Kashmir | News & Discussions.
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chachachoudhary
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@Chacha
I think the above post answered your common sense in a very suitable manner. It is you here who is making a fool out of himself.
Really? Then where are you going to get neutral confirmation? Stop crying for neutral contradiction. Admit that the article is crap and nothing else as nobody else in the world other than a shadowy news group with shadowy reporters in Pakistan has published it.
Pathetic.
chachachoudhary
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To do this, we need firm leadership with a vision. Do you think present leadership with spine of a banana is going to do that. For them vote bank is more important than national interest.
fawwaxs
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Strict curfew re-imposed in Kashmir
SRINAGAR: Indian security forces reinforced a strict curfew in Srinagar on Friday after their decision to briefly relax restrictions for the first time in five days led to huge street protests.
The clampdown was briefly lifted on Thursday and thousands took to the streets of Srinagar to denounce the Indian security forces who have killed 15 Kashmiris in protests over the last month.
Police vehicles fitted with loud-hailers announced late Thursday the re-imposition of the curfew, warning residents not to venture out of their homes.
The Muslim-majority Himalayan region has been wracked by demonstrations since June 11 when security forces were accused of killing a 17-year-old.
As violence spread, local authorities slapped rigid curfews on most of the region, arrested activists and ordered the army onto the streets of Srinagar.
Kashmir is divided between India and Pakistan, which administer it jointly but claim it in full.
An anti-India insurgency in the part ruled by New Delhi has claimed an estimated 47,000 lives.
SRINAGAR: Indian security forces reinforced a strict curfew in Srinagar on Friday after their decision to briefly relax restrictions for the first time in five days led to huge street protests.
The clampdown was briefly lifted on Thursday and thousands took to the streets of Srinagar to denounce the Indian security forces who have killed 15 Kashmiris in protests over the last month.
Police vehicles fitted with loud-hailers announced late Thursday the re-imposition of the curfew, warning residents not to venture out of their homes.
The Muslim-majority Himalayan region has been wracked by demonstrations since June 11 when security forces were accused of killing a 17-year-old.
As violence spread, local authorities slapped rigid curfews on most of the region, arrested activists and ordered the army onto the streets of Srinagar.
Kashmir is divided between India and Pakistan, which administer it jointly but claim it in full.
An anti-India insurgency in the part ruled by New Delhi has claimed an estimated 47,000 lives.
Kashmir - Unending conflict, What is the way out
By: Asghar Ali Engineer
16-Jul-2010
Mumbai: The conflict in Kashmir seems to be unending and the way it is being handled by our armed forces, especially the CRPF is further aggravating it. Unfortunately still it is being addressed primarily as a law and order problem and the aspirations of people and their problems hardly matter. Our armed forces go on violating human rights and they know only to kill. This way instead of solving the problem, we will reduce Kashmir to a vast cemetery. More and more young protestors are dying and death hardly dissuades these young protestors from demonstrating.
It is not that people of Kashmir are really anti-India and want to opt for Pakistan. The recent U.K. think tank survey also established that not more than 4 per cent Kashmiri want to align with Pakistan. They have their own aspirations and problems which must be addressed which are not being addressed and, to the contrary, bullets are fired at them. Now at the all party meeting it was decided that lethal weapons will not be used and instead pepper gun will be used which does not kill but produces, psychological impact similar to real bullets.
Should it have taken so much time to take this decision after killing 15 young people and unleashing angry protests? Even CRPF has suffered great casualties, more than 273 Jawans have been injured in last one month and 1980 over one year. Could this decision not been taken earlier to save young lives and CRPF Jawans from injuries? Or was this technology of pepper gun was invented only before the all Party meeting. Do we have to kill so many innocent civilians before using appropriate technology? Had this decision taken in time it would have saved several lives and would not have pushed the valley on brink of such serious crisis.
I was in Kashmir in June for a workshop on peace and conflict resolution and talked to several people as to what they think could be the solution across cross section of people, including intelligentsia, activists and even common people in the bazaar. One thing which emerges is that Omar Abdullah has failed to deliver on every front and sentiments are overwhelmingly in favour of Mufti Saeed.
