JF-17 Thunder Multirole Fighter [Thread 4]

[nomi007]

i think Pakistan need assistance from tai for the engine improvement

 

[fatman17]

i think Pakistan need assistance from tai for the engine improvement

pls elaborate - is TAI a engine manufacturer?

 

[nomi007]

pls elaborate - is TAI a engine manufacturer?

tai have lot of experience

 

[Emmie]

tai have lot of experience

You mean F124/F125? Man, even its latest variant has thrust way lower than RD93..

 

[monitor]

By pshamim

PAF has not been very happy with the current engine situation. A nagging problem which needs to be resolved. WS-13 has not matured yet. Every thing has been positive about Thunder except
the engine which begs to be improved/changed

 

[SBD-3]

I wonder if somebody has posted this tweet from Alen Warnes

Pakistan unlikely to acquire more than 150 multirole JF-17s as PAF CAS looks to reduce no of fighter aircraft over next 6-8 years.

 

[epinephrine]

I wonder if somebody has posted this tweet from Alen Warnes

with 150 JFTs how PAF will be able to replace the whole fleet of mirages n F-7s which is around 300.around 40 out of these 150 JFTs have already replaced A-5s so it means only 100-110 will be there to replace 300 mirages +F 7s.it shows whether it is confirmed that we are getting 18 more F-16s taking to total to around 100 F-16s or we will induct more J 10Bs then originally planned 2 squdrons.

 

[Pak47]

with 150 JFTs how PAF will be able to replace the whole fleet of mirages n F-7s which is around 300.around 40 out of these 150 JFTs have already replaced A-5s so it means only 100-110 will be there to replace 300 mirages +F 7s.it shows whether it is confirmed that we are getting 18 more F-16s taking to total to around 100 F-16s or we will induct more J 10Bs then originally planned 2 squdrons.

JFT order.. is around 250-300
F-16's i believe is around 75-85
J-10's Pakistan is looking forward to around 150 of those monsters.

 

[epinephrine]

i was replying to hussnain's post abt inducting 150 jfts

 

[Pak47]

i was replying to hussnain's post abt inducting 150 jfts

Yup, got it now.. thanks for clarification.

 

[SBD-3]

with 150 JFTs how PAF will be able to replace the whole fleet of mirages n F-7s which is around 300.around 40 out of these 150 JFTs have already replaced A-5s so it means only 100-110 will be there to replace 300 mirages +F 7s.it shows whether it is confirmed that we are getting 18 more F-16s taking to total to around 100 F-16s or we will induct more J 10Bs then originally planned 2 squdrons.

There can be many reasons for that
1- Financial Constraints
2- Operational synergies. At the moment F-7s are serving as Interceptors while Mirages as ground+maritime attack. Now let me put a simple example, say we have 10 interceptors and ten bombers stationed at a base the operational equation for interception role would be 10+0=10 and for ground attack 0+10=10 leading to a total equation of 10+10=20. Now lets say that we have 20 platforms which are true multirole so we will have 20 aircraft for interception and 20 for ground attack now the equation would be 20+20>10+10 (dont take it as a mathematical problem, the concept of synergy is that 1+1>2).
3- Probably they are saving up for some other "assets" just in case they need them

 

[epinephrine]

There can be many reasons for that
1- Financial Constraints
2- Operational synergies. At the moment F-7s are serving as Interceptors while Mirages as ground+maritime attack. Now let me put a simple example, say we have 10 interceptors and ten bombers stationed at a base the operational equation for interception role would be 10+0=10 and for ground attack 0+10=10 leading to a total equation of 10+10=20. Now lets say that we have 20 platforms which are true multirole so we will have 20 aircraft for interception and 20 for ground attack now the equation would be 20+20>10+10 (dont take it as a mathematical problem, the concept of synergy is that 1+1>2).
3- Probably they are saving up for some other "assets" just in case they need them

u r very right but there is a saying that "quantity has its own quality" n it is right to some extent.air forces r generally compared in terms of the number of fighter aircrafts n then comes their quality.if u have 350 jets against 750 indian jets then paf pilots will be under pressure mentally just because of the difference in the numbers of the air crafts.on the other hand if u have 500 jets against 750 then the mental state of the pilots will be different.
so 150 JFTs+100 F-16s +100 J10=350
n if we get 250-300 jets as planned so far then the figure will be very much decent (450-500).something which we are already maintaining

