Losing interest in Indus civilization

[django]

My Pak Friend,

We must show compassion to those who lie... it is understanable really...since they have to come of with these lies to sustain their illegitmate empire... the bigger the lies the more the indian masses will rally behind them...-

You know the fun part is that Pak is becoming less and less theological state and hin-dia is becoming more and more... which I assure you is a great thing...

I am just happy that Pak Friends are becoming alive to their Heritage...

Without your Past, there is no Future of your own design...

We need to keep the fascism at bay in the region...Kashmir is the capstone that is keeping this sick empire intact... take out the capstone then this weird edifice will crumble all the way to South Tibet and NE states.

Very well put sir.Kudos

 

[VFY]

Just enjoy the music guys/gals instead of fighting over the heritage like a bunch of silly kids

 

[Nilgiri]

That was absolutely beautiful. Thanks.

 

[xairhossi]

@Bharat Muslim What is up with your fetish for these kinda threads? Make a controversial statement on IVC and then proceed to tag the entire forum

 

[my2cents]

Losing interest in Indus civilization

Many Indians are interested in Indus civilization because they associate their country's science & engineering talent with this civilization. They think their country is making strides in science & technology because of the heritage of Indus civilization.

But if the same Indians come to know of the dark truth about India's science & technology, the interest in Indus civilization would fizzle out instantly. Many of India's successes and failures are hidden in mystery and things actually may not be as they appear. When I pondered over the real technological capability of India, I instantly felt like giving the Indus valley civilization discussion a complete miss. In light of these revelations, even if Indus civilization indeed belongs to India, I wouldn't give two hoots.

There are strong reasons to believe that India's civilian space programs and military R&D projects may be non-indigenous or even fake. Indian technology doesn't seem to be about innovation/ingenuity. It is probably about purchasing and managing. The list of misleading red herrings is long. For instance, if India's Mars and Lunar missions are real, why is it unable to invent engines for it's military plane even after so many decades of trying? If Indian space missions are real, why are Indian programmers/coders so notoriously incompetent? Why is India harassed by a tiny country of Pakistan? Please don't cite Western awards and other significant 'recognition' of Indian science & technology. West has it's own agenda and their hyped certificates often don't indicate real merit.

The question is why do Indians do it? Why would Indians fabricate a facade about their science & technology prowess? I can think of two answers: One, to deter nuclear attacks by creating a camouflage of great strength. Two, to make money by siphoning R&D funds. The point they want to convey is: "Since we are capable of making civilian rockets, we are also capable of making effective and functioning nukes. So beware and refrain from using your nukes."

You got it all wrong about IVC being Indian. Remember India did not exist.

The real claimants to IVC are present day Pakistani people.

If you see IVC through that angle it might bring back to your memory the glorious days of Islamic empire and their contribution to science and technology. You will be able to connect the dots and this might pique your interest in IVC.

 

[salarsikander]

Dude you can't shoot every indian for stupid rants of few RSS retards who make such claims.

Neither I can shoot every pakistani for what some stupids from your nation says.

Please hold me accountable only for things I say here.

For discussing these laser vedic ships , flying temples find a guy who seeded this things in your mind.

Spare me.

Thanks.

The silly claim that you're making without any facts or figures is just equal to vedic ships. As said by @Kaptaan You ganga people are nothing more than bunch of clueless swamp people trying to associate yourself with US !

 

[Bharat Muslim]

Does everybody else here (both Indians and Pakistanis) have comprehension problem or is my message lost due to lack of emphasis? If it's later it's my deficiency and I hope this post clarifies. If it's former, every reply here is off-topic and is a derailment of the thread.

The topic is NOT whether India can claim IVC. The topic is whether it is worth taking interest in. Does it give any real pleasure? Earlier I had a fetish about IVC because I linked it with great scientific and technological advancements. But now since it is doubtful that India's progress in above mentioned fields is authentic, I have lost interest in IVC. I have lost interest in IVC because India's science and technology is probably more hype than indigenousness. I have lost interest in IVC because what I thought was fairly indigenous technology may have actually been pretension.

 

[xairhossi]

Does everybody else here (both Indians and Pakistanis) have comprehension problem or is my message lost due to lack of emphasis? If it's later it's my deficiency and I hope this post clarifies. If it's former, every reply here is off-topic and is a derailment of the thread.

The topic is NOT whether India can claim IVC. The topic is whether it is worth taking interest in. Does it give any real pleasure? Earlier I had a fetish about IVC because I linked it with great scientific and technological advancements. But now since it is doubtful that India's progress in above mentioned fields is authentic, I have lost interest in IVC. I have lost interest in IVC because India's science and technology is probably more hype than indigenousness. I have lost interest in IVC because what I thought was fairly indigenous technology may have actually been pretension.

