Let attempts Huge Infiltration - Kashmir on alert

[Kharian_Beast]

^ Terrorist is someone who targets civilians, in this case Indian soldiers were killed in occupied disputed territory. Doesn't seem like a terrorist act to me but a domestic freedom struggle that hasn't magically disappeared just because GoI prayed and wished really hard.

Second, please provide proof Pakistan is sending in anyone let alone providing dubious claims of ''cover fire'' and we might take any ramblings a bit more seriously. Until then, good hunting.

 

[jeypore]

Kharian_Beast;336547

^ Terrorist is someone who targets civilians, in this case Indian soldiers were killed in occupied disputed territory. Doesn't seem like a terrorist act to me but a domestic freedom struggle that hasn't magically disappeared just because GoI prayed and wished really hard.

That does not justify, that they are not terrorist.

Second, please provide proof Pakistan is sending in anyone let alone providing dubious claims of ''cover fire'' and we might take any ramblings a bit more seriously. Until then, good hunting.

It is to be noted that Pakistan troops have been firing throughout the last night at Indian posts in Uri sector. Pak troops have earlier resorted to such tactics to give cover to militants crossing over. Indian Army has lodged a formal protest with their Pakistani counterparts on the same.

This sentence from the article that started this thread.

 

[notsuperstitious]

^ Terrorist is someone who targets civilians, in this case Indian soldiers were killed in occupied disputed territory. Doesn't seem like a terrorist act to me but a domestic freedom struggle that hasn't magically disappeared just because GoI prayed and wished really hard.

Second, please provide proof Pakistan is sending in anyone let alone providing dubious claims of ''cover fire'' and we might take any ramblings a bit more seriously. Until then, good hunting.

DAWN.COM | World | Kashmir fighting kills 24

From Dawn article - the encounter started after overnight 'crossfiring' between india and pakistani forces. the cross border firing is very unusual - there's ceasefire if u know. cover fire like always.

and punjabis of LET are hardly 'domestic freedom fighters'. its a terrorist org, even when they fight our soldiers they still terrorists.

 

[notsuperstitious]

Same goes for the indians......never wanted a fair solution to the kashmir problem anyway......eat bullets now.



You like changing your mind on kashmir over the years and we can do the same........simla accord is old news and null and void...the UN supersedes simla.




Thats good at least this time round the indian will stop killing innocent people in fake encounters and wiping tomatoe ketchup all over themselfs to get a medal and take on the real fighters and and not the defenceless woman and children.

Simla accord was made and reiterated after the UN resolution, it supercedes the UN resolution.


and abt eating bullets, i welcome it if pakistan does this openly instead of committing ten times to stop cross border attacks and just keep doing what they have been doing. whether dialogue or bullets - all the pakistani power centres shud come together and finally decide. that way the entire world can also be clear abt what stand to take.

keep creating terrorists, one day you might realise who its hurting more.

 

[India_loves_peace]

Yeah pretty frustrated when you could not handle few armed men during mumbai carnage. Grow up and quit wet dreaming about creating another BD.

At least we killed all terrorists .... It took time to kill cause there were our guests from other countries which we wanted to save ....and wat is standard of ur police , it was looking at the terrorist when they went on bike .....in front of them ........ Dnt incite India...India is nation of peaceful people . India has not attacked anyone in last 1000 years....and will not ....but remember if u are trying to do Gibralter again pakistan will get paid...

 

[India_loves_peace]

We fight for kashmir and allah.....jihad is the only way to stop the hindu massacre of muslims and let the people of kashmir be free.
Jihad for peace!!!!

We are fighting for our nation ....Ram is with us , Jesus is with us , and allah is also with us... and people in kashmir has support for India too thats why we are in kashmir for 62 years.... and will be their forever.......
You people of pakistan dont want peace in kashmir . Otherwise you havent sent this terrorist who killed hundreds of citizens .....
True faces of pakistani have come up........
These are the people who were saying we are for peace ...
we want terrorist to be killed....
we dnt support terrorist ....
mumbai attack not planned in pak...
ISI doesnt support millitants....
Indians are doing propoganda...
Pakistani people want peace with India...


See at above comments and understand the truth....

Pakistan is exposed to world....................

Good work GOI ...
I am proud to live in India.

 

[godsavetheworld]

^ Terrorist is someone who targets civilians, in this case Indian soldiers were killed in occupied disputed territory. Doesn't seem like a terrorist act to me but a domestic freedom struggle that hasn't magically disappeared just because GoI prayed and wished really hard.

Not really. Thats a rather immature way of looking at things. Firstly the moment they enter Indian territory they termed " Pakistani terrorists". No Kashmiris or Muslim in India recognizes Jihad. Everyone thinks the Allah terrorists follow, is not the "real" Allah that they worship.

Next, all the "brave" terrorists you send in, use Kashmiris as human shields inflicting more civilian casuality. I fail to understand how you support the killing of those whom you are fighting for. And moreover it is these terrorsts you train, and equip that carry out attacks in India, as well as in Pakistan.

