Karzai urges Taliban to fight Pakistan

[haviZsultan]

We are still paying for our Afghanistan policy. Zia Ul Haq has already fanaticized the population and now all the population knows is to kill each other. Even Karzai is finding the willpower to talk back to Pakistan, otherwise everyone discounted that country and believed they with their puny military and economy could do nothing.

Pakistan wants a subservient Afghanistan while Afghans favor total independence and hate us Pakistanis. Pakistan should develop a solid policy to deal with terrorism within its own territory. We defeat Hakimullah Mehsud of the Tehreek E Taliban Pakistan and we win half the battle anyway. Then we can start focusing on the Afghan Taliban as well... but we have to set our priorities. Its surprising that we can arrest commander Qasim for NATO by going right into the middle of FATA (in Wana) but somehow we can't eliminate those militants that pose a direct threat to our Pakistan like Hakimullah, Qari, Fazlullah and others. These militants have continously been attacking Pakistan.

I could prepare a team to hunt down Hakimullah Mehsud if given the chance... but no one trusts me it seems.

 

[Zarvan]

We are still paying for our Afghanistan policy. Zia Ul Haq has already fanaticized the population and now all the population knows is to kill each other. Even Karzai is finding the willpower to talk back to Pakistan, otherwise everyone discounted that country and believed they with their puny military and economy could do nothing.

Pakistan wants a subservient Afghanistan while Afghans favor total independence and hate us Pakistanis. Pakistan should develop a solid policy to deal with terrorism within its own territory. We defeat Hakimullah Mehsud of the Tehreek E Taliban Pakistan and we win half the battle anyway. Then we can start focusing on the Afghan Taliban as well... but we have to set our priorities. Its surprising that we can arrest commander Qasim for NATO by going right into the middle of FATA (in Wana) but somehow we can't eliminate those militants that pose a direct threat to our Pakistan like Hakimullah, Qari, Fazlullah and others. These militants have continously been attacking Pakistan.

I could prepare a team to hunt down Hakimullah Mehsud if given the chance... but no one trusts me it seems.

people have close to Islam Zia or else no one could have stopped may be it would have a little late but it would have because it is inevitable and killing hakeemulah will only make situation worse he will become a hero and somebody will replace him only problem will be solved if we end being tout of USA and stop killing our own people and talk to them and accept those demands which are according to shariah only this can bring peace

 

[Secur]

The case is closed for pakistanis and this has been the official position of Pakistan for the past 60 years. For us afghans, the case is not closed. We do not recognize this imposed line as international border and we want this issue to be settled through a fair refrandum among pashtun and baloches.

As I know the coalition forces do not deliberately kill afghans, this is another cheap propagande by pakistani media. They are not in Afghanistan to kill afghans. Their object is to end of terrorism which is a big help for us afghanistan. Sure, they do some misstakes from time to time which is understandable giving scope of war and the terring of Afghanistan. The only nation which is happy that afghans loses their live it is unfortunately the pakistani nation and thats why Pakistan has always supported dark forces who wanted the destruction of Afghanistan.

Yes it is so and the very same for the International community/UN , who consider Pakistan as the inheritor of the old frontiers of British India . Now either you can accept that reality and move on since the agreement by the late Amir is a fait accompli and works towards the prosperity of the country which is just FUBAR from a long time . Or you can continue this animosity towards Pakistan which has only harmed you since the day you started it . This dream of referendum of any sort , anywhere is not going to come true . This is more of a joke , some ruler of Afghanistan signs a deal with the British , another Govt ratifies it with them but only when Pakistan gets independence do the Afghans remember , " Hey that line's illegal and null void " . You cant renounce anything at will in International Law , your position changes from Govt to Govt it seems , this isn't a comedy circus going . Forget it . Nobody in Pakistan even cares about what the Mayor of the Presidential palace has to say .

