Just three months remaining for the arrival of first ever squadron of thuders!

[TOPGUN]

The bad boys of the sky are due to come soon can't wait to see them in action

 

[ARIZ ZAFAR]

isha'allah


BUT WE HAVE TO WAIT TILL 2012 TO FIN THAT

thats what i want to know.when we have chipped in with 500million dollars which are the components which we have designed.as far as i know we just gave money to Chinese and they did everything.and then we opened an assembly line.thats what we call indigenous?it would have been lot better if we would have invested this money in our own R&D.i know our air force is in dire need to get a new fighter air craft but simply going for some thing like this makes me feel miserable.Chinese played their card wonderfully,they took our money and gave us something which even they wont use.friend its time for us to take our technology to a next level.i know its difficult but not impossible.the other day i was with a Chinese whom i have known for several years and he told me that when they tested this fighter they didn't find it worthy to be inducted in their air force,so they offered it to us at a cheap price.what's the matter with our government?why can't they take decision with their eyes open.most of us might not agree but i don't think it was a good deal when we could have easily got Mirages or even Rafael. there numbers might have been less but we would have got few new generation fighters.

 

[ARIZ ZAFAR]

I have heard that the thunder can really give the MKI a run for it's money, it has better thrust to weight ratio and a tighter turn radius then as compared to the MKI, as long as the fight is not BVR, the thunder should be able to take the MKI real easily................

Bhaijaan do you know what are you saying?please do not make us a laughing stock.thunder and their MKI is totally different fighter.and you said "thrust to weight ratio of thunder is better than MKI"thats utter nonsense.i request you need to update your knowledge.we all love pakistan but i always keep my eyes open and see the world in real sense.please do not mix facts with fiction.

 

[Icarus]

thats what i want to know.when we have chipped in with 500million dollars which are the components which we have designed.as far as i know we just gave money to Chinese and they did everything.and then we opened an assembly line.thats what we call indigenous?it would have been lot better if we would have invested this money in our own R&D.i know our air force is in dire need to get a new fighter air craft but simply going for some thing like this makes me feel miserable.Chinese played their card wonderfully,they took our money and gave us something which even they wont use.friend its time for us to take our technology to a next level.i know its difficult but not impossible.the other day i was with a Chinese whom i have known for several years and he told me that when they tested this fighter they didn't find it worthy to be inducted in their air force,so they offered it to us at a cheap price.what's the matter with our government?why can't they take decision with their eyes open.most of us might not agree but i don't think it was a good deal when we could have easily got Mirages or even Rafael. there numbers might have been less but we would have got few new generation fighters.

The hardware, hydraulics, wiring, electronics, etc is all indigenous.
Engine is russian(for the time being) and avionics are a mix.
The aircraft is worthy by all standards however, every airforce has it's own requirements, China's aircraft's role is mainly offensive and needs to cover long distances. That is why most of their aircrafts are dedicated role twin engine aircrafts, Pakistan on the other hand requires aircrafts for multiple roles and they need to be easy and fast to repair/manage so the maximum number can be pitted against the enemy should the need arise, that is why most of our aircraft are single engine, multirole, day and night aircrafts.
The fact that one airforce does not use a type of plane while another does, does not make it a useless one. Su-30MKI is a beautiful aircraft however, Russia, it's maker, does not use it, does that make it any less deadly ?

 

[Icarus]

thats what i want to know.when we have chipped in with 500million dollars which are the components which we have designed.as far as i know we just gave money to Chinese and they did everything.and then we opened an assembly line.thats what we call indigenous?it would have been lot better if we would have invested this money in our own R&D.i know our air force is in dire need to get a new fighter air craft but simply going for some thing like this makes me feel miserable.Chinese played their card wonderfully,they took our money and gave us something which even they wont use.friend its time for us to take our technology to a next level.i know its difficult but not impossible.the other day i was with a Chinese whom i have known for several years and he told me that when they tested this fighter they didn't find it worthy to be inducted in their air force,so they offered it to us at a cheap price.what's the matter with our government?why can't they take decision with their eyes open.most of us might not agree but i don't think it was a good deal when we could have easily got Mirages or even Rafael. there numbers might have been less but we would have got few new generation fighters.

We already have mirage III and VPA, thay have served the PAF quite well but truth remains that the mirage is an obsolete aircraft. If we buy Rafael's we will have to go hungry for years. It is easy to dream when you are in USA, ground reality is much different.
Plus the French can easily be put under pressure by Indians, who can be certain they will keep supplying us parts should a war start ? The Indians pressurized them into not providing us with the avionics we needed.

 

[Icarus]

Bhaijaan do you know what are you saying?please do not make us a laughing stock.thunder and their MKI is totally different fighter.and you said "thrust to weight ratio of thunder is better than MKI"thats utter nonsense.i request you need to update your knowledge.we all love pakistan but i always keep my eyes open and see the world in real sense.please do not mix facts with fiction.

