J-10 might not needed as they don't add anything to PAF's capability

[Thunder.Storm]

what about j-16 sf

 

[majid mehmood]

Hi,


Count the types of aircraft that the indian air force has.

Now count the type of aircraft that the usaf has. it is a misnoer that they are going for 2 types---they still have a plethora of complimentary aircraft to these two.

So---if the J10 is not the choice---any other potent aircraft maybe the choice at the top tier.

Regardless of what the Paf say----it still needs two types of aircraft before its gets a 5th gen aircraft.

You need---your utility and the type of enemy that you are facing selects the type of aircraft.

Paf has neither of its bases covered---.

F7's and mirages are on their way out---so don't count them---just count the JF17.

The problem in this equation is the F 16----and issues with its supplies.

In the time of war---about 70% of the SU's will be available----.

Do not measure it as one aircraft to JF 17 ----. The SU has the power to carry 5-6 times the numbers of BVR.

A sortie of 2 SU 30's carry as many BVR missiles as 10 JF 17's----so what is the mulitplier effect of power projection for each SU30???

It can carry twice the load of a JF17----so what is the power projection then?

It can stay afloat for 2--3 times than JF 17---so what is the power projection then?

The issue over here is---that the top tier of the Paf is extremely vulnerable and the FLANK is open.

The FLANK means---that the paf has no heavy strike aircraft to respond with. And well know about the top tier issues.

When I state J10C---it is for the reason that it is readily available with the latest chinese avionics and you may have the option to get the Turkish avionics as well or Vixen.

This aircraft has the similar operational costs as the F16's---maybe a little higher--but not out of proportion----.

It is a single engine aircraft----.

You already have all the weapons that the J10 may use.

Plus you will be ably to get the high off bore sight missile for it as well that you may a difficult time otherwise.

So---the J10 is the bottom of the list to fill in the hole---then you can step up from this position to an SU35---Eurofighter---Rafale---J31---that is purely upto you.

But the baseline now is the J10C---.

Realistically---If I have my way---I will either look for the JH7B with aesa----this would be like throwing a monkey wrench into the enemy's planning---or the SU34's.

Because right now----they don't have to worry about any deep strike. With the JH7B's---the unpredictability of where it could strike from and from which direction----would help SPREAD THE ENEMY'S DEFENSE IN A WIDER CIRCLE---which means that the enemy will have to disperse its assets in a wider area and might have to reduce the number of assets from its strike force and divert it elsewhere.


Like mumbai----.The JH7B can strike mumbai from different angles---rather than a direct line of flight.

Mumbai is the jugular vein of india---but it has never been attacked before. The results of strikes would be catastrophic on the psyche of the public and on the investments---.

So---technically---you may have the enemy divert 1/4th of its assets in that region.

Then you may also have the ability to strike Calcuta from over the mountains---if not calcutta---then somewhere close----.

What does that do---again diversion of resources from the main strike point---.

I did not want to bring in Calcutta region before---I thought that you superstars would have the brains to think about the radius of the strike capabilities of the JH7B's on your own and won't wait for me to feed you the directions all the time.

But all you kids can do is argue argue argue---.

I bring in the JH7B---because it is available----but if the SU34 was available---I would not have any problems----.

So--if I got the job today to decide what the paf gets-----I will pick 48 JH7B's with aesa nd ability to launch BVR's and the off bore sight WVR missiles---with growler capabilities and possibly buddy refueling.

There is more to a GUNFIGHT than having the ability to perform HIGH G's all the time.



Sir,

That is a blatant LIE----. In order for you to defend your skies---you need to have the ability to reach into the enemy's stronghold and do damage. Without that---you cannot protect.

first i would appreciate such a good article but paf has already evaluated jh7 and said it was underpowered
as for the case with j10 paf was near to sign the deal untill imf put pressure on us to pay loans
then there is no choice for paf to go for any planes

what about j-16 sf

russia does not allow the sale
although some media reports rumors that it can be sold due different in design

 

[his5850]

what about j-16 sf

J-16 is still in prototype phase it is the copy of SU-30 it is improvement over it i don't know if can buy these planes and very good point was maid by majid mehmood IMF putting pressure on Pakistan to pay the lone and reduce the spending if we need more lone that is also one of the reasons that pakistan couldn't able to bought new planes we don't need JH-7 we got JF-17 for that we going to need J-10

 

[MastanKhan]

J-16 is still in prototype phase it is the copy of SU-30 it is improvement over it i don't know if can buy these planes and very good point was maid by majid mehmood IMF putting pressure on Pakistan to pay the lone and reduce the spending if we need more lone that is also one of the reasons that pakistan couldn't able to bought new planes we don't need JH-7 we got JF-17 for that we going to need J-10

We don't need JH7B's!!! ---then why are some foreign pilots on this forum recommending the JH7B's.