So , the Americans become saviors now in whom you put all your trust , is it so ? But , Mr Karzai and International media which you trust say the same things about Yanks being trigger happy and deliberately killing the Afghans during their operations , now following their campaigns in other countries , taking these facts into account and comparing it with yours , I have no reason to agree with you , none at all . I must remind you that is exactly the same sort of thinking which got Soviets in Afghanistan in the first place . Rest assured , the only people who have worked towards the destruction of your country are Afghans themselves . I know for one that Saudi Arabia and US also provided help and assistance to your people in their war against Comrades of Kabul and the red army . Yet I do not see their name in this selective history of yours .

stop killing our own people and talk to them and accept those demands which are according to shariah only this can bring peace

But we aren't killing our own people in the first place , now how can we stop what we aren't doing ? Sure , we can accept these demands of Sharia if put down by the Pakistani nation , accept the consitution and participate in the elections and if you get the majority of votes required to form Govt then you can implement your idea but it appears that your friends are more happy to " shove it " down the throats of people on gun point , ai'nt going to work that way because they know the silent majority doesn't agree with this barbaric interpretations of theirs . A few thousand armed thugs do not represent the nation .

@Armstrong

Need your opinion on this , mate .

 

[Secur]

Lol yeah controlled it for hundreds of years.

Do not burst their bubble of " never conquered Afghanistan "

 

[FaujHistorian]

I agree with you. I have to also admit that I was shocked when I for the first time talked to pashtun who said that he was proud Pakistani and after a while I noticed that the majority of pakistani pashtuns are indeed proud about being pakistani which is understandable giving how the situation has been in Afghanistan in the past 35 years. The Pakistani government has been very successful in replacing the sense of nationalism of pashtuns with islamism and thats why today the pashtun areas of pakistan are the most islamised or radicalized area in the whole islamic world. The pakistan instituation and social structure are designed so that the only way for a pashtun to be successful is to accept Pakistan, otherwise he and lose everything and wouldn't have access to anything not mention being killed or jailed.
I doubt that so many pashtun would call themselves pakistani if they had some real alternatives of living if they had some real back up to fight for their couse.

I think we afghans need a closure for this problem and this can be achived in two ways
number one through a fair refrandum under UN supervision
number two the so called leaders of pashtun nationalists like Mahmud khan Achikzai, Esfandyar wali and etc in a join conference declare that they are being a pakistani and that they don't have any kind of intension of joining Afghanistan thats all so that we afghans know that you are happy and we for sure will respect your decision and would recognize the border. As you know you leaders when they came to Afghanistan they are giving long speaches about the miserbale life of pashtuns in pakistan and express their wish of one unified afghan nation. When we afghans hear all this then ofcourse we feel responsible to help our pashtun brothers and sisters.

My dear dear dear Afghanistani,

You sadly areliving in the 50s. Perhaps you emigrated to the West long time ago and thus your contact with the land and with Pashutn's in general is limited to the chai discussion in the local Afghan Restaurant.

When was the last time you visited KPK? (If I may ask).


The situation on the ground is that Pashutns in Afghanistan are living under the iron yoke of ex-Northern Alliance.

----- NA is smart. They have gotten USA and NATO on their side. So now Pashtuns even though in large majority in Afghanistan are in fact slaved, or worse, hunted like animals.





Pakistani Pashtuns living in Pakistan see this clearly, but you do not.


This is why Pakistani Pashtuns have said good by this old commie ideals of separating from Pakistan.


Please move to 2013.

Thank you.

 

[shanipisces2002]

lol this karzai what a retard first he was in Pakistan taking funds for his livelyhood and the country who gave him food and shelter now against Pakistan no wonder these Afghans are not to be trusted

 

[rubyjackass]

We are still paying for our Afghanistan policy. Zia Ul Haq has already fanaticized the population and now all the population knows is to kill each other. Even Karzai is finding the willpower to talk back to Pakistan, otherwise everyone discounted that country and believed they with their puny military and economy could do nothing.