I think you should re-read the definition of fact, If you read my post again, it says "I have heard".
Had it been a fact I would have said "I know".

 

[Icarus]

thats what i want to know.when we have chipped in with 500million dollars which are the components which we have designed.as far as i know we just gave money to Chinese and they did everything.and then we opened an assembly line.thats what we call indigenous?it would have been lot better if we would have invested this money in our own R&D.i know our air force is in dire need to get a new fighter air craft but simply going for some thing like this makes me feel miserable.Chinese played their card wonderfully,they took our money and gave us something which even they wont use.friend its time for us to take our technology to a next level.i know its difficult but not impossible.the other day i was with a Chinese whom i have known for several years and he told me that when they tested this fighter they didn't find it worthy to be inducted in their air force,so they offered it to us at a cheap price.what's the matter with our government?why can't they take decision with their eyes open.most of us might not agree but i don't think it was a good deal when we could have easily got Mirages or even Rafael. there numbers might have been less but we would have got few new generation fighters.

Like I said before, the JF-17 in it's current form is just a demo aircraft. To discover it's true capabilities we will have to wait until the first 50 or so are completed.
The other ones, with new radar, frame, engine and avionics will effectively be a new type of aircraft.

 

[nightrider_saulat]

Like I said before, the JF-17 in it's current form is just a demo aircraft. To discover it's true capabilities we will have to wait until the first 50 or so are completed.
The other ones, with new radar, frame, engine and avionics will effectively be a new type of aircraft.

JF-17 BLOCK I is equal to current PAF's F-16B/B(MLU) in terms of capabilities
because both have BVR capability and both have limited payload options under their wings​

 

[Icarus]

JF-17 BLOCK I is equal to current PAF's F-16B/B(MLU) in terms of capabilities
because both have BVR capability and both have limited payload options under their wings​

With these upgrades the Thunder's performance may go up anywhere from 30 to 100% !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! This would make the plane Bad a** add to the equation J-10Bs and the future looks bright !!!!!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JF-17#Planned_upgrades

 

[ARIZ ZAFAR]

The hardware, hydraulics, wiring, electronics, etc is all indigenous.
Engine is russian(for the time being) and avionics are a mix.
The aircraft is worthy by all standards however, every airforce has it's own requirements, China's aircraft's role is mainly offensive and needs to cover long distances. That is why most of their aircrafts are dedicated role twin engine aircrafts, Pakistan on the other hand requires aircrafts for multiple roles and they need to be easy and fast to repair/manage so the maximum number can be pitted against the enemy should the need arise, that is why most of our aircraft are single engine, multirole, day and night aircrafts.
The fact that one airforce does not use a type of plane while another does, does not make it a useless one. Su-30MKI is a beautiful aircraft however, Russia, it's maker, does not use it, does that make it any less deadly ?

incorrect.as far as technological aspects are concerned we have not given any input.our government just funded it as we were short of options.avionics is not just one thing it has number of components which are incorporated which simultaneously work with each other.The main elements of an aircraft's avionics are its communication and navigation systems, sensors (Radar and IR sensors), computers and data bus, and user interface.because of our governments short sighted strategy they have gone for Chinese junk.my point is when we knew we have to survive on our own why not to fund our own organization.why not to strengthen our own economy rather than buying something which will be outdated in next 5 years.
The hardware, hydraulics, wiring, electronics, etc is all indigenous.i m not sure about that.hardware is just not about making a iron mounted platform,but using computational exercises make it more efficient ,stealth, realiable and secure.when we know our neighbors have already developed a stealth tejas(80% stealth).and speaking from my own engineering expertise i know Indian's have learnt a lot much technique of making a good aircraft.we need a concrete plan, simply by banking on china will get us no where.if we have to make investment let us invest in joint R&D with other nations.
the end point is we all know we have to counter India's growing military power.we need to work on it not just go on buying junk stuff which are untested,unreliable and not so accurate weapons.i have seen their business model and trust me they are not the best in any thing.to counter India we need a motivated nation with with good R&D.

 

[nightrider_saulat]

With these upgrades the Thunder's performance may go up anywhere from 30 to 100% !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! This would make the plane Bad a** add to the equation J-10Bs and the future looks bright !!!!!
JF-17 Thunder - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

block52,J-10B and JF-17II will be equal to each other in performance and capabilities

 