Why some foreign pilots on sinddefence recomending the JH7B.

Why on defence talk foreign pilots recomending the JH7B---and you 24 years old know more about it and its utility than them or me.

You still a 24 years old kid with no experience of the world and no access to books to read---your only source is what daddy or unckes told you or what you read on we search---.

Visit some libraries and read up on material for a few years about wars and air combat and ground combat----start from before the roman armies and come down and see why why all the successful military campaigns had their success rooted in heavy equipment.

first i would appreciate such a good article but paf has already evaluated jh7 and said it was underpowered
as for the case with j10 paf was near to sign the deal untill imf put pressure on us to pay loans
then there is no choice for paf to go for any planes


russia does not allow the sale
although some media reports rumors that it can be sold due different in design

Hi,

Thank you----the paf believes that untill an unless it don't have an eternal hardon---it won't work for them.

All bomber type aircraft are under powered in some sorts---. How about their primo choice the Fantan A5's---how badly under powered were they?

What do they need the power for to deliver standoff weapons from 250 miles away. This aircraft goes over mach 2 and can fly low as well.

Even in car sales----there are customers coming in and saying about 300 HP vehicles---oh it is underpowered----under powered my ar-se----you came in driving a 130 HP piece of sh-it and complaining about the 300 HP.

And when you call back the customer---they either bough =t the same vehicle somewhere else---or got something with lesser horse power.

That was a pure B S statement by the paf---because they could not find any other fault----.

The F14 tomcat was an extremely successful air craft---the Phantom was the most successful under powered aircraft of its time that even the turks are still using it.

The israelis showed the world what they could do with this under powered aircraft in the 1973 war against egypt---against the very agile and powerful and nimble mig 21.

 

[his5850]

We don't need JH7B's!!! ---then why are some foreign pilots on this forum recommending the JH7B's.

Why some foreign pilots on sinddefence recomending the JH7B.

Why on defence talk foreign pilots recomending the JH7B---and you 24 years old know more about it and its utility than them or me.

You still a 24 years old kid with no experience of the world and no access to books to read---your only source is what daddy or unckes told you or what you read on we search---.

Visit some libraries and read up on material for a few years about wars and air combat and ground combat----start from before the roman armies and come down and see why why all the successful military campaigns had their success rooted in heavy equipment.




Hi,

Thank you----the paf believes that untill an unless it don't have an eternal hardon---it won't work for them.

All bomber type aircraft are under powered in some sorts---. How about their primo choice the Fantan A5's---how badly under powered were they?

What do they need the power for to deliver standoff weapons from 250 miles away. This aircraft goes over mach 2 and can fly low as well.

Even in car sales----there are customers coming in and saying about 300 HP vehicles---oh it is underpowered----under powered my ar-se----you came in driving a 130 HP piece of sh-it and complaining about the 300 HP.

And when you call back the customer---they either bough =t the same vehicle somewhere else---or got something with lesser horse power.

That was a pure B S statement by the paf---because they could not find any other fault----.

The F14 tomcat was an extremely successful air craft---the Phantom was the most successful under powered aircraft of its time that even the turks are still using it.