Pakistan wants a subservient Afghanistan while Afghans favor total independence and hate us Pakistanis. Pakistan should develop a solid policy to deal with terrorism within its own territory. We defeat Hakimullah Mehsud of the Tehreek E Taliban Pakistan and we win half the battle anyway. Then we can start focusing on the Afghan Taliban as well... but we have to set our priorities. Its surprising that we can arrest commander Qasim for NATO by going right into the middle of FATA (in Wana) but somehow we can't eliminate those militants that pose a direct threat to our Pakistan like Hakimullah, Qari, Fazlullah and others. These militants have continously been attacking Pakistan.

I could prepare a team to hunt down Hakimullah Mehsud if given the chance... but no one trusts me it seems.

What is missing for your team?

When was the last time you visited KPK? (If I may ask).


The situation on the ground is that Pashutns in Afghanistan are living under the iron yoke of ex-Northern Alliance.

----- NA is smart. They have gotten USA and NATO on their side. So now Pashtuns even though in large majority in Afghanistan are in fact slaved, or worse, hunted like animals.

Sad that you believe in this 'Pashtuns are under NA's thumb in Afghanistan' theory. Afghanistan is trying to build a normal inclusive state. This incitement of Afghan Pashtuns is Pakistani establishment's propaganda. It is no different from the Punjabi army narrative in Pakistan. Do not do to others what you don't want done to you.

 

[ShahidT]

Lol yeah right... all of them rule ur country for hundreds of years... alexander whose quotes u boast... even married an afghan princess!

how polite of you. was more like he f***ed and dumped her on the trash heap, just like dozens of other "wives" he "married" along the way. peculiar behaviour for a f*ggot if you ask me.

 

[Adamkhel]

In the initial days Pakhtunistan was a burning issue. Ajab khan Afridi and Faqir of IPI advocated for independent pakhtunistan and Bacha khan advocated for autonomous pakhtunistan province....but it failed to gain momentum and soon subsided....After that mere mentioning of word Pashtun nationalism was raising eye brows....Through education, literature and media, muslim nationalism was promoted and ethnic nationalism was highly discouraged and deemed unislamic...one of the word that was connecting lar pakhtuns with bar ones was "afghan", it was made sure that they are disconnected from it. Interestingly in domiciles of our fathers and old land records our nasal is written Afghan...Moreover intensive urdufication took place all over Pakistan....The institutionalized pakhtuns of nowadays dont know about their history, heroes and literature, they are as much pakistanized as lahoris...its not that there is any ban on pashto and pashtun matters, but any institutionalized lar pakhtun within pakistani enviroment wont feel appetite for pashtuniyat.
Interesting the least educated, least pakistanized tribals of FATA have still that spark which they used to have against british.....But they are radicalized by ISI since russian war , so in the form of taliban they are on different path...
ANP is doing politics in the name of pakhtun nationalism, they have established ties with military establishment....they even dont talk about Afghanistan...
So wrora the thing is pakistani pakhtuns themeselves are giving up on their langauge, identity, culture, history etc, i wont put blame on punjabis...as pakhtuns are 4 thousands year old nation so desification process and assimilation is extremely slow...but it is a solid fact that if Pakistan remained intact for hundreds of years, as many claim, there would be no pakhto and pakhtunwali in KPK ...my descendants would look and behave like irfan pathan (indian cricketer) and they might be speaking urdu or punjabi.
Moral of the story: keep the territorial integration of Afghanistan at all cost !, make firm unity with tajiks and others, and give up on the doomed ones i.e lar pakhtuns.

Thank you very much for your post!
As I said earilier you are the only one in this forum who knows very well the situationa and is able to analyzie situation in a very realistic way. Although I don't agree with you in some details and overall I agree with your analysis. I personally have changed a lot in the recent years. I was one of those afghans who strongly believed in the unification of pashtuns on both side of durrand line but after a while I have noticed that we the pashtuns for the reasons that you have stated and many other reasons have grown aprat. We might share common ancestary, history and langauge but don't have common view about our future. Most of you guys happy to bash Khan ghafar khan as traitor and salute for Junnah, in the next 20 years you could hardly find anyone who will be able to write in pashto and the version of the pashtu that you would speak would be a hybrid of panjabi-urdu and pashto. Your children wouldn't know anything about Durrani, Khushal or Rahman baba and the culture for you guys would be the cheap and vulgar movies which are made in Peshawor.

