J 10B radar is indeed an AESA.

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

Congrats on this wonderful news

 

[nomi007]

j-10b especially fc-20 will be inducted in to 2014-15 so its too early to assume the analysis

 

[PWFI]

j-10b especially fc-20 will be inducted in to 2014-15 so its too early to assume the analysis

bro acording to latest report of eaglehannan 3 Fc-20 are coming to pakistan in december , this news is report by antiboy

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

bro acording to latest report of eaglehannan 3 Fc-20 are coming to pakistan in december , this news is report by antiboy

Well it would be great moral boost to see J10B in Pakistani colors surely it will motivate the fans of Pakistan Forces , and 3 jets would pave way for training of pilots immediately in anticipation of bigger order of 33 more planes in years to come.

No point to train new pilots ,on mirage when they will be flying 100 J10B (ops I meant 36) J10B

I mean 2011 is almost gone , so 2012 is here that is just 2 years away from full arrival of J10B or how I like to call it J10 beast plane


If training goes on between 2012 -2013 for new pilot batch , likely by time J10Best comes it will give us to train 18-20 pilots or more

 

[Martian2]

Nice picture Azad. I removed the moderate blue filter from the photo.

J-10 Vigorous Dragon airbase

[Note: Thank you to AZADPAKISTAN2009 for the picture.]

 

[AerospaceEngineer]

How was I proved wrong? What claims have I made here so far?

You proved wrong almost everytime you say some thing abouot Chinese military!

 

[Akasa]

bro acording to latest report of eaglehannan 3 Fc-20 are coming to pakistan in december , this news is report by antiboy

Are you sure that's the FC-20s, not the JF-17 Block II? Because according to insiders, the JF-17 Block II will be delivered in around November 2011.

 

[PWFI]

Are you sure that's the FC-20s, not the JF-17 Block II? Because according to insiders, the JF-17 Block II will be delivered in around November 2011.

He(antiboy) quote eaglehannan :

I have already reported that FC20/J-10Bs are under going final integration. The numbers and contract was to be announced when Gilani was here this year but for certain reasons the numbers and actual contract was not announced. However, Inshallah this bird is coming. As per last news, I also reported this already, the first 4 are to be recieved by this december. I know it sounds un realistic but so was all that I reported before and was proved right. The information I brought is from serious sources and sometimes they do want things to be known before announced. I leave it to senior members or ex forces people here who got my meaning.

Now there is another twist to this situation. While AF has clearly stated @ occasions that FC20 is exactly the bird we require for our high end requirement, ball less Gilani and Ghadarri want otherwise. US wants more influence in air force. They want the young officers to have A CHAKKER OF AMRICA to as usual infleunce them. I wish our ex-military people here shed some light on this issue. I critisize them if they decide not to do so. This is how US drills into young officers mind that US is mighty, you cant fight it, you have to listen to it, they are next to God. Go back tell your squadern what you saw and liberalism is professionalism.
No kidding thats true. Thanks to Allah for 80s embargoes, Officers at higher echelons totally understand that and want to break free from such a politicaly induced drug into air force. Army had the fair share of this drug and we are bearing fruits of it now. I can assure you the project directors and leaders from Paf HAVE NO DOUBT THAT THIS BLOCK52 IS NOT TO BE OUR SPEARHEAD. I was not active here that much so i reported it in another forum. Without any masala tarka added, I quoted them as telling me this.

That is the answer to your question. The fregin Gilani did not annouce the contract. He is thus far trying to shove F-16s down PAFs throat. Again, its not the F-16s that I call the problem. Its the US leverage on AF I am talking about. Issi bahanay the young officers will be invited to US for long stays followed by all the rest of crap. I quote a Chinese source "Taiwanese dreed PAF and PLAAF Nexus. US hates this co-operation, we are definately doing the things right".

FC20 is J-10B with serious sensor fusion. While less information is leaked out, it is for sure that IT WILL BE MORE THAN A MATCH FOR ANYTHING ELSE IN OR BROUGHT IN THIS REGION. I reported earlier that "J-10A versions are on active duty along with SU30s in South China Sea and straits of Taiwan". While we are again using our "Amrica is God" galsses to view the situation, J-10A version is already challanging F-18EFs. Proves its worth and gives out a lot about FC20.


Sir, as responded above, F-16s are definately excellent till FC20 make up numbers but this is NO REASON TO GO FOR another 18. The current F-16 forces is enough for current top tier and future mid tier force. The limited resources should be poured in the FC20.
I have already reported that PAF pilots are getting trained in Chingdu over the A version and 2 B versions. There are 2 teams conducting testings, Pakistani and Chinese.
I think FC20 will be inducted straight into operational duties and this will be the first time PAF has tactics and procedures in place even before the platform is inducted (This part is my own speculation)

Rest assured sensor systems on FC20 are extracted from lessons learnt on Western/American platforms by PAF and Russian systems developed and merged by Chinese. The targeting pods in F-16s are no more exclusive. WMD advertised for JFT is @ par with Sniper pod. LGBs and PGMs are already validated on JFT. Passive sensors are mastered by russians, found on SU and Migs have already found their way on JFT blk2. Thats the beauty of integration. I am all for Chinese way. You only need to have a know how of reverse engineering with quality and add to those modules lessons learnt from other sources. No need of reinvesting the wheel. The resulting product is an integration of many tecs of different origins.

Based on mentioned realities, i deem the purchase of 18 more F-16s a waste of money, wrong political decission, unnecessary leverage given to US and cause of concern in long run.



PAF said it on Zhuhai Air Show as well as in Turkey that they speculate WS10A which is different from WS10 now under going trials to mature in 5 years, while Chinese friends claim it to be 3 years at most.

