JF-17 Block-3 -- Updates, News & Discussion

[Dazzler]

Any indication what the specs of the WS-13X engine are and how it compares in performance to the RD-93 and RD-93MA engines?

always good to have an alternative engine, just in case relations with the Russians deteriorate.

Last I checked they were testing IPE variant of ws-13. If that's the case, then it should be similar or slightly better than 93m. However, 93m has same dimensions at baseline so no external/ modifications needed. Flight testing was underway since March 2021.
Paf birds will stick to MA. But exports might feature 13 especially markets where Russia and China are competing head on. Argentina being a test case.
China doesn't want anyone to ruin th deal like Ukrainians did with Peru mbt fiasco.

There are significant technical observations I have made in new block, should stirr some arguments with regards to newer blocks of falcon, rafale & 30mki @Deino @Eveybody - where is @Oscar ?

He is @SQ8 these days.

I replied to the post above, which quoted your two years old claim that you still ignored to explain … and if you would read properly; Huitong does not agree with you.

So a WS-13 that eventually was tested just a few weeks ago was already recognised by you two years ago?? You must indeed have miraculous analytical capabilities, but what-else should be expected from one who sees fuel in the cockpit walls?

But it seems you like to make bold statements out of the blue, like to ignore arguments and then instead prefer to rant. Well done for an alleged consultant!,

Worry not. I forgive you.

 

[Deino]

There are significant technical observations I have made in new block, should stirr some arguments with regards to newer blocks of falcon, rafale & 30mki @Deino @Eveybody - where is @Oscar ?

Sounds interesting, so please go ahead! ... I'll listen carefully.

 

[siegecrossbow]

aaaaah...good eye! what does it mean?

To prevent different areas of the wing from stalling out before others during high AOA maneuvers.

 

[Dazzler]

optic databus?

MIL-STD-1773 Data Bus

man.fas.org

 

[Cookie Monster]

MIL-STD-1773 Data Bus

man.fas.org

But is that an indication of things to come? Like as a first step...towards future proofing? Not only JF17(even if little by little) but mainly preparing for Azm NGF? To make it resistant to any possible emp threats?
My surprise is bcuz I didn't expect that in JF17...considering how the main goal has been to keep costs low...while still meeting the basic needs...as we saw with choices like not having FBW in all three axis(initially).

 

[Pak Nationalist]

Blk 2 comes with an IFR to extend the operational range of JF-17. My question is that without an onboard OBOGs, is the IFR probe any useful? I do not believe even Blk 3 would be having an OBOGS, can somebody correct me if I am wrong?

 

[Syed_Adeel]

Blk 2 comes with an IFR to extend the operational range of JF-17. My question is that without an onboard OBOGs, is the IFR probe any useful? I do not believe even Blk 3 would be having an OBOGS, can somebody correct me if I am wrong?

Yes the IFR is useful because
1) BlockII has increased capacity cylinders installed to support IFR and longer loiter time.
2) In usual missions, multiple IFR are not considered so it is believed that pilot will not be in air for more than twice time(he can sustain with full internal tanks once)

 

[Pak Nationalist]

Yes the IFR is useful because
1) BlockII has increased capacity cylinders installed to support IFR and longer loiter time.
2) In usual missions, multiple IFR are not considered so it is believed that pilot will not be in air for more than twice time(he can sustain with full internal tanks once)

Are you talking about LOX cylinders? Why did we not go for proper OBOGS? Cost and spatial constraints?

 

[iLION12345_1]

Are you talking about LOX cylinders? Why did we not go for proper OBOGS? Cost and spatial constraints?

Cost and complexity mainly I would say. At some point OBOGS starts saving you space rather than taking up more since you’re replacing large oxygen tanks. However block 2 onwards has increased oxygen capacity, apparently 5.5 hours + , even with IFR, that’s more than enough to sustain the pilot. Given Pakistan and India’s geography as well as the type of missions PAF employs the JF-17 in, longer missions than that will be extremely rare if any at all. So they likely do not see the benefit to be necessary enough to increase the cost.

 

[Deino]

View attachment 773904

JF17 Block 3...

You are late at the party ... has already been posted (several times) last week!

Anyway a nice image of prototype no. 3000 (I assume).

 

[Syed_Adeel]

Are you talking about LOX cylinders? Why did we not go for proper OBOGS? Cost and spatial constraints?

Not sure about block 3 but at least in block 2 they are using the cylinders.
BTW OBOGs is a nice to have otherwise Cylinder do their required work. It could be a matter of redesigning, cost and testing a new system from scratch which has pushed PAF to use cylinders as quick solution.

 

[Pak Nationalist]

Cost and complexity mainly I would say. At some point OBOGS starts saving you space rather than taking up more since you’re replacing large oxygen tanks. However block 2 onwards has increased oxygen capacity, apparently 5.5 hours + , even with IFR, that’s more than enough to sustain the pilot. Given Pakistan and India’s geography as well as the type of missions PAF employs the JF-17 in, longer missions than that will be extremely rare if any at all. So they likely do not see the benefit to be necessary enough to increase the cost.

However, Thunders would be handicapped in maritime strike roles, don't you think?

 

[CriticalThought]

But is that an indication of things to come? Like as a first step...towards future proofing? Not only JF17(even if little by little) but mainly preparing for Azm NGF? To make it resistant to any possible emp threats?
My surprise is bcuz I didn't expect that in JF17...considering how the main goal has been to keep costs low...while still meeting the basic needs...as we saw with choices like not having FBW in all three axis(initially).

Fiber optic naturally supports higher data rates. Latest weapons that rely on sensor fusion will naturally require more data interexchange. The AESA radar, if integrated with a SPECTRA like EW package can provide much richer information as well. This means, there will be weapons and systems that simply aren't available on older blocks, unless and until they are upgraded, which I find doubtful. It also means optically activated actuators on control surfaces. The most important part would be the DEEC (Digital Electronic Engine Control) on the RD-93 and how that has been interfaced with the optic bus. Was the engine upgraded for this?

 

[iLION12345_1]

However, Thunders would be handicapped in maritime strike roles, don't you think?

Why so? 5.5+ hours of oxygen, IFR and couple hundred kilometer range on the Missile itself. thats more than enough.…PN is mainly defensive at the moment but is undergoing a massive upgrade, when they need to go offensive, they’ll procure Air assets accordingly.
Some deep strike fighters for both PAF and PN would be ideal, guessing that’s where Azm or another FGFA will come in.

 

[messiach]

spoonfeed !!

Carry on Miss we are hearing