Israel Hijacks Aid cargo, executes hostages - Pak journo, Talat Hussain taken hostage
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EyelessInGaza
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What angers or irritates some Pakistanis is that Indians seem to have a 'natural' affinity towards Israelis. It's true, we do. We grew up reading about their survival, and their military accomplishments, and it is, for a people who never have had any national or religious conflict with the Jews, hard not to do so. The military ties with Israel are not the main reason many of us support Israel; it's deeper than that.
Note - the Indian government's response has, to my knowledge, never been blatantly pro Israel in matters like the ship incident, so let's leave GOI out of it.
Therefore some Pakistanis accuse us of being chamchas.
What angers or irritates some Indians is that Pakistan seems to have a 'natural' antipathy for Israel, seemingly based on the fact that they are Jews. The hatred seems weird to us, when Pakistan and Israel are thousands of kilometers apart. It seems to us to be based on religious and racism.
That is the reason we end up lining on the other side.
Both POVs have some merit.
But this incident is different, as I will try and analyze in my next post.
Note - the Indian government's response has, to my knowledge, never been blatantly pro Israel in matters like the ship incident, so let's leave GOI out of it.
Therefore some Pakistanis accuse us of being chamchas.
What angers or irritates some Indians is that Pakistan seems to have a 'natural' antipathy for Israel, seemingly based on the fact that they are Jews. The hatred seems weird to us, when Pakistan and Israel are thousands of kilometers apart. It seems to us to be based on religious and racism.
That is the reason we end up lining on the other side.
Both POVs have some merit.
But this incident is different, as I will try and analyze in my next post.
EyelessInGaza
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Based on the facts that we now have - which could change -in my opinion some people on that ship were out to create trouble.
You can use any logic you like, but when a crowd starts to attack armed soldiers, with a stick, or a knife or a tank, you can expect some retaliation.
But that is not the issue. In Jallianwallah Bagh in 1919, the crowd was obviously breaking the rules. The end result - hundreds of civilians (who were breaking the law)killed, not one British Army soldier dead.
At the Dandi March, as I said in an earlier post, scores of civilians (who were breaking the law) were brutally assaulted, not one British official so much as a hair out of place.
In any conflict both sides carry some blame. But you have to look at the end result. And the end result was: 9 or more civilians killed, not one Israeli soldier dead.
When we celebrate the Dandi March and Jallianwallah Bagh as stirring chapters in our Independence struggle, it then is not possible, for me, to defend the Israeli action.
You can use any logic you like, but when a crowd starts to attack armed soldiers, with a stick, or a knife or a tank, you can expect some retaliation.
But that is not the issue. In Jallianwallah Bagh in 1919, the crowd was obviously breaking the rules. The end result - hundreds of civilians (who were breaking the law)killed, not one British Army soldier dead.
At the Dandi March, as I said in an earlier post, scores of civilians (who were breaking the law) were brutally assaulted, not one British official so much as a hair out of place.
In any conflict both sides carry some blame. But you have to look at the end result. And the end result was: 9 or more civilians killed, not one Israeli soldier dead.
When we celebrate the Dandi March and Jallianwallah Bagh as stirring chapters in our Independence struggle, it then is not possible, for me, to defend the Israeli action.
Kompromat
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Turkey will 'never forgive' Israel
UPDATED ON:
Friday, June 04, 2010
03:13 Mecca time, 00:13 GMT
YouTube - Interview with Al Jazeera's Jamal ElShayyal: One of the passengers on the Mavi Marmara
The Turkish president has said that Israel's military raid on civilian aid ships bound for the Gaza Strip has caused "irreparable" damage to his country's relations with Israel, and will "never" be forgiven.
"From now on, Turkish-Israeli ties will never be the same. This incident has left an irreparable and deep scar," Abdullah Gul said in a televised speech on Thursday, as thousands gathered in the streets of Istanbul to pay their respects to the humanitarian activists killed during the raid.
The raid "is not an issue that can be forgotten... or be covered up... Turkey will never forgive this attack," he said.
Nine people - eight Turks and a US national of Turkish origin- were killed in Monday's pre-dawn raid on the Mavi Mamara, which was carrying aid to Gaza in a bid to break Israel's strangling blockade of the territory.
As their funerals got underway on Thursday, thousands poured onto the streets around the Fatih Mosque in Istanbul, chanting slogans condemning Israel and waving Turkish and Palestinian flags.IN DEPTH
Turkish media estimated the size of the crowd as between 15,000 and 20,000 people, a reflection of the depth of anger in Turkey over the Israeli assault on the ships.
Several imams directed the mourners in prayer as eight of the coffins, draped in Turkish and Palestinian flags, were laid on marble stands for people to pay their respects.
Shot from above
The demonstration came as Turkish forensic experts confirmed that the nine activists had been shot dead.
Al Jazeera's Jamal Elshayyal, who reported from the ship during the raid, confirmed that live ammunition had been used by Israeli commandos as they stormed the ship.
