Japan's stealth jet prototype 'to fly this year'

[Gessler]

I think the two fighters are likely to be comparable.Remember the Chinese have immense experience now in building airframes, and radars/electronics from their many fighter programs like JF-17, J-10B and the J-11 series(ok the airframe design is Russian but everything else is Chinese there) Only area of weakness is engines but that will only take a matter of time to fix.

Anyway, good to hear that the Japanese are so far advanced in the military sphere.

Yeah...well Japanese also built Mitsubishi F-2 (F-16) and F-15J fighters.

 

[longewala]

After all the boasting, Japan's ATX turns out to be a copy of LCA Tejas. Cannot get more primitive than copying Indians.

Well, you have to realise not everyone can be as innovative and original as the Chinese when it comes to creating new designs or weapons.

 

[UKBengali]

Yeah...well Japanese also built Mitsubishi F-2 (F-16) and F-15J fighters.

F-2 is better experience as pretty much the whole aircraft, bar the engines is their own.

F-15J was built from assembled kits

 

[Gessler]

Dude, you comparing a low-bypass engine to powerful engine like WS-15 or the US F119. What a joke! LOL


All low grade, low quality scale engine. And most of them have first run in 2000s while our engine WS-10 have its 1st run in 1990s.

Japan had highly pacifist regime. They did barely like 2/10th of what they could actually do due to all the restrictions.

Low quality? OK, so Japanese are low qualify are Chinese are high quality? Last time I heard during Zuhai airshow,
WS-10 TBO is like 300 hours and WS-13 is about half that much (150 hours). That's another word for pathetic.

You are the first person to claim Japanese machinery/electronics as low quality - you must be from the future.

 

[xunzi]

Well, you have to realise not everyone can be as innovative and original as the Chinese when it comes to creating new designs or weapons.

Our design philosophy is a mixture of the past superpower USA and Soviet aircraft design influence. That's why you see our weapon system integrate various advantage of the West and East aerodynamic design. We are hybrid creature as you can see.

 

[Gessler]

After all the boasting, Japan's ATX turns out to be a copy of LCA Tejas. Cannot get more primitive than copying Indians.

A twin-engine copied from a single-engine aircraft, eh?

Apparently you don't have 0.00000000001% of Buddha's wisdom.

 

[Audio]

Our design philosophy is a mixture of the past superpower USA and Soviet aircraft design influence.

No, that's not the real reason why there's mixture.

 

[xunzi]

Japan had highly pacifist regime. They did barely like 2/10th of what they could actually do due to all the restrictions.

Low quality? OK, so Japanese are low qualify are Chinese are high quality? Last time I heard during Zuhai airshow,
WS-10 TBO is like 300 hours and WS-13 is about half that much (150 hours). That's another word for pathetic.

You are the first person to claim Japanese machinery/electronics as low quality - you must be from the future.

I see that you are a Gundam fan so you don't have a good understanding of military tech matter. LOL

Those are low quality engine design for commercial jet and renaissance type aircraft. To power the big boy, you would need a bigger power thrust than anything the Japanese can produce, which is not saying much because they never produce any engine more powerful than WS-10 initial production. I'm not even going to mention the upgrade version of WS-10 that we developed as we gained experience in the late 2000s.

I don't believe an Indian talking about Zuhai airshow is credible,e specially from the so called "heard". LOL What do you know about WS-10A, WS-10A, WS-10B, WS-10G?

No, that's not the real reason why there's mixture.

It is common to have influence from the Soviet design as we are born out of using Soviet hardware for a long time. But this is good because we found flaw in Soviet design and try to compensate that with Western design that we find better, along with our own research design. This make our aircraft rather unique. This is why you see the J-20 design has principle and design philosophy of F-22, MIR, and Su variant.

 

[Audio]

It is common to have influence from the Soviet design as we are born out of using Soviet hardware for a long time. But this is good because we found flaw in Soviet design and try to compensate that with Western design that we find better, along with our own research design. This make our aircraft rather unique. This is why you see the J-20 design has principle and design philosophy of F-22, MIR, and Su variant.

Seriously....anyone believes this?

