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Like India, Pakistan has a Tablighi Jamaat Covid-19 problem too

different sect

@AgNoStiC MuSliM sectarian thread
what is sectarian ?

However the bigger question is. Had OP made this thread if he had gotten a Southern Punjab province

apni aynak uttar kar dekhain tu "Its just a thread!" on the other hand not so surprisingly the reaction is so different by puristanis " some very learned ones amongst us are showing duplicity when tableeghis are discussed they had so much pain , anguish and anxiety when coronavirus started to spread Pakistan .. wonder why ?
 
When and where was Tablighi jamaat involved in militancy?

Firstly, one of my batch-mates in a computer institute was named Jamal Abdul Nasser after the great Egyptian leader. I don't any sensible parents would name their son Saad after Maulana Saad, the leader of the Indian TJ.

Secondly, the Sri Lanka bombing of 2019... I am sure the bombers had something directly related to the TJ or were indirectly inspired by TJ-type groups from Tamil Nadu state in India.

Besides, it is the TJ that has been the inspiration for terrorists from Dagestan to Philippines to Kenya to Europe.

This pic shows my view of TJ :

WhnMHP9.jpg


somtimes i think that lefties in pakistan hate muslims so much that they pick up hindutva propaganda and use it for their low level agenda

I am a Leftie and I don't have any problems with sensible and innocent Muslims - Pakistani or otherwise.

Clearly you have lost your marbles.

The lockdown is taking a toll on you Clearly

Your one-liners have taken a dangerous turn. You are now supporting terrorists.
 
How? And in what specific way?

I would have to be an Intelligence officer to speak in specific terms but it can be commonly understood that the Tableeghis and other elements like Zakir Naik's Peace TV have affected the said peoples.

In my own locality in India, some years ago, some Tableeghis used to visit my house ( thankfully they stopped after a few years of trying :D ). They never spoke of the Libyan and Syrian wars that were conducted by terrorists and supported by NATO.
 
Like India, Pakistan has a Tablighi Jamaat Covid-19 problem too. But blame Imran Khan as well

In Pakistan, Tablighi Jamaat is viewed as benign. Militant groups such as Jaish-e-Mohammed do not like them because Tablighis don’t encourage jihad.

AYESHA SIDDIQA 3 April, 2020 10:05 am IST
Raiwind-Tablighi-Markaz-696x392.jpg

File photo | Raiwind Tablighi Markaz, Pakistan | Raiwind-Tableegi-Markaz/Facebook
Text Size:
India and Pakistan seem to be on the same page as far as the Tablighi Jamaat congregation is concerned. Like in India, after the Nizamuddin Markaz congregation, in Pakistan also, the group is considered as one of the two major sources of the spread of the novel coronavirus.

Many of the 2,000 people that attended the Tablighi Jamaat meeting in Delhi went back to different parts of the country. The Indian government now says that they are spreading the coronavirus in India.

As many as 250,000 people gathered in Pakistan’s Punjab, mid-March to participate in the annual five-day event or Tablighi ijtima. This is where people, mainly subscribing to the Deobandi sect get together to pray and obtain further training in proselytising. Pakistan is predominantly Barelvi. But the Tablighi Jamaat, which was formed in India in 1926, and its congregations are very popular and powerful for two reasons. First, theoretically, it cuts across sects and thus attracts people from all ideological schools, particularly the Barelvis who have no powerful religious forum of their own. Although Maulana Tahir-ul-Qadri’s Minhajul Quran, or politically, the Tehreek-e-Labbaik Pakistan are Barelvi organisations, the Tablighi Jamaat continues to attract Muslims across the board. Even Nawaz Sharif as chief minister of Punjab and later as prime minister supported their gatherings. This is because they are generally viewed as benign.


Second, because of its focus primarily on proselytising, it is popular across the socio-economic classes. From powerful institutions of the state and prominent politicians to the middle and lower middle classes, people are attracted to it for its religious teachings.





Tablighi Jamaat in Pakistan

Although it is accused of links with extremist institutions, in Pakistan’s case, militant organisations such as the Jaish-e-Mohammed do not like the Tablighi Jamaat. This is mainly because Jaish-e-Mohammed has an aversion to any institution that does not encourage jihad. However, it is also a fact that a lot of jihadis from the Deobandi sect were initially inspired to join militant organisations because of the introduction to religion by the Tablighi Jamaat.