 

[ziaulislam]

with 150 JFTs how PAF will be able to replace the whole fleet of mirages n F-7s which is around 300.around 40 out of these 150 JFTs have already replaced A-5s so it means only 100-110 will be there to replace 300 mirages +F 7s.it shows whether it is confirmed that we are getting 18 more F-16s taking to total to around 100 F-16s or we will induct more J 10Bs then originally planned 2 squdrons.

pakistan increase its squardon in 90s from 21 to 26 because it had to fill in the techn gap through induction of older aircrafts.
its possible that we may size down our air force back to 21-22 sq.(india has plans to operate 42 sq currently it is at 32sq)

in that case we will need approx 370 aircrafts
150jf-17s+80f-16s(if we get few old ones)+50 odd j-10s(may be only 36 or more than 50)+50 f-7PGs

even this put us short of the target so their are two possibies
increase in j-10 order
or get more older f-16s
or may be its just rumor we may see further orders on jf-17

in long run i think around 2025 f-7PGs may be replaced by fifth gen aircraft..i am sure PAF will be planning something on paper atleast


i dont think so we are going to order more than 60-70 J-10s unless we get a very attractive Chinese offer
so goes for f-16s we wount go above 80-90 ACs
lastly PN might independently order JF-17 , the naval chief has shown public interst in it, concurrently seeing the naval JF-17 in testing also hints towards it. This would mean that PAF will be able to divert its focus more on IAF

 

[SBD-3]

pakistan increase its squardon in 90s from 21 to 26 because it had to fill in the techn gap through induction of older aircrafts.
its possible that we may size down our air force back to 21-22 sq.(india has plans to operate 42 sq currently it is at 32sq)

in that case we will need approx 370 aircrafts
150jf-17s+80f-16s(if we get few old ones)+50 odd j-10s(may be only 36 or more than 50)+50 f-7PGs

even this put us short of the target so their are two possibies
increase in j-10 order
or get more older f-16s
or may be its just rumor we may see further orders on jf-17

in long run i think around 2025 f-7PGs may be replaced by fifth gen aircraft..i am sure PAF will be planning something on paper atleast


i dont think so we are going to order more than 60-70 J-10s unless we get a very attractive Chinese offer
so goes for f-16s we wount go above 80-90 ACs
lastly PN might independently order JF-17 , the naval chief has shown public interst in it, concurrently seeing the naval JF-17 in testing also hints towards it. This would mean that PAF will be able to divert its focus more on IAF

Separate naval air arm is unlikely since pervaiz shamim sahib once said that a limited number of JFTs would be having antiship capabilities.

 

[SBD-3]

u r very right but there is a saying that "quantity has its own quality" n it is right to some extent.air forces r generally compared in terms of the number of fighter aircrafts n then comes their quality.if u have 350 jets against 750 indian jets then paf pilots will be under pressure mentally just because of the difference in the numbers of the air crafts.on the other hand if u have 500 jets against 750 then the mental state of the pilots will be different.
so 150 JFTs+100 F-16s +100 J10=350
n if we get 250-300 jets as planned so far then the figure will be very much decent (450-500).something which we are already maintaining

You have to understand that Indians are constrained from all sides i.e. China Pakistan Bangladesh and perhaps Srilanka too. With China arming all of its allies with modern weaponry, it is in fact putting more pressure on Indian defence doctrine forcing them to increase spending for staying on par. So even if IAF operates 1000 platforms, it must be noted that IAF's strenght will not be concentrated against one country i.e. IAF may allocate 300 out of its 700 units for western borders but not 1000 Units. This, IMHO provides room for comfort for PAF to maintain its current inventory.