 

[xunzi]

Seriously....anyone believes this?

Who believe in your bullshit when you provide no counter? LOL Ssay something, my friend.

 

[Gessler]

I see that you are a Gundam fan so you don't have a good understanding of military tech matter. LOL

Ofcourse. For example, I don't even know what the liquid used to cool AESA T/R modules is called.

Those are low quality engine design for commercial jet

Does it say in Chinese dictionary that engines for commercial jets are of low quality? They are not low quality,
they are just a different type of engine used for different purpose. But the workings are of the same basic
type - both are turbofan engines.

and renaissance type aircraft.

Reconnaissance, not renaissance. Renaissance takes on an entirely different meaning. Refer to proper Oxford
English dictionary when posting in an English-writing forum, not those Chinese English dictionaries you've got.

To power the big boy, you would need a bigger power thrust than anything the Japanese can produce, which is not saying much because they never produce any engine more powerful than WS-10 initial production. I'm not even going to mention the upgrade version of WS-10 that we developed as we gained experience in the late 2000s.

Meh. Name one critical technology (like crystal blades, high-performance alloys, high pressure chambers etc.) related
to aero engines that Japanese cannot produce? It's nothing they cannot produce, just that they never had to produce
them for their needs, which were met by US-built engines as a default. But in no way can one claim Japanese cannot
do that - they already did great aerospace technology.

For example, look at their AESA technology. The first AESA radar to be put on a warship was developed by Japan
in the 1980s. The first series-production AESA radar to be used on a fighter jet was developed by Japan. The first ground-based AESA radar to become operational was developed by Japan, all in the 1990s.

The first AESA radar to be put on a missile seeker is currently being developed by Japan.

Where does China stand in comparison? You still don't have a single operational fighter squadron with an
indigenous AESA radar, now in 2014! So you see, Japanese have been highly pacifist and restrained in what
fields they venture into, but in the areas where they are active, they are often the world beaters.

I don't believe an Indian talking about Zuhai airshow is credible,e specially from the so called "heard". LOL

Take it from the Deputy Director of Shenyang Engine Institute -

...in interview to CAST representative at Zhuhai a Deputy Director of SARI has
reported that the current TBO of WS-10A Taihang is only 300 hours. Progress with improving TBO and other
characteristics is persist, but going slow. By his words, it is impossible to name a single issue causing
difficulties with Chinese aircraft engines - there are a range of issues, including those related to process
organisation and personnel. The situation with WS-13 Taishan, which should replace the Russian RD-93,
is even more complicated than with Taihang - TBO for WS-13 is less then that 1/2 than for WS-10A."

bmpd - Модель самолета J-31 на авиасалоне в Чжухае

Translate if you want.

What do you know about WS-10A, WS-10A, WS-10B, WS-10G?

I didn't know there were 2 WS-10As, LOL. Thanks for the information!

 

[xunzi]

Ofcourse. For example, I don't even know what the liquid used to cool AESA T/R modules is called.



Does it say in Chinese dictionary that engines for commercial jets are of low quality? They are not low quality,
they are just a different type of engine used for different purpose. But the workings are of the same basic
type - both are turbofan engines.



Reconnaissance, not renaissance. Renaissance takes on an entirely different meaning. Refer to proper Oxford
English dictionary when posting in an English-writing forum, not those Chinese English dictionaries you've got.



Meh. Name one critical technology (like crystal blades, high-performance alloys, high pressure chambers etc.) related
to aero engines that Japanese cannot produce? It's nothing they cannot produce, just that they never had to produce
them for their needs, which were met by US-built engines as a default. But in no way can one claim Japanese cannot
do that - they already did great aerospace technology.

For example, look at their AESA technology. The first AESA radar to be put on a warship was developed by Japan
in the 1980s. The first series-production AESA radar to be used on a fighter jet was developed by Japan. The first ground-based AESA radar to become operational was developed by Japan, all in the 1990s.

The first AESA radar to be put on a missile seeker is currently being developed by Japan.

Where does China stand in comparison? You still don't have a single operational fighter squadron with an
indigenous AESA radar, now in 2014! So you see, Japanese have been highly pacifist and restrained in what
fields they venture into, but in the areas where they are active, they are often the world beaters.



