Kayani, US, Saudi Arabia engineered 2013 elections in favour of PML-N: PTI

[Imad.Khan]

People hoped for a change in form of PTI. The courts, agencies and everything else has been there since start.

But PTI can't provide justice when its hands are tied. Also there are some black sheep in PTI that want it to derail.

 

[I.R.A]

But PTI can't provide justice when its hands are tied. Also there are some black sheep in PTI that want it to derail.

If you remember the crowd PTI managed to pull out in PPP's tenure, you would agree that PTI's hands were never tied. It is just that it wasted all that energy for wrong causes. People are the power, and once upon a time few years back PTI had that power.

 

[Zibago]

If that was the case, the military takeover would have happened in the year of 2014. Apparently, General Raheel trusts Nawaz Sharif enough to collaborate together. I know that is not going to satisfy the ego of Imranistan.

That being said, the national interests has been compromised for so long ever since Imran Khan endorsed pro-stances of Afghan-based-Terrorist-outfit-aka-TTP-Khawarij that killed more than 50,000 people including children and women; destroyed the infrastructures everywhere and undermined the stability of Pakistan for years until the message was sent 'enough is enough'. After the military operation, the efforts spent into stabilizing the economy of Pakistan which contradicts the real mission of TTP and India.

Something tells me that Pakistan army knows more than enough not to trust Imran Khan taking the history of Imran Khan's pro-stances of TTP into account which later confirmed with hints by Ajit Doval, in-charge of Indian NSA in regards to sponsoring Afghan-based terrorist-oufit-aka-TTP-aka-Khawarij to promote terrorism to undermine the existence of Pakistan as whole.



No, that is why his name is used as example. Both Donald and Imran are similar that threatens the national interests of Pakistan and USA. The examples has been mentioned above.

Nah i dont think army wants direct rule they want some control from sidelines only

Really SS said we and Taliban have same thinking they shouldnot attack them his party funded sectarian elements in Punjab for years even when their leaders were doing jail

Donal loves Putin Chudo loves Modi
Both used politics to further national interests both called anti govt protesrs as threat to democracy both fund and support fake news sources(fox,geo)

 

[Finer]

Nah i dont think army wants direct rule they want some control from sidelines only

Pakistan army does, and that is why there is huge history of military takeover in the history of Pakistan. They have ruled most of the decades of Pakistan. The reason Pakistan army was sidelined to allow the democracy because of shambolic performance that followed by. For example, East Pakistan to Bangladesh, Balochistan, Blasphemy laws,...etc does not result well for the stability, economically and politically. Normally, there is pressure of economical sanction unless democracy is given proper chance to rule.

Even in 2014, there was pressure from USA, hence the power-sharing agreement between General Sharif and PM Sharif to collaborate together for the long term goals. If power-sharing agreement wasn't forced on PMLN thus compromising the influence of foreign policy of Pakistan, then the military takeover would have been on the card to ensure foreign policy remains intact or better yet, the main establishment remains on top of foreign policy.

 

[MastanKhan]

So by exposing their corruption PTI has strengthened PMLN, what logic is that?

Hi,

Not about exposing tactics---. But Imran Khan is a very poor judge of the time---his tactics---he has no tactics---he does not have the guts to stick the knife in. He had all the chance 3 years ago---and he let Nawaz walk away free---look how much damage to the country has been done since then.

 

[Mrc]

Since this is a defence forum... i will put it this way

There is an issue on going all out frontal assault... cause if u succeed its ok... but if u fail... you fail big time...

If panama case decision is any thing but disqualification of NS... thats it for PTI... they have no fall back position...
Even by luck ik pervails in panama case... he will eventually lose big time some where else
This is hitler like attitude and will eventually lead to ww2 like results

 

[Zibago]

Pakistan army does, and that is why there is huge history of military takeover in the history of Pakistan. They have ruled most of the decades of Pakistan. The reason Pakistan army was sidelined to allow the democracy because of shambolic performance that followed by. For example, East Pakistan to Bangladesh, Balochistan, Blasphemy laws,...etc does not result well for the stability, economically and politically. Normally, there is pressure of economical sanction unless democracy is given proper chance to rule.

Even in 2014, there was pressure from USA, hence the power-sharing agreement between General Sharif and PM Sharif to collaborate together for the long term goals. If power-sharing agreement wasn't forced on PMLN thus compromising the influence of foreign policy of Pakistan, then the military takeover would have been on the card to ensure foreign policy remains intact or better yet, the main establishment remains on top of foreign policy.