The israelis showed the world what they could do with this under powered aircraft in the 1973 war against egypt---against the very agile and powerful and nimble mig 21.

old man your idea of good plane is under power plane and why we need bomber fighter bomber these type of planes is needed in very big air forces we are not even in top 5 we are not US not china and Russia as well we are already barely fulling our needs

2 rules
1st fulfill the needs then go for extra stuff or make Pakistan economy that strong then do what the hell ever you want

all these talk about planes going over your old brain so i will suggest go mosque and live your life in peace if not then go in front of parliament and protest that you will not eat any thing until they will bought you a JH-7

pakistan have mount of debt to pay and economic crisis going on your idea of make it best from this is what buy JH-7 which is not even a need i can under stand J-10 or Su-34 but why fighter bomber for small air force and what you are talking about Israelis is not tell how good the plane was it tell us how good the pilots were and are You kidding me Phantom is a under power plane it wasn't that maneuverable because of it's wing style not because of it was under power it was famous as Big fast bus you should read some history

 

[Thunder.Storm]

russia does not allow the sale

that was about j11 not j-16

 

[帅的一匹]

buy J-10 or SU-35 but it will more likely to be F-18

I think F18 and Rafale are in the same category?

 

[帅的一匹]

WeLL fRaNkLy SpeakiNg.
If PakistaN Chose J-10B instead of J-10c .
It'll Not Be Good Idea.
Because NeitheR it is Good pLatfoRm to RepLace F-15 BLock 15 with it.
also it is totally Death of JFT BLock 3 Because J-10B is CoNsideRed EquaL to JFT B3
.
As I Said EaRLieR, Buy Some Su-35 n Negotiate With RusSiaNs ABout SeLL of J-11 . . .



.
Yap.
RusSiaN PRotested ABout J-16 ..
FRom WeapoNs to ENgiNe . EveRythiNg is ChiNese

Let Xi talk to Putin, sell J16 to Pakistan. If he not agree, shall sell Su35 to Pakistan. If push come to shove, no need give Rusky a shit. To be honest, J16 is way beyond F16 be it in payload and range. I think India will respond fiercely if China sell Pakistan J16 cause it give detrimental threat to their CBG. The best fighter in PLAAF is J20, then comes the J16 as second.

 

[ACE OF THE AIR]

old man your idea of good plane is under power plane and why we need bomber fighter bomber these type of planes is needed in very big air forces we are not even in top 5 we are not US not china and Russia as well we are already barely fulling our needs

Get a life...Find the old timers who flew the PAF bombers during both Pakistan - India wars...They would tell you some thing which would change your entire perception regarding bombers.

If you remember PAF modified C-130's to do bombing missions specially against supply lines... Also read about the role B-57 Canberra Bombers.

Till that time do not talk about this topic.

Let Xi talk to Putin, sell J16 to Pakistan. If he not agree, shall sell Su35 to Pakistan. If push come to shove, no need give Rusky a shit. To be honest, J16 is way beyond F16 be it in payload and range. I think India will respond fiercely if China sell Pakistan J16 cause it give detrimental threat to their CBG. The best fighter in PLAAF is J20, then comes the J16 as second.

The issue is the engine PAF does not consider the Chinese engine is mature enough. The Russians are not going to sell more powerful engines because they consider that would rival their friend India.

PAF has a chance to get all the aircraft manufactured in China once it procures the SU-35 as that engine is not yet under the agreement of sale to Pakistan.

IF PAF is smart it should get 4 sqd of SU-35 then only the transfer of engines would be allowed. This would also allow China to position those Su-35 that it has promised to procure but are unwilling to because they feel it would not give any advantage over the J-11D and J-15's at Gwadar.

In time of WAR PAF would have the entire fleet of Chinese aircraft on disposal and also Russia would have to supply the SU-35's. This is the latest development that has come out of India falling into US hands...

 

[ACE OF THE AIR]

WeLL SiR. I Didn't Say J-16 oR 11 FoR RepLacemNt of F-16
.
foR That We ShouLd EitheR Get J-10c oR JFT3 aNd 4 wiLL woRk.
.
as we Lack any HeavieR oR Deep stRike CapabLe Jet, J-16 Can Provide Good CoveR aLoNg with Few Su-35 If Russian allows J-11 Sell on that term.
.
N for iNdia . . They R ALReady GettiNg RafaLe. Pak Fa. May Be SupeR VipeRs iN FutuRe. So No WoRRies aBout TheiR WoRRy !!

Hi,

For replacing F-16 it would take time...Most probably it would be replaced by TFX or F-35's... This would happen some time around 2025-2030.

What you are proposing would not happen because replacing a 4 - 4.5 gen aircraft with a similar is not the right thing to be doing when other countries all around would be heading to 5th Gen.