Take it from the Deputy Director of Shenyang Engine Institute -



bmpd - Модель самолета J-31 на авиасалоне в Чжухае

Translate if you want.



I didn't know there were 2 WS-10As, LOL. Thanks for the information!

I'm talking of quality in term of low and high performance engine. Reliability is what you look after. In that case, you have to understand that building a reliable low performance engine is not difficult. We have problem with high-performance engine reliability issue but that is fixed with new update model of WS-10.

Also learn the difference between low and high-bypass turbofan. Why do I need to keep repeating myself? Creating a low thrust engine to power commercial jet flying at low speed is different than one for high speed in a jet fighter. The engine and superalloy industry of Japan is weak. I don't have access to their engine technology capability so we don't know. What I do know is that Japan had weak history in that realm dating back to post-WWII, which is why they always need to buy from the US. Also we do know the supposed XF5-1 to power Japan so called stealth aircraft to be developed and produced is not in the same league as WS-15, F119.

First and foremost, Japan is not the first to develop AESA. They field it first out of trial run while the US AESA version was also concurrently developed and successfully test field a few year later with little problem. When Japan field its AESA, there are numerous problems and malfunction. Though they have fixed it by now. It is not saying much because every countries in the aircraft building business are capable of making AESA. There is nothing cutting edge about Japanese technology that we do not have or know about. Fact.

 

[Gessler]

I'm talking of quality in term of low and high performance engine. Reliability is what you look after. In that case, you have to understand that building a reliable low performance engine is not difficult. We have problem with high-performance engine reliability issue but that is fixed with new update model of WS-10.

Also learn the difference between low and high-bypass turbofan. Why do I need to keep repeating myself? Creating a low thrust engine to power commercial jet flying at low speed is different than one for high speed in a jet fighter. The engine and superalloy industry of Japan is weak. I don't have access to their engine technology capability so we don't know. What I do know is that Japan had weak history in that realm dating back to post-WWII, which is why they always need to buy from the US. Also we do know the supposed XF5-1 to power Japan so called stealth aircraft to be developed and produced is not in the same league as WS-15, F119.

First and foremost, Japan is not the first to develop AESA. They field it first out of trial run while the US AESA version was also concurrently developed and successfully test field a few year later with little problem. When Japan field its AESA, there are numerous problems and malfunction. Though they have fixed it by now. It is not saying much because every countries in the aircraft building business are capable of making AESA. There is nothing cutting edge about Japanese technology that we do not have or know about. Fact.

From kindergarten days onwards...Chinese are taught that they are the center of the universe.

But what else can I say? I have said time and again how Japan had a highly pacifist/restrained regime till now
(Shinzo Abe is making a lot of changes now, though), yet that doesn't seem to get into your brain.

You are confused between quality and role. You think commercial aircraft engines are low quality because they
are designed to travel subsonic, and fighter engines are high quality because they go supersonic with afterburner.

What & how can anyone possibly educate a person who doesn't even know the meaning of the world "quality"? And
yet thinks he is the center of the universe? Huh? Just suffice to say this - a fighter engine, if built wrongly, will only
risk the lives of 1 or 2 pilots, but a commercial aircraft engine, if built wrongly, risks 100s of lives.

And now by debating with the likes of you, I am risking my own life.

 

[Peaceful Civilian]

Cool design but Japan can't make it. Forget about Sixth gen fighter. U.S.A will offer you F35 in good numbers.. Live with it.
If Japan starts from scratch , it will take a decade to catch 4th+ tech, then come with 5th gen. and 6th generation in next century. BY this time we will see big battleships flying from ocean, airbases under water and Sixth gen fighter sitting ducks in front of them.

 

[mike2000]

Nice one japan. Not easy to build a 5th generation stealth fighter indeginously/independently. Only 4 countries have this capability as of yet U.S, Russia.
Though not sure it will be on par with the above countries since japan has been relying on U.S fighters for decades, so it hasn't been producing its own fighters independently unlike the other countries mentioned. So we will have to wait and see if this one will be on par with the above. Since experience does matter as well.
Well done japan