Good to hear that you've managed to overcome your obsession

 

[Joe Shearer]

Does everybody else here (both Indians and Pakistanis) have comprehension problem or is my message lost due to lack of emphasis? If it's later it's my deficiency and I hope this post clarifies. If it's former, every reply here is off-topic and is a derailment of the thread.

The topic is NOT whether India can claim IVC. The topic is whether it is worth taking interest in. Does it give any real pleasure? Earlier I had a fetish about IVC because I linked it with great scientific and technological advancements. But now since it is doubtful that India's progress in above mentioned fields is authentic, I have lost interest in IVC. I have lost interest in IVC because India's science and technology is probably more hype than indigenousness. I have lost interest in IVC because what I thought was fairly indigenous technology may have actually been pretension.

That is the soundest view on the IVC as a propaganda icon.

However, as a monumental social construct, as the building of an entire civilisation that behaved in a socially responsible manner, at a time when most of mankind was up to its armpits in primitive thought and action, this invites continuing and valid interest. To look for propaganda fringe benefits is the hallmark of very small minds; it is good that you have rejected it as a false line of thinking.

Losing interest in Indus civilization

Many Indians are interested in Indus civilization because they associate their country's science & engineering talent with this civilization. They think their country is making strides in science & technology because of the heritage of Indus civilization.

But if the same Indians come to know of the dark truth about India's science & technology, the interest in Indus civilization would fizzle out instantly. Many of India's successes and failures are hidden in mystery and things actually may not be as they appear. When I pondered over the real technological capability of India, I instantly felt like giving the Indus valley civilization discussion a complete miss. In light of these revelations, even if Indus civilization indeed belongs to India, I wouldn't give two hoots.

There are strong reasons to believe that India's civilian space programs and military R&D projects may be non-indigenous or even fake. Indian technology doesn't seem to be about innovation/ingenuity. It is probably about purchasing and managing. The list of misleading red herrings is long. For instance, if India's Mars and Lunar missions are real, why is it unable to invent engines for it's military plane even after so many decades of trying? If Indian space missions are real, why are Indian programmers/coders so notoriously incompetent? Why is India harassed by a tiny country of Pakistan? Please don't cite Western awards and other significant 'recognition' of Indian science & technology. West has it's own agenda and their hyped certificates often don't indicate real merit.

The question is why do Indians do it? Why would Indians fabricate a facade about their science & technology prowess? I can think of two answers: One, to deter nuclear attacks by creating a camouflage of great strength. Two, to make money by siphoning R&D funds. The point they want to convey is: "Since we are capable of making civilian rockets, we are also capable of making effective and functioning nukes. So beware and refrain from using your nukes."

The instances you have quoted are unfortunately each of them incorrect.

1. Regarding the Mars and Moon missions, it is not necessary to evolve a threading system to put together an engineering construct.
2. Regarding the 'invention' of engines, or their innovative design, if one might be permitted a more suitable word, you obviously have no idea about what a great deal of design expertise is called for. It would reward you to look at the failure of the German engines for the ME 262 when they were used for derivative Soviet designs; until the British sold them Rolls Royce engines, Soviet jet plane design was going nowhere. It will further reward you to look at the history of subsequent catch-up artists, including the most notorious, one that still buys Russian technology. It isn't that easy. Only a handful of western nations make successful jet engines.
3. 'Notoriously incompetent'? Having been associated with some parts of the space programme, and given that coding of the mission computer for that particular pre-GSLV line of development was entrusted to my organisation, may I politely say that you are full of it, and brimming?
   
4. India is harrassed by a tiny country of Pakistan, and it is simply because Pakistan defines the rules and then plays its games. There is nothing more to it than that. If India were to follow the same degraded rules, Pakistan would have ceased to exist a long time ago. As an ardent supporter of the Pakistani sub-culture, and of the infinite human capacity of the ordinary Pakistani man and woman, I cannot think of this without a shudder, and with a gladness that we do not stoop to any and everything. Present rhetoric notwithstanding.

It is difficult to grasp your proposed reasons for this state of affairs as serious interventions.

And yet they are close to Hindus civilization

Not nice.

 

[NakedLunch]

That is the soundest view on the IVC as a propaganda icon.

However, as a monumental social construct, as the building of an entire civilisation that behaved in a socially responsible manner, at a time when most of mankind was up to its armpits in primitive thought and action, this invites continuing and valid interest. To look for propaganda fringe benefits is the hallmark of very small minds; it is good that you have rejected it as a false line of thinking.



The instances you have quoted are unfortunately each of them incorrect.