We afghans will find a way to restore peace and order in our country and I know for sure that our children would be able to speak/read/think/write in pashto. They would feel proud about their history and culture and they would for sure know who Mirwais neka, Ahmad shah Durrani and Amanullah were. Khan ghafar khan would be resptected and admired and we would lough at you when your children would claim of being pashtun without knowing pashto just like you laugh today at so called pathans.

Ek dum Upar. Pakistan kai liye kuch bhi karu ga. kio Kai ye Pakistan hi hai Jis nay Hum Punjabio ko Panha di and Pakistan accepted us with open arms without asking any questions about our ethnicity or about our forefathers , we are loyal to the land and give preference to the land instead of giving preference to our ethnicities or forefathers.

And when some afghani bad mouth Pakistan, he should be reminded his Auqaat that at the time partition, Ghairat mand Pathan elders decided to live with Pakistan, not with Afghanistan. Tha't a big slap on Afghanis.

Really? Perhaps you are refering to the phony referandum which was not more than a joke

 

[Glitcher]

That is where the disaster starts, why you interfered and helped extremist so-called mujahidin to fight ussr? and you feed your self first, there is more hunger in pakistan 180million population, we are just 30million. afghans are not beggars they just live in your country because in Afghanistan ISI send Taliban and its unstable to live in. As a result those people have chosen to live in Pakistan.

Great answer sir by this way pakistanis should live in india helo sir for your kind info i do apriciate afghans because they dont beg for money here they just ask for food if there is any left from faimly and they work hard i love that but you should not blame pakistan because they helped you when you were oppresed by ussr when us was attacking you and we gave you shellter and you are always a backstabber do you know that afghan refuges dont want to go back to afghanistan because they love it here you guys have no education system and i have many classmates here who are from afghanistan they are here to get better education and plz stop blaming pakistan for all the mistakes you have done it is only pakistan that has helped you and i would love to know any other country you can tell that has helped afghans more than us so be thankfull to All Mighty Allah that Pakistan is your neighbour and be thank full to Pakistan also

That is where the disaster starts, why you interfered and helped extremist so-called mujahidin to fight ussr? and you feed your self first, there is more hunger in pakistan 180million population, we are just 30million. afghans are not beggars they just live in your country because in Afghanistan ISI send Taliban and its unstable to live in. As a result those people have chosen to live in Pakistan.

Great answer sir by this way pakistanis should live in india helo sir for your kind info i do apriciate afghans because they dont beg for money here they just ask for food if there is any left from faimly and they work hard i love that but you should not blame pakistan because they helped you when you were oppresed by ussr when us was attacking you and we gave you shellter and you are always a backstabber do you know that afghan refuges dont want to go back to afghanistan because they love it here you guys have no education system and i have many classmates here who are from afghanistan they are here to get better education and plz stop blaming pakistan for all the mistakes you have done it is only pakistan that has helped you and i would love to know any other country you can tell that has helped afghans more than us so be thankfull to All Mighty Allah that Pakistan is your neighbour and be thank full to Pakistan also

 

[HAIDER]

Karazai desperately saving his life. Few days back he said CIA bribed him and now he is singing another song. Never seen such unstable person. Its better to have dumb and deaf Afghan president, whose policy would be much better then this jester.

 

[Adamkhel]

It is not the islamism or radicalization kid.

It is difficult to argue with someone doesn't accept that simple fact that pashtuns are today redicalized because of Panjabis polices. Panjabis are building modern schools and universities in Panjab and other areas but they have turn the pashtun areas to the center of quranic schools or madrassas that is producing in best case mullas and in worst cases the worst types of islamists who doesn't accept anyone exept the follower of the version of islam which has been invented in ISI headquarter.