Mufti is considered as more mature and is thought to be talking frankly to the Centre and could handle Kashmir problem more satisfactorily. Omar Abdullah has lost grip over the situation and moreover lacks courage to talk frankly with the Centre. This comes out very strongly across the cross section of people I talked to. Also, the separatist sentiments are not as strong as it is thought to be from outside. They are more angry at the mess in which Kashmir finds itself today.
The youth is interested in employment and betterment of economic situation. Most of the young people I met bitterly complain about lack of economic opportunities in the valley. Even highly qualified persons do not find satisfactory jobs. They are either unemployed or underemployed. The separatists exploit this anger and frustration. However, neither the state government nor the central one is serious about it and keep on condemning separatists for the situation.
Also, in case of Kashmir there is serious political dimension that is of our Constitutional commitment to ensure autonomy and Nehru-Abdullah pact of 1953 further reinforced it but under political pressure from rightwing elements this promise of full autonomy to Kashmir was never fulfilled. Again after militancy movement in Kashmir during late eighties and nineties the then Prime Minister Mr. Narsimha Rao promised Faruq Abdullah whom I had met during my visit to valley in late nineties that he would grant autonomy to Kashmir and when Abdullah asked him how much, he told him sky is the limit. These words ring in my year even today.
However, nothing happened and then the BJP led Government came to power whose agenda was to remove article 370 from the Constitution itself instead of giving even a small element of autonomy to the people of Kashmir. Also, the way we held elections since independence never inspired confidence among the people of Kashmir. In fact the militancy in Kashmir began after 1988 elections were rigged and Salahuddein, a school teacher and now head of Hizbul Mujadidin based in *** was declared defeated though, most of the Kashmiris think, he had won.
It was only in 2004 that for the first time fair elections were held and when I visited the valley I found new confidence among a section of Kashmiri people and some of them told me that if fair elections are held in future also, things will qualitatively change in Kashmir and people of Kashmir will align with India. The elections in 2009 too were more or less fair but unfortunately Omar Abdullah does not seem to be in control.
After long years of militancy and violence people of Kashmir have realized one thing, and I am saying this after interacting with large number of people in the valley that violence does not pay and that peaceful solution is the only way out. But they want peaceful solution with honour and dignity and one which addresses host of their problems one of which is Kashmiriyat, their regional autonomy and pride in their culture and institutions.
We do have problem with Pakistan and we do not want to inter-nationalise the Kashmir problem and we do not want to go for plebiscite. All this is fine but what is coming in the way of our winning the hearts and soul of Kashmiri people. The way our forces indulge in fake encounters and seriously violate human rights is not the way to win their hearts and souls. With such actions we are greatly alienating them.
When Prime Minister Manmohan Singh had visited the valley in August 2006 for a round table conference with Kashmiri leaders he had given a statement that there will be zero tolerance for violations of human rights and there were again fake encounters in the valley. Immediately thereafter I conducted a peace workshop and some participants taunted is this the zero intolerance to violations of human rights?
Unfortunately if anything there is worsening rather than improvement in the situation. Day by day human rights violations are increasing. Few months ago two young women were raped and their bodies were fished out of water and till today no culprit has been arrested. Even CBI did not hold proper inquiry, it is alleged and it is suspected that military and police officials are involved.
Again my interaction with people in the valley show that except a small section of Kashmiris, as also brought out in the survey by the U.K. think tank, no one is for joining Pakistan. All they want is peace and honourable existence. The Government of India and the state government have to do everything possible to ensure this. People feel that Mufti had succeeded in wresting some concessions from the Centre which Omar Abdullah is unable to do either because of his inexperience or lack of courage. Whatever the reason, opinion is swinging in favour of Mufti.
Even Ghulam Nabi Azad is rated as better Chief Minister. The Government of India, in order to stop bloodshed will have to show political courage and determination to take bold steps and strictly discipline the army and not tolerate these violations for fear of demoralizing it. Such an approach will play only in the hands of the terrorists and keep on aggravating the situation.
Fake encounters have absolutely no place in democracy and it is nothing but serious failure of governance if innocent citizens are killed by the police or army. Such unscrupulous officers must be rigorously punished. Such killings can lead to serious trouble even where there is no separatist or terrorist movements, much less in sensitive areas like Kashmir where issues of regional culture and identity are politically extra-sensitive.