Perhaps, this is one of the reasons that the son of (late) Lt General Hameed Gul, known for his contacts with jihadis in Pakistan and Afghanistan, Abdullah Gul was sharp in criticising the media for blaming the Tablighi Jamaat as one of the major sources of coronavirus infection in Pakistan. He said, “Media is constantly spewing venom against Tablighi Jamaat, which is hurting sentiments of millions of people…all those religion-weary news anchors, producers, and all news directors should be fined heavily for such irresponsible behaviour.”

His gripe was that it was the Shia devotees who were responsible for most of the infection.


The problem lies in the structure of the Tablighi Jamaat forum that is based on gathering people from within the country and around the world. Even before the annual get-together in Raiwind, Lahore, teams of proselytisers are dispatched all over the world and inside the country. As per the Tablighi Jamaat system, every team stays in a mosque in the areas they travel to and conduct proselytising activities from there. These tours take place throughout the year. But the annual gathering happens in Lahore.

Also read: Tablighi Jamaat tells its followers not to pursue political dominance in this world

Lockdown still a bad idea?
But does one blame the Tablighi Jamaat for this faux pas or the Punjab government, which was extremely slow in responding to the crisis? The federal government did not behave very differently from its counterparts around the world who took so long in responding to the threat. There still continues to be confusion regarding the lockdown as Prime Minister Imran Khan insists that it is a bad idea.

The Punjab government was neither forceful nor clear in its instructions. This lax attitude was one of the reasons why, as sources said, the Tablighi Jamaat management instructed those of its teams that were yet to finish their tour of duty (the source I spoke to had completed his and had spent four months in the field – from December to March) to go to other places around the country and finish their work.

The Tablighi Jamaat members I spoke with boasted about how well they were organised in Raiwind. After the orders to close shops, there was a separate Tablighi Jamaat office to guide each group on their future course of action. This meant that many of those, who were already exposed to members from countries affected by Covid-19 such as China, Iran, the UK, the US, Spain and others, then moved to other parts in Pakistan carrying the virus with them.

In Sindh, the inspector-general of police Mushtaq Mehr announced a quarantine of all Tablighi Jamaat returnees in his province, especially those sitting in mosques. They would be provided with food and other rations with instructions to the police to ensure that no other person came in contact with them. This meant an end to all preaching activities. This was deemed important after over 130 cases tested positive in the city of Hyderabad. Punjab or Islamabad, on the other hand, have not taken any similar action. While the neighbourhood of Bara Kahu in Islamabad is strictly quarantined as some returning Tablighi Jamaat members tested positive, many of the mosques in smaller towns and rural areas of Punjab with Tablighi Jamaat members sitting inside are reportedly still in action.




The bigger culprit
In many ways, Islamabad and its satellite government in Lahore are even bigger culprits than the Tablighi Jamaat. While Imran Khan remains totally engrossed in his electoral mode by pretending not to hurt sentiments of the religious Right, it is important for him to realise that what he and the world face is an unprecedented turn of events. Religion, though important, cannot be left on its own without any rational guidance. After all, both Iran and Saudi Arabia – the two central hubs of Islamic faith – have ventured to rationalise. Iran stopped Friday prayer gatherings and Saudi Arabia has sealed mosques and even put pilgrimages on hold.

What is required is a firmer but well-thought-out plan of action, especially in Pakistan and India where religion is not simply about faith or culture but is also central to politics and identity of people. Convincing one segment of population becomes tough, especially if the government is seen as partisan.

Closing down Tablighi Jamaat spaces in India, in particular, would require applying rationality to all. Apparently, days after the Tablighi Jamaat gathering at Nizamuddin, there was a large get together at the Shirdi Saibaba temple in Maharashtra. It is the application of greater scientific methodology that will help in survival against this present and clear danger.

The author is research associate at SOAS, London and author of Military Inc. She tweets: @iamthedrifter. Views are personal.

Few facts:

1. You are a shia.
2. Authors is Pakistani Traitor (renegade)
3. This was published by Indians Website.
4. Shias coming back from Iran were so far blamed for Crona outbreak in Pakistan.

Now we can see your (Some may call malicious) intent for posting This Indian article.

If you have problems with Tablighi jamaat, thats fine, but don't peddle blatant Indian lies.
When and where was Tablighi jamaat involved in militancy?
He is just trying to shift the blame from his sect and Iran.
 
I would have to be an Intelligence officer to speak in specific terms but it can be commonly understood that the Tableeghis and other elements like Zakir Naik's Peace TV have affected the said peoples.