He said that he witnessed some of the killings, and confirmed that at least "one person was shot through the top of the head from [the helicopter] above."
Elshayyal was on the top deck when the ship was attacked and said that within a few minutes of seeing the Israeli helicopters, there were shots being fired from above.
"The first shots [coming from Israeli boats at sea] were tear gas, sound grenades and rubber coated steel bullets," said Eshayyal.
"Live shots came five minutes after that. There was definitely live fire from the air and from the sea as well."
He confirmed that some passengers took apart some of the ship's railings to defend themselves as they saw the Israeli soldiers approaching.
"After the shooting and the first deaths, people put up white flags and signs in English and Hebrew," he said.
"An Israeli [on the ship] asked the soldiers to take away the injured, but they did not and the injured died on the ship."
Injured flown home
Earlier on Thursday, three air ambulances landed at a military base in Ankara, the Turkish capital, carrying wounded activists who were transferred from Israeli custody to hospitals in the city.
Hundreds of supporters, including Bulent Arinc, Turkey's deputy prime minister, and several other Turkish politicians, gathered at the airport in Istanbul to welcome the returning activists.
"They faced barbarism and oppression but returned with pride," Arinc told hundreds of jubilant relatives and supporters outside the airport, chanting "God is Great!"
Almost all of the detained passengers on board the flotilla have now been released.
Seven activists wounded in Monday's clashes were still being treated in an Israeli hospital, the Israeli foreign ministry said.
Three others - an Irishman and two women from Australia and Italy - remained in Israel "for technical reasons", the ministry said.
But Ayman Mohyeldin, Al Jazeera's correspondent in Jerusalem, said that four Palestinian-Israelis also remain in prison.
Our correspondent said that Raed Salah, a leader of the Islamic Movement in Israel, was one of those still being held.
Israel defiant
Israel has remained defiant over the raid, rejecting calls for an international investigation into the incident, and warning it is ready to intercept another aid ship, the Rachel Corrie, that is due to head for Gaza next week.
Accusing international critics of "hypocrisy," Binyamin Netanyahu, the Israeli prime minister, defended the seizure of the aid ships on Wednesday.
"This was not the Love Boat," he said in a televised address to the nation, referring to the vessel boarded by commandos. "It was a hate boat."
"These weren't pacifists, these weren't peace activists, they were violent supporters of terrorism."
Netanyahu said the aim of the flotilla was to break the blockade of Gaza, not to bring aid.
He said that if the blockade ended, ships would bring in thousands of missiles from Iran to be aimed at Israel and beyond, creating what he said would be an Iranian port on the Mediterranean.
"The same countries that are criticising us today should know that they would be targeted tomorrow," Netanyahu said.
However, Ban Ki-moon, the UN secretary-general, said the flotilla tragedy only highlights the serious underlying problem - namely, the siege imposed on the Gaza.
He said that the siege was "counter-productive, unsustainable and wrong".
"It punishes innocent civilians," he said, calling for the siege to be lifted immediately.
Turkey will 'never forgive' Israel - Europe - Al Jazeera English
UPDATED ON:
Friday, June 04, 2010
03:13 Mecca time, 00:13 GMT
YouTube - Interview with Al Jazeera's Jamal ElShayyal: One of the passengers on the Mavi Marmara
The Turkish president has said that Israel's military raid on civilian aid ships bound for the Gaza Strip has caused "irreparable" damage to his country's relations with Israel, and will "never" be forgiven.
"From now on, Turkish-Israeli ties will never be the same. This incident has left an irreparable and deep scar," Abdullah Gul said in a televised speech on Thursday, as thousands gathered in the streets of Istanbul to pay their respects to the humanitarian activists killed during the raid.
The raid "is not an issue that can be forgotten... or be covered up... Turkey will never forgive this attack," he said.
Nine people - eight Turks and a US national of Turkish origin- were killed in Monday's pre-dawn raid on the Mavi Mamara, which was carrying aid to Gaza in a bid to break Israel's strangling blockade of the territory.
As their funerals got underway on Thursday, thousands poured onto the streets around the Fatih Mosque in Istanbul, chanting slogans condemning Israel and waving Turkish and Palestinian flags.IN DEPTH
Turkish media estimated the size of the crowd as between 15,000 and 20,000 people, a reflection of the depth of anger in Turkey over the Israeli assault on the ships.
Several imams directed the mourners in prayer as eight of the coffins, draped in Turkish and Palestinian flags, were laid on marble stands for people to pay their respects.
Shot from above
The demonstration came as Turkish forensic experts confirmed that the nine activists had been shot dead.
Al Jazeera's Jamal Elshayyal, who reported from the ship during the raid, confirmed that live ammunition had been used by Israeli commandos as they stormed the ship.
He said that he witnessed some of the killings, and confirmed that at least "one person was shot through the top of the head from [the helicopter] above."
Elshayyal was on the top deck when the ship was attacked and said that within a few minutes of seeing the Israeli helicopters, there were shots being fired from above.