Regional autonomy in many countries is a serious problem whether other countries are involved or not. For example, the question of Basque nationality in Spain is a serious question and only the other day the Basque nationalists organized a demonstration with 2.5 million people to press for their demand. Basque nationalists also resorted to violence for long and exploded bombs. However, they too realized that violence will not take them too far.
We have to sort out Kashmir problem on two fronts, our own internal front and Pakistan front. Here I do not want to comment as far as Pakistan front is concerned. Here my main concern is our own internal front and ensuring peace in the valley and people of Kashmir, in my opinion, are ready for non-violent and honourable peace. Firstly, development will play very important role. The youth must be won over through ensuring employment. Faisal Shahs case is an important example. All Kashmiris felt proud that one of their own has been selected and stood first in IAS examination. Indian Muslims too felt very proud and organized series of receptions for him throughout India.
Thus to solve Kashmir problem internally what is needed is a measure of negotiated autonomy, economic development, greater recruitment of Kashmiri youth in and outside Kashmir including Central Government jobs which will give them greater sense of belonging to India, expeditious development of Railway network and ensuring non-violation of human rights and minimizing presence of armed forces except in border areas can lead to internal peace.
By: Asghar Ali Engineer
16-Jul-2010
Mumbai: The conflict in Kashmir seems to be unending and the way it is being handled by our armed forces, especially the CRPF is further aggravating it. Unfortunately still it is being addressed primarily as a law and order problem and the aspirations of people and their problems hardly matter. Our armed forces go on violating human rights and they know only to kill. This way instead of solving the problem, we will reduce Kashmir to a vast cemetery. More and more young protestors are dying and death hardly dissuades these young protestors from demonstrating.
It is not that people of Kashmir are really anti-India and want to opt for Pakistan. The recent U.K. think tank survey also established that not more than 4 per cent Kashmiri want to align with Pakistan. They have their own aspirations and problems which must be addressed which are not being addressed and, to the contrary, bullets are fired at them. Now at the all party meeting it was decided that lethal weapons will not be used and instead pepper gun will be used which does not kill but produces, psychological impact similar to real bullets.
Should it have taken so much time to take this decision after killing 15 young people and unleashing angry protests? Even CRPF has suffered great casualties, more than 273 Jawans have been injured in last one month and 1980 over one year. Could this decision not been taken earlier to save young lives and CRPF Jawans from injuries? Or was this technology of pepper gun was invented only before the all Party meeting. Do we have to kill so many innocent civilians before using appropriate technology? Had this decision taken in time it would have saved several lives and would not have pushed the valley on brink of such serious crisis.
I was in Kashmir in June for a workshop on peace and conflict resolution and talked to several people as to what they think could be the solution across cross section of people, including intelligentsia, activists and even common people in the bazaar. One thing which emerges is that Omar Abdullah has failed to deliver on every front and sentiments are overwhelmingly in favour of Mufti Saeed.
Mufti is considered as more mature and is thought to be talking frankly to the Centre and could handle Kashmir problem more satisfactorily. Omar Abdullah has lost grip over the situation and moreover lacks courage to talk frankly with the Centre. This comes out very strongly across the cross section of people I talked to. Also, the separatist sentiments are not as strong as it is thought to be from outside. They are more angry at the mess in which Kashmir finds itself today.
The youth is interested in employment and betterment of economic situation. Most of the young people I met bitterly complain about lack of economic opportunities in the valley. Even highly qualified persons do not find satisfactory jobs. They are either unemployed or underemployed. The separatists exploit this anger and frustration. However, neither the state government nor the central one is serious about it and keep on condemning separatists for the situation.
Also, in case of Kashmir there is serious political dimension that is of our Constitutional commitment to ensure autonomy and Nehru-Abdullah pact of 1953 further reinforced it but under political pressure from rightwing elements this promise of full autonomy to Kashmir was never fulfilled. Again after militancy movement in Kashmir during late eighties and nineties the then Prime Minister Mr. Narsimha Rao promised Faruq Abdullah whom I had met during my visit to valley in late nineties that he would grant autonomy to Kashmir and when Abdullah asked him how much, he told him sky is the limit. These words ring in my year even today.