1. Regarding the Mars and Moon missions, it is not necessary to evolve a threading system to put together an engineering construct.
2. Regarding the 'invention' of engines, or their innovative design, if one might be permitted a more suitable word, you obviously have no idea about what a great deal of design expertise is called for. It would reward you to look at the failure of the German engines for the ME 262 when they were used for derivative Soviet designs; until the British sold them Rolls Royce engines, Soviet jet plane design was going nowhere. It will further reward you to look at the history of subsequent catch-up artists, including the most notorious, one that still buys Russian technology. It isn't that easy. Only a handful of western nations make successful jet engines.
3. 'Notoriously incompetent'? Having been associated with some parts of the space programme, and given that coding of the mission computer for that particular pre-GSLV line of development was entrusted to my organisation, may I politely say that you are full of it, and brimming?
   
4. India is harrassed by a tiny country of Pakistan, and it is simply because Pakistan defines the rules and then plays its games. There is nothing more to it than that. If India were to follow the same degraded rules, Pakistan would have ceased to exist a long time ago. As an ardent supporter of the Pakistani sub-culture, and of the infinite human capacity of the ordinary Pakistani man and woman, I cannot think of this without a shudder, and with a gladness that we do not stoop to any and everything. Present rhetoric notwithstanding.

It is difficult to grasp your proposed reasons for this state of affairs as serious interventions.



Not nice.

It is a pleasure to finally make your acquaintance Mr Shearer. I have a lot of respect for the way you conduct yourself.

 

[Joe Shearer]

Thanks. Consider this as a "fly by" - I could just not resist from firing a burst at the Ganga's. I got to keep the Ganga's tickled.

This adage 'Ganga' I have given to - well you know who has a thought out reason. If you look at map of South Asia two major rivers stare out at you. They are Indus on the west with it's green strip of irrigated land Ganga Basin in the east.

The differance between the two is stark. The Indus Basin essentialy is extention of the Middle East dry climate and is marked as semi-arid or aride desert. Only the mighty Indus provides us the water for irrigation otherwise it would be belly up for Pakistan. Therefore Indus Basin defines Pakistan and did so to our ancestors.

Ganga on the other hand is wet, damp and was tropical jungles until not long ago with monkeys, elephants and homo sapiens of cetain variety hanging off the trees. They contributed to no civilization whatsoever. Vast majority of Indian's are part or full descendants of these and thus my preferance for the term 'Ganga'. It captures the essence of what India is and Pakistan is NOT. We are NOT a Ganga people or culture. Not one inch of our land comes anywhere near the Ganga. For me the term Ganga sums up India as opposed to Indus Pakistan. That is why I suggest people here pick up that term please. When I do back here I expect 'Ganga' to be used more frequently.

Look at the physical map of South Asia. You can clearly see Indus Basin seprarated from India by the desert. Ganga Basin which has over 700 million Indians living within it and of course the Dravid India with another 400 million. Only Indian Punjab falls within the geography of Pakistan.

Indian writers know this that is why they will do anything to hyphenate Indus with Ganga in a desperate attempt to leech or suck off Indus - because as we know that is the cradle of civilization in our part of the world. Thus they come up with Indo-Ganga basin when that is incorrect. The two are entirely distinct regions with distinct climates. We must do eveything to link (rightly) Ganga/Hindu > India. Conversely Indus/Muslim > Pakistan. Ganga discharges flows toward and discharges into the Bay of Bengal whereas Indus flows toward and discharges into Arabian Sea.

Even outsiders are slowly realizing this - that geography of the Indus is what underpins Pakistan. Take the time to read this article by Robert Kaplan please.

http://foreignpolicy.com/2012/06/18/whats-wrong-with-pakistan/
http://www.geocurrents.info/geonote...atic-theory-of-pakistans-geographical-destiny


@Sinopakfriend

Is this what was called stooping to conquer? Shouldn't you be somewhere else, talking to some people else, at a slightly more edifying level of conversation?

Just asking.

It is a pleasure to finally make your acquaintance Mr Shearer. I have a lot of respect for the way you conduct yourself.

Thank you so much.

 

[NakedLunch]

Thank you so much.

My pleasure.

 

[salarsikander]

That is the soundest view on the IVC as a propaganda icon.

However, as a monumental social construct, as the building of an entire civilisation that behaved in a socially responsible manner, at a time when most of mankind was up to its armpits in primitive thought and action, this invites continuing and valid interest. To look for propaganda fringe benefits is the hallmark of very small minds; it is good that you have rejected it as a false line of thinking.



The instances you have quoted are unfortunately each of them incorrect.

1. Regarding the Mars and Moon missions, it is not necessary to evolve a threading system to put together an engineering construct.
2. Regarding the 'invention' of engines, or their innovative design, if one might be permitted a more suitable word, you obviously have no idea about what a great deal of design expertise is called for. It would reward you to look at the failure of the German engines for the ME 262 when they were used for derivative Soviet designs; until the British sold them Rolls Royce engines, Soviet jet plane design was going nowhere. It will further reward you to look at the history of subsequent catch-up artists, including the most notorious, one that still buys Russian technology. It isn't that easy. Only a handful of western nations make successful jet engines.
3. 'Notoriously incompetent'? Having been associated with some parts of the space programme, and given that coding of the mission computer for that particular pre-GSLV line of development was entrusted to my organisation, may I politely say that you are full of it, and brimming?
   
