Kashmir | News & Discussions.

[T-Faz]

The more restrictions are in place, the more Kashmiris will be alienated and this cycle will continue for a long time till Pakistan reaches an admirable state (think Ayubs Pakistan). Pakistan is at this state not in a position to put through a mediated and recognised response.

Ayubs mistake was that he went ahead with the 'war' plan rather than using a diplomatic stance to solve the Kashmir problem.

This use of force by India will have long term repercussions. Sure there might nit be much publicity for the Kashmir issue now but be assured, in the future things will change and the issue can become a much bigger problem.

It would be n the best interest of India to appease Kashmiris to the fullest extent they can. If they cannot, they will be stuck in tis quagmire for the foreseeable future.

 

[Rumporum]

I'm from Pakistani Kashmir, Azad Jammu and Kashmir. I view the current unrest as an ongoing struggle and rightful representations of Kashmiris' feelings towards India. My grandad for example, lived through Dogra times and hails the Pakistani Army as his saviors, whereas, he literally loaths the Indian Army for their brutal occupation and war with Kashmir and the Kashmiris. Kashmir was a soverign nation, due to some events, its soveriegnty was breached, for better or for worse, India is still responsible for caring for Kashmiri citizens in a humane way.

Let me give you an example, AJK has a part of Mangla Dam I believe within it, a lot of villages were displaced in the building of the dam. Pakistani irregulars invaded Kashmir first too. However, their is hardly any resistance to Pakistan in comparison to the one in IOK. Why? Because Pakistan has treated Kashmiris humanly and with respect to their deserved rights. Ofcourse, the large majority want an indepedent state of Kashmir, but are very proud of Pakistan and its' achievements. Pakistani independence day is celebrated and Dr. A. Q Khan is a hero. The level of co-operation and brotherhood is so deep due to the common enemy of both peoples, India. Kashmiris see Pakistanis as a brother fighting for their freedom, and as that, a natural ally.

I'll say it a thousand times, Kashmir is India's biggest blunder. The issue could have been resolved, but the Indian Forces acted in an inhumane way against the Kashmiri population, equalling an occupation. - There's a reason I call Pakistani Kashmir, Pakistan Held Kashmir and Indian Kashmir as Indian Occupied Kashmir.

I have asked this before however do you think something like an autonomous status can be given to Kashmir such as Faeroe islands or even better example like Åland Islands. So that basically the entire region of Kashmir is given autonomy on both sides Pak and India. Thus opening up the borders that exist internally.While each side responsible for defence, foreign affairs etc...

Is something even thinkable with the people of Kashmir and bigger question among the peoples and Governments of India and Pakistan?

 

[Icarus]

I have asked this before however do you think something like an autonomous status can be given to Kashmir such as Faeroe islands or even better example like Åland Islands. So that basically the entire region of Kashmir is given autonomy on both sides Pak and India. Thus opening up the borders that exist internally.While each side responsible for defence, foreign affairs etc...

Is something even thinkable with the people of Kashmir and bigger question among the peoples and Governments of India and Pakistan?

According to reports, an agreement to declare Kashmir as an autonomous region was in the works during Musharraf era in co-ordination with India but change in Govt stalled it and the mis-trust following 26/11 confined that plan to the shredder..........we had almost removed the biggest bone of contention from between us, but lost the opportunity to terrorists........

 

[KS]

I have asked this before however do you think something like an autonomous status can be given to Kashmir such as Faeroe islands or even better example like Åland Islands. So that basically the entire region of Kashmir is given autonomy on both sides Pak and India. Thus opening up the borders that exist internally.While each side responsible for defence, foreign affairs etc...

Is something even thinkable with the people of Kashmir and bigger question among the peoples and Governments of India and Pakistan?

The people of India are receptive to the idea of a limited autonomy,but only within the ambits of the Indian constitution --- wherein India controls the defence,foreign affairs and currency and provided the autonomous state gives full protection to the Hindu,Sikh and the Buddhist minorities and does not impose Sharia.

Also the question of opening of the borders doesnt arise till the Militant training camps on the other side are permanently shut down and disabled.We dont want the militants to make use of the open border facilities.

Any other extra-constitutional solution is purely not acceptable and will not be discussed.

According to reports, an agreement to declare Kashmir as an autonomous region was in the works during Musharraf era in co-ordination with India but change in Govt stalled it and the mis-trust following 26/11 confined that plan to the shredder..........we had almost removed the biggest bone of contention from between us, but lost the opportunity to terrorist........

There are some vested interests who dont want to see this problem resolved and they are in both countries. And Im in no way hinting the usual suspects of CIA-MOSSAD.

 

[Icarus]

The people of India are receptive to the idea of a limited autonomy,but only within the ambits of the Indian constitution --- wherein India controls the defence,foreign affairs and currency and provided the autonomous state gives full protection to the Hindu,Sikh and the Buddhist minorities and does not impose Sharia.

Also the question of opening of the borders doesnt arise till the Militant training camps on the other side are permanently shut down and disabled.We dont want the militants to make use of the open border facilities.

Any other extra-constitutional solution is purely not acceptable and will not be discussed.

Again with that govt BS, what evidence do you have to suggest that there are training camps in Azad Kashmir ? An Indian spy satellite circles over Pakistan once every 24 hours, with the capibility to zoom in on objects of interest to an accuracy of within 10 metres yet you have no pictures to sustain your claim. Just a lot of finger pointing. Without pictorial or material evidence, you cannot assert any such allegation.........

 

[Icarus]

There are some vested interests who dont want to see this problem resolved and they are in both countries. And Im in no way hinting the usual suspects of CIA-MOSSAD.

JeM, LeT, JuD ??????