It is the sense of ownership. We gave Pushtoons the sense of leadership that this country belongs to them too. And that's why Pushtoons are everywhere. They are Cricketers, they are in media, they are in Music industry, they are in military, they are in civil services, business, bureaucracy. Literally everywhere.

Aren't muslims among indian leadership, crikcet team, media, movie and other aspect of lives in Indian then why you pakistani are barking against India. Doesn't this proof again that you pakistani have dubble standard one which fits your interest and one for others. Of course pashtuns who make up aorund 20% of Pakistan can be found everywhere but in order to reach something they have to say good bye to their language, culture and nationalism and become a slave of Panjab. You can't show me even one single pashtun who have reached high position in Pakistan who haven't been loyal to instuations which has been desgined by ISI and panjabis.

Our next army chief might be a pushtoon from Tank district. A Pushtoon living in Pakistan has at least 10 times more chance to prosper and even lead his country than a pushtoon living in Afghanistan.

I don't know that person but I know for sure that the person that you are refering is a panjabized pashtun who is worshiping the picture of Junnah which hangs on his wall. No doubt that pashtuns in Pakistan had higher chance to achieve something compared to pashtuns in Afghanistan but was due to the war in Afghanistan. Let's see if you can see the same thing after ten years.
[

Do you think a guy like Shahid Afridi who is loved by the whole country. Who has business in non pushtoon majority cities like Karachi and Lahore. Who lives in a posh neighborhood of Karachi would want to abandon Pakistan and move to Kabul just because for the love of Afghans.

Of course he will not and the same is truth about Irfan khan who is a proud indian and if you were still a colony of Angreez Shahid Afridi would be very proud for being a member of the national teach of Angreez colonial team so the point is that this doesn't mean that pashtuns are doing good just because some of them which accept the chain of gholami are doing good.

Our pushtoons are proud of their ethnicity and are also proud of their country. They are wise people. Not idiots. That they would side with a country like Afghanistan against Pakistan. Nobody exchanges diamond with dirt in this world boy. nobody.

They would have been proud about their ethnicity and their country if Pakistan was controlled by Angreez as well so what you say doesn't make any sense. Of course they are wise and some of them prefer pakistan because as you said they have better or higher chances to be prosper within Pakistan but what do you think will happen when they see and if they see that they will be more prosper of joining with Afghanistan and discover the real diamand?

All of the leaders that you have mentioned here are participating in elections under Pakistani constitution. As monkey said ANP has already abandoned the idea of pukhtoon nationalism and are in total reconciliation with the establishment of Pakistan. Mehmood khan achakzai is following the same path. And very soon he might replace ANP to shake hands with Pakistani establishment.

We will see that

It looks like your condition two is already fulfilled. forget about our land and better focus on your own country. [/QUOTE]

 

[Adamkhel]

Easier method...

Halt all supplies, enforce no fly zone, fence and mine the border.
They will surrender without us having to fire a single bullet.

We Pakistanis have no intention of hurting innocent Afghans, but if they start to pose a threat, they will get their arses handed to them on a plate.

Who do you think that you are? You wouldn't be able to halt the supplies to our country for long but we afghans have the capability to halt the supply for most part of your country by giving arms to pashtuns in Karaachi

 

[M.harris]

Who do you think that you are? You wouldn't be able to halt the supplies to our country for long but we afghans have the capability to halt the supply for most part of your country by giving arms to pashtuns in Karaachi

 

[Adamkhel]

Really? It is your democratically elected President who is asking Taliban to attack our people.

He simply asks them to kill those who instruct them to kill their own people which is totally fine and any patriotic president would do that. What would be your reaction if Indian found/train/arm/support a fanatic military group and sent them to pakistan to destroy schools, roads, clinic..and kill whomever they would like to kill and your president would urge these fanatics to kill the country which is against the prosperity of Pakistan? would you in case also come here and like a donkey insist that your president shouldn't say anything about India?

Why do you lough? Do you think this is an impossible scenario and it is impossible to implement this simple plan?