However, nothing happened and then the BJP led Government came to power whose agenda was to remove article 370 from the Constitution itself instead of giving even a small element of autonomy to the people of Kashmir. Also, the way we held elections since independence never inspired confidence among the people of Kashmir. In fact the militancy in Kashmir began after 1988 elections were rigged and Salahuddein, a school teacher and now head of Hizbul Mujadidin based in *** was declared defeated though, most of the Kashmiris think, he had won.
It was only in 2004 that for the first time fair elections were held and when I visited the valley I found new confidence among a section of Kashmiri people and some of them told me that if fair elections are held in future also, things will qualitatively change in Kashmir and people of Kashmir will align with India. The elections in 2009 too were more or less fair but unfortunately Omar Abdullah does not seem to be in control.
After long years of militancy and violence people of Kashmir have realized one thing, and I am saying this after interacting with large number of people in the valley that violence does not pay and that peaceful solution is the only way out. But they want peaceful solution with honour and dignity and one which addresses host of their problems one of which is Kashmiriyat, their regional autonomy and pride in their culture and institutions.
We do have problem with Pakistan and we do not want to inter-nationalise the Kashmir problem and we do not want to go for plebiscite. All this is fine but what is coming in the way of our winning the hearts and soul of Kashmiri people. The way our forces indulge in fake encounters and seriously violate human rights is not the way to win their hearts and souls. With such actions we are greatly alienating them.
When Prime Minister Manmohan Singh had visited the valley in August 2006 for a round table conference with Kashmiri leaders he had given a statement that there will be zero tolerance for violations of human rights and there were again fake encounters in the valley. Immediately thereafter I conducted a peace workshop and some participants taunted is this the zero intolerance to violations of human rights?
Unfortunately if anything there is worsening rather than improvement in the situation. Day by day human rights violations are increasing. Few months ago two young women were raped and their bodies were fished out of water and till today no culprit has been arrested. Even CBI did not hold proper inquiry, it is alleged and it is suspected that military and police officials are involved.
Again my interaction with people in the valley show that except a small section of Kashmiris, as also brought out in the survey by the U.K. think tank, no one is for joining Pakistan. All they want is peace and honourable existence. The Government of India and the state government have to do everything possible to ensure this. People feel that Mufti had succeeded in wresting some concessions from the Centre which Omar Abdullah is unable to do either because of his inexperience or lack of courage. Whatever the reason, opinion is swinging in favour of Mufti.
Even Ghulam Nabi Azad is rated as better Chief Minister. The Government of India, in order to stop bloodshed will have to show political courage and determination to take bold steps and strictly discipline the army and not tolerate these violations for fear of demoralizing it. Such an approach will play only in the hands of the terrorists and keep on aggravating the situation.
Fake encounters have absolutely no place in democracy and it is nothing but serious failure of governance if innocent citizens are killed by the police or army. Such unscrupulous officers must be rigorously punished. Such killings can lead to serious trouble even where there is no separatist or terrorist movements, much less in sensitive areas like Kashmir where issues of regional culture and identity are politically extra-sensitive.
Regional autonomy in many countries is a serious problem whether other countries are involved or not. For example, the question of Basque nationality in Spain is a serious question and only the other day the Basque nationalists organized a demonstration with 2.5 million people to press for their demand. Basque nationalists also resorted to violence for long and exploded bombs. However, they too realized that violence will not take them too far.
We have to sort out Kashmir problem on two fronts, our own internal front and Pakistan front. Here I do not want to comment as far as Pakistan front is concerned. Here my main concern is our own internal front and ensuring peace in the valley and people of Kashmir, in my opinion, are ready for non-violent and honourable peace. Firstly, development will play very important role. The youth must be won over through ensuring employment. Faisal Shahs case is an important example. All Kashmiris felt proud that one of their own has been selected and stood first in IAS examination. Indian Muslims too felt very proud and organized series of receptions for him throughout India.