[Icarus]

incorrect.as far as technological aspects are concerned we have not given any input.our government just funded it as we were short of options.avionics is not just one thing it has number of components which are incorporated which simultaneously work with each other.The main elements of an aircraft's avionics are its communication and navigation systems, sensors (Radar and IR sensors), computers and data bus, and user interface.because of our governments short sighted strategy they have gone for Chinese junk.my point is when we knew we have to survive on our own why not to fund our own organization.why not to strengthen our own economy rather than buying something which will be outdated in next 5 years.
The hardware, hydraulics, wiring, electronics, etc is all indigenous.i m not sure about that.hardware is just not about making a iron mounted platform,but using computational exercises make it more efficient ,stealth, realiable and secure.when we know our neighbors have already developed a stealth tejas(80% stealth).and speaking from my own engineering expertise i know Indian's have learnt a lot much technique of making a good aircraft.we need a concrete plan, simply by banking on china will get us no where.if we have to make investment let us invest in joint R&D with other nations.
the end point is we all know we have to counter India's growing military power.we need to work on it not just go on buying junk stuff which are untested,unreliable and not so accurate weapons.i have seen their business model and trust me they are not the best in any thing.to counter India we need a motivated nation with with good R&D.

The Tejas is not in mass-production yet and like I said before, with the use of composite materials, stealth features will also be added to the aircraft.
The JF-17 is made to replace the A-5, Mirage and subsequently F-7s.
The aircraft can outperform all of them, therefore I would call it a good buy.
Secondly, it will not be outdated in the next five years, it is a 4th generation aircraft and will not be seeing the scrapyard anytime soon. The planned upgrades for the aircraft will also upgrade it to 4.5 gen.
The only 5th generation aircraft incorporated with ANY airforce is the F-22, which is only available to USAF, it will take at least another 20 or so years before 5th gen aircraft become common, so as I said before, the Thunder will not be seeing the scrapyard anytime soon.

 

[Icarus]

incorrect.as far as technological aspects are concerned we have not given any input.our government just funded it as we were short of options.avionics is not just one thing it has number of components which are incorporated which simultaneously work with each other.The main elements of an aircraft's avionics are its communication and navigation systems, sensors (Radar and IR sensors), computers and data bus, and user interface.because of our governments short sighted strategy they have gone for Chinese junk.my point is when we knew we have to survive on our own why not to fund our own organization.why not to strengthen our own economy rather than buying something which will be outdated in next 5 years.
The hardware, hydraulics, wiring, electronics, etc is all indigenous.i m not sure about that.hardware is just not about making a iron mounted platform,but using computational exercises make it more efficient ,stealth, realiable and secure.when we know our neighbors have already developed a stealth tejas(80% stealth).and speaking from my own engineering expertise i know Indian's have learnt a lot much technique of making a good aircraft.we need a concrete plan, simply by banking on china will get us no where.if we have to make investment let us invest in joint R&D with other nations.
the end point is we all know we have to counter India's growing military power.we need to work on it not just go on buying junk stuff which are untested,unreliable and not so accurate weapons.i have seen their business model and trust me they are not the best in any thing.to counter India we need a motivated nation with with good R&D.

As for inputs, Pakistanis were part of the design team, the re-design team and we do make all the stuff I stated................

 

[ARIZ ZAFAR]

The hardware, hydraulics, wiring, electronics, etc is all indigenous.
Engine is russian(for the time being) and avionics are a mix.
The aircraft is worthy by all standards however, every airforce has it's own requirements, China's aircraft's role is mainly offensive and needs to cover long distances. That is why most of their aircrafts are dedicated role twin engine aircrafts, Pakistan on the other hand requires aircrafts for multiple roles and they need to be easy and fast to repair/manage so the maximum number can be pitted against the enemy should the need arise, that is why most of our aircraft are single engine, multirole, day and night aircrafts.
The fact that one airforce does not use a type of plane while another does, does not make it a useless one. Su-30MKI is a beautiful aircraft however, Russia, it's maker, does not use it, does that make it any less deadly ?

Russia uses su-30.M.K.I is the varient used by India which Indian air force has upgraded like they have fitted it with their indigenously built on board computer.and you have mentioned that we have many air crafts which have night fighting capabilities.i don't think in our PAf more than 150 air crafts will be having night fighting capabilities.

 

[ARIZ ZAFAR]

The Tejas is not in mass-production yet and like I said before, with the use of composite materials, stealth features will also be added to the aircraft.
The JF-17 is made to replace the A-5, Mirage and subsequently F-7s.
The aircraft can outperform all of them, therefore I would call it a good buy.
Secondly, it will not be outdated in the next five years, it is a 4th generation aircraft and will not be seeing the scrapyard anytime soon. The planned upgrades for the aircraft will also upgrade it to 4.5 gen.
The only 5th generation aircraft incorporated with ANY airforce is the F-22, which is only available to USAF, it will take at least another 20 or so years before 5th gen aircraft become common, so as I said before, the Thunder will not be seeing the scrapyard anytime soon.

i know bhaijaan Tejas in not in mass production,but when i checked out its details i was surprised to see that it is purely 4.5th generation fighter where as our thunder is merely 4th generation generation fighter aircraft.thats why i don't like Chinese stuff. they got funds and everything now it is us who are suffering.when is our government going to take some tough steps for empowering its own R&D.