Rafales and F-18's if procured by India would definitely bring in options likes of EFT, J-10 or SU-35's in the present time but if these come in some time later like 2020 onward then PAF would be very comfortable to upgrade their fleet with J-31 or J-20.

 

[帅的一匹]

WeLL fRaNkLy SpeakiNg.
If PakistaN Chose J-10B instead of J-10c .
It'll Not Be Good Idea.
Because NeitheR it is Good pLatfoRm to RepLace F-15 BLock 15 with it.
also it is totally Death of JFT BLock 3 Because J-10B is CoNsideRed EquaL to JFT B3
.
As I Said EaRLieR, Buy Some Su-35 n Negotiate With RusSiaNs ABout SeLL of J-11 . . .



.
Yap.
RusSiaN PRotested ABout J-16 ..
FRom WeapoNs to ENgiNe . EveRythiNg is ChiNese

Get a life...Find the old timers who flew the PAF bombers during both Pakistan - India wars...They would tell you some thing which would change your entire perception regarding bombers.

If you remember PAF modified C-130's to do bombing missions specially against supply lines... Also read about the role B-57 Canberra Bombers.

Till that time do not talk about this topic.


The issue is the engine PAF does not consider the Chinese engine is mature enough. The Russians are not going to sell more powerful engines because they consider that would rival their friend India.

PAF has a chance to get all the aircraft manufactured in China once it procures the SU-35 as that engine is not yet under the agreement of sale to Pakistan.

IF PAF is smart it should get 4 sqd of SU-35 then only the transfer of engines would be allowed. This would also allow China to position those Su-35 that it has promised to procure but are unwilling to because they feel it would not give any advantage over the J-11D and J-15's at Gwadar.

In time of WAR PAF would have the entire fleet of Chinese aircraft on disposal and also Russia would have to supply the SU-35's. This is the latest development that has come out of India falling into US hands...

the engine for J16 is very mature. PLAAF won't send J11b to intercept P8I in the high sea if the engine is not mature. if you still doubt the engine, I can't help you. What is the definition of maturity? Operation more than 15 years? Maybe You have to wait another 15 years to reach the definition of maturity in your dictionary.

 

[Manticore]

.
What ENgiNe J-16 n OtheR J-11s n J-15 Use ??
SpecificatioNs PLz !!

This a forum not a chat site where you write in slangs, abbreviations and write every 2nd letter in capital

This is your warning
Next time there will be section bans

 

[帅的一匹]

.
What ENgiNe J-16 n OtheR J-11s n J-15 Use ??
SpecificatioNs PLz !!

Search WS10G on www.baidu.com.

 

[Thunder.Storm]

Let Xi talk to Putin, sell J16 to Pakistan. If he not agree, shall sell Su35 to Pakistan. If push come to shove, no need give Rusky a shit. To be honest, J16 is way beyond F16 be it in payload and range. I think India will respond fiercely if China sell Pakistan J16 cause it give detrimental threat to their CBG. The best fighter in PLAAF is J20, then comes the J16 as second.

What about j-16 silent flanker?

 

[knight11]

old man your idea of good plane is under power plane and why we need bomber fighter bomber these type of planes is needed in very big air forces we are not even in top 5 we are not US not china and Russia as well we are already barely fulling our needs

2 rules
1st fulfill the needs then go for extra stuff or make Pakistan economy that strong then do what the hell ever you want

all these talk about planes going over your old brain so i will suggest go mosque and live your life in peace if not then go in front of parliament and protest that you will not eat any thing until they will bought you a JH-7

pakistan have mount of debt to pay and economic crisis going on your idea of make it best from this is what buy JH-7 which is not even a need i can under stand J-10 or Su-34 but why fighter bomber for small air force and what you are talking about Israelis is not tell how good the plane was it tell us how good the pilots were and are You kidding me Phantom is a under power plane it wasn't that maneuverable because of it's wing style not because of it was under power it was famous as Big fast bus you should read some history

Agreed with you.
@MastanKhan he is very right, a small airforce should have multirole fighter aircraft.

In my view F-16 serve the PAF requirement best. But if PAF want to shift from F-16 and till J-31 becomes available, the best option till J-31 come in service should be MIG-35. Best part is it can have JF-17, Mig 35 and J-31 all with the Russina RD-33 engine.