Now a new development in last 2 months is that China finally placed orders for around 121 AL31FNs. This led us all to safely believe that WS10A is not ready and will not be in next few years for Which Pakistan can not wait. It is not feasible for any operator except likes of China to operate 2 types of engines for the same platform. You can see that because we opted for PW engines for F-16s in 80s, we can not go for GE engines for the same platform now, even though they are bit more powerful than PW ones. All our F-16s are with PW engines. Same is the case here, Pakistan needs FC20 fast and once we procure it with AL31FN. It might not be feasible for us to ever go for WS10As. Simply because we would not want to have operational complexities. It is at present safe to speculate that WS10A might not see service with PAF. We may be operating 2 russian engines for our top tier aircrafts. JFT and FC20.


Sir while you raised very valid points and I totally understand why you partialy disagree the notion about "Waste of Money". Your points about US and Chinese leverage in the future and the idea of "counter balance" is also correct. I however would urge you to do the cost to benifit analysis.

While we can induct F-16s very fast and they definately are worthy birds with least hastle to operate, definate tactics in place already, and with infastructure in place, the manufacturer of this bird is "NOT JUST INTO SUPPLY OF GOOD AND MIND ITS OWN BUSINESS". USA can be all sassy as it wants but there are somethings that USA values more than money and that is INFLUENCE. I CAN PRETTY MUCH BET ANYONE HERE THAT USA CAN NOT STOP OUR MILITARY AID, UNTILL AND UNLESS US HAS SOME PLAN TO TAKE Pakistan HEAD ON. That time shall come, very soon but not right now.

All our top most ranks in AF are people who have been for one reason or other have stayed trained and lived in US , ALL IN THE NAME OF F-16s. We have our SQD ldrs, WCs, BCs and middle tiers which were never sent to US for training in 80s embargo. They never developed the kind of mentality that the likes of current COAS has. Believe it or not, the mid tiers openly have expressed their openion and mentality difference many time, insiders can confirm my position here. The other day, I requested the retired AF people to please come forward and tell the nation about this issue. I have personaly met retired high rankers and now they say it that IT WAS NOT JUST TRAINING AND F-16S, IT WAS THE ENVIRONMENT GIVEN TO THEM, SITUATIONS THEY WERE PUT IN DELIBRATELY that IN ONE SENIOR'S OPENION WAS DANGEROUS, INFLUENTIAL AND HIGLY SUGGESTIVE. Please read between the lines and make up of what I am trying to say here.

I can bet, there is not a soul symphetic to US in high ranks after the lot of current cheif of air staff. Why so? What sets them apart? Its a shift of mentalities. Its the clash of pre and post US embargo. I wish we break all ties with this US of A. They are suggestive and dangerous influence to all who they are friends with them.

This is the reason why I dread the F-16, cause US has realized its mistake and knows very well that while they have a poodle on top in AF, this might not be the case after the current top rankers are retired. The next COAS may shoot the drone down, thump chest and say bring it on.
THIS IS THE REASON WHY I BELIEVE USA WILL NOT CUT MILITARY AID. US wants mind slaves again who come back from long stays in US all sponsored by US. While they can not mend or bring back time to influence up coming top tiers, they can influence the young lot again in the name of Traning and F-16

 

[nomi007]

if they are coming this year than it is a great news
what is the progress of Chinese AWACS which Pakistan had purchase from china last year
i saw a picture of 2nd Chinese AWACS for Pakistan\
2nd ZDK-03 Airborne Warning And Control Systems (AWACS) is almost ready
8 months since the handover of the first ZDK-03 to the Pakistan Air Force, the second bird is undergo final preparations before before hitting the paint shop.

 

[Akasa]

He(antiboy) quote eaglehannan :

Interesting. The J-10Bs, if delivered, would most likely serve as testing and evaluation for now. They are unlikely to enter service with the PAF until 2014. Heck, they aren't even in full service with the PLAAF yet.

However, the PAF has ordered 50 JF-17 Block II from China, the first to be delivered in November. They will feature an AESA radar based on the one on the J-10B, reduced frontal RCS, increased composites, possible TVC, and much more.

 

[Akasa]

According to PAF insiders, the J-10B and JF-17 Block II will feature a rotating AESA radar.

Unlike a fixed AESA radar, the rotating one will have much superior coverage in all angles, albeit a slight contribution to RCS.

 

[gambit]

According to PAF insiders, the J-10B and JF-17 Block II will feature a rotating AESA radar.

Unlike a fixed AESA radar, the rotating one will have much superior coverage in all angles, albeit a slight contribution to RCS.

Not possible. Fighters cannot have rotating radars. Perhaps you mean 'sweeping', which is mechanically different than rotating.

 

[Akasa]

Not possible. Fighters cannot have rotating radars. Perhaps you mean 'sweeping', which is mechanically different than rotating.

Rotating (or "spinning") radar disc. Don't know the correct terminology, but the Captor for the Eurofighter Tranche 3 has that ability.

 

[gambit]

Rotating (or "spinning") radar disc. Don't know the correct terminology, but the Captor for the Eurofighter Tranche 3 has that ability.

Rotating or spinning mean something has 360 deg of movement about a center. Sweeping mean a 'back and forth' motion like how a fish uses its tail for propulsion. A fighter aircraft has its radar in the nose so it is impossible for the antenna to rotate or spin. The J-10B and the JF-17 are fighters.

 

[ptldM3]

I can think of at least one fighter aircraft that has both the sweeping and rotating motion although the rotating motion isn't redundant, meaning it doesn't constantly rotate in one direction over and over.