious seconds and even though he attempted to re-engage, by now the remaining enemy aircraft were in a descending left-hand turn and accelerating away towards the sanctuary of Afghanistan. With regard to the two MIG-23s that Khalid did engage, the Pakistan Army later found wreckage of both. Khalid remains confident that he would have taken all six had he not been distracted by the false call.

Pakistan Military Consortium :: www.PakDef.info
Only 1 MiG-23, that too damaged. PAF sure likes to exaggerate its claims.
Pakistani Air-to-Air Victories
Just see the number of white unconfirmed kills without any proof in that list. In comparison see the Indian list, less number of made-up kills. PAF sure likes propaganda.

Fact is those MiG-23s were on a bombing mission loaded with bombs hunting Afghan irregulars. I doubt they even carried BVR missiles. MiG-23 was basically a BVR fighter, and not designed for close combat. Plus, PAF had GCI on their side while the MiG-23s were flying without GCI, loaded with bombs & no BVRs.

then ECM systems on board PAF fighters which were targeted at being able to defeat Soviet fighters)..
What ECM? Please provide neutral sources.
 
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I am always going to be skeptical about news reported in this way. We have no way of verifying these quite outlandish claims.
 
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Those F-16s represent the cutting edge of PAF's inventory. While in the case of IAF, we are talking about an aircraft that has been retired/mothballed. And we are comparing the two. That's what makes us proud.

F-16 block 70 with AESA was not good enough for our air force.

Another fact that will make you proud is that JF-17 will also be equipped with BVRs. And we know how unreliable these Migs are - active duty or mothballed.
 
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I don't think the MIG 23 could beat the upgraded F 16's, unless the pilot is an ace. The MIGs have a bad record against the F series.

The only plane to ever defeat and F16 in real combat is the Mirage 2000.
 
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Another fact that will make you proud is that JF-17 will also be equipped with BVRs. And we know how unreliable these Migs are - active duty or mothballed.

Considering they are going up against PAF whose record of crashes in last few months is as bad if not worse than IAF, it kind of cancels itself out :)
 
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Considering they are going up against PAF whose record of crashes in last few months is as bad if not worse than IAF, it kind of cancels itself out :)

Really, a few mishaps in the PAF and you think your 1000+ crashes have become history. :cheesy:
Hell, hardly any other air force around the globe has contributed to the humor. :laugh:

photo.jpg
 
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Really, a few mishaps in the PAF and you think your 1000+ crashes have become history. :cheesy:
Hell, hardly any other air force around the globe has contributed to the humor. :laugh:

Actually it seems Pakistan in its insane drive to compete with India in everything has decided to beat India's record in this area.. And for once it seems to be getting some success.. :)
 
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All PAF F-16As are going midlife upgrade. That will make them compatible with new build F-16C block 52s which carry BVR AIM-120C . So your source in IAF is out of synch with new developments. Now that will make you even more proud!!

Ur saying in future this will happen or that will happen, PAf will get this or that :blah: :blah:

But we are talking about present :smokin:

There is a big difference between reality and dreams.........MiG-23MF is reality at present we IAF have it.
:devil:

Really, a few mishaps in the PAF and you think your 1000+ crashes have become history. :cheesy:
Hell, hardly any other air force around the globe has contributed to the humor. :laugh:

photo.jpg

As always we can't expect a mature and grown up attitude and reply from u.
 
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Ur saying in future this will happen or that will happen, PAf will get this or that :blah: :blah:

But we are talking about present :smokin:

There is a big difference between reality and dreams.........MiG-23MF is reality at present we IAF have it.
:devil:
Actually, Mig 23 is Past.........We have retired it:lol::P
Amusing to see Pakistanis tryng to compare PAF's best with a retired IAF fighter:lol:
 
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Really, a few mishaps in the PAF and you think your 1000+ crashes have become history. :cheesy:
Hell, hardly any other air force around the globe has contributed to the humor. :laugh:

photo.jpg
It is more an insult to PAF, that such a "rubbish" plane has an excellent record against it.....................:bunny:
 
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Really, a few mishaps in the PAF and you think your 1000+ crashes have become history. :cheesy:
Hell, hardly any other air force around the globe has contributed to the humor. :laugh:

photo.jpg

As always we can't expect a mature and grown up attitude and reply from u.
 
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The Indian military aviation historian don't shy from the fact that in response to 40 F-16s acquired by the PAF, the IAF went into a frenzy ending up purchasing some 220 fighter jets. After having little confidence in the Flogger to counter the Fighting Falcon, the
IAF went for the very expensive Mirage-2000s and onto the MiG-29.
Maybe IAF is still not happy with 280 Su-30mki against the PAF's f-16s. So now we are buying 200 MMRCAs, 300 Fifth Gen fighters not to mention LCA and AMCA.
Now what confuses me is why IAF placed only 2 squadrons of Su-30s to face the mighty PAF? :P
 
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Mig-23 is retired...we have mig-2000,su-30 mki,mig-29 and soon we'll have Rafale..so,we are never going to see Mig-23 in Indian sky i guess(unless ww3 is going to be happen very soon)..
 
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THE THING IS IT NEVER WAS ABOUT THE PLANES OR OBJECTS OF MILITARY TECHNOLOGY BUT THE THING THAT MATTERS IS "FAITH"... WE FIGHT FOR A PURPOSE AND THE RIGHT ONE! YOU GUYS LACK THAT WHICH MAKES YOU COWARD...
WE ARE THE PROTECTORS OF "ISLAM" THE TRUE RELIGION OF GOD ALMIGHTY, WHAT DO YOU PROTECT??
 
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Actually, Mig 23 is Past.........We have retired it:lol::P
Amusing to see Pakistanis tryng to compare PAF's best with a retired IAF fighter:lol:

Seems you have missed the banter in the OP. !! :rolleyes:


It is more an insult to PAF, that such a "rubbish" plane has an excellent record against it.....................:bunny:
Care to share that record, not forgetting the F-86 scenario. :)


As always we can't expect a mature and grown up attitude and reply from u.

Kindly remove your Indian goggles, you may then see whom and what i was replying to.
 
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