"The first shots [coming from Israeli boats at sea] were tear gas, sound grenades and rubber coated steel bullets," said Eshayyal.
"Live shots came five minutes after that. There was definitely live fire from the air and from the sea as well."
He confirmed that some passengers took apart some of the ship's railings to defend themselves as they saw the Israeli soldiers approaching.
"After the shooting and the first deaths, people put up white flags and signs in English and Hebrew," he said.
"An Israeli [on the ship] asked the soldiers to take away the injured, but they did not and the injured died on the ship."
Injured flown home
Earlier on Thursday, three air ambulances landed at a military base in Ankara, the Turkish capital, carrying wounded activists who were transferred from Israeli custody to hospitals in the city.
Hundreds of supporters, including Bulent Arinc, Turkey's deputy prime minister, and several other Turkish politicians, gathered at the airport in Istanbul to welcome the returning activists.
"They faced barbarism and oppression but returned with pride," Arinc told hundreds of jubilant relatives and supporters outside the airport, chanting "God is Great!"
Almost all of the detained passengers on board the flotilla have now been released.
Seven activists wounded in Monday's clashes were still being treated in an Israeli hospital, the Israeli foreign ministry said.
Three others - an Irishman and two women from Australia and Italy - remained in Israel "for technical reasons", the ministry said.
But Ayman Mohyeldin, Al Jazeera's correspondent in Jerusalem, said that four Palestinian-Israelis also remain in prison.
Our correspondent said that Raed Salah, a leader of the Islamic Movement in Israel, was one of those still being held.
Israel defiant
Israel has remained defiant over the raid, rejecting calls for an international investigation into the incident, and warning it is ready to intercept another aid ship, the Rachel Corrie, that is due to head for Gaza next week.
Accusing international critics of "hypocrisy," Binyamin Netanyahu, the Israeli prime minister, defended the seizure of the aid ships on Wednesday.
"This was not the Love Boat," he said in a televised address to the nation, referring to the vessel boarded by commandos. "It was a hate boat."
"These weren't pacifists, these weren't peace activists, they were violent supporters of terrorism."
Netanyahu said the aim of the flotilla was to break the blockade of Gaza, not to bring aid.
He said that if the blockade ended, ships would bring in thousands of missiles from Iran to be aimed at Israel and beyond, creating what he said would be an Iranian port on the Mediterranean.
"The same countries that are criticising us today should know that they would be targeted tomorrow," Netanyahu said.
However, Ban Ki-moon, the UN secretary-general, said the flotilla tragedy only highlights the serious underlying problem - namely, the siege imposed on the Gaza.
He said that the siege was "counter-productive, unsustainable and wrong".
"It punishes innocent civilians," he said, calling for the siege to be lifted immediately.
Turkey will 'never forgive' Israel - Europe - Al Jazeera English
Meengla
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BS!
Till 1991 or so--a large part of 'modern' Indian history from 1947--there were hardly any manifestation of this 'natural affinity'. Indeed, India, as part of NAM (the Non Aligned Movement) rightly rooted for the Palestinians. It may also be because India, being part of the Soviet block, rooted for the Palestinians more then.
It was ALWAYS about which side was buttering the Indian bread.
These 'grew up reading...' kind of arguments are so fake, so false, so stupid that it is not even a joke. Plain n simple: Just like Indians stabbed Iran in the back during the nuclear-vote, Indians are now trying to piggy-back the prevalent global war against Islamic extremism to finally settle its own geopolitical goals, with Kashmir being the foremost goal.
As I have kept saying: The bloggers here need to note that Indians are dis-proportionately supportive of Israel in this forum. They are coming up with the same old excuses of Israeli attack which have been discredited even by many Israelis.
Any Arab, or Turk, or Iranian reading these lines should realize that the true hateful nature of these Indian bloggers.
fallstuff
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Depends on what time period you grew up. Pre 1990's India is very different then now. Its more like shockingly 180 degrees turn around.
From the Wiki,
Indo-Israeli relations - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Marxist
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Many people are condemning Indo-Israel relationship,Israel is one of the best friendly nation to India,second-largest military partner so there is no need to revive our Israel policy.
Kompromat
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Israeli apne Nabi ke sagay nahi thay to aur kis ke hon ge
Good decision by Turkey
Absolutely rite zaki.
Huda
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pata nhi baki muslims countries esa kab kregn
Dr.Evil
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I have different take on this.
The present situation is too hot in the Turkey and Isreal, but give it few months every thing will be back to almost normal.
Even now no drastic steps have been taken by both sides like cutting of business relations.
The present situation is too hot in the Turkey and Isreal, but give it few months every thing will be back to almost normal.
Even now no drastic steps have been taken by both sides like cutting of business relations.
Kompromat
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Maybe you should Educate yourself.
Turkey withdraws ambassador to Israel, cancel military drills, calls Security Council meeting
Huda
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han but kuch time k liye hai ye sub
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