Khadim Rizvi under house arrest

[Mage]

Indeed. We hope Pakistan also has turned a corner and is now facing the demons that it should have faced long time ago before they wrecked Pakistan. To be sure Pakistan is also under threat from secular groups like BLA but one look at the last 20 years exposes the ugly reality that the so called religious groups have most blood on their hands. When the world issues travel warnings about Pakistan the biggest percieved threat is the Islamists and not secularists. We must also note that this is not a western thing but equally eastern as well. It's not like the Chinese, Japanese or Koreans feel safe either in Pakistan.

Always look inside not outside. Fix your internal issues and you will be less vulnerable from external pressure. If you improve much more by helping yourself than taking help from someone else. Always look out for your flaws and think how you can you mitigate them.

I believe this should be the way for a nation(specially if the nation is not developed) to act. Don't make noise in the international arena. Keep quite and keep fixing your issues and improve the life of your citizens.

Deng Xiaoping said it the best:
"Keep a cool head and maintain a low profile. Never take the lead - but aim to do something big."

If Pakistan can work on it's image to the world, it will be able to get much more investments across the world which will in return improve the life of average Pakistanis and also give Pakistan a better standing in the international community.

 

[django]

I had parceled him to his leaders for now
Regards

.Kudos

 

[Indus Pakistan]

I am not talking about current laws but ideological roots that led to establishment of both Israel and Pakistan.

Nope.

So Muslim nationalism in India = Pakistan movement = Pakistan

Notice you capped "Muslim nationalism" with India. Your locking a religion to a geography. No can do. Islam is universal and transnational. Certainly not limited to British drawn borders. This of course negates the Muslim tag.

And Jewish nationalism in Palestine = Zionism = Israel

Notce you just said "Jewish nationalism". You did not resrict it to European or America. That is way Aliya can be invoked by African Jews or any Jews from anywhere to right of return.

If you make a phone call one digit can be the differance between call going to Sweden or Nepal. Fact is there is Isreal and Pakistan are fundamentally differant despite the claims made of being religious states. Only Israel is. Pakistan is pseudo-religious state.

 

[Clutch]

This can't be compared to Israel which is a genuine Jewish state and I can cite 'Aliya' in Israeli constitution which gives right to any Jew from and part of the globe to migrate to Israel and recieve automatic citizenship. Does Pakistan have similiar 'Aliya' right open to Muslims? If not please stop comparing.

"Aliya" or Hijrah was made by Indian Muslims to Pakistan post partition. Israel can afford to take in the few million dispora while Pakistan cannot take in the larger number of global muslims.

Israel was primarily concocted by ashkanazi European Jews. Most Sphardic and African Jews did not have a Zionist movement. The European Zionist movement was trying for centuries to form a Jewish nation (not necessarily in Palestine). They used WWII and the Nazi Halacaust to get a state from the British. Then they gathered Jews from different parts of the world with different Jewish backgrounds to form a diverse yet "Jewish" nation.

Israel exists; and has every right to exist. Israel serves as a safety net for the current Jewish dispora... Never again.

Pakistan too is our safety net from the raving hindutva who love to see out blood flow... never again.

Nothing is a 1:1 analogoue... Everything has its on particular history.

But I will always say.. Pakistan First!

 

[Indus Pakistan]

Aliya made by Indian Muslims.

I have differant interpretation of history. I am sure you know about Jinnah's acceptance of the Cabinet Mission Plan but let's leave that for another thread, some other time. On topic I was expecting 100,000s of mobs going crazy across Pakstan after their leader Rizvi was scooped away. Anybody care to expain why the reaction has been thus far muted?

 

[BHarwana]

You know they don't. If they do please cite me the law?

Pakistan was born out of a pseudo-Islam and merely use of religion to secure economic interests. This process led by default to making of Pakistan as much as British attempt at running a trading company to make profit led to making of India.

This can't be compared to Israel which is a genuine Jewish state and I can cite 'Aliya' in Israeli constitution which gives right to any Jew from and part of the globe to migrate to Israel and recieve automatic citizenship. Does Pakistan have similiar 'Aliya' right open to Muslims? If not please stop comparing.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aliyah


"The State of Israel's Law of Return gives Jews and their descendants automatic rights regarding residency and Israeli citizenship."

Disagreed bro.

 

[Clutch]

On topic I was expecting 100,000s of mobs going crazy across Pakstan after their leader Rizvi was scooped away. Anybody care to expain why the reaction has been thus far muted?