You couldnt achieve even megre success you can boast about, on the contraru, got yourself ridiculed in the world for supporting terrorism like no other. Sinnce you knew India was too stron to be defeated in a conventional war, you resorted to dirt cheap tactics of creating a *** that is eating your land."Terrorism you began was a gun that backfired, and now has your whole country injured, with little hope and more fear. Thats what your "freedom struggle" has achieved.

These Jihadis have lost their respect with the Kashmiris and now Kashmiris have also begun to look at Paksitan in the same light. And Pakistan itself has been awarded the titles "International Migrane" and "the most dangerous place on earth", that it cannot get rid of, because it is so embedded in their life and their thoughts.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Simla accord was made and reiterated after the UN resolution, it supercedes the UN resolution.

Simla does not supersede the UN resolutions. The first clause of Simla references and endorses the UN charter and principles.

(i) That the principles and purposes of the Charter of the United Nations shall govern the relations between the two countries.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Next, all the "brave" terrorists you send in, use Kashmiris as human shields inflicting more civilian casuality.

No human shields here. The Freedom Fighters fought head to head with hundreds, if not thousands, of Indian Occupation Forces and killed 8 of them.

Those 'civilian shields', according to human rights organizations, are innocent Kashmiris killed by the Indian Occupation forces in cold blood - the victims of atrocities committed by Indian Occupation Forces.

 

[iamunique]

The Freedom Fighters fought head to head with hundreds, if not thousands, of Indian Occupation Forces and killed 8 of them.

Some 'freedom fighters' indeed! Sir, permit me a slight deviation here... If I'm not mistaken the photo of your avtar shows the statue of Mr.Jinnah. Mr.Jinnah and a couple of gentlemen from our side (most notably Mahatma Gandhi) were also 'freedom fighters', were they not?

Did Mr.Jinnah and Bapuji fight the British with AKs and bazookas? Didn't they achieve their objective nevertheless? Why? Because their cause was genuine and the way they went about it won the respect and admiration of the world to such an extent that the British were made to look like real jackasses and had to give up.

The reason why the Palestinian and Kashmiri 'freedom' struggles have not yet fructified is because even though these peoples are fighting for a just cause, the way they are going about it is wrong. The violent freedom movements being waged by both these peoples just gives an opportunity to the 'agressors' to show these people as ruffians and terrorists who have to be suppressed, and the rest of the world agrees! And so the story continues...

On the other hand, if both these freedom struggles would have been non-violent do you think that Israel or India would have been able to hold onto to these territories? I THINK NOT!

 

[godsavetheworld]

No human shields here. The Freedom Fighters fought head to head with hundreds, if not thousands, of Indian Occupation Forces and killed 8 of them.

Those 'civilian shields', according to human rights organizations, are innocent Kashmiris killed by the Indian Occupation forces in cold blood - the victims of atrocities committed by Indian Occupation Forces.

Obviously not when they in the process of infiltrating, but there have been several instances of terrorists using Kashmiris as human shields:

Instance 1: Hostage Crisis, Tuesday, 21 October, 2003,

Hostage drama

The hostages had been held since early on Monday in a house in a village south of the summer capital, Srinagar.


They emerged on Tuesday after security forces fired tear gas shells into the building, which troops had surrounded, the authorities say.

Four village elders sent to negotiate with the militants had been taken hostage along with eight members of the family that owned the house.

State police chief Gopal Sharma said it was just another instance that militants had used civilians as human shields

Instance 2:

Fleeing militants take family hostage in J-K

Press Trust of India
Posted online: Wednesday, June 18, 2003 at 1348 hours IST


Jammu, June 18: A group of heavily armed Pakistani militants on Wednesday held hostage a family of surrendered militant, including three children, and were using them as human shields during an anti-insurgency operation in Poonch border district in Jammu and Kashmir, official sources said here
The sources said the militants were using the children as human shields forcing the troops to stop firing on the house fearing human casualties, the sources said.

Instance 3:

Jammu encounter ends as all three militants killed, hostages rescued
August 28th, 2008 - 11:42 am ICT by ANI -

Jammu, Aug 28 (ANI): The last of the three militants, who were holed up in a house in Chinore on the outer-skirts of the city, was killed late last night, ending an 18-hour long gunbattle between them and security forces.
According to official sources, the militants killed three male hostages. But, the Army and security forces were able to rescue three women and four children aged between three and nine, who were used as human shields by militants during the encounter.
The militants were believed to be the same men who had infiltrated the international border under the cover of the indiscriminate firing from Pakistan troops at the Border Security Force (BSF) posts in Kana Chak area of Akhnoor sector near Jammu on Tuesday.
Before taking shelter in the house on Wednesday, the militants wearing police uniforms killed two civilians, a jawan and a Junior Commissioned Officer (JCO) firing indiscriminately in the Mishriwala area on the outskirts of the city after sneaking into Jammu.
The Army confirmed the killing of two of the militants, the first around 11.:00 a.m. and the second at 7:30 p.m. The third was said to have been gunned down around midnight.
Meanwhile, normal life continued to remain paralysed in Jammu and Kashmir. (ANI)

Instance 4: HRC report:

For the military establishment of a modern democracy with inbuilt
checks and balances, dealing with internal insurgencies is the
must difficult task. The militants have many times been using
women, children and civilians as human shields. Yet no My Lai or
Tiananmen square type massacres have taken place in India due to
restraint exercised by the soldiers.
Link

Need I say more? This is how you support Kashmiris?

