JF-17 Thunder in Dubai Air Show 2013.

[Ghareeb_Da_Baal]

yaar, sheeshay to tint kara lo.

 

[fatman17]

the platform is maturing very well. this is good news.

 

[SQ8]

One has to understand that the PAF had zero idea of what to do in an airshow. Previously its only experience at airshows was the Islamabad day parade and that too was the F-16 doing some very conventional stuff. That same idea was carried onto the JF-17, however as feedback was "forced" in due to the noise of people pooh- pooing the display..it looks like someone decided to go over the videos of experienced manufacturers and pick out some ideas.

 

[Rahil khan]

When the Arab commentator was asking about the dual seat version of Thunder, and the English commentator explained about rumor that PAF don't acutally require it, why that Arab commentator laughed? Wasn't that strange?

 

[MastanKhan]

@MastanKhan

Mastan sahib, your inputs on the recent performance of jf-17 would be welcome.



At the end, the aircraft goes vertical to 10,000ft and the spectators are left clueless!

Hi,

It is all about the weapons system at this stage----. There is a saying in golf----'drive is for show----putting is for dough'. As I have said many a years ago---it takes about 8 to 10 years for a new aircraft and its pilots to come around.

The bottomline would be its weapons system---. That is what makes or breaks the aircraft.

 

[MastanKhan]

One has to understand that the PAF had zero idea of what to do in an airshow. Previously its only experience at airshows was the Islamabad day parade and that too was the F-16 doing some very conventional stuff. That same idea was carried onto the JF-17, however as feedback was "forced" in due to the noise of people pooh- pooing the display..it looks like someone decided to go over the videos of experienced manufacturers and pick out some ideas.

Hi,

That is a very poor reflection of PAF. If an air force like paf does not know what air shows need and require---then it shows how closed minded and rigid this organization is.

 

[Manticore]

Hi,

It is all about the weapons system at this stage----. There is a saying in golf----'drive is for show----putting is for dough'. As I have said many a years ago---it takes about 8 to 10 years for a new aircraft and its pilots to come around.

The bottomline would be its weapons system---. That is what makes or breaks the aircraft.

so, have the jft weapons systems broken the aircraft?

 

[MastanKhan]

so, have the jft weapons systems broken the aircraft?

The aircraft is not fully operational yet---and neither is the weapons system!

 

[Bossman]

One has to understand that the PAF had zero idea of what to do in an airshow. Previously its only experience at airshows was the Islamabad day parade and that too was the F-16 doing some very conventional stuff. That same idea was carried onto the JF-17, however as feedback was "forced" in due to the noise of people pooh- pooing the display..it looks like someone decided to go over the videos of experienced manufacturers and pick out some ideas.

I think you are not familiar with aerobatic legacy of the PAF. It was the first and maybe the only air force to do a loop with a full squadron strength and the only air force to use bombers i.e. B57s in formation aerobatics. So it is not a matter of skill or style. Its a matter of allocating scarce resources for a dedicated aerobatic team which very few countries in the world have. As far as JF17 is concerned, it is an evolutionary process. It is advisable to take a conservative approach and avoid any serious mishaps in the early stages of an aircraft's development. If a country has an established aviation industry like Russia for example it can get away with a few crashes at international airshows but for a country like Pakistan, any mishap at an international airshow would pretty much mean an end to any international interest in the aircraft.

 

[SQ8]

I think you are not familiar with aerobatic legacy of the PAF. It was the first and maybe the only air force to do a loop with a full squadron strength and the only air force to use bombers i.e. B57s in formation aerobatics. So it is not a matter of skill or style. Its a matter of allocating scarce resources for a dedicated aerobatic team which very few countries in the world have. As far as JF17 is concerned, it is an evolutionary process. It is advisable to take a conservative approach and avoid any serious mishaps in the early stages of an aircraft's development. If a country has an established aviation industry like Russia for example it can get away with a few crashes at international airshows but for a country like Pakistan, any mishap at an international airshow would pretty much mean an end to any international interest in the aircraft.

I am quite familiar with that. Legacy however is not reflective of current realities. Doing a loop with full squadron strength and bombers back in 50's and 60's has little to do with Airshow sensibilities. Back then ..waggling the tail about would get a crowd in frenzy. The last performance of the JF-17 also was not conservative as such either.. Cuban eights, and loops are stressful on the aircraft as well. But it was outdated. These were airshow manoeuvres practised on the F-16 when it gave its display at Farnborough in the 80's. The PAF has a rigid mindset when it comes to picking up more public savvy details and it clearly shows. None of the reasons you state are relevant to maintaining a poor public relations activity on the aircraft while similar amounts of money are spent on ridiculous TV soaps with bad animation.

Hi,

That is a very poor reflection of PAF. If an air force like paf does not know what air shows need and require---then it shows how closed minded and rigid this organization is.

That is reflective of entire Pakistani state machinery.. of which the PAF is part of.

 

[BATMAN]

PAF is trying to sell an aircraft to airforce professionals from across the globe. Who may be least interested in aerobics. What they are interested to see is the a/c not the aerobic skills of pilot.

 

[BATMAN]

Finally the video !!!! thanks to Usman shabbir of pak def

Good commentary and Maverick (Pakistani) performance, as always.
FWB working nicely, and a comprehensive weapon package makes it a true multirole fighter.

 

[Ahmad Masood]

Good commentary and Maverick (Pakistani) performance, as always.
FWB working nicely, and a comprehensive weapon package makes it an multirole fighter.

Wikipedia states JF-17 as a 4th gen fighter whereas some believe its middlish 3rd-4th gen fighter. Is block 1 of JF-17 really a 3rd gen fighter? will block 2 with its a more advanced avionics (i heard) will be counted as 4th gen?

 

[BATMAN]

Wikipedia states JF-17 as a 4th gen fighter whereas some believe its middlish 3rd-4th gen fighter. Is block 1 of JF-17 really a 3rd gen fighter? will block 2 with its a more advanced avionics (i heard) will be counted as 4th gen?

This confusion is because of Chinese classification of generation.
JF-17 is 4th generation by western standards, its a day/night multirole aircraft, FBW, data sharing in netcentric warfare, HUD... some features as proff enough of it being 4th generation, where as its stealth features puts it into 4.5 generation.
No one is making 3rd generation a/c these days. It is stupid to believe ground less Indian propaganda, in this regard.
Anyhow, generation classification is very basic, way to differentiate a/c. It really reflects the generations of the aircraft, they have evolved from and you can write pages on it. There is another thread ,,, info pool take a peep in it..

 

[Ahmad Masood]

This confusion is because of Chinese classification of generation.
JF-17 is 4th generation by western standards, its a day/night multirole aircraft, FBW, data sharing in netcentric warfare, HUD... some features as proff enough of it being 4th generation, where as its stealth features puts it into 4.5 generation.
No one is making 3rd generation a/c these days. It is stupid to believe ground less Indian propaganda, in this regard.
Anyhow, generation classification is very basic, way to differentiate a/c. It really reflects the generations of the aircraft, they have evolved from and you can write pages on it. There is another thread ,,, info pool take a peep in it..

You are right. I am new and what i see most at defence.pk is 'Propaganda'. Never mind, thanks for reply. i will check the other thread.