Zakir is Salafi, Tablighis are just hanafis...in what particular way have they been affected in regards to teachings? Zakir condemned extremism several times so did the school of Deoband

In my own locality in India, some years ago, some Tableeghis used to visit my house ( thankfully they stopped after a few years of trying :D ). They never spoke of the Libyan and Syrian wars that were conducted by terrorists and supported by NATO.

We have something in common I avoid them too, they always come at the wrong moment, anyway i agree that they should talk more about it, they're very politically silent and they take it too far to such an extent that they barely talk about any world issues...they should
 
Few facts:

1. You are a shia.
2. Authors is Pakistani Traitor (renegade)
3. This was published by Indians Website.
4. Shias coming back from Iran were so far blamed for Crona outbreak in Pakistan.

Now we can see your (Some may call malicious) intent for posting This Indian article.


He is just trying to shift the blame from his sect and Iran.

LOL here comes another one , again not so surprising touchy and offensive behavior when tableeghis are pointed out for their "negligent and ignorant behavior" in spreading coronavirus , not just across Pakistan but in other countries as well here is a bit more by more purer sources , lets see what you have to say about this. Very pathetic and disgusting thing about such people is they cannot get out of their sectarian mindset and they just blame everyone for conspiring against them.



Tableeghi Jamaat in hot water in Pakistan too for Covid-19 spread

LAHORE: After taking the heat in Malaysia and India for accelerating the spread of the coronavirus, the Tableeghi Jamaat is in the limelight in Pakistan also for organising its annual mass assembly at Raiwind Markaz in March despite strong opposition by the Punjab government.

According to a report by the Punjab Special Branch, approximately 70,000 to 80,000 members of the Jamaat had attended the religious congregation at the Raiwind Markaz on March 10.

However, Jamaat’s management, at that time, had claimed that the number of the participants was more than 250,000
https://www.dawn.com/news/1547354/tableeghi-jamaat-in-hot-water-in-pakistan-too-for-covid-19-spread
 
in what particular way have they been affected in regards to teachings?

They brain-wash people to believe that Islam is all about prayer, ritual and dress-code and that any bunch of people or society that goes away from overt prayer, ritual and dress-code is meant to be brought "back" to prayer, ritual and dress-code. Some times the TJ uses preaching to supposedly revert a society. Other times when that brain-washing doesn't work in a society, the more violent among the TJ set up or join terrorist movements to bring about the change. Sometimes these TJ people travel to other societies to achieve the jihad. That is why I mentioned Dagestan, Kenya etc.
 
She's a a self hating brownie and is proving to be a tool to pave way for indian Muslims genocide at the hands of radical Hindu state machinery

Her concern is not Pakistan thats just a diversion to further vilify the indian Muslims
 
LOL here comes another one , again not so surprising touchy and offensive behavior when tableeghis are pointed out for their "negligent and ignorant behavior" in spreading coronavirus , not just across Pakistan but in other countries as well here is a bit more by more purer sources , lets see what you have to say about this. Very pathetic and disgusting thing about such people is they cannot get out of their sectarian mindset and they just blame everyone for conspiring against them.



Tableeghi Jamaat in hot water in Pakistan too for Covid-19 spread

LAHORE: After taking the heat in Malaysia and India for accelerating the spread of the coronavirus, the Tableeghi Jamaat is in the limelight in Pakistan also for organising its annual mass assembly at Raiwind Markaz in March despite strong opposition by the Punjab government.

According to a report by the Punjab Special Branch, approximately 70,000 to 80,000 members of the Jamaat had attended the religious congregation at the Raiwind Markaz on March 10.

However, Jamaat’s management, at that time, had claimed that the number of the participants was more than 250,000
https://www.dawn.com/news/1547354/tableeghi-jamaat-in-hot-water-in-pakistan-too-for-covid-19-spread
You have exposed yourself and your intent behind posting Indian articles. so your statement of “sectarian mind set“ sit perfectly well on you.

Govt is struggling to ban juma, where 100x more people gathered weekly. Now find an article condemning every Muslim and Pakistan states, hope it will serve your malicious purpose.
Start From Arnab guswami, or BJP/RSS website.
Artists will sound like,... “Like Indian Pakistan has a Muslim problem too..” Just add Sunni in brackets.
 