Blasphemy law,Bangladesh?

Who is your History teacher?

 

[xyxmt]

Kid? lol. Just coz you can't use Quotes from Hadiths or Quranic verses to support your arguments, you don't want others to use them either.

ok let me share some quotes from some famous individuals.

And my favourite quote which basically tells us about the upbringing of people like you that support corruption or corrupt people

will you also produce Quote Like "chewing food must be done with teeth in your mouth" or "when it itches you must scratch"...certain things in life are well known facts and you don't need to google for quotes. Just out of curiosity what purpose a quote serves when you search it out of necessity, it seems like you had no idea what kind of damage corruption does so you had to find some quotes. Honestly makes you look stupid producing quotes like this, reason I addressed you as a kid for which i was right.

 

[Jzaib]

Geo is trying to make this a new since yesterday . they will get nothing out of it . Geo is a PMLN media cell we shouldn't take it very seriously

 

[Taimoor Khan]

Corruption has always been part of the worlds since mankind. Even then, the nation progressed against all the odds, and even today, the nation still can progress. The main establishment is not free from corruptions either, but that doesn't mean they will sell the nation down the drain. Despite the weakness, people are still loyal to the nation.

Nawaz Sharif was product of Zia-ul-Haq, but Zardari was not planned. I think it has to do with allegedly Benazir wanted to take Pakistan army into accountability for the illegally takeover of the democracy against the wills of Pakistan as nation.

So you connect the dots with the death of Benazir and the exit-strategy between Zardari and Musharraf.

Corruption which destroy the state from within, weaken its foundations so much so that one day it will all crumble from its own weight, anyone with slight sense to patriotism, will not allow it to go on. This is exactly what is happening in Pakistan for donkey years, just because the corrupt rulers are easy to manipulate and control due to their many weaknesses. This has been the bottom line of our establishment unfortunately, which lacks logic and suicidal for the state in longer run. People of Pakistan deserve better.

That's how the worlds operate all over the world, but Pakistan main establishment can go overboard for the greed of powers sometimes.

Imran Khan is not trusted because of his history of pro-stances of TTP that killed more than 50,000 people including children and women; destroyed infrastructures everywhere and undermined the stability of Pakistan including its image.

Not to mention, it is confirmed with Ajit Doval based on his interviews leaving veiled hints in regards to sponsoring Afghan-based terrorism in form of Terrorist-outfit-aka-TTP-aka-Khawarij.

The signs of Imran Khan has been nothing but the anarchism which came at the price of Pakistan as whole. Never mind provoking racial war recently and in the past, 2014, failed before it began. Not to mention, his rigid and stubborn stances that contradicted the national interests of Pakistan, even refused to listen to sane reasons.

JFK was dispatched by powers to be who control America after his speech against the secret societies. You dont toe the line of establishment, you are history, thats how it works everywhere. BUT here in Pakistan, either establishment has become so weak that every tom dick and harry can curse it in public and private or the establishment itself have become so corrupt, that they are no longer interested in keeping the state on the path of defined goals and interests. Both scenarios are terrifying.

IK supporting Taliban is a week argument. All he said that talk to them, find out who is willing to talk and isolate those who are beyond reproach and this is exactly what happened. Why fight with those who we dont need to and create enemies for no reason? Irony is, that current rulers, the Noora brothers are known to have contacts with OBL and Talibans to keep Punjab safe! YET its kosher for them to carry on hanging with the power. Do I need to remind you that how seats are won in interior Punjad by Noora league with the support of same elements?

In my opinion, the only mistake IK did was his utterance before the May 2013 election when he was asked , I think by Indian media about if he would bring Army under his control after becoming the PM. He said that if he cant, being a PM, he will resign. That was amateur response. He should have know the dynamics of power structure in Pakistan. Establishment should come to some give and take arrangement with IK, drawing red lines for both, and let him have it as a third option. We cannot go on with this Noora and Zardari musical chair show for long. Pakistan cannot afford it any longer.

 

[Finer]

Blasphemy law,Bangladesh?

Who is your History teacher?

They are the result of the military actions that made Blasphemy Law reality, East Pakistan to Bangladesh and almost made the same mistake with Balochistan until Zardari, despite his reputation for 10%, undid the damages on Balochistan through his diplomatic tactics for years made pathway for Nawaz Sharif to carry on and fast-track CPEC.

It is same military that missed great opportunity to claim IOK in 62 during the war between India and China which Ayub Khan was ordered not to get involved by Uncle Sam.

By the way, you are not gonna find real history in Pakistani history books. They are censored for reasons.