Thus to solve Kashmir problem internally what is needed is a measure of negotiated autonomy, economic development, greater recruitment of Kashmiri youth in and outside Kashmir including Central Government jobs which will give them greater sense of belonging to India, expeditious development of Railway network and ensuring non-violation of human rights and minimizing presence of armed forces except in border areas can lead to internal peace.
Areesh
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Rant of a 6 year old girl again. Will you post something constructive on this thread or keep asking, ranting and crying. We gave you a credible source now it is up to you to accept it or deny it with some proof. We have had enough of your immature rants. Neither the source nor the report is crap, if someone is crap it is you.
hal-fgfa
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First off all Army not deployed in cities .. Army is for Border safety there . In cities Local police and CRPF working not Army.
India cant reduce Army presence there you know why .
hal-fgfa
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Rant of a 6 year old girl again. Will you post something constructive on this thread or keep asking, ranting and crying. We gave you a credible source now it is up to you to accept it or deny it with some proof. We have had enough of your immature rants. Neither the source nor the report is crap, if someone is crap it is you.
A Pakistani source is creatable ??? joking na
First off all Army not deployed in cities .. Army is for Border safety there . In cities Local police and CRPF working not Army.
India cant reduce Army presence there you know why .
Yes it is tense at the moment but i meant in long term for Kashmir to be stable and secure Indian goverment must provide jobs to these youths so they dont have time to play with stones all days
Silver-Scorpion
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yes, they have the right and they are getting it...atleast more than your side...and about carrer opportunity..sorry..you know nothing...they have more brighter future than in your side..cause we have work for them..job opportunities..and we know where you stand..
a very small example....
a kashmiri in Indian administration...
Srinagar doc becomes first Kashmiri to top IAS - dnaindia.com
are you crazy ?? do you even know at what positions muslims are in India ?? lol..they have been at postion,which any muslim in the world would envy..sorry no examples here...serach it..or see some bollywood movies or the list of Indian ministers or even presidents..
fortunately..you are wrong my friend....they are staying with us and they are safe with us...the procession that you aretalking about,should be 1000 times bigger to say that every kashmiri wants India to go...BTW..just look at your last sentence..that says it all..see ya.
This is off topic but so was this post quoted above. I just wanted to say that the link you provided about this Kashmiri guy, a doctor and the first ever Kashmiri who topped the civil service exam in India had his father assassinated(this is written in the article for which the link is provided above). I don't know about you but if losing your father is the cost of succeeding in Indian occupied Kashmir then I am glad I do not live there. Also notice how he is the first guy to top the civil service exam and this article was posted in May, 2010. If one Kashmiri guy managed to get a good job and a good future in the 63 years of Indian occupation, that's not saying much about equality instead it makes me think otherwise.
Also your opinion about Muslims having positions in India that others would "envy" for which you avoided providing examples, is also not true. Despite being the largest minority in India, Muslims are rather oppressed. Here is an example and you can see hundreds more if you search for it.
Andrew Buncombe's Asia Diary - Do Muslims get a fair deal in India?
dabong1
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By Cyril Almeida Friday, 09 Jul, 2010
“As far as Delhi is concerned, Omar’s a great guy. He is married to a sardarni, his mother is British. He represents what Delhi would like a Muslim leader to be,” Shamim added.
“But religious identity matters in the Valley. He can’t even speak the language.”
http://www.defence.pk/forums/kashmir-war/64670-indian-army-marches-kashmir-cursh-protests-12.html
So your main man in kashmir cant speak the language......is he still a kashmiri or shall we throw him out of the fold?
Last edited:
Markus
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No, not only the current leadership but no leadership till date has had the guts to do this.
And thats why I mentioned that if India cannot eliminate Hurriyat which is operating from Indian soil then what right does it have to ask Pakistan to take action against its own people.
chachachoudhary
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Rant of a 6 year old girl again. Will you post something constructive on this thread or keep asking, ranting and crying. We gave you a credible source now it is up to you to accept it or deny it with some proof. We have had enough of your immature rants. Neither the source nor the report is crap, if someone is crap it is you.
If you do not have the guts to answer the questions, you should not enter such arguments in the first place. Talking round and round does not make you smarter buddy. Go play outside.
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