Indian media is not demonizing the sikhs for the spread of Corona in Indian punjab bcoz of their guru's recent world tour nor they blaming the hundred thousands Hindu religious gathering which are still taking place or the Hindu expats and Indian students evacuated from middle east and China to score a point against Pakistan but only Muslims
 
Other times when that brain-washing doesn't work in a society, the more violent among the TJ set up or join terrorist movements to bring about the change. Sometimes these TJ people travel to other societies to achieve the jihad. That is why I mentioned Dagestan, Kenya etc.

Every harmless ideology have some psychos as a contrast. You'll relate to that better than all of us here, both as a leftist and a Muslim
 
Like India, Pakistan has a Tablighi Jamaat Covid-19 problem too. But blame Imran Khan as well

In Pakistan, Tablighi Jamaat is viewed as benign. Militant groups such as Jaish-e-Mohammed do not like them because Tablighis don’t encourage jihad.

AYESHA SIDDIQA 3 April, 2020 10:05 am IST
Raiwind-Tablighi-Markaz-696x392.jpg

File photo | Raiwind Tablighi Markaz, Pakistan | Raiwind-Tableegi-Markaz/Facebook
Text Size:
India and Pakistan seem to be on the same page as far as the Tablighi Jamaat congregation is concerned. Like in India, after the Nizamuddin Markaz congregation, in Pakistan also, the group is considered as one of the two major sources of the spread of the novel coronavirus.

Many of the 2,000 people that attended the Tablighi Jamaat meeting in Delhi went back to different parts of the country. The Indian government now says that they are spreading the coronavirus in India.

As many as 250,000 people gathered in Pakistan’s Punjab, mid-March to participate in the annual five-day event or Tablighi ijtima. This is where people, mainly subscribing to the Deobandi sect get together to pray and obtain further training in proselytising. Pakistan is predominantly Barelvi. But the Tablighi Jamaat, which was formed in India in 1926, and its congregations are very popular and powerful for two reasons. First, theoretically, it cuts across sects and thus attracts people from all ideological schools, particularly the Barelvis who have no powerful religious forum of their own. Although Maulana Tahir-ul-Qadri’s Minhajul Quran, or politically, the Tehreek-e-Labbaik Pakistan are Barelvi organisations, the Tablighi Jamaat continues to attract Muslims across the board. Even Nawaz Sharif as chief minister of Punjab and later as prime minister supported their gatherings. This is because they are generally viewed as benign.


Second, because of its focus primarily on proselytising, it is popular across the socio-economic classes. From powerful institutions of the state and prominent politicians to the middle and lower middle classes, people are attracted to it for its religious teachings.





Tablighi Jamaat in Pakistan

Although it is accused of links with extremist institutions, in Pakistan’s case, militant organisations such as the Jaish-e-Mohammed do not like the Tablighi Jamaat. This is mainly because Jaish-e-Mohammed has an aversion to any institution that does not encourage jihad. However, it is also a fact that a lot of jihadis from the Deobandi sect were initially inspired to join militant organisations because of the introduction to religion by the Tablighi Jamaat.


Perhaps, this is one of the reasons that the son of (late) Lt General Hameed Gul, known for his contacts with jihadis in Pakistan and Afghanistan, Abdullah Gul was sharp in criticising the media for blaming the Tablighi Jamaat as one of the major sources of coronavirus infection in Pakistan. He said, “Media is constantly spewing venom against Tablighi Jamaat, which is hurting sentiments of millions of people…all those religion-weary news anchors, producers, and all news directors should be fined heavily for such irresponsible behaviour.”

His gripe was that it was the Shia devotees who were responsible for most of the infection.


The problem lies in the structure of the Tablighi Jamaat forum that is based on gathering people from within the country and around the world. Even before the annual get-together in Raiwind, Lahore, teams of proselytisers are dispatched all over the world and inside the country. As per the Tablighi Jamaat system, every team stays in a mosque in the areas they travel to and conduct proselytising activities from there. These tours take place throughout the year. But the annual gathering happens in Lahore.

Also read: Tablighi Jamaat tells its followers not to pursue political dominance in this world

Lockdown still a bad idea?
But does one blame the Tablighi Jamaat for this faux pas or the Punjab government, which was extremely slow in responding to the crisis? The federal government did not behave very differently from its counterparts around the world who took so long in responding to the threat. There still continues to be confusion regarding the lockdown as Prime Minister Imran Khan insists that it is a bad idea.

The Punjab government was neither forceful nor clear in its instructions. This lax attitude was one of the reasons why, as sources said, the Tablighi Jamaat management instructed those of its teams that were yet to finish their tour of duty (the source I spoke to had completed his and had spent four months in the field – from December to March) to go to other places around the country and finish their work.