 

[Kharian_Beast]

The reason why the Palestinian and Kashmiri 'freedom' struggles have not yet fructified is because even though these peoples are fighting for a just cause, the way they are going about it is wrong. The violent freedom movements being waged by both these peoples just gives an opportunity to the 'agressors' to show these people as ruffians and terrorists who have to be suppressed, and the rest of the world agrees! And so the story continues...

On the other hand, if both these freedom struggles would have been non-violent do you think that Israel or India would have been able to hold onto to these territories? I THINK NOT!

Pure bollocks...some people have the right to loot plunder and rape while the rest have to put their hat in hands and take a beating? Thats utter BS, Palestinians and Kashmiri's have full rights to self defence despite what the monopolized popular media wants to portray. Why doesn't India take a stance of non violence in Kashmir, after all isn't Gandhi the founder of your nation? Jinnah was a meat eating man, he knew the importance of a strong military in order to safe guard our people, we don't believe in subservience to anyone. This doesn't mean every time Indians are engaged by a small group of people that Pakistan is behind it all.

 

[notsuperstitious]

Simla does not supersede the UN resolutions. The first clause of Simla references and endorses the UN charter and principles.

Yes indeed, and as the UN resolution was passed under chapter VI, it is non binding. so under UN charter the resolution is non binding. hence no conflict with the simla accord.

In any case even if it was passed under Chapter VII, the same has not been honored by pakistan as the resolution demands pakistan pull back its 'tribesmen' and army from Pakistan Occupied Kashmir, only after that India to pull back its troops to the minimum reqd level and then conduct the plebiscite. if pakistan was interested in a plebiscite, why did they not pull back?

Just one more example that you just keep breaking ur word. its a habit.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

P2BI:

Pakistan does not support or condone those kinds of actions, nor deos it have control over these groups one they enter Kashmir, however, every institution has some individuals who act against basic principles.

The Indian Occupation Forces however are part of the Indian Government, and their abysmal record on atrocities is clear, as attested by international organizations:

Thousands lost in Kashmir mass graves

18 April 2008

Call on India to investigate enforced disappearances and mass graves in Kashmir and Jammu​

Hundreds of unidentified graves – believed to contain victims of unlawful killings, enforced disappearances, torture and other abuses - have been found in Indian-administered Jammu and Kashmir.

Amnesty International has urged the Indian government to launch urgent investigations into the mass graves, which are thought to contain the remains of victims of human rights abuses in the context of the armed conflict that has raged in the region since 1989.

The findings appear in the report Facts under Ground, issued on 29 March by the Srinagar-based Association of the Parents of Disappeared Persons (APDP). The report details the existence of multiple graves which, because of their proximity to Pakistan controlled-areas, are in areas not accessible without the specific permission of the security forces. Since 2006, the graves of at least 940 people are reported to have been discovered in 18 villages in Uri district alone.
Thousands lost in Kashmir mass graves | Amnesty International

We are talking thousands brutally massacred, raped and tortured by the Indian Occupation Forces, the incidents you highlighted don't hold a candle to the atrocities committed by the Indian Army and paramilitary units.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Some 'freedom fighters' indeed! Sir, permit me a slight deviation here... If I'm not mistaken the photo of your avtar shows the statue of Mr.Jinnah. Mr.Jinnah and a couple of gentlemen from our side (most notably Mahatma Gandhi) were also 'freedom fighters', were they not?

Did Mr.Jinnah and Bapuji fight the British with AKs and bazookas? Didn't they achieve their objective nevertheless? Why? Because their cause was genuine and the way they went about it won the respect and admiration of the world to such an extent that the British were made to look like real jackasses and had to give up.

The reason why the Palestinian and Kashmiri 'freedom' struggles have not yet fructified is because even though these peoples are fighting for a just cause, the way they are going about it is wrong. The violent freedom movements being waged by both these peoples just gives an opportunity to the 'agressors' to show these people as ruffians and terrorists who have to be suppressed, and the rest of the world agrees! And so the story continues...

On the other hand, if both these freedom struggles would have been non-violent do you think that Israel or India would have been able to hold onto to these territories? I THINK NOT!

My answer to that is on this thread http://www.defence.pk/forums/strategic-geopolitical-issues/23916-fierce-gun-fight-rages-kashmir.html

Nehru's lies and reneging on his commitment to the Kashmiris, Pakistan and the United Nations, Indian support for terrorism and destabilization of East Pakistan through the sixties and into 1971, the invasion of Siachen in violation of the Simla agreement - all of that is what led to the Pakistani decision to support the Freedom Movement in the 1990's. The blame here lies solely at India's feet.