Historical Interpretations are infinite; truth is exclusive. In today's world , Information is plentiful and knowledge is scarce.

Pakistan is a much more complex society than many give it credit for. The so far muted response on Rizvi arrest could be compared with the somewhat muted response on Nawaz's arrest.

It is the backdoor wheeling and dealing that determines what happens in the streets.

 

[BHarwana]

I have differant interpretation of history. I am sure you know about Jinnah's acceptance of the Cabinet Mission Plan but let's leave that for another thread, some other time. On topic I was expecting 100,000s of mobs going crazy across Pakstan after their leader Rizvi was scooped away. Anybody care to expain why the reaction has been thus far muted?

Because he is not in jail and in his house under arrest. Please read the title. Yes conservatives are a problem but so are liberals who are trying their best to provoke a violence by poking the other side.

 

[Meengla]

I have to say that this forum was a soothing touch when the TLP goons were burning and rioting a few weeks ago and the govt did nothing to stop them; like the Dawn.com editorial, I too was very upset with the govt then. But then some forum members, especially from the UK and elsewhere in the West, said that govts often allow such riots but only to 'tag' the rioters for a later response. Seems like Imran Khan's govt has just done exactly that.

Also, the way Mr. K.H. Rizvi went about issuing threats against the State of Pakistan, made it just about impossible for anyone in Pakistan to defend him--no one, perhaps not even really mullahs like Maulana Diesel, would really support who was an obviously illiterate person over-reaching... The State of Pakistan correctly sensed that Rizvi is not a Maulana Moudoodi.

Having said all this... I don't think a person should be tried for criticizing courts' decisions or even for inciting the military officials to commit mutiny. We liberals--and I proudly include myself into that--want free speech so long as it doesn't lead to violence or restrict others' freedoms. Mr. Rizvi is a good candidate to be tried for actual acts of violence on the roads of Pakistan. So Godspeed on those trials!!

 

[BHarwana]

What khadim has to understand is that this is not a case of what majority thinks but it is a matter of law and order and in that you don't do what majority thinks but you do what is true, no matter if whole world is against it.

 

[Zibago]

Sometimes I feel of dying from shame when I see how two faced these folks are, living in the West and then cursing at them. He's probably employed there, has friends there and has a brighter future there than most of his compatriots, yet he chooses the way of violence not only against the Dutch but his fellow Pakistanis as well.

For you shame is the only thing to feel here lives can be cut short

Because he is not in jail and in his house under arrest. Please read the title. Yes conservatives are a problem but so are liberals who are trying their best to provoke a violence by poking the other side.

Article 6 is long overdue for Punjabi Sufi Muhammad wanna be

 

[BHarwana]

For you shame is the only thing to feel here lives can be cut short

Article 6 is long overdue for Punjabi Sufi Muhammad wanna be

Yep nothing should be above the law. Only way to bring change should be through the process of vote and not destruction of public property.

Protest is a democratic right but miss use of protest is a crime to turn it into violence.

 

[My-Analogous]

Yep nothing should be above the law. Only way to bring change should be through the process of vote and not destruction of public property.

Protest is a democratic right but miss use of protest is a crime to turn it into violence.

Awaiting your opinion on above. We must do the same and no one above the law

 

[django]

I don't think a person should be tried for criticizing courts' decisions or even for inciting the military officials to commit mutiny.

This by definition will lead to violence and a breakdown in discipline which will leave the nation at the mercy of its enemies, wouldn't the Gangadeshis love Pakistani citizens to openly call for mutiny at the top of their voices as to make it an perfectly acceptable demand to debate and possibly implement,,,, my dear chap if one wishes for a mutiny in Pak army, he/she should be immediately apprehended PERIOD as their is a very thin line preventing us from complete chaos, on one side you have US/Nato/hostile Afghanistan and on the other side Gangadesh and us stuck right in the middle, a very tough neighbourhood indeed.

-want free speech so long as it doesn't lead to violence

Your comments are frankly a contradiction, and do bear in mind the fact that the only reason these pseudo-liberlas have a high degree of freedom to express their views is due to the bravery and immense sacrifices of Pak military ever since the inception of glorious Pakistan!

 

[BHarwana]

Awaiting your opinion on above. We must do the same and no one above the law

I have no opinion on this I have stated the law. I have seen many trolls online trying to provoke tlp my only concern here is that my country remains peaceful. Which it will. TLP tried to pressure a court decision which was wrong because justice is not dependent on democracy but it is dependent on evidence.

Liberals are celebrating this as victory but I will celebrate this as victory for law.