4. India is harrassed by a tiny country of Pakistan, and it is simply because Pakistan defines the rules and then plays its games. There is nothing more to it than that. If India were to follow the same degraded rules, Pakistan would have ceased to exist a long time ago. As an ardent supporter of the Pakistani sub-culture, and of the infinite human capacity of the ordinary Pakistani man and woman, I cannot think of this without a shudder, and with a gladness that we do not stoop to any and everything. Present rhetoric notwithstanding.

It is difficult to grasp your proposed reasons for this state of affairs as serious interventions.



Not nice.

It gives me immense pleasure tomsee you back. Please stick around. We need more sane voice from this wretched part of world

 

[PaklovesTurkiye]

That is the soundest view on the IVC as a propaganda icon.

However, as a monumental social construct, as the building of an entire civilisation that behaved in a socially responsible manner, at a time when most of mankind was up to its armpits in primitive thought and action, this invites continuing and valid interest. To look for propaganda fringe benefits is the hallmark of very small minds; it is good that you have rejected it as a false line of thinking.



The instances you have quoted are unfortunately each of them incorrect.

1. Regarding the Mars and Moon missions, it is not necessary to evolve a threading system to put together an engineering construct.
2. Regarding the 'invention' of engines, or their innovative design, if one might be permitted a more suitable word, you obviously have no idea about what a great deal of design expertise is called for. It would reward you to look at the failure of the German engines for the ME 262 when they were used for derivative Soviet designs; until the British sold them Rolls Royce engines, Soviet jet plane design was going nowhere. It will further reward you to look at the history of subsequent catch-up artists, including the most notorious, one that still buys Russian technology. It isn't that easy. Only a handful of western nations make successful jet engines.
3. 'Notoriously incompetent'? Having been associated with some parts of the space programme, and given that coding of the mission computer for that particular pre-GSLV line of development was entrusted to my organisation, may I politely say that you are full of it, and brimming?
   
4. India is harrassed by a tiny country of Pakistan, and it is simply because Pakistan defines the rules and then plays its games. There is nothing more to it than that. If India were to follow the same degraded rules, Pakistan would have ceased to exist a long time ago. As an ardent supporter of the Pakistani sub-culture, and of the infinite human capacity of the ordinary Pakistani man and woman, I cannot think of this without a shudder, and with a gladness that we do not stoop to any and everything. Present rhetoric notwithstanding.

It is difficult to grasp your proposed reasons for this state of affairs as serious interventions.



Not nice.

back......

 

[Bharat Muslim]

That is the soundest view on the IVC as a propaganda icon.

However, as a monumental social construct, as the building of an entire civilisation that behaved in a socially responsible manner, at a time when most of mankind was up to its armpits in primitive thought and action, this invites continuing and valid interest. To look for propaganda fringe benefits is the hallmark of very small minds; it is good that you have rejected it as a false line of thinking.



The instances you have quoted are unfortunately each of them incorrect.

1. Regarding the Mars and Moon missions, it is not necessary to evolve a threading system to put together an engineering construct.
2. Regarding the 'invention' of engines, or their innovative design, if one might be permitted a more suitable word, you obviously have no idea about what a great deal of design expertise is called for. It would reward you to look at the failure of the German engines for the ME 262 when they were used for derivative Soviet designs; until the British sold them Rolls Royce engines, Soviet jet plane design was going nowhere. It will further reward you to look at the history of subsequent catch-up artists, including the most notorious, one that still buys Russian technology. It isn't that easy. Only a handful of western nations make successful jet engines.
3. 'Notoriously incompetent'? Having been associated with some parts of the space programme, and given that coding of the mission computer for that particular pre-GSLV line of development was entrusted to my organisation, may I politely say that you are full of it, and brimming?
   
4. India is harrassed by a tiny country of Pakistan, and it is simply because Pakistan defines the rules and then plays its games. There is nothing more to it than that. If India were to follow the same degraded rules, Pakistan would have ceased to exist a long time ago. As an ardent supporter of the Pakistani sub-culture, and of the infinite human capacity of the ordinary Pakistani man and woman, I cannot think of this without a shudder, and with a gladness that we do not stoop to any and everything. Present rhetoric notwithstanding.

It is difficult to grasp your proposed reasons for this state of affairs as serious interventions.



Not nice.

@NakedLunch

Is this @Joe Shearer guy's English is of too high a level for me to understand or did he misinterpret my post and started irrelevant rambling?