 

[KS]

Again with that govt BS, what evidence do you have to suggest that there are training camps in Azad Kashmir ? An Indian spy satellite circles over Pakistan once every 24 hours, with the capibility to zoom in on objects of interest to an accuracy of within 10 metres yet you have no pictures to sustain your claim. Just a lot of finger pointing. Without pictorial or material evidence, you cannot assert any such allegation.........

It doesnt need a 100 Mil $ satellite to discern what common sense can tell you.

JeM, LeT, JuD ??????

Definitely possible! It may also be some portions in the Army on either side who dont want a cut in their spendings.

 

[Icarus]

It doesnt need a 100 Mil $ satellite to discern what common sense can tell you.



Definitely possible! It may also be some portions in the Army on either side who dont want a cut in their spendings.

Common sense tells most Pakistani members that the TTP are in some way associated with Indian presence in Afghanistan, then why do you complain about lack of evidence ? After all, that is what common sense tells us.............

 

[Icarus]

How's this for evidence?

YouTube - ********* (a.k.a Pakistan) terrorist interview

Pardon me for the indecent video title but that is something beyond my control.

Your telling me that Indian intel agencies are foolish enough to let press interview a detained border crosser indicted in a possible terrorism/espionage/spying charge ? That is against basic protocols.........

 

[queerbaits]

I'm not military, however the nature of my work keeps me with the military. So by that regard, yes I am still active.
As for the ground situation: It was pretty bad at the time, people's livelihoods were destroyed, many had to migrate, people lost homes and relatives since the Indians made little distinction between civilian and military targets. For them, every building on our side of the border belonged to the enemy but we had to be very careful to avoid civilian casualties to avoid losing respect with the Kashmiris. There were quite a few assassination attempts on officers, especially the commandant. Usually IEDs and Anti-tank mines. We also caught Indian spies who came to set up the IEDs and for recon. Most of them are with the ISI others we turned into double agents and they subsequently settled in Pakistan. If you had anything particular you would like to ask, you are more than welcome.........

so from ur post i am to understand that indians attack civilians while pakistan are saints....indians infilitrate and pakistan are tha all whites.....what a impartial view!!!!

 

[KS]

Common sense tells most Pakistani members that the TTP are in some way associated with Indian presence in Afghanistan, then why do you complain about lack of evidence ? After all, that is what common sense tells us.............

Red Herring !

India does not have a common border with Afghanistan or FATA for us to send reinforcements for our TTP comrades lol And they themselves have on many occasion said if India were to fight Pakistan they would sacrifice their life for Pakistan.They are more like our Maoists and no I dont blame ISI for Maoism.

As for the Kashmir issue - pray tell me where these freedom fighters come from when they get hunted down near the LoC.Surely there is no other country bordering India there other than Pakistan !

 

[Icarus]

so from ur post i am to understand that indians attack civilians while pakistan are saints....indians infilitrate and pakistan are tha all whites.....what a impartial view!!!!

No, he asked me how it was at my side, and I told him........
Here's about the other side as well.......
http://www.defence.pk/forums/india-defence/81849-real-life-hero-who-inspired-border.html#post1294929

 

[Rumporum]

So from the responses here that autonomy is probably the best option... What do the locals think of this and despite that after 26/11 the tensions increased are there any plans to restart the dialogue between Pak and India?

As what I see or in my opinion any solution to any conflict let alone Kashmir there must be a basic level or trust and understanding between two parties or at least a desire.. its after that can one come to the main issue. That's what probably is lacking between India and Pak and without that each side will accuse the other and as they say in Africa when two elephants fight the grass gets trampled in this case the locals/people of Kashmir

 

[Icarus]

Red Herring !
India does not have a common border with Afghanistan or FATA for us to send reinforcements for our TTP comrades lol And they themselves have on many occasion said if India were to fight Pakistan they would sacrifice their life for Pakistan.They are more like our Maoists and no I dont blame ISI for Maoism.

But India does maintain a significant presence in Afghanistan.......And they do have a military base in Tajikistan which is 2 kilometres from the Tajik-Afghan border.......They leased it in 2005 and the trouble in Pakistan began the very next year.......What does common sense say now ?

As for the Kashmir issue - pray tell me where these freedom fighters come from when they get hunted down near the LoC.Surely there is no other country bordering India there other than Pakistan !

Ever give it a thought that they could be home grown ? BLA is home grown..........TTP is home grown(to some extent). Why can't the Kashmiri freedom fighters be home grown ?

 

[KS]

But India does maintain a significant presence in Afghanistan.......And they do have a military base in Tajikistan which is 2 kilometres from the Tajik-Afghan border.......They leased it in 2005 and the trouble in Pakistan began the very next year.......What does common sense say now ?

Cmon now you are starting to wildly speculate and give both a cause-effect relationship.And how do you think is militarily and logistically possible to support such a huge group (TTP) operating in almost the whole of FATA from just a single ,medium size airbase and that too far away from the Afghan-FATA border.

And it was only the leasing that took place in 2005 --- the renovation work was just finished.So it became operation just recently.

Ever give it a thought that they could be home grown ? BLA is home grown..........TTP is home grown(to some extent). Why can't the Kashmiri freedom fighters be home grown ?

Some of the militants are misguided Kashmiris and no one is denying that --- But what about the the rest,where do they get their training,what purpose they have across the border,where do they get that AKs,RPGs,grenades,mil grade SATCOM equipments etc.

Surely I guess you are not insinuating that the training camps are also inside the Indian borders only away from the eyes of the '0.7 million' Indian Army in Kashmir.

BTW Breaking news just now on CNN-IBN - Lashkar terror camps still active in Pakistan