Corruption which destroy the state from within, weaken its foundations so much so that one day it will all crumble from its own weight, anyone with slight sense to patriotism, will not allow it to go on. This is exactly what is happening in Pakistan for donkey years, just because the corrupt rulers are easy to manipulate and control due to their many weaknesses. This has been the bottom line of our establishment unfortunately, which lacks logic and suicidal for the state in longer run. People of Pakistan deserve better.

Even corruptions exist largely in the first world, that doesn't stop the world from progressing nor that did.

Pakistan deserves better, but we live in real world where the lines between right and wrong has been blurred, and to the extent, it now boils down to the survival of the nation as whole now.

I would very much welcome change, but the change is not there yet. If you are talking about PTI, then it is same political party that discharged its own local accountability team for allegedly exposing the corruption from within. The same political party that had years of pro-stances for TTP that challenged the existential of Pakistan; not to mention responsible for killing more than 50,000 people including children and women. So that leaves the option to what now?

As for now, the stability is best option provided the democracy goes smoothly and hopefully new political party emerges from the democracy system.

JFK was dispatched by powers to be who control America after his speech against the secret societies. You dont toe the line of establishment, you are history, thats how it works everywhere. BUT here in Pakistan, either establishment has become so weak that every tom dick and harry can curse it in public and private or the establishment itself have become so corrupt, that they are no longer interested in keeping the state on the path of defined goals and interests. Both scenarios are terrifying.

You could argue that but in Pakistan case, they are pretty consistent when it comes to the national interests of Pakistan.

IK supporting Taliban is a week argument. All he said that talk to them, find out who is willing to talk and isolate those who are beyond reproach and this is exactly what happened. Why fight with those who we dont need to and create enemies for no reason? Irony is, that current rulers, the Noora brothers are known to have contacts with OBL and Talibans to keep Punjab safe! YET its kosher for them to carry on hanging with the power. Do I need to remind you that how seats are won in interior Punjad by Noora league with the support of same elements?

IK supporting TTP is proven fact, and later became official in COAS meeting in the year of 2014 to counter General Kiyani proposal; the military project. The same COAS which Imran Khan was caught lying misquoting General Kiyani by stating that the military operation has 40% chance to succeed, which later denied and clarified by General Kiyani by stating that the military can eradicate only 40% portion of terrorism and more military operation are needed to eradicate terrorism.

As for Noora begging Talibans to leave Punjab alone, they were begging, not making deal since Zardari was federal government of Pakistan, the only one with the authority to make deals, who was not interested in the military operation repeatedly proposed by General Kiyani. Imran Khan was the face of TTP which enjoined the majority of people in favor of peace proposal for TTP depsite TTP being openly caught for killing innocent people in front of people of Pakistan.

Since PMLN had no authority, hence it was literally begging since Zardari was not interested in the military operation. It cannot be coincident that soon after PMLN came into the power, the military operation was proposed to stabilize the economy that was damaged by TTP thanks to Zardari not listening to General Kiyani for years, and on the top of it, succeeded by Imran Khan propagating TTP as face of peace.

In my opinion, the only mistake IK did was his utterance before the May 2013 election when he was asked , I think by Indian media about if he would bring Army under his control after becoming the PM. He said that if he cant, being a PM, he will resign. That was amateur response. He should have know the dynamics of power structure in Pakistan. Establishment should come to some give and take arrangement with IK, drawing red lines for both, and let him have it as a third option. We cannot go on with this Noora and Zardari musical chair show for long. Pakistan cannot afford it any longer.

That is not only reason, but among many reasons, one of them was his rigid and stubborn stances. He refused to consider from the military operation's point of view despite the evidence in regards to TTP openly killing innocent people in front of Pakistan. TTP was the major threat and still is, and there is no way the main establishment is going to risk with raving madman that cannot reconcile with given his rigid and his stubborn stances that contradicted the national interests of Pakistan for years.

It makes sense why PMLN is set to win the next election because of collaboration between General Sharif and PM Sharif that contributed heavily to stabilize the economy of Pakistan in the shortest period of time despite all of the odds. After what Zardari and Imran Khan did during the tenure of Zardari as federal government, they can say goodbye to the position of federal government of Pakistan for the time being since the main establishment is not in mood to risk TTP letting off the hook.

 

[Zibago]

They are the result of the military actions that made Blasphemy Law reality, East Pakistan to Bangladesh and almost made the same mistake with Balochistan until Zardari, despite his reputation for 10%, undid the damages on Balochistan through his diplomatic tactics for years made pathway for Nawaz Sharif to carry on and fast-track CPEC.