The Tablighi Jamaat members I spoke with boasted about how well they were organised in Raiwind. After the orders to close shops, there was a separate Tablighi Jamaat office to guide each group on their future course of action. This meant that many of those, who were already exposed to members from countries affected by Covid-19 such as China, Iran, the UK, the US, Spain and others, then moved to other parts in Pakistan carrying the virus with them.

In Sindh, the inspector-general of police Mushtaq Mehr announced a quarantine of all Tablighi Jamaat returnees in his province, especially those sitting in mosques. They would be provided with food and other rations with instructions to the police to ensure that no other person came in contact with them. This meant an end to all preaching activities. This was deemed important after over 130 cases tested positive in the city of Hyderabad. Punjab or Islamabad, on the other hand, have not taken any similar action. While the neighbourhood of Bara Kahu in Islamabad is strictly quarantined as some returning Tablighi Jamaat members tested positive, many of the mosques in smaller towns and rural areas of Punjab with Tablighi Jamaat members sitting inside are reportedly still in action.




The bigger culprit
In many ways, Islamabad and its satellite government in Lahore are even bigger culprits than the Tablighi Jamaat. While Imran Khan remains totally engrossed in his electoral mode by pretending not to hurt sentiments of the religious Right, it is important for him to realise that what he and the world face is an unprecedented turn of events. Religion, though important, cannot be left on its own without any rational guidance. After all, both Iran and Saudi Arabia – the two central hubs of Islamic faith – have ventured to rationalise. Iran stopped Friday prayer gatherings and Saudi Arabia has sealed mosques and even put pilgrimages on hold.

What is required is a firmer but well-thought-out plan of action, especially in Pakistan and India where religion is not simply about faith or culture but is also central to politics and identity of people. Convincing one segment of population becomes tough, especially if the government is seen as partisan.

Closing down Tablighi Jamaat spaces in India, in particular, would require applying rationality to all. Apparently, days after the Tablighi Jamaat gathering at Nizamuddin, there was a large get together at the Shirdi Saibaba temple in Maharashtra. It is the application of greater scientific methodology that will help in survival against this present and clear danger.

The author is research associate at SOAS, London and author of Military Inc. She tweets: @iamthedrifter. Views are personal.
There is no any tablighi jamat gathering taking place anywhere in the world. Not official.
And if somebody is doing it, then he is doing it on his own. So tablighi jamat can't be blamed for that.
Secondly, what Imran has to do with tablighi jamat? He is sufi, and his wife is Barelvi. And his near relatives are Shia. Tablighi jamat is not even near him.
Stop Imran bashing.
 
Every harmless ideology have some psychos as a contrast. You'll relate to that better than all of us here, both as a leftist and a Muslim

I agree.

And as you indicated, it is best that we don't have personal encounters with the TJ or the equivalent movements in other religious. :D
 
You have exposed yourself and your intent behind posting Indian articles. so your statement of “sectarian mind set“ sit perfectly well on you.

Govt is struggling to ban juma, where 100x more people gathered weekly. Now find an article condemning every Muslim and Pakistan states, hope it will serve your malicious purpose.
Start From Arnab guswami, or BJP/RSS website.
Artists will sound like,... “Like Indian Pakistan has a Muslim problem too..” Just add Sunni in brackets.

haha .. seriously i am exposed ! read your comments again . You didn't answer the question what do you have to say against the other article about tableeghis in hot water or you are checking about if you can some how prove that this guy also doesn't belong to your favourite molvi group: here it again for your convenience
https://www.dawn.com/news/1547354/tableeghi-jamaat-in-hot-water-in-pakistan-too-for-covid-19-spread

There is no any tablighi jamat gathering taking place anywhere in the world. Not official.
And if somebody is doing it, then he is doing it on his own. So tablighi jamat can't be blamed for that.
Secondly, what Imran has to do with tablighi jamat? He is sufi, and his wife is Barelvi. And his near relatives are Shia. Tablighi jamat is not even near him.
Stop Imran bashing.

Blaming Imran as he is the PM and where the tableegis gathered "raiwind" is in Punjab which is also ruled by his party despite all the warning he did nothing to prevent

https://gulfnews.com/world/asia/pak...-despite-coronavirus-concerns-1.1584119639994
250,000 pilgrims gather in Pakistan despite coronavirus concerns
 

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