It is same military that missed great opportunity to claim IOK in 62 during the war between India and China which Ayub Khan was ordered not to get involved by Uncle Sam.

By the way, you are not gonna find real history in Pakistani history books. They are censored for reasons.



Even corruptions exist largely in the first world, that doesn't stop the world from progressing nor that did.

Pakistan deserves better, but we live in real world where the lines between right and wrong has been blurred, and to the extent, it now boils down to the survival of the nation as whole now.

I would very much welcome change, but the change is not there yet. If you are talking about PTI, then it is same political party that discharged its own local accountability team for allegedly exposing the corruption from within. The same political party that had years of pro-stances for TTP that challenged the existential of Pakistan; not to mention responsible for killing more than 50,000 people including children and women. So that leaves the option to what now?

As for now, the stability is best option provided the democracy goes smoothly and hopefully new political party emerges from the democracy system.





You could argue that but in Pakistan case, they are pretty consistent when it comes to the national interests of Pakistan.



IK supporting TTP is proven fact, and later became official in COAS meeting in the year of 2014 to counter General Kiyani proposal; the military project. The same COAS which Imran Khan was caught lying misquoting General Kiyani by stating that the military operation has 40% chance to succeed, which later denied and clarified by General Kiyani by stating that the military can eradicate only 40% portion of terrorism and more military operation are needed to eradicate terrorism.

As for Noora begging Talibans to leave Punjab alone, they were begging, not making deal since Zardari was federal government of Pakistan, the only one with the authority to make deals, who was not interested in the military operation repeatedly proposed by General Kiyani. Imran Khan was the face of TTP which enjoined the majority of people in favor of peace proposal for TTP depsite TTP being openly caught for killing innocent people in front of people of Pakistan.

Since PMLN had no authority, hence it was literally begging since Zardari was not interested in the military operation. It cannot be coincident that soon after PMLN came into the power, the military operation was proposed to stabilize the economy that was damaged by TTP thanks to Zardari not listening to General Kiyani for years, and on the top of it, succeeded by Imran Khan propagating TTP as face of peace.




That is not only reason, but among many reasons, one of them was his rigid and stubborn stances. He refused to consider from the military operation's point of view despite the evidence in regards to TTP openly killing innocent people in front of Pakistan. TTP was the major threat and still is, and there is no way the main establishment is going to risk with raving madman that cannot reconcile with given his rigid and his stubborn stances that contradicted the national interests of Pakistan for years.

It makes sense why PMLN is set to win the next election because of collaboration between General Sharif and PM Sharif that contributed heavily to stabilize the economy of Pakistan in the shortest period of time despite all of the odds. After what Zardari and Imran Khan did during the tenure of Zardari as federal government, they can say goodbye to the position of federal government of Pakistan for the time being since the main establishment is not in mood to risk TTP letting off the hook.

Please research origins of Pakistan,s blasphemy law before posting bs

 

[MastanKhan]

Hi,

Take it next step further---Osam Bin Laden and Abottabad strike---. I had stated many a years ago---that the strike was with the permission of Gen Kiyani Gen Pasha and ACM Sulieman---.

Most of you made fun of me at that time and many were extremely sarcastic---.

As I had stated---tactically---and militarily---the U S seals operation was not possible without the help of pak military for the timeline that was given in the interview of the navy seal and the damaged helicopter---.

So---it was only a matter of time that the dead bodies popped out of the graves---and Gen Kiyani's was the most prominent---.

Gen Kiyani was on the U S govt's payroll for a long time---much much longer than people could assume.

My brother had told Gen Musharraf not to trust him---not to promote him---but Mushy being Mushy was not a good judge of character of men.

So---what do we knw now---Gen Kiyani was the go to guy for the americans---he was in their happy books---him and americans were a team---he cared less about pakistan---.

You don't have to be sitting in a meeting to know many a things ( one ver senior member over here posted )---to him I give the great american example---.

When you are buying a steak---you don't have to stick your head into the bulls ar-se to look at it---you take the butcher's word for it.

 

[mingle]

Kiyani should come forward and kill this for ever also explain why he met showbaz and Nisar 12 times Secret plus one meeting in turkey just before election when TUQ said everything settled why his brothers got govt contrats from showbaz ?

 

[Finer]

Please research origins of Pakistan,s blasphemy law before posting bs

This is where your research comes handy to counter my argument. So far you have provided none. Feel free to prove me wrong.